Bulletguy Posted May 8, 2018 Share Posted May 8, 2018 So that lunatic in the White House trashes the Iran nuclear deal calling it "decaying and rotten" (he really should stop looking at himself in the mirror).....and though Iran have said they will remain in the deal, since Trumps announcement Iran say they are ready to restart nuclear work with uranium enrichment and with that bring increased hostility aggravated by no other than Trump himself. He and he alone is accountable for that. That warmongering idiot is just itching to get pressing buttons. He seems to think only the US should have nuclear toys to play with. The man behaves like a petulant little child and he doesn't 'like' it because it was another deal done under the Obama administration. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-44045957 https://www.haaretz.com/middle-east-news/iran/iran-slams-trump-s-illegal-illegitimate-move-to-quit-nuclear-deal-1.6072056 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted May 8, 2018 Author Share Posted May 8, 2018 Here a real politician and statesman who conducted his term of office with professionalism, diplomacy and respect, rather than a swaggering thug from a cheap telly game show......tells it exactly how it should be. Trump’s decision today to withdraw from the Iranian nuclear deal is a major strategic mistake that not only damages the United States’ ability to prevent Iran from acquiring the material for a nuclear weapon, but also impairs our ability to prevent the spread and use of nuclear weapons, to work with allies and partners on issues of global concern and to protect our interests in the Middle East for years, if not decades, to come. “The Iran deal is and has always been about depriving Iran of the nuclear materials—highly enriched uranium and plutonium—needed to make a weapon. As international inspectors, who have been on the ground every day since the deal was concluded, have confirmed: the Iran agreement has accomplished this. The fact that the advice of this nation’s most important allies was ignored in this decision adds to the consequence of the President's decision." https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/iran-nuclear-deal-live-updates-trump-hassan-rouhani-europe-france-us-latest-a8341146.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 Mmmmmm .... Because burning our flag the US flag in its parliament and shouting death to the US is a sign of sane people init Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John52 Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 By illegally invading Iraq and Libya, America has already shown dictators like Kim Jong Un the way to survive is to go nuclear. Now Trump goes one step further by showing you can't rely on America to keep to its word either :-( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 John52 - 2018-05-09 9:00 AM By illegally invading Iraq and Libya, America has already shown dictators like Kim Jong Un the way to survive is to go nuclear. Now Trump goes one step further by showing you can't rely on America to keep to its word either :-( There's been a war brewing with Iran for years, so far its just been proxy wars in other countries :-| ........ Maybe you should send Corbyn for a cuppa tea with the Ayatollah?........That'll sort it (lol) (lol) (lol) ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 It is all too easy to draw uninformed conclusions about anything from Nuclear to Brexit when all you have to go on is the media 'opinions' and published 'expert views'. On the surface of it it does look like Trump has acted precipitously but time and events to come alone will tell who was right and who was wrong, not media based opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soarer Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 John Bolton is calling the shots the guy is dangerous Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 The JCPOA probably had the Iranian regime laughing all the way to the bank setting them up rather nicely to be a far more potent enemy of the West in the future. On that I would agree with Trump. Not sure he's chosen the best course to remedy its shortcomings as that has yet to be seen. Brave or stupid only history will tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 soarer - 2018-05-09 12:12 PM John Bolton is calling the shots the guy is dangerous Your avatar is a perfect illustration of the position we should adopt once the missiles are incoming :D ....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted May 9, 2018 Author Share Posted May 9, 2018 John52 - 2018-05-09 9:00 AM By illegally invading Iraq and Libya, America has already shown dictators like Kim Jong Un the way to survive is to go nuclear. After Trumps childish goading and taunting of Kim only a few months ago failed, he's probably thinking of jumping into bed with him now. Now Trump goes one step further by showing you can't rely on America to keep to its word either :- Very true. Tracker - 2018-05-09 10:21 AM On the surface of it it does look like Trump has acted precipitously but time and events to come alone will tell who was right and who was wrong, not media based opinions. So we sit around and wait until the idiot starts blasting off his nukey toys he's itching to play with to see 'who was right/wrong'? Great! *-) soarer - 2018-05-09 12:12 PM John Bolton is calling the shots the guy is dangerous You're right. Bolton has a brain where Trump is a playground bully boy thug without a brain. Bolton has a dangerous mind, Trump a dangerous gob. