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Oh deary deary me!


Barryd999

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Labour should have binned Corbyn in 2017 but of course back then he did far better than the "powers that be" expected and became the peoples hero, especially with the young. He was even on at Glastonbury. So the hatchet job from those who actually decide our leaders began and of course was a roaring success helped by his inept stance on Brexit.

 

The media moguls and Tufton street mob decide our leaders of course which is why they are so crap or in the case of Johnson exceptionally crap. Useful idiots maybe until (as in Johnsons case) they are no longer useful. It remains to be seen who they put in power next but democratic, it certainly isn't.

 

Looks like some EU countries are pulling the stops out to help with the energy crisis, it remains to be seen what happens here. VAT was just 5% on domestic energy anyway so in the great scheme of things as they are now no big shakes.

 

https://www.thenational.scot/news/19813493.energy-bills-5-european-countries-limiting-skyrocketing-costs-citizens/

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"And just to be clear - I voted Remain - but it does make me laugh that those most vehement to our leaving the EU now want VAT removed from utility bills - which is only now a possibility as we are no longer part of the EU."

 

The reason they are asking for it is to embarrass the government, Johnson promised to do away with it during the campaign, together with £350 million a week for the NHS. So I think it is quite right for the opposition to ask why these Brexit benefits aren't being delivered.

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Guest pelmetman
Barryd999 - 2022-01-10 4:50 PM

 

I never thought I would post a "Sun" link or even an article from Piers Morgan.

 

This has got to be the most damaging press coverage for Johnson in his entire shambles of a premiership. Surely thats the end of him now.

 

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/17268563/boris-johnson-shambles-quit-piers-morgan-uncensored/

 

Oh dreary dreary me *-) ...........

 

You do know that if Boris gets the push.......The Tories will still be in power? ;-) .........

 

Keep on Hating & Hoping (lol) (lol) (lol) ............

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Gremlin - 2022-01-11 9:17 AM

 

CurtainRaiser - 2022-01-10 5:55 PM

 

"And just to be clear - I voted Remain - but it does make me laugh that those most vehement to our leaving the EU now want VAT removed from utility bills - which is only now a possibility as we are no longer part of the EU."

 

The reason they are asking for it is to embarrass the government, Johnson promised to do away with it during the campaign, together with £350 million a week for the NHS. So I think it is quite right for the opposition to ask why these Brexit benefits aren't being delivered.

 

So the opposition is embarrassing the Government by pushing for something that would not have been possible if the opposition had been in power?

 

Not a wise move:-

 

“Never interrupt your opponent when he is making a mistake”

 

 

Its called holding people to account. It quite literally is the role of the opposition and the actions of a Independent press.

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pelmetman - 2022-01-11 8:59 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-10 4:50 PM

 

I never thought I would post a "Sun" link or even an article from Piers Morgan.

 

This has got to be the most damaging press coverage for Johnson in his entire shambles of a premiership. Surely thats the end of him now.

 

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/17268563/boris-johnson-shambles-quit-piers-morgan-uncensored/

 

Oh dreary dreary me *-) ...........

 

You do know that if Boris gets the push.......The Tories will still be in power? ;-) .........

 

Keep on Hating & Hoping (lol) (lol) (lol) ............

 

Really? Oh I thought they would all clear off and go home. *-)

 

There is a risk of course that the Tufton street mob could put in a bonkers puppet like Liz Truss but Im not sure even they would get away with that. My money would be on Rishi and I can live with that for now but your hero has to go as he is a disgrace and a totally despicable human being. He has dragged this country into the gutter and we are the laughing stock of the world as a result. Worse than that his horrendous handling of the pandemic, the lies and corruption are unforgivable. Not only do I want him gone, I want him locked up but ill settle for the former for now. Anyone (like you) still supporting this clown after everything he has done needs to take a good long look at themselves.

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Gremlin - 2022-01-11 9:32 AM

 

CurtainRaiser - 2022-01-11 9:25 AM

 

Gremlin - 2022-01-11 9:17 AM

 

CurtainRaiser - 2022-01-10 5:55 PM

 

"And just to be clear - I voted Remain - but it does make me laugh that those most vehement to our leaving the EU now want VAT removed from utility bills - which is only now a possibility as we are no longer part of the EU."

 

The reason they are asking for it is to embarrass the government, Johnson promised to do away with it during the campaign, together with £350 million a week for the NHS. So I think it is quite right for the opposition to ask why these Brexit benefits aren't being delivered.

 

So the opposition is embarrassing the Government by pushing for something that would not have been possible if the opposition had been in power?

