CliveH Posted May 27, 2008 Share Posted May 27, 2008 This is a table of tax rates (inclusive of VAT) for both petrol and diesel compiled by the AA from EU statistics. Full article at :- http://uk.news.yahoo.com/rtrs/20080527/tuk-uk-britain-fuel-europe-fa6b408.html What struck me is the 69% and 69% for petrol and diesel respectively in the UK. Compare that to say France 60% tax on petrol but only 42% tax on diesel. And don’t forget in France they did away with Road Tax on cars and added the cost of the tax to the cost of fuel. So not good that your average Mondeo or Passat driver will be paying a good few hundred pounds more under the latest stealth tax from this Government. COUNTRY: PETROL %’age: DIESEL %’age: BRITAIN . 69% . 69% NETHERLANDS . 66% 38% GERMANY . 65% 47% BELGIUM . 62% 31% FRANCE . 60% 42% FINLAND . 58% 31% PORTUGAL . 58% 36% DENMARK . 54% 36% SWEDEN . 53% 39% AUSTRIA . 48% 38% All of a sudden – moving to Portugal and running around in a diesel vehicle (only 36% fuel duty and a decent climate!!!!) seems very attractive. You can see why the truckers and hauliers are up in arms over this carn’t you!. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pagey Posted May 27, 2008 Share Posted May 27, 2008 clive im a bit suprised at this i was in belgium/holland and france last week and diesel was about 1.34,1.40.and 1.38 euro/litre so does this mean that the oil companies/filling stations are making a lot more over there than they do over here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CliveH Posted May 27, 2008 Author Share Posted May 27, 2008 Not sure about that pagey - but to be fair to them - they always say they make virtually no profit on fuel sales in the UK. Most rural garages that sold fuel no longer do so. Most rural fuel outlets are now shut. My local garage only survives due to the Londis shop attached to it. No profit in fuel at all he says - it is just what draws the customers into his shop. Maybe this is different within the EU? But if you were paying 138 Euro a litre with the exchange rate I make that about 105p a litre so that is about 25p a litre cheaper. Thank God my Discovery runs on LPG - on my last trip to France about 16 months ago I was paying under 1/2 a Euro a Litre - which was about 35p a litre - the exchange rate is not anything like as good now sadly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GJH Posted May 27, 2008 Share Posted May 27, 2008 I can see a few people shouting if somebody suggests all tax and benefit systems are harmonised throughout Europe :D Graham Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted May 27, 2008 Share Posted May 27, 2008 Work collegue just got back from near Lyon, he reacons fuel was near enough same price as here petrol at about $1.50 deisel dearer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CliveH Posted May 27, 2008 Author Share Posted May 27, 2008 On the autoroutes that is certainly the case - but off these and into the towns at supermarkets etc the price of fuel is very much less than on the autoroutes. Can not speak from recent experience tho - as have not travelled in the EU for about 16 months now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGD Posted May 27, 2008 Share Posted May 27, 2008 CliveH - 2008-05-27 4:19 PM Not sure about that pagey - but to be fair to them - they always say they make virtually no profit on fuel sales in the UK. Most rural garages that sold fuel no longer do so. Most rural fuel outlets are now shut. My local garage only survives due to the Londis shop attached to it. No profit in fuel at all he says - it is just what draws the customers into his shop. Maybe this is different within the EU? But if you were paying 138 Euro a litre with the exchange rate I make that about 105p a litre so that is about 25p a litre cheaper. Thank God my Discovery runs on LPG - on my last trip to France about 16 months ago I was paying under 1/2 a Euro a Litre - which was about 35p a litre - the exchange rate is not anything like as good now sadly. If you look at the numbers you'll see how little the oil Companies actually make; as a percentage of total sales, their profit is tiny. As an example, I looked at the 2007 annual report and accounts for BP. All the following figures are in millions of USD's: Total Sales Revenue 289,000 Net Profit after Tax 21,169 Net Profit as a precentage of sales: 7.3% Their net profit in 2007 was even lower than in 2006 (22,286) and 2005 (22,632). And lest we forget, all that 21,169 net profit in 2007 went to the owners of BP as dividend to shareholders (as return on the risk that shareholders take when they invest their money into a Company).....which includes everyone with investment funds or pension funds or ISA's etc which include some BP shares in their portfolio................at a payout of one dollar and 8 cents per share of the Company that they owned. 7.3% net profit on sales is NOT a good number. Really. And although the summary Report does not indicate from which parts of BP's operations the major portion of it's profits came, I bet it was from operations other than refining and selling of vehicle petrol and diesel (eg heavy fuel oils, wind and electricity generation, etc etc). I suggest that the two parties in the oil exploration/drilling/export/refining/distribution/retail sale chain that ARE making FANTASTIC "profit" are: A. The OPEC countries Governments, whose crude oil it is to begin with, and who sell it to oil refiners on the global trading markets. B. The UK Government. Because they tax fuel so may times: import duty charged to the refiner. Corporation tax on UK oil Company profit. Tax added to the per-litre price of refined petrol & deisel at the pump. AND then VAT added as 17.5% percentage ON TOP OF the other tax per