Advice on Autotrail Warranty and Dealer Support

[Bop]

G'Day All,

 

This is my first post so I've got my fingers crossed that all goes well.

 

As the story goes my wife and I took the plunge in Sep-16 and bought a new MH (Autotrail Imala 620 DD Hi-Line), while at the same time becoming new motor-homers. We did the deal at the end of the season so the choice of MHs was somewhat reduced but nevertheless we settled on the 620 and thought it would be ideal for touring around the country roads of Scotland (a favourite hobby of ours). We absolutely love our first four trips within our local area but we've decided that we will try some European travel in the summer and as such we want to change our van for a bigger version that better supports trips of 1-month and upwards.

 

On Wednesday of last week we went back to our local AT Dealer to look at part exchanging our van. Our MH is a 66-plate Euro-5 version and has had the tracker, Media Pack-1, awning, bike rack and solar panel systems fitted. It wasn't cheap and we expected to take a financial hit on the PX but we were shocked to hear that a new Euro-6 version would cost circa £47,000 to buy, excluding the extras, and that we would be offered £36,000.

 

I do know that I may get a better deal if I sell my MH privately so after picking myself up off the floor in the Autotrail sales office I asked the big question: "If I were to buy a new van from some other AT Dealer then would 'you guys' be able to service it and conduct any warranty issues if needed".

 

The response was "we would try and fit you in, can't promise, but you do have to realise that we need to put our own customers first".

 

I appreciate the fact that my question was a bit cheeky but I'm trying to save some money here and I naturally assumed that the 5 and 10-year warranties which Autotrail publicise would be honoured by any Autotrail Dealer.

 

There is also a chance that my wife and I may have to relocate down South (from the North East) so if we buy a van from a NE Dealer then could we potentially have future problems in claiming any future warranty from a dealer where we were not its customer.

 

Sorry for the long post but I know that it's in good hands with you knowledgeable fellows.

 

Best regards,

 

Andrew

[william4]

We live in the NE and we purchased our Tracker five years ago at Spinneys in Cheshire - plus £3000 ON PX for our 03 Pollensa compared to local AT dealer - my advice would be shop around, and have a word with Autotrail with regard to warranty work- don't think that there would be a problem getting the work done locally. Another avenue to explore is to try Marquis who have outlets nationwide and are now part of the same group as Autotrail - trigano

[Keithl]

Bop - 2017-02-06 10:25 AM

 

We absolutely love our first four trips within our local area but we've decided that we will try some European travel in the summer and as such we want to change our van for a bigger version that better supports trips of 1-month and upwards.

 

Andrew

 

Hi Andrew and welcome to the forum,

 

First thing I have to ask is 'Why'?

 

Just because you want to tour for longer does not mean you need a larger MH! In fact many MH'ers prefer smaller as it then easier to find camping spots, parking in cities is easier, ferries are cheaper, etc, etc...

 

Our AT Cheyenne is 6.5 m long and I would not want to go any larger for the ease it offers, and we have now owned it for 9 years!

 

Why not try at least one longer trip before condemning it?

 

Keith.

[foxy]

Hi Andrew, when I could not get booked into auto trail's own service centre at Grimsby they gave me the website of approved dealers they approve. www.approvedworkshops.co.uk. you punch in where you live and it gives you the nearest. I did and never looked back as it put me onto Springfield motorhomes in Bridlington and they have been brilliant.

 

hope this helps

Paul

[QFour]

Just remember that your contract is with the Dealer who supplied it in the first place. NOT the manufacturer. We had a Swift for a few years and although Swift say you can go to any Dealer but most don't want to know UNLESS you bought it from them. You can see why. If the guy has fell out with his supplying Dealer it only means one thing TROUBLE.

 

You will always take a hit on a new vehicle. £45,000 MH is £7,500 into the Vat system so you loose that as you drive off the premises. Then they have to sell it and pay Vat on the difference they bought it for and what they sell it for :-| ..

 

Shop around BUT the Dealer is one of the most important bits of the sale and don't expect the Dealer round the corner to be falling over themselves to help you in an emergency *-)

[Brian Kirby]

Keithl - 2017-02-06 12:31 PM

 

Bop - 2017-02-06 10:25 AM

 

We absolutely love our first four trips within our local area but we've decided that we will try some European travel in the summer and as such we want to change our van for a bigger version that better supports trips of 1-month and upwards.

 

Andrew

 

Hi Andrew and welcome to the forum,

 

First thing I have to ask is 'Why'?