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 Bulletguy - 2018-05-09 1:52 PM Tracker - 2018-05-09 10:21 AM On the surface of it it does look like Trump has acted precipitously but time and events to come alone will tell who was right and who was wrong, not media based opinions. So we sit around and wait until the idiot starts blasting off his nukey toys he's itching to play with to see 'who was right/wrong'? Great! There you go again, choosing to think along the same old lines as ever . To me at least I see far less risk of the US using nuclear weapons first than the likes of Iran and others and all the while we have the fallback of a better deterrent that makes a nuclear first use against the US and Europe less likely - but I don't expect any Corbynites to understand that concept. Agreed, the world would be a better place without nuclear weapons but as they do exist I would prefer to see them in the hands of responsible nations like the US, UK, France, and yes even Russia, and there is no way I could support us not having them in an insecure world! If Iran is blatantly telling lies to outwit the nuclear deal termst hen just maybe Trump is justified in coming down harder on them? Who knows as we only ever get fed what suits those in power who have the spies on the ground and very sophisticated satellites in the sky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 Violet1956 - 2018-05-09 12:55 PM . Brave or stupid only history will tell. The U.S. ( along with the rest ) signed an agreement with Iran. According to the experts on the ground in Iran, and some of Trumps own people, the Iranians have kept their side of the agreement. I don't see how Trumps decision to back out can be seen as " brave " - surely it only shows other countries that any agreement with Trump is not worth the paper it's written on ? ......... and the worst of it is that he plans sanctions against the rest of us if we keep our side of the agreement. :-| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted May 9, 2018 Author Share Posted May 9, 2018 malc d - 2018-05-09 2:27 PM Violet1956 - 2018-05-09 12:55 PM . Brave or stupid only history will tell. The U.S. ( along with the rest ) signed an agreement with Iran. According to the experts on the ground in Iran, and some of Trumps own people, the Iranians have kept their side of the agreement. I don't see how Trumps decision to back out can be seen as " brave " - surely it only shows other countries that any agreement with Trump is not worth the paper it's written on ? ......... and the worst of it is that he plans sanctions against the rest of us if we keep our side of the agreement. :-| Very well said Malc....perfectly summed up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 “Brave” in the sense that it is a risky way of getting a better deal that would weaken Iran’s military strength overall if that was Trump's intention. Although let's not kid ourselves, this isn't Trump's idea he's just a puppet. To my mind Iran is still a "rogue" state and an agreement that increases Iran's wealth and thus its firepower, even though short of nuclear capacity, did not go far enough to protect our allies including Israel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 Violet1956 - 2018-05-09 3:05 PM ........................................ did not go far enough to protect our allies including Israel. So you don't think Russia, China, France, Germany, the U.K and the U.S should have all signed it ? :-| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soarer Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-05-09 12:59 PM soarer - 2018-05-09 12:12 PM John Bolton is calling the shots the guy is dangerous Your avatar is a perfect illustration of the position we should adopt once the missiles are incoming :D ....... Exactly...he he Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 malc d - 2018-05-09 3:18 PM Violet1956 - 2018-05-09 3:05 PM ........................................ did not go far enough to protect our allies including Israel. So you don't think Russia, China, France, Germany, the U.K and the U.S should have all signed it ? :-| I accept some deal had to be made. All I know is that the Iranians are a duplicitous lot and that Trump, or whoever is pulling his strings, is right in that it probably didn’t go far enough and we can’t be confident that it is being effectively policed either. I doubt that all relevant evidence is in the public domain on that score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 One thing to bear in mind is it shows how little Trump cares for his relationships with the EU And more importantly the UK. He is setting fire to any foreign policy that he doesnt like and sod who it effects. It would have probably had more credibility if this move was based on any evidence of none compliance but where is it? This is the man that the Brexiteers are pinning their trade deal hopes on but we are insignificant to him now. Boris Johnson didnt even get to meet him, just some half arsed interview over Fox News. Macron and Merkle however got to go to the White House but he cast their opinions aside as well. This could have serious implications for people like Air Bus with current contracts for 100 air craft where the wings are manufactured in the UK and sanctions from the US are almost certainly going to affect that. Then of course further destabilisation of yet another middle eastern country could be the final straw for a lot of the down trodden citizens of Iran who are already at breaking point. If it all implodes then there's another load heading our way as refugees. Make no mistake, Trump will eventually fall out with everybody as he puts up his walls and flexes his (Well his military's) Muscles and pishes on everything from climate change to trade deals to peace keeping treaties. In some respects Im not bothered. I want nothing to do with them while he is in charge. Its another thorn in the side of Brexit as far as Im concerned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 malc d - 2018-05-09 2:27 PM Violet1956 - 2018-05-09 12:55 PM . Brave or stupid only history will tell. The U.S. ( along with the rest ) signed an agreement with Iran. According to the experts on the ground in Iran, and some of Trumps own people, the Iranians have kept their side of the agreement. :-| Perhaps they have ;-) .........All that proves is they'll take a bit longer to build a bomb :-| ......... It hasn't stopped their provoking Sunni and Shia bun fights in the rest of the Middle East.......Not that I give a Shiite of course being an Atheist :D .......... Religious nutters are all mad and bad in my book *-) .......