 

Not a wise move:-

 

“Never interrupt your opponent when he is making a mistake”

 

 

Its called holding people to account. It quite literally is the role of the opposition and the actions of a Independent press.

 

I totally agree that the Press should be all over this like a rash. However Starmer is not doing himself any favours by advertising the fact that Boris could (and most certainly should IMO) remove VAT from utility bills which is an option that would not even been an option for him if Starmer (who was against Brexit) was PM and we were still in the EU.

 

The problem about holding “others to account” is that it really does work both ways.

 

If someone stands on a mandate that they will save people money if you vote for their policy, it is reasonable for the opposition to remind the electorate that a promise is being broken. That's how it works.

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Gremlin - 2022-01-11 9:58 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-11 9:50 AM

 

pelmetman - 2022-01-11 8:59 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-10 4:50 PM

 

I never thought I would post a "Sun" link or even an article from Piers Morgan.

 

This has got to be the most damaging press coverage for Johnson in his entire shambles of a premiership. Surely thats the end of him now.

 

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/17268563/boris-johnson-shambles-quit-piers-morgan-uncensored/

 

Oh dreary dreary me *-) ...........

 

You do know that if Boris gets the push.......The Tories will still be in power? ;-) .........

 

Keep on Hating & Hoping (lol) (lol) (lol) ............

 

Really? Oh I thought they would all clear off and go home. *-)

 

There is a risk of course that the Tufton street mob could put in a bonkers puppet like Liz Truss but Im not sure even they would get away with that. My money would be on Rishi and I can live with that for now but your hero has to go as he is a disgrace and a totally despicable human being. He has dragged this country into the gutter and we are the laughing stock of the world as a result. Worse than that his horrendous handling of the pandemic, the lies and corruption are unforgivable. Not only do I want him gone, I want him locked up but ill settle for the former for now. Anyone (like you) still supporting this clown after everything he has done needs to take a good long look at themselves.

 

I can remember people saying exactly the same about Tony Blair. The words are much the same just the originating “tribe” differs.

 

And I suspect Boris will end up in the upper house as well.

 

Have I got this right? You are comparing Boris Johnson to Tony Blair? Blair was popular, he won three elections. I am surprised Johnson has lasted as long as he has to be honest. Probably only because the new baby Tory red wall voters were so heavily invested in him and Brexit they were in denial for so long but only a total idiot would continue to support him now.

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Gremlin - 2022-01-11 10:24 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-11 10:15 AM

 

Gremlin - 2022-01-11 9:58 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-11 9:50 AM

 

pelmetman - 2022-01-11 8:59 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-10 4:50 PM

 

I never thought I would post a "Sun" link or even an article from Piers Morgan.

 

This has got to be the most damaging press coverage for Johnson in his entire shambles of a premiership. Surely thats the end of him now.

 

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/17268563/boris-johnson-shambles-quit-piers-morgan-uncensored/

 

Oh dreary dreary me *-) ...........

 

You do know that if Boris gets the push.......The Tories will still be in power? ;-) .........

 

Keep on Hating & Hoping (lol) (lol) (lol) ............

 

Really? Oh I thought they would all clear off and go home. *-)

 

There is a risk of course that the Tufton street mob could put in a bonkers puppet like Liz Truss but Im not sure even they would get away with that. My money would be on Rishi and I can live with that for now but your hero has to go as he is a disgrace and a totally despicable human being. He has dragged this country into the gutter and we are the laughing stock of the world as a result. Worse than that his horrendous handling of the pandemic, the lies and corruption are unforgivable. Not only do I want him gone, I want him locked up but ill settle for the former for now. Anyone (like you) still supporting this clown after everything he has done needs to take a good long look at themselves.

 

I can remember people saying exactly the same about Tony Blair. The words are much the same just the originating “tribe” differs.

 

And I suspect Boris will end up in the upper house as well.

 

Have I got this right? You are comparing Boris Johnson to Tony Blair? Blair was popular, he won three elections. I am surprised Johnson has lasted as long as he has to be honest. Probably only because the new baby Tory red wall voters were so heavily invested in him and Brexit they were in denial for so long but only a total idiot would continue to support him now.

 

But Blair falsified the document on WMD. Hoon, the then defence minister now says Blair wanted him to destroy the document that outlined that the war would be illegal.

 

Blair sent soldiers to their death in a war zone as all they had was Land Rovers from the streets of Belfast.

 

IMO Blair is a war criminal.

 

IMO Boris is a buffoon

 

So no, I am not saying the two are directly comparable. Blair’s crimes are infinitely greater.

