Current drain

[weldted]

Elddis Aspire 255, using the Votronic solar computer as a monitor of current draw I have noticed when hab electrics off at control panel there is a 0.2 amp discharge, if I disconnect the tracker this drops to 0.1. With hab electrics on draw rises to 0.5 to 0.6. This is with the solar panels isolated. Removing all the hab fuses and replacing them one at a time the 12 volt strip light LEDs which have an illuminated dimmer switch shows 0.1 discharge, the tv power circuit which also for some reason protects the two solenoid valves for the water intake pump and the toilet flush does also show 0.1 discharge. The Votronic 430 Mppt has a second outlet for keeping the engine battery topped up when this wire is connected will also show a 0.1 discharge. When all fuses are in it shows 0.5 to 0.6 discharge. Not perhaps the most accurate way of measuring the current as the computer only shows discharge in 0.1 of an amp steps. But still overnight adds up to quite a loss of capacity. ( two 100 amp Youasa L36-EFB )

[1951Pete]

We had a current leak and I purchased a Gunson tester which still keeps a fuse in circuit. It quickly identified the leak and subsequent fix.

 

http://www.gunson.co.uk/product/77069

 

I bought it online through Amazon much cheaper than the list price. Good bit of kit and worth what I paid for it.

 

We also discovered that if we leave the control panel battery selector in the mid position there is no current drain at all but there is a minimal drain if left on leisure battery even with the master switch off.

[plwsm2000]

Obviously the current drain depends on what EBL and display unit you have and what devices are permanently connected to the 12V system.

 

As you say, having only 0.1A resolution on the display can be a bit misleading since a change of only a few milliamps might change the display by 0.1A if the actual current is near the chnage over point (i.e if the real current is 0.149A, your display may round this down to 0.1A. A 2mA increase to 0.151 might be rounded up to 0.2A)

 

Just for comparison (not sure how much use this will be for your setup), I measured the various devices in my van which has a Schaudt EBL223 and DT200 display. I also have a Votronic mppt duo solar regulator. I measured the currents by putting a high accuracy DMM in series with the hab battery (actually I used another DMM to separately measure the current in the 12V battery voltage monitor wire). Here are the readings.

 

Fridge (electric)________364mA

Fridge (gas)__________361mA

Alde (no heat)___________9mA

Alde (electric heater)___1719mA

Alde (gas heater) _____1924mA

Step _______________2174mA

Water pump_________1274mA

Electric bed (down)____1474mA

Electric bed (up)_______3074mA

Toilet flush____________697mA

Radio (off)_____________42mA

Radio (low volume)____1064mA

Main lights (undimmed)_3804mA

Spot lights (undimmed)__854mA

Reading lights (each) ____98mA

Step light_____________779mA

Awning light___________289mA

Shower light___________588mA

Bathroom light_________894mA

Kitchen light___________824mA

Extractor fan___________454mA

Avtex TV (standby)_______10mA

TV (on)______________1644mA

Votronic (night)___________5mA

 

The actual EBL/DT takes an extra 217mA when ON and 127mA with "12V off". The battery voltage monitor circuit draws 22mA that does NOT go through the current shunt/current display.

When everything is shutdown for long term storage, the total current is 6mA which is just on the voltage monitor circuit. This corresponds to the 4Ahr per month that is stated in the EBL manual when shutdown. The 5mA Votronic drain would be on top of this unless it is disconnected (I don't use this shutdown mode myself).

 

If you are looking to buy a current meter, I would highly recommend one of these

[url=] https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/UNI-T-UT210E-True-RMS-AC-DC-Current-LCD-Diaplay-Digital-Clamp-Meter-A7I3/152979133798 [/url]

or just google UNI-T UT210E for other suppliers. Make sure you get the 210"E" version though. This one has a DC current clamp (many others only are AC clamps). I now keep this in the van in place of my normal "emergency" dmm.

 

[weldted]

Many thanks for your detail reply, have ordered the meter and the gu son unit suggested from the previous reply.

 

The control panel is a PC320-EX.