 

Just because you want to tour for longer does not mean you need a larger MH! In fact many MH'ers prefer smaller as it then easier to find camping spots, parking in cities is easier, ferries are cheaper, etc, etc...

 

Our AT Cheyenne is 6.5 m long and I would not want to go any larger for the ease it offers, and we have now owned it for 9 years!

 

Why not try at least one longer trip before condemning it?

 

Keith.

I have to say I agree with the above. It will be costly to change, but if that is what you decide you need to do, you may do better on price by looking elsewhere. You don't say where you are based, but are there dealers for other makes within reasonable reach? You may find that a dealer selling other makes, offers a better trade-in just to get your business. After all, Autotrail are not the only player in the game.

 

You may also find that a dealer in a slightly different area has more competition, so offers better prices.

 

What you are really looking at is the cost to change, rather than what the selling price, or the p/x offer, is. If you negotiate around that, it may help get to a more acceptable deal.

 

I also agree that extended trips do not dictate larger vans. We have been touring around Europe since 2005, and until 2013 had vans that were just 6.0 metres long. Our present van is 6.75 metres, due to our choice of twin longitudinal beds. We are, and were, perfectly comfortable in these vans, in which we spend 8 - 12 weeks at a time, spring and autumn, and have visited most countries in western and central Europe, including Greece. As ever, these choices are personal matters. there is no "right", or "wrong".

 

However, there is clearly something about the layout of your Imala 620 that you don't like, and getting the layout right is the key to contentment. Now that you have gained experience, what is it that you are looking for, that the Imala lacks? If you can outline that, we may be able to suggest some alternatives.

 

The comments above regarding your contractual rights against the selling dealer are pertinent, as are those regarding warranty. Remember that only the dealer who sold you the van is legally obliged to rectify defects, and that his obligation to do so is not limited by the terms of the warranty. Also, bear in mind that the warranty is a largely unenforceable promise from the manufacturer, and that he is entitled to interpret its meaning as he sees fit. It is only the selling dealer who is legally obliged to be "reasonable".

 

The answer to your question regarding servicing and warranty work will lie largely within the warranty documents. You will be obliged to have certain work carried out (usually at least an annual damp check, sometimes more) in order to maintain the converter's warranty in force. Read the warranty terms carefully to be sure you know your obligations in this respect, with special regard to who may do this work. It is normally only authorised dealers who can do this, and failure to observe this will void your warranty. Make sure your service visits are properly recorded.

 

Regarding base vehicle warranty work and servicing, you should have no problems at all, but do carefully check the qualifying servicing intervals, as these change quite significantly from model to model, and variant to variant. That apart, any authorised repairer can carry out warranty work on the mechanical components, but beware those motorhome dealerships who claim to have Fiat (or whatever) trained mechanics in their workshops, and so can also carry out vehicle servicing. They are unlikely to be authorised to undertake warranty work, and any attempt to do so will be liable to void your base vehicle warranty. Mechanical servicing can be carried out by any competent garage - though I prefer to use a main dealer while the warranty is in force.

 

Note that the AlKo rear axle requires annual greasing, and that this is not a standard Fiat (or whoever) item. It is also unlikely to be carried out by an Autotrail dealer during whatever servicing they may execute. Consequently, many seem not to get greased' leading to eventual premature failure of the swinging arm bearings, which is expensive to remedy.

 

Whether a dealer from whom you didn't buy will service your van, or attend to warranty work is, despite the manufacturer's warranty's fine words, a bit of a lottery. The only answer that can be given is that some will, and some won't. Most will do the servicing work, because that earns revenue. Warranty work, however, may be refused - usually on the ground (if any is given) that the rates paid by the manufacturer do not reflect their costs. Some understand that if they treat you well you may buy your next van from them, others lack this attitude. My suspicion is that those who say no are less likely to be customer focused, so may be better avoided in any case. The ones who will carry out warranty work on vans that they didn't supply seem generally to be those with satisfied customers. It reflects a management attitude that seems to pervade the whole business.

[Bop]

Brian, Keith, William, Paul et al,

 

I would just like to thank you for all of your very useful responses. I've been chomping at the bit to get back to the forum following my initial post today but the boss (aka Mrs Bop) has kept me on our house project longer than I wanted. I have my human rights but she doesn't seem to understand that point :-D

 

The main reason for wanting to change the MH is our desire to have a rear lounge and a dining area at the same time. The current set-up of converting the dinette area to a double bed is fine but that extra space is something that we would both like. I've seen a few MHs which vary in length between 7m and 7.3m so that would be a marginal increase on our current 6.34m van.

