ColinM50 Posted April 19, 2017 Share Posted April 19, 2017 Bought a brand new Elddis 196 M/H in Feb and it comes with a fitted bike rack. We've never carried bikes before but bought ourselves a couple of lekky bikes off Ebay since we're going to Holland next week. Seems a good time to use them. Each bike weighs 26Kg on our bathroom scales, (I bought the scales downstairs rather than taking the bikes up to the bathroom to weigh them (lol) . So that gives me 52 Kg and the Fiamma bike rack says, in the instructions, it has a limit of 60 Kg. But is that limit the same for the M/H? I would ask the dealer I bought it from but they're pretty useless, only ever get an answerphone from their service manager and of course guess how often he returns calls./messages. So what do you think? Have I got enough leeway with the Fiamma instructions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted April 19, 2017 Share Posted April 19, 2017 Colin, Was the 26 kg each with or without the batteries? If with then remove them and re-weigh. Also the bikes are less of a target without the batteries as they are normally expensive and difficult to replace. Keith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted April 19, 2017 Share Posted April 19, 2017 I suppose it'll be down to a bit of a personal judgement call... but I'd certainly be taking as much off the bikes as I "realistically" could... Our old Compass 120 came with a bike rack and small rear Fiamma box..and with that, even when the box was empty, you could make the rear wall of the van flex, just by apply a bit of pressure to the rack... :-S ..and to my mind, it's not just the "static" weight but the constant bouncing and jarring... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinM50 Posted April 19, 2017 Author Share Posted April 19, 2017 Good point Keith, the weights are with batteries so as you say I'll take them out and put them in the M/H. seems like a plan eh *-) And yes Pepe, it's the possible flexing of the rear wall that concerns me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airstream Posted April 19, 2017 Share Posted April 19, 2017 Many tales of bike racks failing through poor fitting If fitted through manufacturers strong points then should be OK http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/fitting-bike-rack-to-motorhome.4172/ Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rupert123 Posted April 19, 2017 Share Posted April 19, 2017 There is no way I would carry two electric bikes on anything but a tow bar mounted rack. The rack you have may take 60kg but whether the van will is another matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bop Posted April 19, 2017 Share Posted April 19, 2017 Colin, You can phone the Elddis Manufacturing Facility on 01207 699 000 who should be able to help. Give them a bell tomorrow and see what they have to say. All the best, Andrew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColinM50 Posted April 20, 2017 Author Share Posted April 20, 2017 Thanks all especially Bop. Just phoned them and was given a new special customer support number, 03719642113 and a lovely Geordie lady there, dontch just love that accent, went away to find out and came back with an answer. If it's fitted with their recommended Fiamma rack, then 60 kg's is OK. I questioned her about "what if's" and she said there won't be a problem with up to 60 Kg, IF there is, the warranty kicks in. Can't say faired than that can you? So thanks all and as mentioned earlier, esp Bop Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pepe63xnotuse Posted April 20, 2017 Share Posted April 20, 2017 Just looking at some images online and it appears to have quite a lengthy tail overhang...I don't know what the luggage/locker capacity it has towards the rear (nor what your axle ratings are) but it'd be worth keeping an eye on the rear axle loading... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adiebt Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 rupert123 - 2017-04-19 10:08 PM There is no way I would carry two electric bikes on anything but a tow bar mounted rack. The rack you have may take 60kg but whether the van will is another matter. Had Fiamma 60kg rack fitted four years ago , travelled 25K miles with e - bikes , never a problem . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keninpalamos Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 Adiebt - 2017-04-21 8:22 AM rupert123 - 2017-04-19 10:08 PM There is no way I would carry two electric bikes on anything but a tow bar mounted rack. The rack you have may take 60kg but whether the van will is another matter. Had Fiamma 60kg rack fitted four years ago , travelled 25K miles with e - bikes , never a problem . the 60kg rack is not the problem as has been pointed out and milage done is irrelevant. It's the suitability of the Motorhome back wall, rear axle weight limit and how it has been fitted. The same goes for motor bikes/scooters. Many of the overhangs and distances these scooters are from the rear axle take some believing and are obviously overloading the back axle and chassis extensions on many vans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyg3nwl Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 Hi, just to inform you that we carry 2 electric bikes quit happily on rear rack, but we always remove . the batteries and saddles, and stow them as far forward as possible under the bunks or in overhead lockers, to minimise effect on rear axle weights (batteries under bunk, saddles overhead) We went fully laden last year to weighbridge,and came in at 3400 all up including water, and full diesel, 2 adults, so in permitted rating on both axles. Van is Stargazer on fiat 2.3 base 09 version. Each battery weighs 4 kg in our case, so well worth while stowing well forward. Also, bikes not much use without batteries and saddles, so less attractive to potential thieves.. heavy duty security lock joins the 2 bikes together, one facing each direction, so even more a deterrent. Tonyg3nwl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mgnbuk Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 You should also consider the effort involved in geting heavy bikes onto a high-mounted rack. I could do our original bikes on my own, but the extra 5 or so kilos each (with batteries removed) when we changed to electrics made loading a 2 person operation - and that was a struggle ! And the Fiamma rack that was rock steady with the two non-assisted bikes became noticably "wobbly" with the two electrics on board, even though it was under the maximium rated load. I only did one trip with the electric bikes on the back before getting an Atera towbar mounted carrier - easy to fit, much easier to load as much lower & rock steady. But you do need a towbar