New Leisure battery

[JohnSue1664232222]

I've just bought my first new battery. My question is, do leisure batteries come ready charged ? After having the battery fitted I drove home (about 15 miles). The panel light was on while the engine was running so it was charging (I switched a light on to check).

 

The following day I switched on at the panel. No light on the panel. Tried the light. Nothing. Started the engine. The panel light came on and the light worked.

 

Help.

 

John

[Keithl]

Hi John,

 

It sounds like the fuse located near the leisure battery has blown and all you are checking with the light on and engine running is that power from the starter battery/alternator is getting as far as the control panel.

 

Use a multi meter and check the voltage at the leisure battery first with the engine off and no lights on, second with the engine off and several lights turned on and then finally with the engine running. Let us know the results and we'll take it from there.

 

PS Do you have a battery selection switch for leisure/starter battery selection?

 

Also what is your make, model and year of MH and make of control panel please?

 

Keith.

[JohnSue1664232222]

Hi Keith. Thanks for the reply.

 

The van is an Elnagh Marlin Slim 3 2002 reg. The panel is a PC090 (DS300EL distribution box). There is a switch for checking both batteries. There's power showing in the car battery and nothing in the leisure.

 

I'll check voltage at the battery as you suggest (and anything else I can think of) and come back.

 

John

[StuartO]

It certainly sounds as if the leisure battery is not connected to the MH properly, maybe simply because the dealer forgot to put the fuse into the fuse holder when it was installed!

[aandncaravan]

Yes batteries do come 'ready charged, but rarely fully charged, 80% charged is typical, hence it always a good idea to charge a battery overnight, or longer, before using.

 

However, as the others have said above, your issue is a most likely a broken link between the Leisure battery and the vehicle wiring. Often caused by a mishap during fitting of shorting or cross connection of the battery leads blowing the main fuse.

This fuse should be found very near the Leisure batteries, usually between 30 and 50 amps and one of the larger variety than the standard automotive type? See photo of a typical main fuse.

 

On many continental MH's the 12v battery wiring Colours are typically Blue for Live and Brown for Neutral, the opposite of the UK 240v standard, so some people connect the battery the wrong way around blowing the fuse, and sometimes, the main controller/charger?

Not uncommon for a 'British' built Motorhome Dealer to send us a German/Italian vans Control box after a battery swap.

Only Friday we received a Hymer Elektroblock EBL from an Autosleepers Dealer with this exact affliction.

 

Suggest you check that once you find the fuse that everything is working as it should, mains charger, Fridge, Water heater, Water Pump, etc? Any problems, get back to the battery fitters while they still remember you, as the issues can be expensive to fix.

 

Can we suggest that you, or anyone else with a continental built Motorhome, put Red tape around the positive Lead and Black Tape around the Neutral so those Technicians more used to the Red/Black wiring scheme have a guide?

 

[JohnSue1664232222]

Many thanks for all the replies. I'll come back asap with news.

 

John :-)

[JohnSue1664232222]

aandncaravan - 2016-06-19 2:41 PM

 

Yes batteries do come 'ready charged, but rarely fully charged, 80% charged is typical, hence it always a good idea to charge a battery overnight, or longer, before using.

 

However, as the others have said above, your issue is a most likely a broken link between the Leisure battery and the vehicle wiring. Often caused by a mishap during fitting of shorting or cross connection of the battery leads blowing the main fuse.

This fuse should be found very near the Leisure batteries, usually between 30 and 50 amps and one of the larger variety than the standard automotive type? See photo of a typical main fuse.

 

On many continental MH's the 12v battery wiring Colours are typically Blue for Live and Brown for Neutral, the opposite of the UK 240v standard, so some people connect the battery the wrong way around blowing the fuse, and sometimes, the main controller/charger?

Not uncommon for a 'British' built Motorhome Dealer to send us a German/Italian vans Control box after a battery swap.

Only Friday we received a Hymer Elektroblock EBL from an Autosleepers Dealer with this exact affliction.

 

Suggest you check that once you find the fuse that everything is working as it should, mains charger, Fridge, Water heater, Water Pump, etc? Any problems, get back to the battery fitters while they still remember you, as the issues can be expensive to fix.

 

Can we suggest that you, or anyone else with a continental built Motorhome, put Red tape around the positive Lead and Black Tape around the Neutral so those Technicians more used to the Red/Black wiring scheme have a guide?