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 pelmetman - 2018-05-09 4:59 PM It hasn't stopped their provoking Sunni and Shia bun fights in the rest of the Middle East.. Of course it didn't - that wasn't part of the deal that was signed. :-| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 malc d - 2018-05-09 5:32 PM pelmetman - 2018-05-09 4:59 PM It hasn't stopped their provoking Sunni and Shia bun fights in the rest of the Middle East.. Of course it didn't - that wasn't part of the deal that was signed. :-| Therein lies the rub does it not Malc? Iran’s increased wealth due to the lifting of sanctions provides support for the likes of Hezbollah and the Taliban. https://gandhara.rferl.org/a/afghanistan-iran-taliban-alliance/28399944.html Lie down with dogs and guess what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 malc d - 2018-05-09 5:32 PM pelmetman - 2018-05-09 4:59 PM It hasn't stopped their provoking Sunni and Shia bun fights in the rest of the Middle East.. Of course it didn't - that wasn't part of the deal that was signed. :-| Which kinda proves it was just a pointless exercise by the pretentious pious *-) ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 Barryd999 - 2018-05-09 4:37 PM One thing to bear in mind is it shows how little Trump cares for his relationships with the EU And more importantly the UK. He is setting fire to any foreign policy that he doesnt like and sod who it effects. It would have probably had more credibility if this move was based on any evidence of none compliance but where is it? This is the man that the Brexiteers are pinning their trade deal hopes on but we are insignificant to him now. Boris Johnson didnt even get to meet him, just some half arsed interview over Fox News. Macron and Merkle however got to go to the White House but he cast their opinions aside as well. This could have serious implications for people like Air Bus with current contracts for 100 air craft where the wings are manufactured in the UK and sanctions from the US are almost certainly going to affect that. Then of course further destabilisation of yet another middle eastern country could be the final straw for a lot of the down trodden citizens of Iran who are already at breaking point. If it all implodes then there's another load heading our way as refugees. Make no mistake, Trump will eventually fall out with everybody as he puts up his walls and flexes his (Well his military's) Muscles and pishes on everything from climate change to trade deals to peace keeping treaties. In some respects Im not bothered. I want nothing to do with them while he is in charge. Its another thorn in the side of Brexit as far as Im concerned. I get the feeling you dont like POTUS Trump ... Maybe I am reading it wrong ... I reckon you prefer ar8e lickers like Obama and the heads of the EU who'd quite gladly lie back and take one fir the boys when dealing with rogue states like Iran ... Jeez you wet whinge types ... Here we have someone who's just gobbed North Korea after years of pussy footing around ... Americans released today Barry did Obama get any of that ??? ... POTUS Trump does what he said during the election campaign and he dont give a fudge what wet wipes say Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted May 9, 2018 Share Posted May 9, 2018 Lest it be thought that I entirely agree with Antony and Dave P on this topic I must admit that I have chosen to play devil’s advocate. I am no fan of Trump but I am wary that the “horns” and “halo” effect may cloud my judgement. Malc, Barry, BG, John52 and others, who are appalled by Trump’s decision may be right. I respect their views as they take the trouble to make sure they are well-informed. Nevertheless, I would maintain that whether Trump’s move is going to be of benefit to “world peace” is too soon to call. Something in my gut tells me that we in the West are a tad too complacent about the vicious extremist Islamic regimes in the world that are inclined to view any willingness to compromise as weakness. I have very limited knowledge of international relations between the West and the countries in the Middle East but sometimes they seem to me to be a bit like my attempts to secure a good deal in the bazaar in Marrakech, which no one will be surprised to learn, I never did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted May 9, 2018 Author Share Posted May 9, 2018 malc d - 2018-05-09 3:18 PM Violet1956 - 2018-05-09 3:05 PM ........................................ did not go far enough to protect our allies including Israel. So you don't think Russia, China, France, Germany, the U.K and the U.S should have all signed it ? :-| I think that important 'bit' has got lost and reneging on the deal has given Iran the green light to restart their nuclear programme which they said they will do. Can't blame 'em but if anything kicks off big time then everyone needs remember who the lunatic was who started it. UK, Russia and Europe needs to distance itself from US now. It's becoming an out of control rogue nation and cannot be trusted. Bottom line is Trumps trashed it because the deal was done under Obama's admin and he hates Obama. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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