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Gross Weight


PJay

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Has any one up rated their motor home. How easy is it? I understand it is a paper exercise ? we Have been discussing this issue, with some-one who would like to do this, to achieve more payload

Experience of this , would be most welcome

PJay

 

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You can DIY however we did ours through SV Tech.  Planning to go to 3850kgs they came back with all the info etcv and told us we could go to 4000kgs thereby gaining extra capacity.......needless to say that's what we did.  Speaking to their guys at Malvern Show this year they are recognised as 'knowing their business' at DVLA and as a consequence the re-rating is, or was in our case a painless smooth experience.  So for me DIY or SV Tech?   SV Tech very time simply for the ease and hassle free dealings...oh not forgetting the extra 150kgs over what we would have had if going the DIY route.
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Hi Pjay

 

In an earlier thread I had asked about uprating since we discovered after purchasing our Chausson Welcome 717GA that when fully loaded we were 350 kgs overweight - 249 kgs overweight on the rear axle!

 

Yes it can be a paper exercise but unfortunately our wasn't. The Chausson is built in the 3500 light chassis. If it had been in the 3500kg heavy or maxi chassis then we would simply have had SVTech do the paperwork and issue a new weight plate taking it up to 3850kg. We had two problems. The first was that the light chassis could only be taken up to 3650kg as a paper exercise and the second was that this would neither give us the 3950kg MAM we needed or put any if the increased capacity on the rear axle which would remain at 2000kg and we needed that to be at least 2240kg.

 

SVTech did all the calculations and determined we could uprate the MAM to 3850 and the rear axle to 2240 but would need to replace the rear tyres (215/70 R15) with tyres that had a higher load index (225/70 R15) and fit air suspension on the rear axle. We did both these things and had the van uprated accordingly.

 

So, it can be done but when considering simply uprating the motorhome you have to make sure that any Astra payload you gain is where you need it. If the uprate simply increases the front axle load capacity but the rear axle is overloaded it is still illegal - and possibly dangerous.

 

My advice (and that of SVTech) is to have the vehicke weighed fully loaded to determine what the overall and axle weights are now and from that where you need the extra payload.

 

David

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One thing to keep in mind is that once you are over 3500kg there are a lot of roads, for those who tour France, that you are not allowed on. OK you could probably drive hundreds of thousands of kilometres without being stopped but there is always a chance.
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The SvTech website

 

http://www.svtech.co.uk/vehicles/motorhomes/

 

carries a lot of information about uprating a motorhome’s Gross Vehicle Weight (GVW), including an application form and weight calculator.

 

It has to be asked though whether uprating a motorhome’s GVW from 3400kg to 3500kg makes logical sense. If the vehicle has been weighed and found to be between 3400kg and 3500kg, one would have thought that ‘losing’ the above-3400kg amount should be practicable without resorting to uprating the GVW. Travel with less water in the fresh-water tank and/or with less fuel in the fuel tank. Audit the stuff that’s being carried and only carry what’s essential rather than what might possibly be needed, etc. etc.

 

The accuracy of a weighbridge also needs to be considered, as a weighbridge intended to handle a 40-tonne lorry may well not be 100%-accurate when weighing a motorhome with a 3.4-tonne GVW. If the weighbridge overreads by (say) just 20kg, this might well affect the uprating rationale.

 

It’s one thing to find that (like David’s Chausson) a motorhome’s rear axle’s is significantly overloaded, or its GVW is exceeded by several hundred kilogrammes, but uprating merely to gain 100kg seems very questionable.

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Recently had ours uprated to the combined axle weights - no mechanical alterations were needed but giving us an extra 250Kgs. Still within 3500Kgs but downside is the rear axle is the one that is likely to be overloaded anyway so still have to be circumspect about what you carry and where it is distributed.

 

Did ours through SVTech. They do a good service and provide the support.

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We had ours uprated to 3850 by SVTECH but it was just a paper exercise and cost almost £300

 

Now I don't mind anyone running a business but they had a monopoly and had cornered the market and priced an hours work accordingly as they knew what paperwork to fill in.

 

On the motorhome fun site there are posts from people using another company who charge about half the SVTECH price...........................have a look...........although they do a good service, I reckon SVTECH have exploited their position for too long.................................as indeed do many companies supplying the motorhome market

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webby1 - 2016-10-28 6:28 PM

 

We had ours uprated to 3850 by SVTECH but it was just a paper exercise and cost almost £300

 

Now I don't mind anyone running a business but they had a monopoly and had cornered the market and priced an hours work accordingly as they knew what paperwork to fill in.

 

On the motorhome fun site there are posts from people using another company who charge about half the SVTECH price...........................have a look...........although they do a good service, I reckon SVTECH have exploited their position for too long.................................as indeed do many companies supplying the motorhome market

 

http://consulting-engineer.b99.co.uk/bury-st-edmunds/j-r-consultancy/

 

Half the price of SVT, although now also jumping on the bandwagon somewhat having started out at c. £80 a year or so ago.

