dawki Posted September 19, 2018 Share Posted September 19, 2018 Hi just finally ordering new tyres for the motorhome 235/65/16 119-121 load I have a choice of vanco 2 or van contact any one has any info on which are better for a 3850kg van. Any info much appreciated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted September 19, 2018 Share Posted September 19, 2018 What do Continental say, as they probably know more about the application specifications of their own tyres than anyone else? And if you are very lucky you might even get recommended tyre pressures too, hopefully a lot less than the ridiculously hard pressure that Fiat say Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted September 19, 2018 Share Posted September 19, 2018 those numbers make no sense, that aside, originally had Vanco2's on the van, not overly impressed, now have Van Contact 100's on the back, these have a better wet rating than the Vanco's and when looking at them they have wider gaps on the tread. Would have got Van Contact 200's but they aren't available for the load rating needed for my van. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dawki Posted September 19, 2018 Author Share Posted September 19, 2018 Oops should say 235/65/16 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted September 19, 2018 Share Posted September 19, 2018 Dawki, Assuming you mean 235/65 R 16 with a 10 Ply rating then from page 75 of this Conti Tyres booklet it seems that only Vanco 2 are available in your selected Load Index. Vanco Contact 2 are not available with a LI above 105. https://blobs.continental-tires.com/www8/servlet/blob/85806/e0854f2c7866c64da551474b998ef8b3/download-technical-databook-data.pdf Pressure v Load ratings are given on pages 88/89. Keith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starvin marvin Posted September 19, 2018 Share Posted September 19, 2018 dawki - 2018-09-19 7:29 PM Hi just finally ordering new tyres for the motorhome 235/65/16 119-121 load I have a choice of vanco 2 or van contact any one has any info on which are better for a 3850kg van. Any info much appreciated Why haven’t you included Continental Vanco Camper? We have these on ours, much preferred to Michelin offerings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted September 19, 2018 Share Posted September 19, 2018 starvin marvin - 2018-09-19 8:04 PM dawki - 2018-09-19 7:29 PM Hi just finally ordering new tyres for the motorhome 235/65/16 119-121 load I have a choice of vanco 2 or van contact any one has any info on which are better for a 3850kg van. Any info much appreciated Why haven’t you included Continental Vanco Camper? We have these on ours, much preferred to Michelin offerings. Vanco Campers (at least the ones on blackcirlces) in that size are not up to the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted September 19, 2018 Share Posted September 19, 2018 For some reason I've been bumped off Blackcircles and can't get back on, but I'm sure I saw Van Cantact 200's in your size and rating, these would be the ones I'd go for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted September 19, 2018 Share Posted September 19, 2018 colin - 2018-09-19 8:19 PM starvin marvin - 2018-09-19 8:04 PM dawki - 2018-09-19 7:29 PM Hi just finally ordering new tyres for the motorhome 235/65/16 119-121 load I have a choice of vanco 2 or van contact any one has any info on which are better for a 3850kg van. Any info much appreciated Why haven’t you included Continental Vanco Camper? We have these on ours, much preferred to Michelin offerings. Vanco Campers (at least the ones on blackcirlces) in that size are not up to the job. Yep, follow my link above and VanContact Campers in your size are only listed with a LI of 115. Keith. PS Why do you need a LI of 121/119? I would have thought 115 would be adequate for 3,850 kg??? PPS I run a GVW of 3,800 kg with a LI of 112 so cannot understand why need to go above 115? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dawki Posted September 19, 2018 Author Share Posted September 19, 2018 Hi many thanks for your replies Origanal tyres are 121 loading and I am sure it was the rear axle capacity that warrant that Continental contact do seem to be available https://www.kwik-fit.com/tyres/search/details/continental/vanco-contact-2/t1002726 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aandncaravan Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 I thought the Vanco 2 was a later tyre with more grip overall? The Conti and Vanco 'Eco' have a 'B' Energy/fuel saving rating with 'low rolling resistance' which usually translates to low grip in the dry? Don't forget to specify you would like newly manufactured tyres, a couple of sets delivered to us were over a year old. One set had a 3 year old tyre as part of it. The Michelin van tyres, in our experience, have in the past had a better resistance to cracking than the Continental