 

I was not aware that the supplying dealer was actually the only POC for warranty issues but I've not exactly been impressed with the dealer too date. The Sales Team was/is second to none but the bit behind the scenes seems wanting in areas.

 

Too date I've not been rude to the dealer (not my MO) but I have told the guys that their PDI, in hindsight, was somewhat poor. This may be partially my fault as, during the collection of the van, I was so busy in trying to learn how to operate the heating/gas/water/power controls (as our first MH) that I didn't fully inspect the vehicle itself in great detail. I later found a few issues including: a ding to the bonnet; a ding to the NSF door crease; a badly repaired ding and paint job to the front GRP accommodation pod; a faulty LED strip light; three non functioning locks; two internal small rips/dings to the wall lining; a non-fitting front carpet with broken lugs; and many dozens of mastic smudges and dabs to the bodywork ( the largest being 9x8 inches in size). I later went back to the dealer to ask if they would repair the dings but was told that I should have inspected the van better during the handover of the vehicle. They also mentioned that they would never ding a vehicle while it was in their custody. This was a funny comment considering on Wednesday gone there was a big Autotrail MH in the sold section with its arse hanging off due to a reversing collision by one of the technicians. These guys seem happy to take your money but the after service is not that great.

 

You guys have been great and I can only thank you for your advice and support.

 

Very best,

 

Andrew

[Bop]

william4 - 2017-02-06 11:30 AM

 

We live in the NE and we purchased our Tracker five years ago at Spinneys in Cheshire - plus £3000 ON PX for our 03 Pollensa compared to local AT dealer - my advice would be shop around, and have a word with Autotrail with regard to warranty work- don't think that there would be a problem getting the work done locally. Another avenue to explore is to try Marquis who have outlets nationwide and are now part of the same group as Autotrail - trigano

 

Thanks William. I think I'll take a look up to Marquis at the weekend to see what they can offer.

 

Cheers,

 

Andrew

[Bop]

Morning All,

 

I've read the T&Cs as advised by you fine fellows and there are definitely some bits that are open to interpretation.

 

It does state that your first POC for all warranty work is the supplying dealer as per Sect 1.2 of the generic T&Cs, but it then stipulates in Sect 1.3 that Autotrail VR Ltd will 'through its dealer network' repair or replace ............... for 5-years, stipulations and caveats apply.

 

May I ask if anyone on the forum has had any experience of the following examples since my job may force me to move 250-miles South. ( I did read a post on MMM that someone had added 3,000 miles to their MH odometer due to the need for the broken MH to be returned consistently to its supplying dealer).

 

1. If my supplying dealer was in the North and I lived in the South then would I be able to access the southern dealership network?

 

2. If you were to sell a van privately then would the supplying dealer for the new purchaser (for the purpose of the Warranty T&Cs) be the dealer who first sold the vehicle.

 

This is a bit of a heavy subject for a Tuesday morning so apologies in advance.

 

Regards,

 

Andrew

[Derek Uzzell]

Bop - 2017-02-06 8:33 PM

 

...I was not aware that the supplying dealer was actually the only POC for warranty issues...

 

Andrew

 

If you re-read Brian’s posting I believe you’ll see that he did not say this.

 

Although your contract is with the Auto-Trail dealership that sold you your Imala motorhome and is responsible for repairing the faults that you have listed, it would be unrealistic to expect future warranty-related work to be carried out only by that dealership.

 

A map showing Auto-Trail dealerships can be found here

 

http://www.auto-trail.co.uk/find-a-dealership/auto-trail#search

 

Let’s say someone living in Scotland buys a new Auto-Trail motorhome from Perthshire Caravans near Dundee and shortly afterwards needs to move house to Exeter. In such an instance it would be ridiculous for Auto-Trail to insist that warranty-work should be performed only by the original vending dealership, rather than by a more-conveniently located dealership in south-west England. (This is the type of scenario you’ve mentioned regarding yourself.) And what happens if the original vending dealership should go bust shortly after a new motorhome is purchased, or decides not to continue as an Auto-Trail agent?

 

If you sell your Imala privately (or to another dealership) there should be no ‘carry over’ to the buyer of your contract with the Auto-Trail dealership that sold the Imala to you.

 

As Brian says, while some motorhome dealerships might well be reluctant to carry out under-warranty work on motorhomes they have not sold, that does not mean they cannot or that all dealerships will refuse to do this.

