depreciation

[rambo63]

Just had a shock at nec how much my motor home as depreciated

Majestic 135 2015 2years old 1500 miles lost 20k in 2 years. Wish i had known before wasting my time and money on buying one. could have had hired one and still had change to have had a round the world cruise.

[PJay]

You will always loose the vat paid on new vehicles 20%, as soon as your name goes on log book!! Therefore the depreciation will be greater in the early years Keep the van and the way new ones are going up, you will probably get what you paid for it another couple of years!!

 

PJay

[Kevin1946]

Sorry to read you are so unhappy but I think your van will depreciate at a far lower rate from now on,judge it over 4 or 5 years,check out the value of 5 year old vans,don't let this get to you or it will ruin your enjoyment.

If you have made a mistake you just have to accept it. Your are lucky to be able to buy a new van,it is still as good as new with that small miles on it,GO AND ENJOY IT,be happy You are in such a good position to be able to pay for a van like it,the worst scenario is you lost a couple of thousand more than you had anticipated,it's not the end of the world.

Best of luck & good health

Kevin

[PJay]

rambo63 - 2017-10-25 8:51 PM

 

Just had a shock at nec how much my motor home as depreciated

Majestic 135 2015 2years old 1500 miles lost 20k in 2 years. Wish i had known before wasting my time and money on buying one. could have had hired one and still had change to have had a round the world cruise.

 

Why where you getting valuation, at NEC? Are you thinking of trading it in, then?

1500 miles in 2 years? We average 5000. miles a year, and that is just using at the most twice.

I guess you still work, hence being able to afford a new van to use very little. Hardly worth having a van , let alone trading it for a new one

 

PJay

[Guest pelmetman]

Depreciation is only a issue if you sell ;-) .........

 

Ours has lost 13k 8-) .......

 

Over 27 years :D ......

 

Which works out at £487 per year........So mohoing need not be a expensive hobby B-) ......

 

 

[lennyhb]

Our first Hymer lost 23% over 6 years, the last one we have recently traded lost 8% over 3 years, good value as far as I'm concerned.

[lennyhb]

PJay - 2017-10-25 11:56 PM

 

You will always loose the vat paid on new vehicles 20%, as soon as your name goes on log book!! Therefore the depreciation will be greater in the early years Keep the van and the way new ones are going up, you will probably get what you paid for it another couple of years!!

 

PJay

 

VAT has nothing to do with it you buy it for X pounds you sell it for X pounds, losing the VAT is dealer BS.

[Tall_Mike]

Very sore point with me at the moment, far worse than I expected.

 

The van was a demonstrator with 700 miles on the clock, ex show, although never slept in - I don't think we over paid initially when compared to the cost of new,

 

Our van is just over 2 years old, - very good condition, done about 8,500 miles. Looked at trade in / trade up possibilities and the valuation we got was a 34% decrease in value over our purchase price, - admittedly it is the only valuation we have had. - Because it is a base model, no air con etc although it has a comfortmatic the advice was - "there is no demand for these without cab air con". - Haven't found it to be an issue myself, the heating / cooling works quite well - although not to the level of air con.

 

The only good point is that if we keep it for another couple of years, - I don't think the depreciation will continue at such a rate, - say 40% over 4 years isn't nearly as bad as 34% over 2 - although another issue is that Adria have just bought out a new and quite uprated model range for 2018 (Sun Living) which might clobber our values even more.

 

 

[John52]

How much of that is dealer mark-up?

(and to be fair they need a lot of money to cover all their costs - and 20% VAT on top of their costs)

As others have said the longer you keep it, the more years this initial heavy loss is spread over.

Ideally you want to buy one privately a couple of years old when someone else has taken the initial big depreciation hit (unless you want an (overpriced in Britain) Hymer imported at Continental price, and be lucky with the exchange rate, which lennyhb did and omits to mention)

But buying second hand is not so nice, and riddled with pitfalls, especially when buying privately to save dealer mark up and VAT.....

[Beltie]

Based on valuations I have just had at the NEC, my 'van has lost about 30% over eight years. I'm happy with that, it compares very favorably with my car!

[crocs]

rambo63 - 2017-10-25 8:51 PM

 

Just had a shock at nec how much my motor home as depreciated

Majestic 135 2015 2years old 1500 miles lost 20k in 2 years. Wish i had known before wasting my time and money on buying one. could have had hired one and still had change to have had a round the world cruise.

 

Are you saying that you were offered in the low £20ks? If so, that dealer is having a laugh!

[lennyhb]

John52 - 2017-10-26 10:35 AM

 

How much of that is dealer mark-up?

(and to be fair they need a lot of money to cover all their costs - and 20% VAT on top of their costs)

As others have said the longer you keep it, the more years this initial heavy loss is spread over.