van tyre, but that experience was for vey old tyres and recent Rubber compounds may have changed. Load rating and Speed ratings are usually similar. Michelins significantly quieter. The Continental, that is all Vanco 1, Vanco 2 and Conti - 235/65 R16 are more usually rated 121/119R. That is a rating of 121 as being able to carry 1,450kg or 2,720kg per axle. Michelins similar, see chart below. Continental Campers 235/65 R16 CP are lower 115R, as per most van tyres - 1215kg per tyre, 2430kg per axle. However, the load index on a tyre is ABSOLUTELY related to it's tyre pressure, which you should always seek from the tyre manufacturer. A tyre with a load index of 1,450 kg at 30psi will not carry the same weight as a 1215 kg at it's correct 65PSI, or whatever pressure. If it was me, I would always go for the highest load rating as you can't be sure when tyre pressure drops, giving quite a safety margin. This website is very good for doing tyre comparisons ; https://www.camskill.co.uk/m91b0s2219p0/Van_Tyres_-_Trailer_Tyres_-_Caravan_Tyres_-_Motorhome_Tyres_-_Minibus_Tyres_-_16_inch_R16_inch_-_235_65_16_235_65R16 Evergreen have just introduced a 119/1450kg Tyre - Evergreen EV516 - 235/65 R16 C 121R TL with a Rain/wet weather rating of 'B' at £80, but it's a bit noiser than a Michelin. When choosing a tyre for a motorhome we would suggest you opt for at least a 'C' wet weather rating but nothing better than a 'C'/'D' for Energy/Fuel Saving as the best tyres for saving fuel are usually 'low rolling resistance' that usually translates into 'Low grip'. Hifly have also introduced the new Hifly Super 2000 Van -235/65 R16 C 121R at £60 with a Rain rating of 'C'? With being broke and not exactly needing the best long life tyres because of my Cancer I fitted cheap Hifly tyres to the front of my Mitsubishi 7 seater about 4 weeks ago. I am really impressed by the grip in both wet and dry. They are far, far superior to the supposedly better budgets I have moved to the rear. I am not recommending £60 HiFly Motorhome tyres, just amazed that the Chinese really do seem to be giving tyre quality a higher priority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 It’s possible to obtain Continental Vanco FourSeason and Michelin’s Agilis CrossClimate tyres in (Mercedes Sprinter suitable) 235/65 R16C 121/119N specification. https://tinyurl.com/yay6r6cd Both of those are arguably a better choice for a motorhome than Vanco-2 or VanContact. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aandncaravan Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 Derek, They are much more expensive tyres and ratings that I suspect have lower grip in both dry and wet than the Summer versions. The Vancontact 4 season is 'A'/'B' wet/low rolling resistance, which IMO, goes to far as stated above. The Wet grip tests focus on Aquplaning in deep water, much more so than the usual conditions we encounter in the UK. As a result the 'A' rated tyres tend to have very wide open grooves with less real rubber 'blocks' on the road. The low rolling resistance is often achieved by compromising grip as well, often using harder compound rubber. Clearly a tyre that has good soft grippy rubber will not get a low rolling resistance rating. This can compromise 'normal' wet driving and Dry driving to some extent. So better than a 'C' should be avoided for rolling resistance/energy saving, if safety is important, IMO. While a 'A' wet rating might initially look the best, check out just how wide some of these 'Drainage' channels are and how little rubber is actually on the road. At £176, in your link, that is a huge amount more. Not that I am obessed by tyre technology or anything like that!!! :$ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 On my car I've changed the Conti premium contact for Michelin cross climate, these give better grip all year. At one time I had the Michelin Cross Climates on rear and Conti's on the front, but I changed the Conti's on the front even thou they had plenty of tread left as they where so poor compared to the Michelins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 aandncaravan - 2018-09-20 10:44 AM Derek, They are much more expensive tyres and ratings that I suspect have lower grip in both dry and wet than the Summer versions. The Vancontact 4 season is 'A'/'B' wet/low rolling resistance, which IMO, goes to far as stated above... The only recentish independent exhaustive test I’m aware of that has compared tyres that would be ‘motorhome suitable’ was carried out by the German motorhome magazine Promobil in 2013 and involved panel-van conversions and six tyres with a 215/70 R15C 109 specification. Continental’s VancoCamper and Michelin’s Agilis Camping and Agilis+ were included in the test, but the clear winner was Hankook’s Vantra LT RA18. Out of interest I compared the manufacturer’s ‘labelling data’ for each of the six tyres with the results of the test and it was plain