 

When it’s plain that physical damage to a vehicle has occurred before it was handed over to the buyer, there should be no argument about the vendor being responsible for getting the damage repaired. It might be difficult for the dealership to argue that you have any responsibility for the poor repair to the GRP accommodation pod, but I’m not sure what you can do about the ‘dings’ to the bonnet and door-crease if the dealership insists that these were not present when the motorhome was handed over to you and it’s not realistically possible to prove otherwise.

 

As you have some confidence in the dealership’s sales team, I suggest you take a tough line with them.

[Bop]

Morning Derek, that's very useful and clear info - very much appreciated.

 

I bet I don't come across as a new motor-homer, eh? :-D

[Brock]

Bop,

 

The offer for your motorhome on trade in seems realistic to me given that most people write off the VAT paid as they drive out of the dealers. That accounts for the first 20% of depreciation. New motorhomes with a Euro6 engine will be more expensive.

 

You bought the right motorhome for the right reasons at the time. I understand you now want a bigger motorhome for longer spells away on the Continent. But how big and what layout? How will you know what you will need until you go to across the Channel? Will you then get a sudden hankering to go in the winter after you have visited the Alpine pastures in the summer - we did? Visiting the Christmas Markets is very popular. You could buy a bigger van now, tour Europe and find it's the wrong van again.

 

I suggest you try out a European tour with your current van and see how you get on. Then if it works out OK, you'll then have a better idea of what you want next, may have moved south , and might find the depreciation slightly more palatable.

 

Also bear in mind that if you do move house, you might find it difficult to store a larger van. You might find that the house you want doesn't suit your bigger van or endear you to the neighbours.

 

When we moved house the last time, the house we wanted couldn't take the motorhome and there were no local storage yards. Almost all the modern houses had restrictive covenants on what you can and cannot park on the land. We deferred buying a new motorhome until we had found somewhere to live - fortunately with space to park the van behind the building line - but we are restricted to a maximum of 6.5m in length unless we use a now conveniently situated storage yard with a waiting list.

 

I'd put the house move ahead of the decision to change the motorhome.

[Mike88]

I note that it is your intention to use the van for longer periods away in Europe. That being the case your usage of the van is far different in warmer climates than in Scotland where you have motorhomed to date.

 

While you might not like the dining arrangements in your present van you may find when in Europe you will dine outside as frankly it will be too hot to bother eating in you van when temperatures are above 25 degrees. Most dine outside under a blind.

 

The question I would ask is why you need to change your motorhome so soon before you have even used the thing abroad?

 

My advice would be to go on your foreign travels and then decide whether your existing van meets your needs. That might avoid the possibility of wanting to change again on your return.

 

 

[Brian Kirby]

Bop - 2017-02-06 8:33 PM............................The main reason for wanting to change the MH is our desire to have a rear lounge and a dining area at the same time. The current set-up of converting the dinette area to a double bed is fine but that extra space is something that we would both like. I've seen a few MHs which vary in length between 7m and 7.3m so that would be a marginal increase on our current 6.34m van..............................Andrew

The layout you describe is very popular in UK, so there should be no problem finding vans to suit from UK manufacturers.

 

Oddly, it has never been that popular in continental Europe, though the February edition of Le Monde du Camping Car carries a brief review of 12 motorhomes with this layout. Inevitably, not all are represented in the UK market, though this changes from time to time, and I don't pretend to monitor who is acting as UK agent for which continental marque. So, I shall merely headline these 12 models, with a side note as to whether I think there may be a UK dealership.

 

Bear in mind that if you want a van for touring Europe left hand drive can be an advantage, and is not a significant disadvantage for use in UK, and that vans sourced direct from European dealerships can be personally imported, often at a substantial saving over UK cost (although in your present position, you would almost certainly have to sell privately to get the best price on your existing van, and p/x would be out of the question). If that idea appeals, I can suggest a possible way around this snag.

 

Prices quoted are claimed to be on the road in France, but should give some idea of comparative costs. The vans are:

 

Autostar Intégral I 720 SUA: (No UK Autostar dealer AFAIK). 7.39M long, 3,500kg MAM, 430kg payload (insufficient, IMO). €74,990.

Bavaria Profilé T 650/Intégral I 650 U: (No UK Bavaria dealer AFAIK). 6.5M long, 3500kg MAM, 680kg payload. €48,900/€60,900.