[747]

1951Pete - 2019-01-16 10:39 AM

 

We had a current leak and I purchased a Gunson tester which still keeps a fuse in circuit. It quickly identified the leak and subsequent fix.

 

http://www.gunson.co.uk/product/77069

 

I bought it online through Amazon much cheaper than the list price. Good bit of kit and worth what I paid for it.

 

We also discovered that if we leave the control panel battery selector in the mid position there is no current drain at all but there is a minimal drain if left on leisure battery even with the master switch off.

 

Thanks for that info. I have had the Maplin version for about 10 years but it is on its last legs. That one in your link IS expensive, I paid £9.99 for mine and Maplins were never cheap. I will check out Amazon thanks.

[robdav]

plwsm2000 - 2019-01-16 12:58 PM

 

Obviously the current drain depends on what EBL and display unit you have and what devices are permanently connected to the 12V system.

 

As you say, having only 0.1A resolution on the display can be a bit misleading since a change of only a few milliamps might change the display by 0.1A if the actual current is near the chnage over point (i.e if the real current is 0.149A, your display may round this down to 0.1A. A 2mA increase to 0.151 might be rounded up to 0.2A)

 

Just for comparison (not sure how much use this will be for your setup), I measured the various devices in my van which has a Schaudt EBL223 and DT200 display. I also have a Votronic mppt duo solar regulator. I measured the currents by putting a high accuracy DMM in series with the hab battery (actually I used another DMM to separately measure the current in the 12V battery voltage monitor wire). Here are the readings.

 

Fridge (electric)________364mA

Fridge (gas)__________361mA

Alde (no heat)___________9mA

Alde (electric heater)___1719mA

Alde (gas heater) _____1924mA

Step _______________2174mA

Water pump_________1274mA

Electric bed (down)____1474mA

Electric bed (up)_______3074mA

Toilet flush____________697mA

Radio (off)_____________42mA

Radio (low volume)____1064mA

Main lights (undimmed)_3804mA

Spot lights (undimmed)__854mA

Reading lights (each) ____98mA

Step light_____________779mA

Awning light___________289mA

Shower light___________588mA

Bathroom light_________894mA

Kitchen light___________824mA

Extractor fan___________454mA

Avtex TV (standby)_______10mA

TV (on)______________1644mA

Votronic (night)___________5mA

 

The actual EBL/DT takes an extra 217mA when ON and 127mA with "12V off". The battery voltage monitor circuit draws 22mA that does NOT go through the current shunt/current display.

When everything is shutdown for long term storage, the total current is 6mA which is just on the voltage monitor circuit. This corresponds to the 4Ahr per month that is stated in the EBL manual when shutdown. The 5mA Votronic drain would be on top of this unless it is disconnected (I don't use this shutdown mode myself).

 

If you are looking to buy a current meter, I would highly recommend one of these

[url=] https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/UNI-T-UT210E-True-RMS-AC-DC-Current-LCD-Diaplay-Digital-Clamp-Meter-A7I3/152979133798 [/url]

or just google UNI-T UT210E for other suppliers. Make sure you get the 210"E" version though. This one has a DC current clamp (many others only are AC clamps). I now keep this in the van in place of my normal "emergency" dmm.

 

Hi Phil

 

Interesting post.

 

I have just purchased a UT210D which is slightly different to the UT210E in that you can't select the range of current you're measuring, is does it in AUTO mode, see image https://www.amazon.co.uk/Digital-Current-Resistance-Capacitance-Multimeter/dp/B0757RZK6X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1551185470&sr=8-1&keywords=UT210D

 

It can measure down to 10mA according to the manual. If I remove the fuse for the solar controller I get a reading of about -00.18 which if I'm reading it right equates to 180mA. I think I read elsewhere on this forum that anything up to about 50mA is an acceptable idle draw, would you agree?

 

If I remove the three fuses labelled Radio, TV&Satellite and heating I can get the draw down to zero basically. I'm just thinking that 180mA is quite a high draw for a satellite receiver/auto dish aligner, a Pioneer AVH-A3100DAB stereo and a Truma Combi 6 E boiler all supposedly switched off.

 

Any thoughts?

