antony1969 Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 Whatever team you support , deal , no deal or no Brexit is it inevitable that we are heading for civil unrest here in Blighty ??? ... The bitterness on both sides which we see on here often is the same throughout the country ... One side or maybe both are not going to be happy when it comes to the crunch , even less happy than they are now so are we heading for trouble ... Maybe big trouble ??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowie Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 Do you really see bitterness on both sides...... on here: I think you are mistaken And I don’t see anything as inevitable Snowie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 Brits have a proud history of fighting for democracy B-) .......... If we have to do it on our own streets, then it'll be no ones fault but the Remoaners :-| ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowie Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 Ouch!, I thought I could feel a pincer movement there, and from an expected quarter. I really don’t see mainstream Brexiters or mainstream remainders fighting on the streets. I do fear that extreme right and extreme left may hijack Brexit. But I have faith in the rest of the population to behave sensibly whilst making their feelings known. I just might be tempted to get out there myself. One thing is certain, whilst we are all sick of the way this issue is being progressed, more of us understand more of what is at stake. And for that reason extremists will be seen as just that. And I expect the turnout at the next vote, be it general election or “people’s vote” will be higher. Snowie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 snowie - 2019-01-12 2:09 PM I just might be tempted to get out there myself. Have you ever been on a demo Snowie? :-> ........... If not here's a tip ;-) ....... Wear over sized wellies with shin pads stuffed down the back to protect the back of your ankles, for when the Rozzers accidentally on purpose kick them to keep you moving 8-) ........... It still hurts, but not as much :D ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 I always thought it was just a bit "Panto" on here isnt it? Not really bitterness or anger, I am sure we would all get on famously down the boozer. Possibly. (lol) I think Brexit has certainly divided the nation though and I Dont see much of that being repaired easily. If there is civil unrest and violence though because one element doesnt get what they want then there is a simple solution to that, lock em up! I see Chris Grayling has said Blocking Brexit could lead to a surge in far-right extremism in the UK and that not leaving the EU would cause the 17 million people who voted for Brexit to feel "cheated". This could end centuries of "moderate" politics in the UK, he said. I think that boats sailed Chris, look at your own party now. Claiming 17m people are on the brink of becoming extremists is a bit much. All this talk though from Brexiteer pollys about the nation turning violent if they dont get their Brexit and fascism taking over is really a cheap project fear tactic. We are British remember, we saw off Adolf Hitler so a few pensioners throwing their zimmers through M&S Window should hardly be a problem, even Nigel putting his Khaki trouser on isnt exactly scary, just an offensive thought. James O Brian puts it well. https://i.postimg.cc/bNhZPHCz/screenshot-87.png Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 I don't believe any 'unrest' would result in scrapping on the streets though certainly there are factions that seem to be agitating for exactly that. A country totally divided and split with feral angry youth lacking self discipline makes easy cannon fodder for the manipulators who agitate from a distance using social media, whipping up the hatred. None appear to have any meaningful employment, instead channeling their energy into disruptive behaviour. One of the rabble rousers from last week, Goddard, has finally been arrested today for public order offences. Ideally his type need putting to a few years of hard manual labour but will no doubt end up with a slap on the wrist. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/yellow-vests-james-goddard-arrest-london-march-westminster-mps-abuse-soubry-far-right-a8724491.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 Barryd999 - 2019-01-12 3:08 PM I see Chris Grayling has said Blocking Brexit could lead to a surge in far-right extremism in the UK and that not leaving the EU would cause the 17 million people who voted for Brexit to feel "cheated". Surely - people feeling cheated after an election is not new. Why should they react any differently this time ? ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 Barryd999 - 2019-01-12 3:08 PM I see Chris Grayling has said Blocking Brexit could lead to a surge in far-right extremism in the UK and that not leaving the EU would cause the 17 million people who voted for Brexit to feel "cheated". I suspect that is typical political spin and has more to do with getting the vote in favour of 'the deal' and him keeping his job than with reality? Brexiteers are by and large by nature a sensible lot, unlike the hordes of remoaner whingers who hate not getting their own way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snowie Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 Tracker - 2019-01-12 4:12 PM Brexiteers are by and large by nature a sensible lot, unlike the hordes of remoaner whingers who hate not getting their own way? The fact that you add the question mark suggests to me that your tongue is firmly in your cheek. Snowie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 snowie - 2019-01-12 5:23 PM Tracker - 2019-01-12 4:12 PM Brexiteers are by and large by nature a sensible lot, unlike the hordes of remoaner whingers who hate not getting their own way? The fact that you add the question mark suggests to me that your tongue is firmly in your cheek. Snowie Sorry. Brexiteers are by and large by nature a sensible lot, unlike the hordes of remoaner whingers who hate not getting their own way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 Tracker - 2019-01-12 5:57 PM...……………...Brexiteers are by and large by nature a sensible lot, unlike the hordes of remoaner whingers who hate not getting their own way. Oversimplification, I'm afraid Richard. I don't know any remainers who are concerned at "not getting their own way". What they are concerned about is that they think Brexit is a political and economic mistake that will make the UK a poorer country. That will mean fewer jobs and lower standards of living for the great majority of people. If people think that is the most likely result of Brexit, why on earth would they change their minds merely because others voted for it? There is a fundamental misunderstanding about Brexit, and most of the politicians are still making it. There is no compromise possible over membership of the EU. We are either in, or we are out. Where is the half-way compromise that politicians instinctively seek? Just as one can't be a little bit pregnant, one can't be partially in the EU. The concept is an oxymoron. This problem underlay the referendum, with those who promoted it apparently thinking that the public's response could be "fudged" after the event if they got an answer they thought undesirable. A few of them are beginning to grope their way to understanding that such a fudge isn't possible. It is, as was said as soon as the referendum was proposed, binary. That binary quality is what causes the split, and it is incapable of reconciliation. This means that roughly half the county is going to be unhappy with whatever result emerges. The only feasible solution is a second referendum. We now know what the "deal" offers in terms of how we may leave. We have some idea of what a no deal Brexit might do to the economy, and we know much better what we have now in terms of membership. But, we know nothing whatever of the terms on which we might continue to trade with, and visit, the EU, post Brexit, and shall know nothing of those terms until long after we leave. It is a classic pig in a poke, and yet the Brexiters favour it. Why? Leaving means that we shall, realistically, not join again if we decide that leaving was a mistake, because the price for re-joining will be membership of the Euro, Schengen, The Charter of Fundamental Rights, and the Area of Freedom, Security and Justice - from all of which we presently have opt-outs. Moreover, it means that to maintain trade, especially for those industries such as the motor industry - where components cross into and out of the UK to tight schedules - we shall add cost and delay to production that will (the industry being dominated by foreign manufacturers) mitigate against the EU as a good place to base the production facilities. There are already signs that this knowledge is being acted upon. It also means that to maintain any trade we must become rule takers and not rule makers. Finally, there is no logical imperative driving leave. We are not under any identifiable threats from the EU and, being on the inside, we should know of any that are in the pipeline, and have the right, as members, to argue our case. Were we to remain, therefore, we retain the right to leave, hopefully in a properly considered and planned way, at whatever future date those threats materialise and cannot be negotiated away. We are presently looking at a very severe recession at a time when we haven't recovered from 2008, so now is hardly a good time to place our economy in even greater jeopardy. The maxim is fix the roof while the sun shines, while we seem to have a leaking roof while performing a rain dance! It makes no sense on any level so, back to the beginning, why would people be expected to say to the other half "that's OK, you go ahead and make us all poorer, and we'll just tag along for the ride and no hard feelings"? There are some things that people want, but will disadvantage them. If they are the only ones affected fair enough, the rest of us can help them patch themselves up and learn from the experience. But when everyone will be disadvantaged, irrespective of whether or not they wanted the same thing, who is going to willingly submit to that? We have greater understanding than lemmings or Gadarene swine. Do intelligent beings knowingly vote for increasing poverty? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 Brian Kirby - 2019-01-12 7:09 PM Tracker - 2019-01-12 5:57 PM...……………...Brexiteers are by and large by nature a sensible lot, unlike the hordes of remoaner whingers who hate not getting their own way. Oversimplification, I'm afraid Richard. I don't know any remainers who are concerned at "not getting their own way". (lol) (lol) (lol) ........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 Brian Kirby - 2019-01-12 7:09 PM There is a fundamental misunderstanding about Brexit, and most of the politicians are still making it. There is no compromise possible over membership of the EU. We are either in, or we are out. Correct......and we voted to Leave .............Perhaps you Remoaners should try to accept that FACT *-) ....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 Brian Kirby - 2019-01-12 7:09 PM The only feasible solution is a second referendum. Too late Hombre :D .............The only way to get another vote is to extend article 50........which will bring in that other inconvenient fact that it will mean the UK taking part in the EU elections >:-) ....... A prospect that you Remoaners are studiously avoiding discussing? :D ............Cant think why (lol) (lol) (lol) .......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 Brian Kirby - 2019-01-12 7:09 PM Moreover, it means that to maintain trade, especially for those industries such as the motor industry - where components cross into and out of the UK to tight schedules - You mean those foreign owned motor industries that the EU is being instrumental in moving to low wage Eastern European economies? *-) ......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 Brian Kirby - 2019-01-12 7:09 PM Finally, there is no logical imperative driving leave. Except that the majority of the UK think there is.........not that you blinkered Remoaners can see it *-) ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 Brian Kirby - 2019-01-12 7:09 PM It makes no sense on any level so, back to the beginning, why would people be expected to say to the other half "that's OK, you go ahead and make us all poorer, and we'll just tag along for the ride and no hard feelings"? There's a world recession coming.......but it's looking like the Brexit drag on the economy has helped stop the UK from booming like Germany........which is now technically in recession 8-) ....... https://www.cnbc.com/2019/01/08/german-industrial-data-prompts-fears-of-recession.html So we maybe poorer.......but prolly not as poor as we might of been if we hadn't voted to Leave B-) ....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 Brian Kirby - 2019-01-12 7:09 PM We have greater understanding than lemmings or Gadarene swine. Drunker and Co clearly haven't *-) ............ They are blithely carrying on ignoring that us Populists are on the March >:-) ........... Something else which you Remoaners ignore, as you strive to lock the BREXIT TROJAN horse into the EU stable :D ............ Is that by doing so you are only hastening the demise of the empire you worship 8-) .......... Bring on the May elections B-) ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 pelmetman - 2019-01-13 8:49 AM Brian Kirby - 2019-01-12 7:09 PM The only feasible solution is a second referendum. Too late Hombre :D .............The only way to get another vote is to extend article 50........which will bring in that other inconvenient fact that it will mean the UK taking part in the EU elections >:-) ....... A prospect that you Remoaners are studiously avoiding discussing? :D ............Cant think why (lol) (lol) (lol) .......... So what? As I said in your other thread where you were talking to yourself we would be entitled to take part in the elections as we are in the EU and may well be staying in the EU if we have another referendum and if that doesnt wash we can just revoke article 50 and hold another referendum whenever we wish, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 Barryd999 - 2019-01-13 10:00 AM pelmetman - 2019-01-13 8:49 AM Brian Kirby - 2019-01-12 7:09 PM The only feasible solution is a second referendum. Too late Hombre :D .............The only way to get another vote is to extend article 50........which will bring in that other inconvenient fact that it will mean the UK taking part in the EU elections >:-) ....... A prospect that you Remoaners are studiously avoiding discussing? :D ............Cant think why (lol) (lol) (lol) .......... So what? As I said in your other thread where you were talking to yourself we would be entitled to take part in the elections as we are in the EU and may well be staying in the EU if we have another referendum and if that doesnt wash we can just revoke article 50 and hold another referendum whenever we wish, The current predictions are the increase in number of anti EU MEP's in other EU countries will effectively mean the numbers of populist MEP's in the EP will stay the same.......IF we don't take part >:-) .......... All your doing by making us stay in the EU is hastening the demise of the EU ;-) ........Because we'll just have to destroy it from the inside instead >:-) ........