 

 

I've had the motorhome for 9 years and it's amazing how little I know, even the basics. With fuses I only think (thought) about the fusebox in the wardrobe. Never having had a problem with the leisure battery I simply didn't know that there was a fuse for the battery in the battery compartment. And, sure enough, it had blown. It wasn't the continental wire colouring as you questioned. I just don't know when it went.

 

And it's an inline fuse not the type pictured. I've ordered a few and they're on the way. I'm sure it'll work because when I shorted out the connectors using a screwdriver lo and behold everything worked

 

(lol)

 

Many thanks for your help. Hopefully others who haven't had leisure battery problems before will benefit from this thread.

 

John

[Tracker]

JohnSue - 2016-06-21 10:36 AM

 

when I shorted out the connectors using a screwdriver lo and behold everything worked

 

 

NOT a good idea - had there been a fault you might have got a very different result and caused some damage too!

 

Lurking in the bottom of my tool box I have a cable with an inline low amp fuse in it with a probe on each end for just such a purpose. Much safer!

[JohnSue1664232222]

Fair comment :-)

[Tracker]

JohnSue - 2016-06-21 10:36 AM

Hopefully others who haven't had leisure battery problems before will benefit from this thread.

 

That means almost everyone who has ever owned a motorhome!

 

My perception is that the more 'modern' and technology theory driven these vans get the more unreliable they seem to be getting - especially once out of warranty?

[aandncaravan]

Tracker, You write,

"My perception is that the more 'modern' and technology theory driven these vans get the more unreliable they seem to be getting - especially once out of warranty?"

 

I understand your view point, but to balance that argument can we go back to 1963 to that Bedford CA based Camper that you or a friend maybe had?

It's 1,400cc petrol engine that only did 23mpg would struggle to reach 55mph. It was as safe as a Plastic Reliant 3 wheel and cornered nearly as badly. If you were very, very lucky you might be able to make it between the 3,000 mile service intervals without visiting the Garage again.

Driving from London to Margate was a major adventure!!

Rarely would the engine cover more than 15,000 miles without needing a decoke and 30,000 without needing a rebuild. Unlikely that many CA's covered more than 40,000 miles in total before being scrapped, unless they underwent major mechanical rebuilds with new engine, gearbox, etc.

 

 

Return to today and look at Robin Hoods recent epic 4,800 miles journey up through Norway in his modern vehicle in just weeks. A Fiat Ducato would most likely be ready to repeat that again the following day.

Give it a Service, and another 10k is not normally any issue.

 

I am the same as you in that I sometimes forget what we have now. When I should actually think myself lucky that I can remember how bad things were, to appreciate them all the more.

 

What could be simpler than a Morris 1,000's Points Ignition for igniting the spark, just a 'switch' and a Coil? Yet it is probably the most troublesome, high maintenance part on the whole car. It's carburettor ranks second. Compare that to the seriously complex ECU, hundreds of thousands of transistors and components, for the Ignition and fuel injection on a Toyota Camry 3.0 V6 that has 150,000 plus reliability without a hand ever undoing it's casing?

 

 

I see incredibly complex electronics that have so many features they seem to be building in potential failure points. But the next day a very simple BCA charger design from the 1990's lands on my desk. Despite it's simplicity it's actually less reliable, and I realise it isn't how complex it is, but how well it is made.

 

While some parts of modern motorhomes are not perfect, considering the use to which they can be put, they are amazing compared to those 1960's Post Office vans or Ambulances.

 

.

 

[Tracker]

Fair comment Alan - we also did a 7000 mile 8 week trip round Norway and Scandinavia in a Euro 4 2.3 Ducato a few years back and it was totally and superbly reliable - even the electrics.

 

If I may say, you do seem to have taken my observations which were intended to relate to the habitation electrics and electronics of modern motorhomes being designed specifically for on site use and not for nomadic off grid use and turned it into a criticism of modern engines which is not what I said.

 

Furthermore some of the suggested developments like 'intelligent' alternators sound as if they might well create more problems for us than they will solve. I could be wrong and hope that I am but I regret that I don't have much faith in politically imposed pollution targets bearing much resemblance to efficient engineering solutions.

 

I really like modern engines, I particularly like well proven Euro 4, I like the long service intervals and I like the durability, but my non expert perception is that I still have little faith in DPF technology, the use of adblue as a modern efficient solution, or as yet unproven long term Euro 5 or 6 technology.

 

By the way, I don't think I ever got as much as 23 mpg from a Bedford CA (later ones 1507cc) , or a CF (2279cc) or a Transit, or a Commer, although the Austin J4 and Sherpa might just about have made it - when any of all them were not overheating or having other tantrums!

