747 Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 Just to be aware at Calais. The report is from the Daily Express which is pro Brexit but I doubt it is a fabrication. http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/681614/Calais-migrants-refugees-Britain-UK-EU-referendum-Brexit-Euro-2016 I am aware that British TV Channels never show any of this type of problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billggski Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 Don't see why the express prints this other than to stoke up tension. These aren't eu citizens so brexit wouldn't make any difference, unless France decides to stop processing passports on their side and moves the "jungle" to Kent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuartO Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 It was reported by the BBC recently that migrants had tried swimming across the harbour in the small hours to board a ferry and it took several hours to get the ferry traffic moving again but I hadn't heard anything about this stoning incident - nor that French police were expressing the view that migrants are "getting more dangerous". The swimming incident presumably reflects the increasing difficulty which migrants have encountered because of the new security fencing and it makes sense that the migrants will try other ways of getting to UK and this might include escalating violence - including violence towards the vehicles of ferry/tunnel users which is presumably an expression of their frustration. Let's face it the migrants are not likely to just quietly give up and go away so some permanent solution to the gatherings of migrants at ports of access to UK is still needed. It's down to the politicians to work something out but there is no sign of anything in the way of new thinking so far. It must be very frustrating being a French CRS policeman in the Calais/Dunkirk area at the present time too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 Billggski - 2016-06-21 3:51 PM Don't see why the express prints this other than to stoke up tension. These aren't eu citizens so brexit wouldn't make any difference, unless France decides to stop processing passports on their side and moves the "jungle" to Kent. And thats precisely what it is.....nothing more and nothing less. The first paragraph alone should be enough to tell anyone with a grain of common sense. After last weeks horrendous murder of Jo Cox i think we've all seen enough hatred and divisiveness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webby1 Posted June 21, 2016 Share Posted June 21, 2016 Absolutely right Bulletguy I have seen nothing in the Brexit campaign that does not boil down to Johnny Foreigner tell us what to do........................... them immigrants coming over here....................... oh and we won the war as well. For so many it is the bottom line of what they call sovereignity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
747 Posted June 21, 2016 Author Share Posted June 21, 2016 webby1 - 2016-06-21 9:17 PM Absolutely right Bulletguy I have seen nothing in the Brexit campaign that does not boil down to Johnny Foreigner tell us what to do........................... them immigrants coming over here....................... oh and we won the war as well. For so many it is the bottom line of what they call sovereignity. Then why are up to 8 EU members starting to ask for their own referendum? Why do some Germans want a UK out vote to happen (to kick start their own movement)? Even the French are p***ed off with the EU. For Brexit supporters it's a win win. A UK OUT vote will just bring it about quicker. The end is nigh, the EU is doomed ..... doomed I tell e'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StuartO Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 And there was me thinking this thread was about problems for motorhomers at Calais...... Hasn't there been another thread on Chatterbox running for some time about Brexit and the EU? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
747 Posted June 22, 2016 Author Share Posted June 22, 2016 StuartO - 2016-06-22 8:09 AMAnd there was me thinking this thread was about problems for motorhomers at Calais...... Hasn't there been another thread on Chatterbox running for some time about Brexit and the EU? Webby started it Sir ...... give him detention. :-> As for some of the replies, how does a Somali or an Afghan refugee (economic migrant?) understand the ramifications of a UK referendum? Rumours spread like wildfire and I would suspect there is at least some truth in the report.It is no coincidence either that a large convoy of cars were prevented from leaving the UK on their alleged 'Aid' trip to the migrants. The Aid itself (in one large lorry) was allowed through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 webby1 - 2016-06-21 9:17 PM oh and we won the war as well. Two actually :D ......... Although this ones on a knife edge :-S .......... It'll be the migrant crisis that'll do for the EU eventually >:-)........ Unless they manage to control it........and how are they going to control it ;-) .......... By inviting more migrants 8-) .......... You couldn't make it up (lol) (lol) (lol) ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mel64 Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 Just when I thought it was about Calais, just passed though no problem ask other motor homers same no problems. French TV not mentioned although fair to say fuel shortage not mentioned. Take your pick who is telling Truth ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