Benimar Mileo 282: (UK Benimar dealer/s). 6.95M long, 3500kg MAM, 461kg payload (very marginal, IMO). €52,995.

Bürstner Brevio T646: (UK Burstner dealers). 6.53M long, 3,500kg MAM, 705kg payload. €51,490.

Bürstner Lyseo T 744. 7.49M long, 3,500kg MAM, 408kg payload (insufficient, IMO). €57,480.

Challenger Profilé 291 Cruise Edition: (UK Challenger dealers). 6.96M long, 3,500kg MAM, 474kg payload (marginal, IMO). €55,990.

Chausson Profilé 611 Travel Line (A clone of the above, only available in France, AFAIK. The differences are in internal finishes, length, weight and price identical)

Hymer B 534 Duomobil: (UK Hymer dealers). 6.99M long, 3,500kg MAM, 455kg payload (marginal, IMO) €89,060! :-)

LMC Explorer I 655 G: (UK LMC [Lord Munsterland Caravans] dealer?). 6.86M long, 3,500kg MAM, 505kg payload (just adequate, IMO). €69,480.

Mobilvetta K-Yacht Tekno Line 80: (UK Mobilvetta dealers). 6.99M long, 338kg payload (joke, IMO!). €74,990.

Pilote Intégral G 650 U/Profilé P 650 U: (UK Pilote dealers). 6.5M long, 680kg payload. €60,900/€48,900.

Rapido Intégral 9094 dF: (UK Rapido dealers). 7.39M long, 3,500kg MAM, 680kg payload. €4,500.

 

Re moving: if you come 250 miles south from Durham, you end up somewhere on, or just south of, the Thames. You'd need to look for dealers around where you may be based and, depending on when you move, then decide whether to buy near Durham, or delay buying until after you move. If you do the latter, you will resolve potential problems over who to use for service/warranty.

 

Your AT sounds a bit of a mess when delivered. It is not the customer's job to inspect the van on delivery (though it is sensible to do so, in one's own interest), that is what you pay the dealer to do. His response is insolent, IMO.

 

FWIW, I have now imported three vans (Bürstner, Hobby and Hymer), one from France, and two from Germany via an excellent import agent. In all cases the vans were fault-free on delivery. Faults did arise during the warranty period on two, but were very satisfactorily resolved, under warranty, by UK dealers. So, it can be done - if the dealer applies himself diligently.

[Derek Uzzell]

A follow-up to Brian’s UK agency listing...

 

1: Bavaria

 

There is now a UK agency

 

http://www.oakwellmotorhomes.com/european-motorhomes/

 

2: Challenger/Chausson

 

There are no UK Challenger agencies, but quite a few UK Chausson dealerships.

 

https://www.chausson-motorhomes.com/contact-us/your-dealer/

 

The priority at this point should be to press the vending dealership to rectify the Imala’s faults. Should Andrew decide to exchange the motorhome or sell it privately, if noticeable faults are present this will negatively affect its value.

[PJay]

As others have said. try touring in Europe with your current van, if you like it as you say do. We have a 6.2 mtr van and tour for 3 months at any one time. You do not need any more "stuff" in van for long trips, They do have washing machines. In fact you probably need less clothes , as the weather is warmer, than Scotland They also have large supermarkets , which we usually use as you can park a van in car parks

Re service if you do move south , then wait and (if you must) buy one down here. I would not take that sort of lose on a year old van, just on a whim. Also larger vans are not always easy to find places in camp sites.

As has also been said, you do live outside most of the time., We have to make the bed up from the dinette, How long does it take ? A couple of minuets

TRY your current van abroad, first before you change. Who knows you may make another costly mistake in your second choice!

PJay

PS enjoy your first trip over the water

 

Having just looked up your model. i see it is the same layout as our swift, but we do have the over cab bed (which we no longer use) so have the storage space there. If you have a bike rack, you could put a box on the back for chairs etc A lot cheaper than a change of van, and it will be a 7 mtr length

PJay

[Brian Kirby]

Derek Uzzell - 2017-02-07 1:39 PM.................2: Challenger/Chausson

 

There are no UK Challenger agencies, but quite a few UK Chausson dealerships.

 

https://www.chausson-motorhomes.com/contact-us/your-dealer/

 

The priority at this point should be to press the vending dealership to rectify the Imala’s faults. Should Andrew decide to exchange the motorhome or sell it privately, if noticeable faults are present this will negatively affect its value.

Re Challenger/Chausson, guilty! My apologies for inverting the UK dealer position.