Ideally you want to buy one privately a couple of years old when someone else has taken the initial big depreciation hit (unless you want an (overpriced in Britain) Hymer imported at Continental price, and be lucky with the exchange rate, which lennyhb did and omits to mention)

But buying second hand is not so nice, and riddled with pitfalls, especially when buying privately to save dealer mark up and VAT.....

 

Wasn't lucky with the exchange rate, first van we bought cost us £7k more than when we ordered it , 1.45/£ at order time when but paid for it at 1.25/£. It still only devalued by 23% over 6 years.

Last van we traded with the same dealer we bought it from in Belgium and only lost 8% in 3 years and got a 20% discount on the new one.

I was in a UK Hymer dealer a couple of days ago for the same van as ours with similar spec they wanted £99½k we only paid £72K including import and on the road costs.

Rip off Britain again.

[Will86]

rambo63 - 2017-10-25 8:51 PM

 

Just had a shock at nec how much my motor home as depreciated

Majestic 135 2015 2years old 1500 miles lost 20k in 2 years. Wish i had known before wasting my time and money on buying one. could have had hired one and still had change to have had a round the world cruise.

 

 

When buying an object such as a M/H you are buying an experience which I doubt has a value. It serves your varying purposes for what ever time you want it to. It has little use other than increasing your experiences of the surroundings for which as a person you should benefit.

 

In other words do your homework well before buying

[Tall_Mike]

Always knew that a Motorhome is a depreciating asset, it's in fact an expensive luxury and very hard to argue that we "must have it". - It's highly unlikely to appreciate in value unless you are very lucky or are able to do some clever dealing, - For us it is our first Motorhome, I know a lot more now which hopefully negates the issue of being ripped off,

 

Buying something of such value privately from ebay for example wouldn't be for me and "if it seems to be to good to be true", it certainly will be.

 

Take into account that it's our holiday, it's our hobby, and something that gives us a lot of enjoyment, these are aspects which it's very hard to put a cost on, - even in our first 18 months we have had some adventures, and depreciation only really becomes a cost to the wallet if you sell the thing but even so, it isn't ideal.

 

The other thing is the hike in prices this year for 2018 vans - new vans have seen a significant Price jump, probably through the Brexit effect, not sure how this will filter through to the second hand market.

 

 

[Don636]

The annoying thing about motorhome pricing in that there do not seem to be any independent price guides available are there are for cars say so I find it almost impossible to gauge what our van is worth. We paid £54,500 for a Vantage Neo in May 2014 with the 150 engine and Comfortmatic and it has now done 13,000 miles. The same van would be around £65,000 new and, based on Vantage vans for sale at the dealer, I reckon they would advertise a van like mine for around £50,000 so I wonder what the dealer mark up is likely to be and what could I sell or trade it in for. If we say that the dealer mark up might be 20% or £10,000 (I have no idea) this would give a trade in value of £40,000 or around 27% depreciation in 3 1/2 years which sounds not too bad or am I hopelessly optimistic? I have hardly ever been able to find Vantage vans for sale outside the dealer and wonder where they all go to.

[lennyhb]

Don636 - 2017-10-26 4:18 PM

 

The annoying thing about motorhome pricing in that there do not seem to be any independent price guides available are there are for cars say so I find it almost impossible to gauge what our van is worth.

Nobody buys a standard van, when you add some extras it does not affect the price especially with cars but Motorhomes are a bit different like when a drivers door is an option etc. We had £15k of manufacturers extras on ours it could have easily have been £25k and fitted another £3k myself. Because of this the list price bears no reflection on the sale price every Motorhome is different.

OK, you could have a ballpark figure but that could be varied by plus/minus £10k.

[RogerC]

Back to the OP.  The valuation is in part dependant on what you are looking to do with your vehicle.  Trade it in against one that the dealer has a decent margin on and he has more room to manoeuvre.  Conversely if looking to buy something with little profit for him, or indeed to simply sell yours, the valuation is always going to be low.

As for wasting money, it's only such if you don't use the MH in order to justify the outlay.

Some posts here have looked at depreciation over the years.  I tend to look at it as an asset, albeit depreciating, which effectively costs less per night the more I use it, hence to me/us it is value for money.  Add in the opportunity to roam at will, to pitch in some beautiful locations, to experience things a hotel based holiday can never provide, spending more time in the great outdoors and the 'depreciation' matters less and less.  At least to me and mine it does.

[Don636]

RogerC makes a very good point and this is exactly how I look at it however, if I come to change the van I will be very interested in how much it is worth at that point as the less the value the more I will have to dip into savings to make up the balance.

[StuartO]

rambo63 - 2017-10-26 11:51 AMJust had a shock at nec how much my motor home as depreciatedMajestic 135 2015 2years old 1500 miles lost 20k in 2 years. Wish i had known before wasting my time and money on buying one. could have had hired one and still had change to have had a round the world cruise.