747 Posted June 22, 2016 Author Share Posted June 22, 2016 Billggski - 2016-06-21 3:51 PM Don't see why the express prints this other than to stoke up tension. These aren't eu citizens so brexit wouldn't make any difference, unless France decides to stop processing passports on their side and moves the "jungle" to Kent. You may be suspicious of the Daily Express but what about the BBC? I am suspicious of the BBC as they have been playing down the trouble in Calais to please someone. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-kent-36578348 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave225 Posted June 24, 2016 Share Posted June 24, 2016 Came through the Tunnel on the 22nd. No problems at all. Arrived early but unfortunately could not 'jump' to an earlier train, but not a big idssue. No real checks of the van except to see if the gas was off. My only 'grump' was we passed throuigh UK Border ontrol and then went into the departure lounge appropriately called 'Charles Dickens' to visit WH Smith for a paper, and were charged 2.50 euors indstead of the 60p it is normally. Why am I in Britain but still charged in euros I wonder, oh yes, proifiteering. I forgot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candapack Posted June 24, 2016 Share Posted June 24, 2016 Billggski - 2016-06-21 3:51 PM Don't see why the express prints this other than to stoke up tension. These aren't eu citizens so brexit wouldn't make any difference, unless France decides to stop processing passports on their side and moves the "jungle" to Kent. Which if I was French I would be expecting my Government to do as soon as they can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antony1969 Posted June 24, 2016 Share Posted June 24, 2016 candapack - 2016-06-24 8:33 PM Billggski - 2016-06-21 3:51 PM Don't see why the express prints this other than to stoke up tension. These aren't eu citizens so brexit wouldn't make any difference, unless France decides to stop processing passports on their side and moves the "jungle" to Kent. Which if I was French I would be expecting my Government to do as soon as they can. Well thankfully the French government have already confirmed no change in the immigration treaties with UK So no problem other than we pay £7 million quid to help police Calais after those lovely young men have travelled through Europe to get the promised land Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted June 24, 2016 Share Posted June 24, 2016 The Mayor of Calais has spoken http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-36626553?intlink_from_url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.bbc.co.uk%2Fnews%2Flive%2Fuk-politics-36570120&link_location=live-reporting-story%3FSThisFB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted June 24, 2016 Share Posted June 24, 2016 The article I posted is not quite accurate. There will be no jungle in Kent. If our border with France becomes more penetrable there will be more migrants to house and feed until their asylum claims are processed after they reach the UK. Many of those are under (or claim to be) under the age of 18 and become looked after children i.e. Local Authorities have to put them in care) straining our Children's services. It is essential that those who are taking forward the Brexit vote that they do all they can to negotiate with France to retain the Le Touquet agreement. I wish them success but I have my doubts about their ability to achieve it. :-( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted June 25, 2016 Share Posted June 25, 2016 Violet1956 - 2016-06-24 10:47 PM The article I posted is not quite accurate. There will be no jungle in Kent. If our border with France becomes more penetrable there will be more migrants to house and feed until their asylum claims are processed after they reach the UK. Many of those are under (or claim to be) under the age of 18 and become looked after children i.e. Local Authorities have to put them in care) straining our Children's services. It is essential that those who are taking forward the Brexit vote that they do all they can to negotiate with France to retain the Le Touquet agreement. I wish them success but I have my doubts about their ability to achieve it. :-( Its clear that they are not asylum seekers but economic migrants or else they would've claimed asylum in the first safe country they arrived in :-| .......... So no need to treat them as asylum seekers *-) ........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted June 25, 2016 Share Posted June 25, 2016 pelmetman - 2016-06-25 8:13 AM Violet1956 - 2016-06-24 10:47 PM The article I posted is not quite accurate. There will be no jungle in Kent. If our border with France becomes more penetrable there will be more migrants to house and feed until their asylum claims are processed after they reach the UK. Many of those are under (or claim to be) under the age of 18 and become looked after children i.e. Local Authorities have to put them in care) straining our Children's services. It is essential that those who are taking forward the Brexit vote that they do all they can to negotiate with France to retain the Le Touquet agreement. I wish them success but I have my doubts about their ability to achieve it. :-( Its clear that they are not