litre it has already enforced upon the retailer. The UK Government LIKES the wholesale price of crude oil to be very high; for two reasons: 1. It makes it look as if it ain't the Government who is responsible for the massive price increases.....but only a thicko cannot see that taxes of 69% on top of whatever the wholesale price is, represent by far the biggest element in the cost you as a consumer pay. 2. Because the taxes the Government charge are a percentage of the traded wholesale price, the higher that price goes, the more tax-take the Governnent receives. Thus Mr Bean and the Government will bleat on about it being an international problem, not a UK one. That is a lie, pure and simple. Because 69% of the problem has nothing at all to do with the wholesale traded price. It is purely the result of his Government's taxation of the stuff. Rant over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted May 27, 2008 Share Posted May 27, 2008 BGD - 2008-05-27 9:48 PM The UK Government LIKES the wholesale price of crude oil to be very high; for two reasons: 1. It makes it look as if it ain't the Government who is responsible for the massive price increases.....but only a thicko cannot see that taxes of 69% on top of whatever the wholesale price is, represent by far the biggest element in the cost you as a consumer pay. 2. Because the taxes the Government charge are a percentage of the traded wholesale price, the higher that price goes, the more tax-take the Governnent receives. Thus Mr Bean and the Government will bleat on about it being an international problem, not a UK one. That is a lie, pure and simple. Because 69% of the problem has nothing at all to do with the wholesale traded price. It is purely the result of his Government's taxation of the stuff. Rant over. I take opposite view, UK gov hates it when oil prices are high, it shows up the high taxes, and just like this thread and lots of other stories they take a lot of stick for it, and don't think tories will be any better, after all they started the fuel esculater. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGD Posted May 28, 2008 Share Posted May 28, 2008 But Colin, just listen to the recent outpourings of the glorious leader Mr Bean......."The International problems", "outside of our control", "we are listening to the people", how could anyone doubt him??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CliveH Posted May 28, 2008 Author Share Posted May 28, 2008 I think you are both correct. From the financial viewpoint the Government (whichever one, whatever one) likes high oil prices because of the tax revenue it reaps. But they do not want it so high that the population looses patience. It is only when fuel prices really hurt that people get out on the streets. And those that don't "get out on the streets" tacitly support those that do. Like I said earlier - the indications are that the police on the beat, in the police cars etc do not have their hearts in stopping a blockade because they have been most royally shafted by this government over a 2.5% pay award that was agreed by all sides then reneged on by the government. And in the last year the price of fuel has gone up by circa 30% and 69% of that is tax. So let's say we are paying an extra 35 pence a litre now - 69% of that is 24 pence. So the actual cost of the fuel has gone up 11 pence but the tax we pay on each litre has gone up 24 pence. It is a sobering thought that if we are paying 130 pence a litre, that means that the actual cost of the item we put in our tanks is just 40 pence and a whopping 90 pence is tax!! Just imagine how your average Copper feels about that when they have been denied a perfectly reasonable 2.5% pay rise by individuals (on both sides of the house) that are desperate to stop the general public from knowing what "expense" fiddles they get up to to run, furnish and buy a second home as well as employ members of their families for non-existent work. This goes down REALLY well with people now struggling to pay the bills on the only home they have got and feed a family that they cannot fiddle an income for. I can see this getting out of hand unless "Mr Bean" and his numpties get a grip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GJH Posted May 28, 2008 Share Posted May 28, 2008 Just to go back to the original post on this thread. I did a bit of looking round the web last night and, whilst the comparison of tax rates tell a story so do the average pump prices for May 2008, also published by the AA HERE. Comparisons with our nearest continental neighbours shows that, in UK pence terms, the UK is ahead on diesel but pretty much on a par with France & Germany (and way behind Belgium & the Netherlands) for unleaded. Given the difference in tax rates that means that there must be another factor driving such high pump prices in the other countries - which, presumably, is the "cut" which the oil companies and retailers (one and the same in many cases) take. That tends to make me suspect that pump prices are set by the companies at what they think the market will stand in each country - which doesn't surprise me given the supply & demand situation at the moment. Graham Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pagey Posted May 28, 2008 Share Posted May 28, 2008 Graham this is what i was thinking when i replied to clive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GJH Posted May 28, 2008 Share Posted May 28, 2008 pagey - 2008-05-28 11:44 AM Graham this is what i was thinking when i replied to clive Knew I'd seen something along those lines somewhere but missed your post when I looked at this thread earlier :-D Graham Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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