fitted to use one ! Nigel B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyg3nwl Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 mgnbuk - 2017-04-21 10:04 AM You should also consider the effort involved in geting heavy bikes onto a high-mounted rack. I could do our original bikes on my own, but the extra 5 or so kilos each (with batteries removed) when we changed to electrics made loading a 2 person operation - and that was a struggle ! And the Fiamma rack that was rock steady with the two non-assisted bikes became noticably "wobbly" with the two electrics on board, even though it was under the maximium rated load. I only did one trip with the electric bikes on the back before getting an Atera towbar mounted carrier - easy to fit, much easier to load as much lower & rock steady. But you do need a towbar fitted to use one ! Nigel B If you go down the towbar route, the the weight of towbar and bikes at rear end might well push you over rear axle limits, particularly if you keep batteries at the rear end as well ? Worth checking on weighbridge the current axel loads as is, then add towbar weight, and bike weights to answer and see if it is still acceptable.. dont forget the distance behind rear wheel has to be considered when calculating, and too much on rear end might just aggravate front end traction. ? Tonyg3nwl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyg3nwl Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 Hi again, just one other thought, would existing bike rack interfere with loading bikes on a towbar mounted rach. Would it e necessary to remove the fiamma rack if you went down towbar path. ??? Tonyg3nwl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mgnbuk Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 tonyg3nwl - 2017-04-21 5:19 PM Hi again, just one other thought, would existing bike rack interfere with loading bikes on a towbar mounted rach. Would it e necessary to remove the fiamma rack if you went down towbar path. ??? Tonyg3nwl I took mine off, as I think it did interfere. Not difficult, just two bolts to remove from the bottom brackets & the top brackets are hooks. Saves a bit of weight, though with the towbar mount rack being a steel frame it is quite a bit heavier than the all-aluminium Fiamma rack & will still eat into payload & axle loading. It might help in preventing you putting your back out, though ! I already had a towbar mounted - my usage alternates between bicycle tours & motorcycle tours, so a tow bar is an essential item for me. The OP may not have one, though, & your comments re : additional weights given the quoted van layout are worth noting. Nigel B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adiebt Posted April 21, 2017 Share Posted April 21, 2017 keninpalamos - 2017-04-21 9:07 AM Adiebt - 2017-04-21 8:22 AM rupert123 - 2017-04-19 10:08 PM There is no way I would carry two electric bikes on anything but a tow bar mounted rack. The rack you have may take 60kg but whether the van will is another matter. Had Fiamma 60kg rack fitted four years ago , travelled 25K miles with e - bikes , never a problem . the 60kg rack is not the problem as has been pointed out and milage done is irrelevant. It's the suitability of the Motorhome back wall, rear axle weight limit and how it has been fitted. The same goes for motor bikes/scooters. Many of the overhangs and distances these scooters are from the rear axle take some believing and are obviously overloading the back axle and chassis extensions on many vans The mileage is far from irrelevant, if there was to be a failure then the failure would of occurred by now , as to lifting heavy bikes on and off the rack , my fiamma goes from ground level to upright via a winch , easy peasy . Mine was fitted by a Bailey specialist so im secure in the fact that all is good in all departments as the mileage driven with apparatus in situ testifies to . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyishuk Posted April 22, 2017 Share Posted April 22, 2017 Whilst sitting on site inFrance a couple of years ago, with a beer in hand, I watched a Motorhome with bikes on the back gently peruse the site for a posi. Next time around, travelling at a kiddy safe speed, it went over a speed hump and the bikes, rack and fair proportion of the back fell into the road. Never been a fan of bikes on the back, after seeing that. But don't let me put you off ;-)) Rgds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crocs Posted April 22, 2017 Share Posted April 22, 2017 tonyishuk - 2017-04-22 3:24 PM Whilst sitting on site inFrance a couple of years ago, with a beer in hand, I watched a Motorhome with bikes on the back gently peruse the site for a posi. Next time around, travelling at a kiddy safe speed, it went over a speed hump and the bikes, rack and fair proportion of the back fell into the road. Never been a fan of bikes on the back, after seeing that. But don't let me put you off ;-)) Rgds Obviously not fitted correctly and/or outwith motorhome/rack capabilities? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keninpalamos Posted April 23, 2017 Share Posted April 23, 2017 Adiebt - 2017-04-21 9:23 PM keninpalamos - 2017-04-21 9:07 AM Adiebt - 2017-04-21 8:22 AM rupert123 - 2017-04-19 10:08 PM There is no way I would carry two electric bikes on anything but a tow bar mounted rack. The rack you have may take 60kg but whether the van will is another matter. Had Fiamma 60kg rack fitted four years ago , travelled 25K miles with e - bikes , never a problem . the 60kg rack is not the problem as has been pointed out and milage done is irrelevant. It's the suitability of the Motorhome back wall, rear axle weight limit and how it has been fitted. The same goes for motor bikes/scooters. Many of the overhangs and distances these scooters are from the rear axle take some believing and are obviously overloading the back axle and chassis extensions on many vans The mileage is far from irrelevant, if there was to be a failure then the failure would of occurred by now , as to lifting heavy bikes on and off the rack , my fiamma goes from ground level to upright via a winch , easy peasy . Mine was fitted by a Bailey specialist so im secure in the fact that all is good in all departments as the mileage driven with apparatus in situ testifies to . An insecure or badly fitted rack is relevant. How much load it takes is relevant and how it is loaded is relevant How many miles it does is irrelevant as it's relation to the 'van it is an inanimate object but I understand what you are saying. No offence intended. Do you have a picture of the winch system. Sounds interesting. Something a friend of mine could do with on her 'van Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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