 

Thanks

 

Rob

 

 

 

 

[plwsm2000]

Hi Rob,

The 210D has a 200A maximum range whereas it is 100A on the 210E. I think the 210E is slightly more accurate but the 210D is perfectly ok as it also measures DC currents (many current clamps only measure AC currents).

 

When measuring currents in the mA ranges, technique is quite important. The DC clamp actually measures the DC magnetic field around the wire and at low currents, this field is not much greater that the earth's magnetic field. You will find that if you rotate the DC clamp meter without clamping it around a wire, the reading changes slightly as it acts almost like a compass!.

When you use it on the lowest range, try to orientate it in the same way as it will be on the wire and then press the zero. Then clamp it onto the wire and take the reading. On the higher current ranges, this effect is small so you can zero it in any orientation.

Note: You must always zero it before clamping it onto the wire to be measured.

 

My 210E reads about 180mA (0.18A) before it is zeroed which might just be a coincidence, but made me wonder if you zeroed it correctly?

 

If you read a minus figure, it just means that the current is flowing in the opposite direction to the "+" symbol on the clamp. If you rotate the clamp 180 degrees so the wire enters from the other side, the reading polarity will change (quite useful for checking if the battery is charging or discharging). This only happens with DC clamps.

 

There are several relays inside my EBL which each take 20-30mA each. My radio is continuously powered (to store the radio channels etc) and takes 42mA when "off". With the various dimmer switches, TV / heater standby, frost protection value etc. drawing a few milliamps each even when "off", it all adds up. Your sat receiver will be on top of all this, so 180mA is not crazy.

180mA is 4.3Ahrs per day so a couple of days is not far off 10% of a normal battery capacity. 50mA is 1.2Ahrs so your battery will still need charging up every few weeks without solar.

How you use the van and whether you have EHU or solar will govern what you consider is "acceptible"

Only you can say.

 

 

 

[Charles]

To get a better reading on a clamp meter you can make a coil of say 10 turns of wire, clamp the Jaws through it but then divide the reading by 10 B-)

[robdav]

plwsm2000 - 2019-02-26 2:48 PM

 

Hi Rob,

The 210D has a 200A maximum range whereas it is 100A on the 210E. I think the 210E is slightly more accurate but the 210D is perfectly ok as it also measures DC currents (many current clamps only measure AC currents).

 

When measuring currents in the mA ranges, technique is quite important. The DC clamp actually measures the DC magnetic field around the wire and at low currents, this field is not much greater that the earth's magnetic field. You will find that if you rotate the DC clamp meter without clamping it around a wire, the reading changes slightly as it acts almost like a compass!.

When you use it on the lowest range, try to orientate it in the same way as it will be on the wire and then press the zero. Then clamp it onto the wire and take the reading. On the higher current ranges, this effect is small so you can zero it in any orientation.

Note: You must always zero it before clamping it onto the wire to be measured.

 

My 210E reads about 180mA (0.18A) before it is zeroed which might just be a coincidence, but made me wonder if you zeroed it correctly?

 

If you read a minus figure, it just means that the current is flowing in the opposite direction to the "+" symbol on the clamp. If you rotate the clamp 180 degrees so the wire enters from the other side, the reading polarity will change (quite useful for checking if the battery is charging or discharging). This only happens with DC clamps.

 

There are several relays inside my EBL which each take 20-30mA each. My radio is continuously powered (to store the radio channels etc) and takes 42mA when "off". With the various dimmer switches, TV / heater standby, frost protection value etc. drawing a few milliamps each even when "off", it all adds up. Your sat receiver will be on top of all this, so 180mA is not crazy.

180mA is 4.3Ahrs per day so a couple of days is not far off 10% of a normal battery capacity. 50mA is 1.2Ahrs so your battery will still need charging up every few weeks without solar.

How you use the van and whether you have EHU or solar will govern what you consider is "acceptible"

Only you can say.

 

 

 

Thanks Phil. Have definitely been zeroing it before reading and keeping the orientation the same. It seems the satellite box is the worst culprit and I can get to pretty much a zero current reading by removing the relevant fuse.