 

Re the outstanding defects, I agree. The dealer should have attended to this damage without arguing.

 

My only reservation regarding this is how long after delivery the bodywork faults were noticed, and whether they were immediately recorded back to the dealer. If notification was not until after the Scots trip, and the dealer knows that, then the case will, inevitably, be weaker. Of course, it may not be the dealer himself who is responsible for the body damage. I assume even ATs are delivered to the dealer on a transporter, so there is scope for damage during loading/unloading, or even at the factory before transporting.

 

But, it still falls to the dealer to have verified the condition of the vehicle, and to have rectified any defects, before handover. In effect, you/AT have paid him to do this work within the price you paid for the van. Just as you can't now provide proof positive that the damage was there on delivery, he can't provide proof positive that it wasn't. As Derek says, any visible damage will affect its resale value.

 

Besides, he needs shafting for that quip that you should have checked it more thoroughly on handover. Bloody cheek! Push your complaint higher up the management chain.

 

Edit to add, re the list of continental made vans (but equally applicable to UK made vans) and my comments re payload. Most, if not all, will be available with chassis upgrades to increase payload, albeit at additional cost. However, once over 3,500kg MAM, different (lower) speed limits will apply in much of continental Europe, and weight restrictions on rural roads/bridges, and in some towns, can be a bit of an pain.

[Bop]

Brock - 2017-02-07 11:35 AM

 

Bop,

 

The offer for your motorhome on trade in seems realistic to me given that most people write off the VAT paid as they drive out of the dealers. That accounts for the first 20% of depreciation. New motorhomes with a Euro6 engine will be more expensive.

 

You bought the right motorhome for the right reasons at the time. I understand you now want a bigger motorhome for longer spells away on the Continent. But how big and what layout? How will you know what you will need until you go to across the Channel? Will you then get a sudden hankering to go in the winter after you have visited the Alpine pastures in the summer - we did? Visiting the Christmas Markets is very popular. You could buy a bigger van now, tour Europe and find it's the wrong van again.

 

I suggest you try out a European tour with your current van and see how you get on. Then if it works out OK, you'll then have a better idea of what you want next, may have moved south , and might find the depreciation slightly more palatable.

 

Also bear in mind that if you do move house, you might find it difficult to store a larger van. You might find that the house you want doesn't suit your bigger van or endear you to the neighbours.

 

When we moved house the last time, the house we wanted couldn't take the motorhome and there were no local storage yards. Almost all the modern houses had restrictive covenants on what you can and cannot park on the land. We deferred buying a new motorhome until we had found somewhere to live - fortunately with space to park the van behind the building line - but we are restricted to a maximum of 6.5m in length unless we use a now conveniently situated storage yard with a waiting list.

 

I'd put the house move ahead of the decision to change the motorhome.

 

John, that's all interesting stuff for consideration so thanks for posting up. My wife and I are doing towards a dining area plus a rear seating area but I know from reading other MMM threads that ferry costs may become extortionate if the van is too big. We've only spent 8-days away (and 2 on our driveway) but it seems obvious to both of us that 'she' wants her space in the morning and I want mine, hence a van with two seating areas.

 

Our AT only has a handful of miles on the clock so would the mileage silting from a Euro trip effect the cost further or not?

 

What I do know about dealers is that they'll try everything in the book to reduce the PX cost if possible.

[Bop]

Mike88 - 2017-02-07 12:07 PM

 

I note that it is your intention to use the van for longer periods away in Europe. That being the case your usage of the van is far different in warmer climates than in Scotland where you have motorhomed to date.

 

While you might not like the dining arrangements in your present van you may find when in Europe you will dine outside as frankly it will be too hot to bother eating in you van when temperatures are above 25 degrees.

 

 

Mike, I've specifically picked up on the two paragraphs above as I was reading that AT vans have Level-3 insulation. I'm assuming that's good but do most vans have level-3 or is it just the AT variants.

 

Cheers, Andrew

[Bop]

Brian Kirby - 2017-02-07 1:04 PM

 

Bop - 2017-02-06 8:33 PM............................The main reason for wanting to change the MH is our desire to have a rear lounge and a dining area at the same time. The current set-up of converting the dinette area to a double bed is fine but that extra space is something that we would both like. I've seen a few MHs which vary in length between 7m and 7.3m so that would be a marginal increase on our current 6.34m van..............................Andrew

The layout you describe is very popular in UK, so there should be no problem finding vans to suit from UK manufacturers.