 

[StuartO]

I suspect the technophobia I feel (and which perhaps Tracker shares) in relation to increasing complex motoring electronics stems partly from getting old and my not really wanting to encounter unnecessary change, therefore not really wanting any more progress, just so that I don't have to learn any more tricks.  Lots of other, younger people want new gadgets and features of course, but not me any more.  My new car (a Honda CRV) has so much electronics on it that as soon as I get the knack of using something (eg the speed limiter) I forget what I learned last week about something else. 

 

My MH is ten years old, pre-CAMBUS, which pleases me, yet it does have a simple (compared with the CRV) cruise control and it does have (what is to me) modern reliability.  But I'm glad it has a relatively simple electronic interface (compared with the CRV) so I can enjoy driving it without getting over-taxed or needing to call for a grandchild to explain.  It's got a Schaudt Electroblok to which a solar panel and regulator was added (professionally) and that works reliably too - but I don't really understand the menu settings and configuration side of it.  I was puzzled and nervous about a B2B so I was pleased and relieved to read Alan's recent thread about one of those which convinced me that I needn't go there.

 

We've looked at changing the MH several times over the years but ended up concluding each time that we're happy enough with what we've got with, for example, a Garmin satnav sitting on the dash instead of something integrated.  Hopefully the reliability will last my motorhoming lifetime.

 

 

 

[Tracker]

We are pretty much like minded there Stuart, and I suspect that we are not the only ones.

 

Not least of my issues with 'progress' is 'how exactly does this benefit me' - and to be honest most of the time whilst it might benefit the environment in theory, placate some of the tree huggers and politicians, I can't see how it benefits me especially as it all gets more and more expensive it.

 

Our latest car too has so much gadgetry that, like Stuart, I have to keep reading the manual to remember how it all works.

 

That said I really like the radar guided cruise control that adjusts speed to keep the car in front at a safe distance from 0 mph right up to the legal limit (ish)! Easy and relaxed driving at it's best - as long as one appreciates that these things are driving AIDS and are not infallible so to pay attention to what is happening around you at all times is crucial!

[breakaleg]

I can't tell you how pleased I was when my brand new last year Elddis Autoquest 115 and found that it had an analog gauge for water and battery and proper switches for all the electrics, no taking the the thing apart to find a reset button, who cares that the gauges are not accurate. lol and to find a hole in the side of the van to fill up with water no switching something on to make it fill the tank and a spare wheel below the van for the RAC to struggle with in the event of a puncture, and a rear door that locks with a key, no realigment or polishing contacts to get in or out.

I just love living in the recent past.

Pete :-D

[aandncaravan]

Tracker, You are right, I did wander off the 'Habitation electronics' topic a bit, but I couldn't think of any other way to show how much we have moved forward in all areas.

 

I agree with you that sometimes 'progress', like when it is legislation driven, isn't always the solution the consumer would prefer.

 

The Euro IV engine is a good one because it came out of sensible, in my view, legislation that cleaned the engines up enormously by improved efficiency. Euro V and later seem to be about meeting 'artificial', maybe even unreasonable, targets from Brussels.

 

When we start up a Motorhome in the workshop with a pre 2000 engine, the exhaust fumes quickly become unpleasant and it gets turned off as soon as the test is complete.

A Euro IV engine is much, much less unpleasant and there is not the 'panic' to finish the test and switch off.

Euro V, despite the alleged lower emissions, hasn't got a noticeable improvement 'to the Nose', but as already documented has lots of disadvantages for the consumer.

 

I agree with what both you and Stuart seem to be saying, that we like 'progress in moderation?'.

 

 

Breakaleg, The simpler system you have installed doesn't mean it will be more reliable than a more complex solution.

The Motorhome builders objective on that model is installing a bottom budget solution. In our experience, it isn't just functionality that is sacrificed, but quality.

 

 

I can remember saying to someone once that I didn't like Electric Windows because they always break after high mileages. Three Citroen Picasso's and both front windows on all three cars failed before 60,000 miles when my old Humber Sceptre 'Hand wound' windows were 19 years old and worked perfectly.

However, my current 16 year old Mitsubishi Galant Tow car (towing, work hack that has had a hard life) has 4 perfectly working, quiet and smooth electric windows.

 

 

Coming back to your original comment Tracker about MH electronics, If it's poor quality it will break regardless of complexity. It is when it is badly made and complex it's a nightmare.