asylum seekers but economic migrants or else they would've claimed asylum in the first safe country they arrived in :-| .......... So no need to treat them as asylum seekers *-) ........... Unfortunately Dave that is not the law. The Refugee Convention which we signed up to in 1951 does not allow countries to reject asylum claims out of hand because the claimant has passed through a safe country. It is not something that is ignored when their claims are considered however. Section 8 of the Asylum and Immigration (Treatment of Claimants, etc.) Act 2004 requires decision makers to take into account their failure to claim asylum in a safe country as damaging their credibility (note our own piece of legislation nothing foisted on us by Europe). But it is not the starting point for consideration of their bona fides as refugees. Sometimes it weighs heavily against them and sometimes it does not. :-( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted June 25, 2016 Share Posted June 25, 2016 Violet1956 - 2016-06-25 9:18 AM pelmetman - 2016-06-25 8:13 AM Violet1956 - 2016-06-24 10:47 PM The article I posted is not quite accurate. There will be no jungle in Kent. If our border with France becomes more penetrable there will be more migrants to house and feed until their asylum claims are processed after they reach the UK. Many of those are under (or claim to be) under the age of 18 and become looked after children i.e. Local Authorities have to put them in care) straining our Children's services. It is essential that those who are taking forward the Brexit vote that they do all they can to negotiate with France to retain the Le Touquet agreement. I wish them success but I have my doubts about their ability to achieve it. :-( Its clear that they are not asylum seekers but economic migrants or else they would've claimed asylum in the first safe country they arrived in :-| .......... So no need to treat them as asylum seekers *-) ........... Unfortunately Dave that is not the law. The Refugee Convention which we signed up to in 1951 does not allow countries to reject asylum claims out of hand because the claimant has passed through a safe country. It is not something that is ignored when their claims are considered however. Section 8 of the Asylum and Immigration (Treatment of Claimants, etc.) Act 2004 requires decision makers to take into account their failure to claim asylum in a safe country as damaging their credibility (note our own piece of legislation nothing foisted on us by Europe). But it is not the starting point for consideration of their bona fides as refugees. Sometimes it weighs heavily against them and sometimes it does not. :-( Well now we're soon to be in control of our own laws.......we can change them ;-) ...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted June 25, 2016 Share Posted June 25, 2016 pelmetman - 2016-06-25 9:34 AM Violet1956 - 2016-06-25 9:18 AM pelmetman - 2016-06-25 8:13 AM Violet1956 - 2016-06-24 10:47 PM The article I posted is not quite accurate. There will be no jungle in Kent. If our border with France becomes more penetrable there will be more migrants to house and feed until their asylum claims are processed after they reach the UK. Many of those are under (or claim to be) under the age of 18 and become looked after children i.e. Local Authorities have to put them in care) straining our Children's services. It is essential that those who are taking forward the Brexit vote that they do all they can to negotiate with France to retain the Le Touquet agreement. I wish them success but I have my doubts about their ability to achieve it. :-( Its clear that they are not asylum seekers but economic migrants or else they would've claimed asylum in the first safe country they arrived in :-| .......... So no need to treat them as asylum seekers *-) ........... Unfortunately Dave that is not the law. The Refugee Convention which we signed up to in 1951 does not allow countries to reject asylum claims out of hand because the claimant has passed through a safe country. It is not something that is ignored when their claims are considered however. Section 8 of the Asylum and Immigration (Treatment of Claimants, etc.) Act 2004 requires decision makers to take into account their failure to claim asylum in a safe country as damaging their credibility (note our own piece of legislation nothing foisted on us by Europe). But it is not the starting point for consideration of their bona fides as refugees. Sometimes it weighs heavily against them and sometimes it does not. :-( Well now we're soon to be in control of our own laws.......we can change them ;-) ...... We can't unilaterally amend the Refugee Convention. We would need to withdraw from it or the Contracting Parties would have to agree to amend it I believe.. As far as I am aware no country that has ratified the Refugee Convention has withdrawn from it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted June 25, 2016 Share Posted June 25, 2016 This is interesting. A petition seeking that parliament debate withdrawal from the Refugee Convention closed with only 145 signatures in February 2016. https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/104797 Veronica Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted June 25, 2016 Share Posted June 25, 2016 Violet1956 - 2016-06-25 10:20 AM This is interesting. A petition seeking that parliament debate withdrawal from the Refugee Convention closed with only 145 signatures in February 2016. https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/104797 Veronica No doubt "if" they move the border back to the UK and "if" it becomes a bigger problem........then I suspect they'll get a lot more than 145 signatures ;-) ...