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulletguy Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 pelmetman - 2019-01-13 9:12 AM Brian Kirby - 2019-01-12 7:09 PM We have greater understanding than lemmings or Gadarene swine. Drunker and Co clearly haven't *-) ............ They are blithely carrying on ignoring that us Populists are on the March >:-) ........... Something else which you Remoaners ignore, as you strive to lock the BREXIT TROJAN horse into the EU stable :D ............ Is that by doing so you are only hastening the demise of the empire you worship 8-) .......... Bring on the May elections B-) ........ Seven disjointed tweet like responses to one post spread over half an hour make absolutely no sense at all. Are you using a phone to write those tweets on? :-| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barryd999 Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 pelmetman - 2019-01-13 10:16 AM Barryd999 - 2019-01-13 10:00 AM pelmetman - 2019-01-13 8:49 AM Brian Kirby - 2019-01-12 7:09 PM The only feasible solution is a second referendum. Too late Hombre :D .............The only way to get another vote is to extend article 50........which will bring in that other inconvenient fact that it will mean the UK taking part in the EU elections >:-) ....... A prospect that you Remoaners are studiously avoiding discussing? :D ............Cant think why (lol) (lol) (lol) .......... So what? As I said in your other thread where you were talking to yourself we would be entitled to take part in the elections as we are in the EU and may well be staying in the EU if we have another referendum and if that doesnt wash we can just revoke article 50 and hold another referendum whenever we wish, The current predictions are the increase in number of anti EU MEP's in other EU countries will effectively mean the numbers of populist MEP's in the EP will stay the same.......IF we don't take part >:-) .......... All your doing by making us stay in the EU is hastening the demise of the EU ;-) ........Because we'll just have to destroy it from the inside instead >:-) ........... Predictions you say? We have all had enough of predictions. Project fear! Your populist nut jobs make a lot of noise but thats all they are, noise and tabloid columns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 Barryd999 - 2019-01-14 12:57 AM pelmetman - 2019-01-13 10:16 AM Barryd999 - 2019-01-13 10:00 AM pelmetman - 2019-01-13 8:49 AM Brian Kirby - 2019-01-12 7:09 PM The only feasible solution is a second referendum. Too late Hombre :D .............The only way to get another vote is to extend article 50........which will bring in that other inconvenient fact that it will mean the UK taking part in the EU elections >:-) ....... A prospect that you Remoaners are studiously avoiding discussing? :D ............Cant think why (lol) (lol) (lol) .......... So what? As I said in your other thread where you were talking to yourself we would be entitled to take part in the elections as we are in the EU and may well be staying in the EU if we have another referendum and if that doesnt wash we can just revoke article 50 and hold another referendum whenever we wish, The current predictions are the increase in number of anti EU MEP's in other EU countries will effectively mean the numbers of populist MEP's in the EP will stay the same.......IF we don't take part >:-) .......... All your doing by making us stay in the EU is hastening the demise of the EU ;-) ........Because we'll just have to destroy it from the inside instead >:-) ........... Predictions you say? We have all had enough of predictions. Project fear! Your populist nut jobs make a lot of noise but thats all they are, noise and tabloid columns. Us populist nut jobs won Brexit Barry ;-) .......... If you manage to pervert democracy and force us to stay in the EU *-) .......... Do you think 52% of us Brits will suddenly become pro EU? (lol) (lol) (lol) ........ We'll just have to destroy the EU from within.....and we can make a start on the 23rd of May >:-) ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted January 14, 2019 Share Posted January 14, 2019 pelmetman - 2019-01-13 9:03 AM Brian Kirby - 2019-01-12 7:09 PM It makes no sense on any level so, back to the beginning, why would people be expected to say to the other half "that's OK, you go ahead and make us all poorer, and we'll just tag along for the ride and no hard feelings"? There's a world recession coming.......but it's looking like the Brexit drag on the economy has helped stop the UK from booming like Germany........which is now technically in recession 8-) ....... https://www.cnbc.com/2019/01/08/german-industrial-data-prompts-fears-of-recession.html So we maybe poorer.......but prolly not as poor as we might of been if we hadn't voted to Leave B-) ....... Not so, in a world recession everyone gets poorer. If the UK Brexits, the UK will get poorer than it otherwise would have been under any circumstances. So, take one adverse factor and add another what do you get? Let me see. 2 + 2 = 4. So one reason for recession, added to another, = what? Worse recession, seem to me the answer to that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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