 

 

Hmm. A war in which both the public and both sides of the house supported. I find it somewhat ironic that the very people who are now frothing at the mouth and seething about his knighthood will have been itching for it all to kick off in Iraq sat with their popcorn watching the first bombs fall live on TV.

 

This is not about Blair anyway or any other Prime Minister from the last century its about Johnson. Pelmet will be along in a minute to try and find a way to blame Jeremy Corbyn.

 

Blair is gone, Corbyn has gone, Brexit is (supposedly) done, the focus is now on Johnson and whether he is fit to run this country which of course he is not.

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Guest pelmetman
Barryd999 - 2022-01-11 9:50 AM

 

pelmetman - 2022-01-11 8:59 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-10 4:50 PM

 

I never thought I would post a "Sun" link or even an article from Piers Morgan.

 

This has got to be the most damaging press coverage for Johnson in his entire shambles of a premiership. Surely thats the end of him now.

 

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/17268563/boris-johnson-shambles-quit-piers-morgan-uncensored/

 

Oh dreary dreary me *-) ...........

 

You do know that if Boris gets the push.......The Tories will still be in power? ;-) .........

 

Keep on Hating & Hoping (lol) (lol) (lol) ............

 

Really? Oh I thought they would all clear off and go home. *-)

 

There is a risk of course that the Tufton street mob could put in a bonkers puppet like Liz Truss but Im not sure even they would get away with that. My money would be on Rishi and I can live with that for now but your hero has to go as he is a disgrace and a totally despicable human being. He has dragged this country into the gutter and we are the laughing stock of the world as a result. Worse than that his horrendous handling of the pandemic, the lies and corruption are unforgivable. Not only do I want him gone, I want him locked up but ill settle for the former for now. Anyone (like you) still supporting this clown after everything he has done needs to take a good long look at themselves.

 

So just as I thought ;-) .........

 

It's all about LOSER vengence *-) ........

 

Don't bother looking in the mirror......it'll prolly crack (lol) (lol) (lol) ...........

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Guest pelmetman
CurtainRaiser - 2022-01-11 11:50 AM

 

A few facts:

 

Blair is guilty of war crimes.

 

Johnson is guilty of theft and corruption. And thousands of unnecessary deaths.

 

Pelmethead hasn't got any windows.

 

 

A few more ;-) ........

 

Blair is guilty of Lying to start a illegal war *-) ..........

 

Boris is guilty of making mistakes in a Pandemic, just like Italy, Spain, France, Germany etc etc :-| .......

 

CurtainTWITcher still hasn't got any balls >:-) .........

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Barryd999 - 2022-01-10 4:50 PM

 

I never thought I would post a "Sun" link or even an article from Piers Morgan.

 

This has got to be the most damaging press coverage for Johnson in his entire shambles of a premiership. Surely thats the end of him now.

 

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/17268563/boris-johnson-shambles-quit-piers-morgan-uncensored/

 

Bit of a stretch to claim Johnson has 'got Brexit Done' when you see how much there is still to do.

But what I found most offensive was giving Johnson credit for the vaccine rollout. A friend of mine is an ex nurse, now wheelchair bound and seriously disabled and was one of the thousands of volunteers who gave their time for nothing to help with the vaccine rollout.

She is skint and working for nothing, whilst Johnson defends his overpaid MPs taking bungs and £300 billion of our money spaffed away on useless stuff. People are only starting to wake up to that now they are looking at a tax hike - that will take 20 years to pay it back.

People like her have simply been ignored whilst Johnson claims the credit. >:-)

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Guest pelmetman
CurtainRaiser - 2022-01-11 12:32 PM

 

Gremlin - 2022-01-11 12:10 PM

 

Indeed - but it still needs to be said.

 

As does Johnson's record of 175,000

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/jan/11/uk-covid-death-toll-ons

 

Seems the only person without blood on their hands is Pelmethead.

 

So what about the 20 European countries who's death rates are worse than ours? :-| ........

 

Surely they must be even worse murderers? >:-) ..........

 

Got any balls yet? (lol) (lol) (lol) ...........

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John52 - 2022-01-11 12:31 PM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-10 4:50 PM

 

I never thought I would post a "Sun" link or even an article from Piers Morgan.

 

This has got to be the most damaging press coverage for Johnson in his entire shambles of a premiership. Surely thats the end of him now.

 

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/17268563/boris-johnson-shambles-quit-piers-morgan-uncensored/

 

Bit of a stretch to claim Johnson has 'got Brexit Done' when you see how much there is still to do.