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 Violet1956 - 2016-06-25 9:18 AM pelmetman - 2016-06-25 8:13 AM Violet1956 - 2016-06-24 10:47 PM The article I posted is not quite accurate. There will be no jungle in Kent. If our border with France becomes more penetrable there will be more migrants to house and feed until their asylum claims are processed after they reach the UK. Many of those are under (or claim to be) under the age of 18 and become looked after children i.e. Local Authorities have to put them in care) straining our Children's services. It is essential that those who are taking forward the Brexit vote that they do all they can to negotiate with France to retain the Le Touquet agreement. I wish them success but I have my doubts about their ability to achieve it. :-( Its clear that they are not asylum seekers but economic migrants or else they would've claimed asylum in the first safe country they arrived in :-| .......... So no need to treat them as asylum seekers *-) ........... Unfortunately Dave that is not the law. The Refugee Convention which we signed up to in 1951 does not allow countries to reject asylum claims out of hand because the claimant has passed through a safe country. It is not something that is ignored when their claims are considered however. Section 8 of the Asylum and Immigration (Treatment of Claimants, etc.) Act 2004 requires decision makers to take into account their failure to claim asylum in a safe country as damaging their credibility (note our own piece of legislation nothing foisted on us by Europe). But it is not the starting point for consideration of their bona fides as refugees. Sometimes it weighs heavily against them and sometimes it does not. :-( Under the present situation i suggest we revoke our inclusion in the act. NO jungle or equivalent in Kent. If travellers or stowaways dont have the relevent visas or work permits. Ship them right back to where they came from. And fine the shipping line that allowed them to board. Job done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Violet1956 Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 Rayjsj - 2016-06-26 11:33 AM Under the present situation i suggest we revoke our inclusion in the act. NO jungle or equivalent in Kent. If travellers or stowaways dont have the relevent visas or work permits. Ship them right back to where they came from. And fine the shipping line that allowed them to board. Job done. Nothing wrong with the Act I mentioned. If an illegal entrant claims asylum in the UK then the Act says it goes against them. The UK can't legislate to the effect that a faiure to claim in a safe country means that the asylum seeker can just be sent back to their country of origin without considering their asylum claim. We can only do that if we withdraw from the Refugee Convention or we manage to persuade the current countries of the UN who have ratified it that it should be amended to state that. Don't shoot me though. I am only the messenger! I can quite understand why people are so fed up with the situation. There are many who feel that the Refugee Convention is past its sell -by date and does not reflect the current realities of the modern world or the current needs of those facing persecution or other forms of serious harm in their countries of origin. The scale of abuse of the system is naturally a concern as is the criminality and callousness of people traffickers. Veronica Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 Violet1956 - 2016-06-26 1:18 PM Rayjsj - 2016-06-26 11:33 AM Under the present situation i suggest we revoke our inclusion in the act. NO jungle or equivalent in Kent. If travellers or stowaways dont have the relevent visas or work permits. Ship them right back to where they came from. And fine the shipping line that allowed them to board. Job done. Nothing wrong with the Act I mentioned. If an illegal entrant claims asylum in the UK then the Act says it goes against them. The UK can't legislate to the effect that a faiure to claim in a safe country means that the asylum seeker can just be sent back to their country of origin without considering their asylum claim. We can only do that if we withdraw from the Refugee Convention or we manage to persuade the current countries of the UN who have ratified it that it should be amended to state that. Don't shoot me though. I am only the messenger! I can quite understand why people are so fed up with the situation. There are many who feel that the Refugee Convention is past its sell -by date and does not reflect the current realities of the modern world or the current needs of those facing persecution or other forms of serious harm in their countries of origin. The scale of abuse of the system is naturally a concern as is the criminality and callousness of people traffickers. Veronica If they do move the border to the UK...... the irony will be that there won't be any camp, they'll be up the M20 like rats up a drainpipe to London ;-) .............. Looks like those folk who live in London, will still get the open door migration they wanted :D ....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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