howie Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 Don,t know how it came about, but the big debate down the pub last night was are the Royal family worth it. Quite a few of the younger ones looked on them as a outdated expense with no place in todays modern world for such things. Those for were adamant that they more than paid their way through the amount of tourism income they generate, that the pomp and ceremony brightens up a increasingly grey world, and that having all those stately homes and beautifull gardens coming under state control would spell the end of so many of these great institutions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J9withdogs Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 I am unashamedly a Royalist and think that we are envied by countries who don't have the traditions that we enjoy in this country. I have just seen one of those Channel 4 clips with someone slagging off people who have received OBE's, and while a lot are given to public servants who were only doing the job they were paid to do, many heroes in our communities would have remained 'unsung' without honours like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howie Posted June 24, 2007 Author Share Posted June 24, 2007 Good for you Janine. I,ve got a legend tattooed on a certain part of my anatomy which proudly states "God Queen and Country" (now available in full colour at a special introductory price) which still holds true after all these years. Under certain conditions this also includes "Death Before Dishonour" and "United we Stand, Divided we Fall" but this of course will cost extra. XXX :-> ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J9withdogs Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 hmmm.. now let me guess where it is.... I once knew a bloke who had 'Llandudno' tattooed on a certain part of his anatomy.. 8-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howie Posted June 24, 2007 Author Share Posted June 24, 2007 Let me know when you come across Llanfairpwlchgwyngogorechy llantysiliogygogogoch and chopper can sign him up for a nationwide tour. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J9withdogs Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 What's chopper got to do with it - is he a freak-show promoter or a pimp? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 Over the past few years I have become, little by little, a republican.Why? Because, to me, the present Queen is the last of the breed worthy of office. Most of her offspring seem little more than clowns, living on wildly unrealistic state handouts. Those contraceptively careless hangers on, the lesser Royals, even more so. Sell off their estates, and put the lot of them out to work - assuming any of them could find an employer! If not, basic unemployment pay, they haven't been paying their stamps, have they?But beyond that, I have come round to thinking our politics would also benefit considerably from an elected President. Not on the American model, where the President wields far too much power, but certainly more powerful than the Irish model, where the President (with the exception of the excellent Mary Robinson) seems substantially invisible. After Thatcher and Blair, both of whom have behaved as unelected presidents, I think we just need someone to knock sense into our PMs overinflated heads from time to time. They are, after all, elected by a party that also selects all the candidates for election to parliament, they hand out all the top jobs in the cabinet, and in a number of other public institutions, including the odd reward for services rendered in the house of Lords, and they then rule pretty much as absolute Monarchs. They have reduced the Commons to a cypher, they have trounced the revising powers of the Lords, and they alone decide when we shall go to war, and with whom.So, since we can't have both Monarch and President, I'm in favour of a President. So there! And if you don't like it, choose your Monarchy with greater care in future! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J9withdogs Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 Down the centuries the monarchs have always had, shall I say, a flamboyant lifestyle, and I think that our present queen has been the exception. This doesn't mean we should abolish the monarchy, just because the next generation are following in their ancestors' footsteps. Eccentricity is part of the rich tapestry of life! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howie Posted June 24, 2007 Author Share Posted June 24, 2007 What about the spirtual needs of our country Brian, not so much in the relegious sense, but goverments come and go and the reining monarch remains a constant source of comfort and pride and the flag we all rally to in times of trouble. I know your arguments are always sound, but there are some thing that go beyond sound and sensible explanations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 Please excuse "two for the price of one" answers!"I know your arguments are always sound, but there are some thing that go beyond sound and sensible explanations." Too kind, too kind, Howard. Beyond sensible explanations? Too right mate! That's about where I've go to with them. They're completely beyond sensible explanation!"Eccentricity is part of the rich tapestry of life!"Not of I'm paying for it, it ain't! There are too many of them, they are poor value, and the present bunch are poor quality. Let's just put the poor things out of their misery. It's cruel! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
howie Posted June 25, 2007 Author Share Posted June 25, 2007 Brian Kirby - 2007-06-24 6:49 PM Not of I'm paying for it, it ain't! There are too many of them, they are poor value, and the present bunch are poor quality. Let's just put the poor things out of their misery. It's cruel!And yet we pay for such things as the dome or the next games and are we getting value there or adding more to the quality of our lives compared to the trooping of the colours or the changing of the guard etc. Lets be honest Brian, present political thinking is all about appeasment and hairbrushing anything associated with our imperial and successfull past completely out of the history books. Find me a state school that now teaches the great achievements of men such as Wolffe, Nelson or Clive of India. Not on your nelly, and having the Royal Family as a constant reminder to when we truly were a great nation must be a real thorn in the side of the chattering class apologists, who for reasons best known to themselves wish to deny any these achievments ever took place. Yes I agree there are to many of them, and getting shot of all the hanger ons would be welcome, but to myself and many others the Queen is the constant thread that brings some comfort in these changing times. A sorry bunch!. Well that depends on what newspapers you read and their political affiliations, but I firmly believe that to know where you are going you must know where you come from, and this is what the Queen gives us. History, pride and a strong sense of identity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CliveH Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 I agree totally with Brian on this. I too have lost my respect for the concept of a Royal Family over the years. I wonder what the hell is going to happen when the Queen dies and Charles take over - someone who lied re his marriage vows and seems to live on an alien planet compared to the one I inhabit. Then there is the issue of tax. Why is it that all of our assets on death are subject to a swinging 40% tax on everything above £300K (07/08) and the Trust laws that could protect some of this are now being torn up by our new PM Gordon the "Go Fer" (Go Fer this tax - Go Fer that tax) so that unlike the Windsor’s our assets on death will be taxed a third time! First we have to pay income tax on what we earn - the Windsor’s do not. Secondly, we pay tax on our savings, investments and pension fund growth - either as income or CGT - the Windsor’s do not. And as I say, finally, our savings/assets over £300K will be subject to a 40% tax raid - whilst the Windsor’s will not. Oh they look pretty and I am sure some Tourists will pay handsomely for the privilege of seeing them. But value for money? Let’s have a vote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michele Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 NO is my vote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 howie - 2007-06-25 1:27 AM And yet we pay for such things as the dome or the next games and are we getting value there or adding more to the quality of our lives compared to the trooping of the colours or the changing of the guard etc. Lets be honest Brian, present political thinking is all about appeasment and hairbrushing anything associated with our imperial and successfull past completely out of the history books. Find me a state school that now teaches the great achievements of men such as Wolffe, Nelson or Clive of India. Not on your nelly, and having the Royal Family as a constant reminder to when we truly were a great nation must be a real thorn in the side of the chattering class apologists, who for reasons best known to themselves wish to deny any these achievments ever took place. Yes I agree there are to many of them, and getting shot of all the hanger ons would be welcome, but to myself and many others the Queen is the constant thread that brings some comfort in these changing times. A sorry bunch!. Well that depends on what newspapers you read and their political affiliations, but I firmly believe that to know where you are going you must know where you come from, and this is what the Queen gives us. History, pride and a strong sense of identity. I'm all kind of yes and no about this Howard! I agree with most of what you say, and I do think we have become afraid to celebrate our great achievements. And yet, and yet. The present royals are really a bit of an invention, the lineage is somewhat shaky, and I've now had enough of the fawning and pandering that surrounds them and their tribe of followers. So, on balance, I still think we should pension them all off, on modest pensions, and just accept the need for a President with some actual political power, rather than persist with a Monarch whose only remaining power would disappear like summer snow (it's coming I hear!) as soon as it was used!I know its sad, but we can't keep on walking forwards while looking backwards - too many lamp posts! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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