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P.S. are the documents supplied by these companies vehicle or model specific i.e. if you know someone that has already uprated the exact same motorhome model could you buy the existing documentation from them if you preferred, as opposed to starting from square one?
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Steve928 - 2016-10-28 7:09 PM

 

webby1 - 2016-10-28 6:28 PM

 

We had ours uprated to 3850 by SVTECH but it was just a paper exercise and cost almost £300

 

Now I don't mind anyone running a business but they had a monopoly and had cornered the market and priced an hours work accordingly as they knew what paperwork to fill in.

 

On the motorhome fun site there are posts from people using another company who charge about half the SVTECH price...........................have a look...........although they do a good service, I reckon SVTECH have exploited their position for too long.................................as indeed do many companies supplying the motorhome market

 

http://consulting-engineer.b99.co.uk/bury-st-edmunds/j-r-consultancy/

 

Half the price of SVT, although now also jumping on the bandwagon somewhat having started out at c. £80 a year or so ago.

 

I think SVTech are probably charging what they believe they can get for the service they provide. I did try the other place - left messages and got no reply so had little choice in the end. In my case it was not a paper exercise so I would not have known what was required but, for the same price, I received technical advice on what mechanical changes I would have to make to allow the uprate and then received the documentation and new weight plate.

 

David

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Dizzied - 2016-10-31 7:29 PM

 

This might be a strange question but have any of you who have up rated the gross vehicle weights been through French tolls? If so were charged the higher rate for the increased vehicle weights?

 

My van weighs 4200Kg and less than 3m high. I have always been charged Class 2 on French motorways.

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As far as I’m aware French 'toll booths’ (manual or automated) have no technical means of assessing a vehicle’s gross weight (GVW).

 

Vehicle classificationn is described here

 

http://www.autoroutes.fr/en/vehicle-classification.htm

 

and although Categories 1 to 4 include a weight element, establishing a vehicle’s GVW easily won’t be straightforward, though confirming a vehicle’s height or number of axles will be much simpler.

 

I’ve never heard of a motorhome being charged the Category 3 tariff merely because its GVW exceeds 3.5 tonnes.

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We have on one occasion been charged class 3, due to HEIGHT , as with dome come just over the 3 mtr.

Seldom use motorway toll road. The no toll roads are more than good enough, and much better than lots of UK roads. Probably paid for with EU money!!

PJay

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Assuming that your motorhome’s GVW does not exceed 3.5 tonnes and its overall height WITHOUT the sat-TV dome does not exceed 3.0 mtres, the vehicle SHOULD qualify for the Category 2 tariff.

 

The criteria relating to autoroute charging by vehicle-height were discussed here in 2010, and it became apparent that there was ‘small print’ in the autoroute regulations that defined which things-on-the-roof counted towards overall height and which did not.

 

Aerials, roof-boxes, roof-bars, rotating-lights, taxi-signs, sat-TV-dishes, roof-windows and solar-panels do not count, whereas living-accomodation (like a sleeping-pod on a lorry) air-conditioners and refrigeration-units do count.

 

Automated vehicle-height measuring equipment won’t be able to discriminate, so if a roof-box or a sat-TV dish/dome pushes a motorhome’s height above 3.0 metres, the motorhome will be considered to be in Category 3.

 

It’s a fair bet too that autoroute toll-booth attendants won’t be familiar with - or will choose to ignore - the small-print rules and (unless a motorhome’s driver is aware of the rules and can satisfactorily argue his/her case) will treat every vehicle with an overall height exceeding 3.0 metres as qualifying for Category 3 irrespective of anything on the roof that might be contributing towards that height.

 

The method of financing autoroute construction/maintenance varies. This recent French article may be of interest

 

http://www.lefigaro.fr/economie/le-scan-eco/decryptage/2016/09/19/29002-20160919ARTFIG00266-autoroutes-comment-l-etat-finance-les-projets.php

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Derek Uzzell - 2016-11-01 1:45 PM

 

Aerials, roof-boxes, roof-bars, rotating-lights, taxi-signs, sat-TV-dishes, roof-windows and solar-panels do not count, whereas living-accomodation (like a sleeping-pod on a lorry) air-conditioners and refrigeration-units do count.

 

I recently had an email discussion with Sanef Tolling regarding a different issue but their response contained the following quote;

 

"To be class 2 the overall height must be less than 3 metres including anything on or fitted to the roof and the gross weight must not exceed 3.5 tonnes metric. If you are only just over some operators will accept you as class 2 and there are 22 different road operators in France, hence mixed results."

 

Cleary some confusion still reigns.

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Derek Uzzell - 2016-11-01 1:45 PM

 

Assuming that your motorhome’s GVW does not exceed 3.5 tonnes and its overall height WITHOUT the sat-TV dome does not exceed 3.0 mtres, the vehicle SHOULD qualify for the Category 2 tariff.

