Guest Tracker Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 When I were a lad and being educated, against my will mainly, back in the 1950's money was tight, teachers mainly drawn from ex servicemen, buildings in a not wonderful state of repair and little budget for niceties - either in school or at home. Nevertheless I, and most of my contemporaries, came away with literacy (including punctuation and spelling), numeracy (including mental arithmetic), and a reasonable command of the English language. The fact that our mainly academic subjects did little to prepare us for the real world was a bit of a downer, but by and large, given the circumstances and the thinking of the era I think that the schools and teachers did a bloody good job with us. These days with huge budgets, both at school and at home, and an abundant supply of supposedly qualified teachers being paid ever higher salaries why is the UK slipping further and further behind many other countries in the basic standard of general education being provided? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michele Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Work this one out then Rich . Child R & F have a full cirriculum ? Now whilst I agree that they should do something and not just sit that they also have the right to be educated I dont agree with teaching them 2+2 is 4 . Why because they cant say it they cant understand it it has no relevance in their world They have not a clue and they are never going to walk into a shop and say can I have 4 of these please ever ever . But I do think that they should learn things llike self help skills such as putting socks on this is your front this is your back turn around and this is water its in a tap you make your own juice look this is how we make juice wash your hands wash your face so forth .. The whole world has gone mad . The above would go someway to ensuring that they are prepared for the outside world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Tracker - 2007-12-05 1:14 PM When I were a lad and being educated, against my will mainly, back in the 1950's money was tight, teachers mainly drawn from ex servicemen, buildings in a not wonderful state of repair and little budget for niceties - either in school or at home. Nevertheless I, and most of my contemporaries, came away with literacy (including punctuation and spelling), numeracy (including mental arithmetic), and a reasonable command of the English language. The fact that our mainly academic subjects did little to prepare us for the real world was a bit of a downer, but by and large, given the circumstances and the thinking of the era I think that the schools and teachers did a bloody good job with us. These days with huge budgets, both at school and at home, and an abundant supply of supposedly qualified teachers being paid ever higher salaries why is the UK slipping further and further behind many other countries in the basic standard of general education being provided? I blame (partly) : Electronic calculators Computers with spell checking I believe they also have exams now with multiple choice answers - what's the point of that ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 michele - 2007-12-05 1:23 PM Work this one out then Rich . Child R & F have a full cirriculum ? Now whilst I agree that they should do something and not just sit that they also have the right to be educated I dont agree with teaching them 2+2 is 4 . Why because they cant say it they cant understand it it has no relevance in their world They have not a clue and they are never going to walk into a shop and say can I have 4 of these please ever ever . But I do think that they should learn things llike self help skills such as putting socks on this is your front this is your back turn around and this is water its in a tap you make your own juice look this is how we make juice wash your hands wash your face so forth .. The whole world has gone mad . The above would go someway to ensuring that they are prepared for the outside world. I would have thought that their parents should be teaching most of that - not university trained teachers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michele Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Ah but I do day in day out over & over Ground Hog day . When they are special needs its also written into the education that they have special needs . So such things as self help skills should be taught . University trained teacher s????R hasnt even got a teacher she has for over 1 year now had a LSA learning support assistant there are no teachers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 michele - 2007-12-05 2:03 PM Ah but I do day in day out over & over Ground Hog day . When they are special needs its also written into the education that they have special needs . So such things as self help skills should be taught . University trained teacher s????R hasnt even got a teacher she has for over 1 year now had a LSA learning support assistant there are no teachers. I didn't know that you were talking about special needs children Michele, that is ,of course, a different matter. (...and not one I know anything about ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 All children should be able to check their change in a shop and this surely does come down to basic 2 + 2 - which everyone does need? I don't blame electronic anything - I blame successive governments and their 'expert' advisers who have consistently dismantled tried and tested methods in favour of new and untested theories. It is right that we should include modern gadgetry in teaching as there are many benefits but we should still not lose sight of the basics - in my humble view? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Syd Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 They should never have dropped Latin from the National curriculum. Look where that decission has got us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Tracker - 2007-12-05 2:34 PM All children should be able to check their change in a shop and this surely does come down to basic 2 + 2 - which everyone does need? I don't blame electronic anything - I blame successive governments and their 'expert' advisers who have consistently dismantled tried and tested methods in favour of new and untested theories. It is right that we should include modern gadgetry in teaching as there are many benefits but we should still not lose sight of the basics - in my humble view? I'm not against the use of electronics as long as the children are able to calculate without them. They should be used simply as a tool , not a replacement for learning. So it seems we are both 'in the same camp' on this. ( This is not really relevant to this thread, but when I was in junior school, a new invention, the ball point pen, was banned because it 'ruined our handwriting') Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 malc d - 2007-12-05 3:25 PM ( This is not really relevant to this thread, but when I was in junior school, a new invention, the ball point pen, was banned because it 'ruined our handwriting') You must be of a similar age to me Malc - I remember that too - although my handwriting was so awful with the old school nib and ink well pens that in my case there was little to ruin! PS Nothing is ever off thread as long as it is remotely connected! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Syd - 2007-12-05 3:11 PM They should never have dropped Latin from the National curriculum. Look where that decission has got us Quod erat demonstrandum, Sid; quod erat demonstrandum. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 im sorry to say but the problem is a society problem in general, too many single parents, a child needs the comfort and support of a normal family life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J9withdogs Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 K&D - 2007-12-05 6:22 PM im sorry to say but the problem is a society problem in general, too many single parents, a child needs the comfort and support of a normal family life. That's a sweeping statement, Dean. I have brought my son up single-handedly, and he's a clever, articulate and popular lad. There are plenty of kids with two parents who have problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Syd Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Brian Kirby - 2007-12-05 6:08 PMSyd - 2007-12-05 3:11 PM They should never have dropped Latin from the National curriculum. Look where that decission has got us Quod erat demonstrandum, Sid; quod erat demonstrandum. :-)BrianI couldn't agree more(Ithink) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michele Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Although I have not YET had to suffer a divorce I find that what you say Dean is Crap and its Crap because yes there are loads of single parents doing a thankless task everyday of their lives . It dont make it any better if you have two parents or one I think you get good kids in both same as you get bad kids in both . Its a hard job bringing up kids and most older ladies didnt choose it . Afetr all when you settle down with somone how do you know hes gonna run off with younger model andyou will be left holding the babys I am sure no one intentionally go's into a relationship thinking that will happen . Lucky us to have a partner what would happen if we split I guess we would be one of the singles A.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J9withdogs Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 I think that a lot of the problems today are caused by a lack of respect, and this has to be taught at a very early age. When I was young you respected teachers, policemen and your parents. This seems to be lacking in many of the younger generation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 J9withdogs - 2007-12-05 6:30 PM K&D - 2007-12-05 6:22 PM im sorry to say but the problem is a society problem in general, too many single parents, a child needs the comfort and support of a normal family life. That's a sweeping statement, Dean. I have brought my son up single-handedly, and he's a clever, articulate and popular lad. There are plenty of kids with two parents who have problems. sorry if this as caused affence i can see how it as. he who as no sin cast the first stone and that is certainly not me.but it is hard for a woman to be mum and dad, hats of to all who do a wonderful job trying. im sure your one of them janine you should and am sure are very proud of yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J9withdogs Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 No problem, Dean (lol) and, yes, I am a very proud mum. His dad certainly missed out big time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 I don't know because our son had a full time Mum - but I sorta get the feeling that 'latch key' kids had something more to do with it than genuine herd working single parent families? Nevertheless it is easy and convenient for government to blame individuals for the failures of the education system and I remain convinced that today's materialistic and selfish 'society' is the result of poor education not the cause. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 Tracker - 2007-12-06 10:29 AM I don't know because our son had a full time Mum - but I sorta get the feeling that 'latch key' kids had something more to do with it than genuine herd working single parent families? Nevertheless it is easy and convenient for government to blame individuals for the failures of the education system and I remain convinced that today's materialistic and selfish 'society' is the result of poor education not the cause. It is my belief that childrens ( and adults ) behaviour is a result of their upbringing, not their education. Their ability, or lack of it, can be put down to their education. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michele Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 You know what I often get stared at when chastising my kids my own I am talking about the ones that are compus mentus well thats what they tell me. But people stare as if to say my god thats a bit strong or I wouldnt do that . Well it never done me no harm and I never got brought home by the police I was never rude to my elders or teachers and if I saw a copper I would be the utmost polite . These days I think that I disavantage my own kids because I tell them off if the school was to phone and say they had done something wrong I would say punish them and I'm right behind you . So I disavantage my kids because they are out there with a bunch who 's parents give them no consiquences for their own actions .. But I pride myself when people say your son & daughter are just totally lovely to be around such nice human beings with the correct morals and standards.. Nothing is easy in life so they may as well have a rough ride from me. Its not going to fall at their feet so get up and go get it . Shame others dont think that way If my children ever brought the police to the door (except for the ones who live here ) I would go nuts . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horse444 Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 *-) Respect goes both ways, see my comments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
michele Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 Exactly we should respect the children and put on a good example and receive it back dont go blaming the kids for everything . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 Come to think of it mutual respect played a big part in Andy's bringing up. Whilst home life was not really a democracy his point of view was often sought at decision times and his thoughts taken into account - no matter how crazy! Made him feel part of the 'management' I think, and maybe less likely to rebel when things didn't go his way? The trouble is you don't know what you got right and what you got wrong until it is too late to right the wrongs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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