that ranking the tyres based solely on the labelling-data would have produced a quite different order to that established by the test. Although the labelling data may offer a useful guideline, taking the data at face value won’t necessarily allow valid real-world comparisons to be made. The test also indicated that price and performance do not necessarily go hand in hand, with the most expensive VancoCamper and Agilis Camping tyres not showing up well in the ‘wet road’ tests, being out-performed in the wet by a half-the-price Chinese-made product. The reason I suggested that Vanco FourSeason and Cross Climate were arguably better for a motorhome was because of their aggressive ‘all weather’ tread pattern (that SHOULD provide enhanced off-road traction) and that both carry the 3PMSF symbol that makes them eligible for winter use in countries that demand ‘winter’ tyres be fitted. Their elevated price does not change those criteria. I have reservations about fitting directional tyres (like the CrossClimate) to a motorhome as it complicates carrying a spare-wheel, but the tyre tself has had very good reviews and (I suggest) Michelin’s advertising seems to confirm its motorhome suitability. I’ve been riding/driving all sorts of vehicle for over 60 years and the only time I remember losing grip really unexpectedly was in a VW Golf GTi fitted with Pirelli P6 tyres on a wet road at night when the car’s front tyres lost grip momentarily with no warning. At the time the P6 was the ’tyre to have’ and it may be that there was something on the road (like a diesel spillage) that provoked the incident. There have been other instances of grip-loss, but they were inevitably because the road conditions were such that no self-respecting tyre could retain grip or it was my own fault. According to Wikipedia “Hifly” is a brand of the Chinese company Shandong Hengfeng Rubber & Plastic Co, Ltd that has been in business since 1995. Although low-priced, there’s no particular reason to think “Super 2000” tyres would have been problematic if fitted to dawki’s Auto-Trail motohome, but only usage would have established their longevity and how well they maintained performance when part worn. There are some user-reviews here http://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Tyre/Hifly/Super2000.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spirou Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 There's quite a few more on Promobil 215/70 R 15 summer tire test 2017 (Ducato) https://www.promobil.de/sommerreifen-test-wohnmobil-215-70-r-15-pirelli-nokian-michelin-goodyear-firestone-cooper-continental-apollo/ 235/65 R 16 C all season tire test 2016 (Sprinter) https://www.promobil.de/ganzjahresreifen-fuer-wohnmobile-im-test-all-season/ 215/70 R 15 C winter tire test 2013 https://www.promobil.de/vergleich/winterreifen-fuer-wohnmobile-vergleichstest-sicher-durch-den-winter/ 235/65 R 16 C winter tire test 2012 https://www.promobil.de/werkstatt/winterreifen-fuer-vans-und-wohnmobile-bei-promobil-de/ 235/65 R 16 C summer tire 2012 https://www.promobil.de/vergleich/test-235-sommerreifen-fuer-transporter-und-wohnmobile-2012/ 225/65 R 16 C summer tires 2012 https://www.promobil.de/vergleich/test-225-sommerreifen-fuer-transporter-und-wohnmobile-2012/ 215/65 R 16 C winter tires 2011 https://www.promobil.de/werkstatt/vergleichstest-winterreifen-bei-promobil-de/ 235/65 R 16 C all season tires 2010 https://www.promobil.de/zubehoertest/drei-wetter-haft/ 225/75 R 16 winter tires 2009 https://www.promobil.de/winterreifen-fuers-wohnmobil/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billggski Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 It could be that manufacturers' labels on tyres are as reliable as those on batteries! ???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spirou Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 Obviously there's quite a few parameters that are hard to control when it comes to testing tires, which is why any single test won't be an accurate match to the tyre label. See EU label testing protocol info: https://www.unece.org/fileadmin/DAM/trans/doc/2011/wp29grrf/GRRF-71-10e.pdf Or a more general overview: https://ec.europa.eu/energy/sites/ener/files/documents/Study%20in%20support%20of%20the%20Review%20of%20the%20Tyre%20Labelling%20Regulation_final.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billggski Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 Ii still fit camping tyres, I'm quite particular, using winter and summer tyres for my cars. Just reckon it's not that expensive in the grand scheme of tjings! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 Derek Uzzell - 2018-09-20 2:29 PM The reason I suggested that Vanco FourSeason and Cross Climate were arguably better for a motorhome was because of their aggressive ‘all weather’ tread pattern (that SHOULD provide enhanced off-road traction) and that both carry the 3PMSF symbol that makes them eligible for winter use in countries that demand ‘winter’ tyres be fitted. Their elevated price does not change those criteria. I have reservations about fitting directional tyres (like the CrossClimate) to a motorhome as it complicates carrying a spare-wheel, but the tyre tself has had very good reviews and (I suggest) Michelin’s advertising seems to confirm its motorhome suitability. I can only say how they perform on my SX4 4x4, when driving on wet grass which is on clay rich soil the Cross Climates perform very well, the previous Conti's (which where very much a summer road tyre) would have me switching to 4wd when the grass was wet and if very wet would have me crossing fingers that I wouldn't get stuck, with the Cross Climates I can leave it in 2wd more often, and I've never felt I'd get stuck in 4wd, don't get me wrong, these are no 'mud pluggers', but they are significantly better than the Conti Premium Contact. Billggski - 2018-09-20 3:18 PM Ii still fit camping tyres, I'm quite particular, using winter and summer tyres for my cars. Just reckon it's not that expensive in the grand scheme of tjings! Years ago I had a couple of 'interesting' experiences with cheap tyres, nowadays I go for what I think is best. The Cross Climates are never going to be the ultimate summer or winter tyre, although independent group testing shows they are very good in either conditions. The thing is in the UK (at least where I live) we never have clearly defined dates when it is safe to say a winter or summer tyre will be better, last winter as an example we had mostly mild weather with just a couple of cold periods, I'm fairly confident that for the majority of the time the Cross Climates where the best tyre to be on. I should note reading some tests a few weeks back it appears other companies have introduced tyres which are on a par with Cross Climates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will86 Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 Surely whatever make or tyre size / tread one uses the drill is to drive on the tyres' capabilities plus the weight of your vehicle, deep water conditions are expressed ... simply read the road ahead and adjust. I don't see any problem whether its wet, dry, floods, snow, ice or sticky tar. Who cares what the adverts say? Just keep it simple Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 Will86 - 2018-09-20 5:17 PM Surely whatever make or tyre size / tread one uses the drill is to drive on the tyres' capabilities plus the weight of your vehicle, deep water conditions are expressed ... simply read the road ahead and adjust. I don't see any problem whether its wet, dry, floods, snow, ice or sticky tar. Who cares what the adverts say? This may have been the case umpteen years ago but any current road tests will support the view that there is considerable variation between different tyres on and off road performance and if you are buying new tyres you would be daft not to buy the best you can afford. That apart no matter how well you read the road good tyres should be better at getting and keeping you out of unexpected trouble, especially on the slippery stuff, even if you are lucky enough to be a world class rally driver with lots of recent experience of skid and grip control, which most of us are not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will86 Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 "The best you can afford" you say but apart from assuming that certain parts of the world produce poor quality how can one 'ever tell'. It reminds me of Tesco who squeeze a producer forcing them to reduce their quality yet at the same time shouting how good they are and keeping THEIR price high to convince us they are better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 spirou Thanks for the links - the 2017 test report makes particularly interesting reading as the 215/70 R15C tyre size is very commonly fitted to up-to-3500kg motorhomes. I note that the ‘winner’ of the test - the Apollo Altrust (summer) tyre - can be obtained in the UK for around £75, and that there's an ’all season’ variant for around £90. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
starvin marvin Posted September 20, 2018 Share Posted September 20, 2018 colin - 2018-09-19 8:19 PM starvin marvin - 2018-09-19 8:04 PM dawki - 2018-09-19 7:29 PM Hi just finally ordering new tyres for the motorhome 235/65/16 119-121 load I have a choice of vanco 2 or van contact any one has any info on which are better for a 3850kg van. Any info much appreciated Why haven’t you included Continental Vanco Camper? We have these on ours, much preferred to Michelin offerings. Vanco Campers (at least the ones on blackcirlces) in that size are not up to the job. What are you talking about? These are camping car tyres!! Doh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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