 

The criteria relating to autoroute charging by vehicle-height were discussed here in 2010, and it became apparent that there was ‘small print’ in the autoroute regulations that defined which things-on-the-roof counted towards overall height and which did not.

 

Aerials, roof-boxes, roof-bars, rotating-lights, taxi-signs, sat-TV-dishes, roof-windows and solar-panels do not count, whereas living-accomodation (like a sleeping-pod on a lorry) air-conditioners and refrigeration-units do count.

 

Automated vehicle-height measuring equipment won’t be able to discriminate, so if a roof-box or a sat-TV dish/dome pushes a motorhome’s height above 3.0 metres, the motorhome will be considered to be in Category 3.

 

It’s a fair bet too that autoroute toll-booth attendants won’t be familiar with - or will choose to ignore - the small-print rules and (unless a motorhome’s driver is aware of the rules and can satisfactorily argue his/her case) will treat every vehicle with an overall height exceeding 3.0 metres as qualifying for Category 3 irrespective of anything on the roof that might be contributing towards that height.

 

The method of financing autoroute construction/maintenance varies. This recent French article may be of interest

 

http://www.lefigaro.fr/economie/le-scan-eco/decryptage/2016/09/19/29002-20160919ARTFIG00266-autoroutes-comment-l-etat-finance-les-projets.php

 

At the time we also had and air con roof mounted

PJay

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Slight deviation to thread!

We have just looked at the vin plates on our cars.

Oh car is 3750 , Mine 2750.

Does this mean we should not be driving the larger car??? No body has ever quired age regarding driving cars. we have even hired cars in the past which would have been over 3500. For instance the insurance company gave OH a large 4x4 Santa Fe , on hire when some one ran into the back of his car.

 

Your views please

PJay

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I suspect you are misreading your cars' VIN-plates.

 

The attached photo is of the VIN-plate of a Hyundai “Santa Fe”.

 

The data indicate that the Hyundai’s gross vehicle weight (GVW) is 2550kg, its gross train weight (GTW) is 4750kg and its maximum front and rear axle weights are respectively 1350kg amd 1450kg.

 

To have a GVW of 3750kg a car would need to be huge (or armoured!) and, although a GVW of 2750kg would be credible for a hefty 4x4, I’m guessing that’s not what you drive.

 

Are you sure you aren’t confusing your cars’ GTW (ie. the weight of the fully-loaded car plus a fully-loaded trailer) with the GVW?

31600681_SantaFeVINplate.jpg.cb79317f11d0f750401f5c84c03fbefc.jpg

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Derek Uzzell - 2016-11-01 6:15 PM

 

I suspect you are misreading your cars' VIN-plates.

 

The attached photo is of the VIN-plate of a Hyundai “Santa Fe”.

 

The data indicate that the Hyundai’s gross vehicle weight (GVW) is 2550kg, its gross train weight (GTW) is 4750kg and its maximum front and rear axle weights are respectively 1350kg amd 1450kg.

 

To have a GVW of 3750kg a car would need to be huge (or armoured!) and, although a GVW of 2750kg would be credible for a hefty 4x4, I’m guessing that’s not what you drive.

 

Are you sure you aren’t confusing your cars’ GTW (ie. the weight of the fully-loaded car plus a fully-loaded trailer) with the GVW?

 

OH looked at cars. I guess wrong !! Did think it odd, the Mondeo would weight more than the van!

 

Will go and tell him, he got confused. ( Old Age!1) Thanks again Derek for your wisdom

 

P

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Steve928 - 2016-11-01 2:02 PM

 

Derek Uzzell - 2016-11-01 1:45 PM

 

Aerials, roof-boxes, roof-bars, rotating-lights, taxi-signs, sat-TV-dishes, roof-windows and solar-panels do not count, whereas living-accomodation (like a sleeping-pod on a lorry) air-conditioners and refrigeration-units do count.

 

I recently had an email discussion with Sanef Tolling regarding a different issue but their response contained the following quote;

 

"To be class 2 the overall height must be less than 3 metres including anything on or fitted to the roof and the gross weight must not exceed 3.5 tonnes metric. If you are only just over some operators will accept you as class 2 and there are 22 different road operators in France, hence mixed results."

 

Cleary some confusion still reigns.

 

As I said earlier, this height-thing came up in a 2010 toll-related discussion (see Patricia’s comments)

 

http://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Millau-Bridge-tolls/21046/

 

The ‘small print’ can (just) be seen in the “Remarques” section on the bottom-right of the first page of this document:

 

http://www.autoroutes.fr/FCKeditor/UserFiles/File/ASFA%20CLASSE%20VEHICULE%20BD.pdf

 

As far as I’m aware the autoroute classification system is set in stone and that includes the vehicle-height-related ‘funny’ rules.

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