 

Oddly, it has never been that popular in continental Europe, though the February edition of Le Monde du Camping Car carries a brief review of 12 motorhomes with this layout. Inevitably, not all are represented in the UK market, though this changes from time to time, and I don't pretend to monitor who is acting as UK agent for which continental marque. So, I shall merely headline these 12 models, with a side note as to whether I think there may be a UK dealership.

 

Bear in mind that if you want a van for touring Europe left hand drive can be an advantage, and is not a significant disadvantage for use in UK, and that vans sourced direct from European dealerships can be personally imported, often at a substantial saving over UK cost (although in your present position, you would almost certainly have to sell privately to get the best price on your existing van, and p/x would be out of the question). If that idea appeals, I can suggest a possible way around this snag.

 

Prices quoted are claimed to be on the road in France, but should give some idea of comparative costs. The vans are:

 

Autostar Intégral I 720 SUA: (No UK Autostar dealer AFAIK). 7.39M long, 3,500kg MAM, 430kg payload (insufficient, IMO). €74,990.

Bavaria Profilé T 650/Intégral I 650 U: (No UK Bavaria dealer AFAIK). 6.5M long, 3500kg MAM, 680kg payload. €48,900/€60,900.

Benimar Mileo 282: (UK Benimar dealer/s). 6.95M long, 3500kg MAM, 461kg payload (very marginal, IMO). €52,995.

Bürstner Brevio T646: (UK Burstner dealers). 6.53M long, 3,500kg MAM, 705kg payload. €51,490.

Bürstner Lyseo T 744. 7.49M long, 3,500kg MAM, 408kg payload (insufficient, IMO). €57,480.

Challenger Profilé 291 Cruise Edition: (UK Challenger dealers). 6.96M long, 3,500kg MAM, 474kg payload (marginal, IMO). €55,990.

Chausson Profilé 611 Travel Line (A clone of the above, only available in France, AFAIK. The differences are in internal finishes, length, weight and price identical)

Hymer B 534 Duomobil: (UK Hymer dealers). 6.99M long, 3,500kg MAM, 455kg payload (marginal, IMO) €89,060! :-)

LMC Explorer I 655 G: (UK LMC [Lord Munsterland Caravans] dealer?). 6.86M long, 3,500kg MAM, 505kg payload (just adequate, IMO). €69,480.

Mobilvetta K-Yacht Tekno Line 80: (UK Mobilvetta dealers). 6.99M long, 338kg payload (joke, IMO!). €74,990.

Pilote Intégral G 650 U/Profilé P 650 U: (UK Pilote dealers). 6.5M long, 680kg payload. €60,900/€48,900.

Rapido Intégral 9094 dF: (UK Rapido dealers). 7.39M long, 3,500kg MAM, 680kg payload. €4,500.

 

Re moving: if you come 250 miles south from Durham, you end up somewhere on, or just south of, the Thames. You'd need to look for dealers around where you may be based and, depending on when you move, then decide whether to buy near Durham, or delay buying until after you move. If you do the latter, you will resolve potential problems over who to use for service/warranty.

 

Your AT sounds a bit of a mess when delivered. It is not the customer's job to inspect the van on delivery (though it is sensible to do so, in one's own interest), that is what you pay the dealer to do. His response is insolent, IMO.

 

FWIW, I have now imported three vans (Bürstner, Hobby and Hymer), one from France, and two from Germany via an excellent import agent. In all cases the vans were fault-free on delivery. Faults did arise during the warranty period on two, but were very satisfactorily resolved, under warranty, by UK dealers. So, it can be done - if the dealer applies himself diligently.

 

Hi Brian,

 

That is a fantastic collection of facts and figures - incredibly useful indeed. I do have a pal that is an importer (based in South Shields) so he would have no issues with importing a vehicle on my behalf. You really have given me food for thought and especially now that the Euro-GBP exchange rates may become more favourable in coming months. I'm going to hold that thought and investigate further.

 

Regarding the damage etc, I really do not like being stitched up by any dealer and once burnt then I have real problems in going back to them. It sound terrible but I like everyone to treat each other with respect from the outset and without issues or sly moves. To that end I have already sorted the issues for myself:

 

It took me 6-hours to remove the mastic and a further 5-hours to waxoil the underbody. The dings and shell were all sorted by friends for less than £120, albeit I owe them favours now, and the rest of the stuff was rectified by me. It is sad to say but the Imala is now in a proper dealer condition. To add to the problems but it took me a further 2-hours to remove all of the residue from the delivery stickers. This was done with half a bottle of Autoglyms own tar remover; I forgot to mention that one.