 

The OP hasn't sold his MH, so he's relying on a valuation of some sort and the figure he was given may have very little validity as an indication of what he could actually get for it if he made some effort to sell to get the best possible price.  If you simply ask a trade buyer what he would pay for your motorhome, especially if he thinks you are unlikely to make much effort to shop around for best price, you might simply get a cheeky offer, in case he's silly enough to accept it.

 

Without clearer information about what he paid for his MH and where and from whom he got his valuation, it's simply not possible to offer meaningful comment and he might be beating himself up about this without good reason.

 

[Brock]

There are three things I consider.

 

1. The cost/benefit analysis of what I could do with the money I spend on motorhoming and the joy I get from motorhoming [similar to Roger C].

2. Total cost of ownership over the expected lifetime of my ownership of the vehicle. This includes depreciation which is what rambo63 is beginning to understand.

3. Cost of changing should I decide to buy something else which the NEC and other such shows will always highlight because the models on show tend to blinged-ip.

 

I can sympathise with rambo63 but apart from suggesting he either sells up to cut his losses or uses the van more to get the benefits, all I can do is I hope he finds a way working through the shock.

[globebuster]

It's all very well if you can afford, and justify buying new - or if you have enough disposable income/savings to consider it a life enhancing benefit.

 

When we returned to motorhoming a few years back I decided to buy an old Hymer, to see if it was really what we wanted to do.

In the first 18 months I changed vans 3 times, and in a period of 3 years, on 5 occasions - between 2012/15.

All used and of varying ages, from 20 years for the Hymer, to 3 years on the previous and current one.

I can't resist hunting down a bargain, and although it takes time and effort, I actually get some real satisfaction in doing it - I think this just an extension to my classic car buying really.

 

Across those first 4 vans I made a profit of £8750 including the last purchase, where the dealer offered me 3k more than I'd paid 18 months before, for the van I traded in - the last being the only one sourced through a dealer.

I did a 'hypothetical' deal at the NEC and was offered only £1500 less than I paid for the present van back in January 2015 on a new purchase.

 

Perhaps when I fully retire I might consider buying new, but as motorhoming is not my only hobby that involves fairly chunky sums of money I may not wish, or indeed be able to.

 

The thought of 'bonfiring' 20k - that might have bought me another nice classic would be unbearable!

 

I think if you buy the right make, in a desirable layout with a good cab spec, and do the leg-work - whether buying new or used you should be OK, and not take too much of a 'hit'

 

Personally if I had 40-45k to spend on a new [dare I say] budget van, I think I'd be looking to spend that on a 'nearly new' higher spec model from a brand I knew had good mid/long term residual value.

 

I'd say to the poster - just keep using it!

There will be a point where [with a bit of luck] the residual will start to 'bottom out'

 

 

[michaelmorris]

We reckon on our 2003 Autoquest will depreciate by about £1000 a year until it hits 20 years old, then lose around £500-£600 a year after that.

 

We did the maths before we bought our van and worked out that owning a motorhome was not a route to cheap holidays. When you add up all the costs, we reckon it costs around the same as renting cottages. What the motorhome gives us is flexible holidays and easy spontaneous touring.

 

When we retire and get to (hopefully) use the van much more, then it will give us cheap holidays.

[Keith T]

rambo63 - 2017-10-25 8:51 PM

 

Just had a shock at nec how much my motor home as depreciated

Majestic 135 2015 2years old 1500 miles lost 20k in 2 years. .

 

Are you basing this against the 2017/18 price, as in reality trade in value 'loss' can only be against the price paid, or value of the original 2014 date, I would suggest.

 

We part exchanged a 10year old Burstner in our deal for a new 2017 model from a different manufacturer, and against the price we paid in 2007 we 'lost' about 30%.....I guess if we had kept it for another couple of years the loss wold have been nearer 35%, but still far better than a car!

[Billggski]

A car dealer I used to buy from always said he made his profit when he bought, that gave him his margin to sell.

I bought privately in June, four years ago. The family had bought it in January and then decided they didn't like motorhoming.

It had been traded in by its first owner after three years and 9,000 miles, it had been loaded with extras, and came with most of a three year warranty.

Last week I was passing Don Amott and called in to see what they had. The sales team had a Glass's guide, but it didn't list 2009 prices. They indicated that the difference between trade-in prices and forecourt was 10-20%.

The "bottom" price on mine was still higher than we paid four years ago!

 

[Charles]

That valuation is a joke. Our van was new in 2014, we paid £36,350 for it. There is an identical one (even mileage) on eBay now for £32,999. It's a dealer admittedly but there isn't THAT much difference. The new price has jumped up to £42k so the used ones hold their value very well.

 

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F352077784947