 

Enough of my waffle so I'll leave it here by thanking you again for your suburb help and advice.

 

 

[cleddytanhouse]

Sadly, your experience with Autotrail mirrors my own. My tracker is not yet 2 years old. In the first year, 1000 miles of the 3000 it had clocked up, we're going back on forth to the dealer. When I complained to the dealer, they wrote back saying that I should expect problems in the first year!!!!!

They said that they would contact AT regarding any compensation, but, nothing was forthcoming.

The second year has been better, but, a major flood from a disconnected sink waste may have ongoing consequences.

For a so called "quality" manufacturer, Autotrail have some way to go to match that description!!!

[Bop]

PJay - 2017-02-07 2:02 PM

 

As others have said. try touring in Europe with your current van, if you like it as you say do. We have a 6.2 mtr van and tour for 3 months at any one time. You do not need any more "stuff" in van for long trips, They do have washing machines. In fact you probably need less clothes , as the weather is warmer, than Scotland

 

Having just looked up your model. i see it is the same layout as our swift...................

 

PJay

 

Hi PJay, that's good advice but trying telling that to my wife and her umpteen trunks of stuff. I'm a military guy through and through so I can live out of a Tesco bag but the missus seems to want to take spare of everything.

 

Put it this way; I am very conscience of the axle weight of the van but she must push me close to it every time.

 

Incidentally, Pjay, I was looking at a Swift the other day and it looked very spacious and comfortable but in comparison the Autotrail range in general seems incredibly dull.

 

All the best,

 

Andrew

[Bop]

cleddytanhouse - 2017-02-07 8:02 PM

 

Sadly, your experience with Autotrail mirrors my own. My tracker is not yet 2 years old. In the first year, 1000 miles of the 3000 it had clocked up, we're going back on forth to the dealer. When I complained to the dealer, they wrote back saying that I should expect problems in the first year!!!!!

They said that they would contact AT regarding any compensation, but, nothing was forthcoming.

The second year has been better, but, a major flood from a disconnected sink waste may have ongoing consequences.

For a so called "quality" manufacturer, Autotrail have some way to go to match that description!!!

 

That is sad to hear Cleddy. I hope my comment doesn't offend anyone but I've got the impression recently from looking at the AT range that there are far better vans on the market these days.

 

Ive been around our Imala with a fine tooth comb and it looks as if Autotrail has used the best components of a weetabix box and have integrated them into a Tupperware tub.

 

Sorry!

[ray love]

cleddytanhouse - 2017-02-07 8:02 PM

 

Sadly, your experience with Autotrail mirrors my own. My tracker is not yet 2 years old. In the first year, 1000 miles of the 3000 it had clocked up, we're going back on forth to the dealer. When I complained to the dealer, they wrote back saying that I should expect problems in the first year!!!!!

They said that they would contact AT regarding any compensation, but, nothing was forthcoming.

The second year has been better, but, a major flood from a disconnected sink waste may have ongoing consequences.

For a so called "quality" manufacturer, Autotrail have some way to go to match that description!!!

:-( We had the same problem with our new Delaware water poured through under the sink requiring a complete drying with a hairdryer in every nook and cranny, the pipes are only a push fit and part company very easily, I've now taped all the joints up

Ray.

[Mike88]

Bop - 2017-02-07 7:42 PM

 

Mike88 - 2017-02-07 12:07 PM

 

I note that it is your intention to use the van for longer periods away in Europe. That being the case your usage of the van is far different in warmer climates than in Scotland where you have motorhomed to date.

 

While you might not like the dining arrangements in your present van you may find when in Europe you will dine outside as frankly it will be too hot to bother eating in you van when temperatures are above 25 degrees.

 

 

Mike, I've specifically picked up on the two paragraphs above as I was reading that AT vans have Level-3 insulation. I'm assuming that's good but do most vans have level-3 or is it just the AT variants.

 

Cheers, Andrew

 

While your van is well insulated you will still find that it will get uncomfortably hot inside in a Mediterranean climate. You will spend most of your time out of doors including I suspect dining.

 

As for needing separate space to your wife in the mornings can't you go outside and relax in a chair as that is the best part of the day? I find that to be a great way to start the day with a cup of tea and a book in the peace and quiet. Most people in fact consume breakfast outside as well as other meals.

 

Of course it all depends where and when you propose to spend your holiday but the 4 summer months in the Med do get incredibly hot.