But what I found most offensive was giving Johnson credit for the vaccine rollout. A friend of mine is an ex nurse, now wheelchair bound and seriously disabled and was one of the thousands of volunteers who gave their time for nothing to help with the vaccine rollout.

She is skint and working for nothing, whilst Johnson defends his overpaid MPs taking bungs and £300 billion of our money spaffed away on useless stuff. People are only starting to wake up to that now they are looking at a tax hike - that will take 20 years to pay it back.

People like her have simply been ignored whilst Johnson claims the credit. >:-)

 

Of course Brexit is not done and of course Johnson deservers no credit for the Vaccine roll out but Im kind of glad Piers never went down that road. Had he done so Sun readers would have closed ranks and just put it down as a bitter remoaner rant. What he has done is much better as its exposed to his not so bright supporters just how much he has taken the piss out of them and what a lying toad he is without risking degrading their desperately important Brexit "win". Im pretty sure its why Starmer has played it canny on slagging of Brexit. Slowly slowly catch the monkey.

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pelmetman - 2022-01-11 11:36 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-11 9:50 AM

 

pelmetman - 2022-01-11 8:59 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-10 4:50 PM

 

I never thought I would post a "Sun" link or even an article from Piers Morgan.

 

This has got to be the most damaging press coverage for Johnson in his entire shambles of a premiership. Surely thats the end of him now.

 

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/17268563/boris-johnson-shambles-quit-piers-morgan-uncensored/

 

Oh dreary dreary me *-) ...........

 

You do know that if Boris gets the push.......The Tories will still be in power? ;-) .........

 

Keep on Hating & Hoping (lol) (lol) (lol) ............

 

Really? Oh I thought they would all clear off and go home. *-)

 

There is a risk of course that the Tufton street mob could put in a bonkers puppet like Liz Truss but Im not sure even they would get away with that. My money would be on Rishi and I can live with that for now but your hero has to go as he is a disgrace and a totally despicable human being. He has dragged this country into the gutter and we are the laughing stock of the world as a result. Worse than that his horrendous handling of the pandemic, the lies and corruption are unforgivable. Not only do I want him gone, I want him locked up but ill settle for the former for now. Anyone (like you) still supporting this clown after everything he has done needs to take a good long look at themselves.

 

So just as I thought ;-) .........

 

It's all about LOSER vengence *-) ........

 

Don't bother looking in the mirror......it'll prolly crack (lol) (lol) (lol) ...........

 

Just as you "thought"? Thats an oxymoron if ever I saw one. You think wrong of course. Revenge for what? Brexit? Screwing the country over? Corruption? Lies? Failing to protect the country from Covid? The list goes on and on.

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Barryd999 - 2022-01-11 11:26 AM

 

Hmm. A war in which both the public and both sides of the house supported. I find it somewhat ironic that the very people who are now frothing at the mouth and seething about his knighthood will have been itching for it all to kick off in Iraq sat with their popcorn watching the first bombs fall live on TV.

 

This is not about Blair anyway or any other Prime Minister from the last century its about Johnson.

Unlike Corbyn Johnsons voting record shows he consistently voted in favour of the invasion of Iraq and Pelmet was certainly among those glued to their televisions in excitement.

 

Blair is just a smokescreen used by hypocrites who forget we were Americas obedient little poodle.

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Gremlin - 2022-01-11 2:18 PM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-11 1:49 PM

 

pelmetman - 2022-01-11 11:36 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-11 9:50 AM

 

pelmetman - 2022-01-11 8:59 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-10 4:50 PM

 

I never thought I would post a "Sun" link or even an article from Piers Morgan.

 

This has got to be the most damaging press coverage for Johnson in his entire shambles of a premiership. Surely thats the end of him now.

 

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/17268563/boris-johnson-shambles-quit-piers-morgan-uncensored/

 

Oh dreary dreary me *-) ...........

 

You do know that if Boris gets the push.......The Tories will still be in power? ;-) .........

 

Keep on Hating & Hoping (lol) (lol) (lol) ............

 

Really? Oh I thought they would all clear off and go home. *-)

 

There is a risk of course that the Tufton street mob could put in a bonkers puppet like Liz Truss but Im not sure even they would get away with that. My money would be on Rishi and I can live with that for now but your hero has to go as he is a disgrace and a totally despicable human being. He has dragged this country into the gutter and we are the laughing stock of the world as a result. Worse than that his horrendous handling of the pandemic, the lies and corruption are unforgivable. Not only do I want him gone, I want him locked up but ill settle for the former for now. Anyone (like you) still supporting this clown after everything he has done needs to take a good long look at themselves.

 

So just as I thought ;-) .........

 

It's all about LOSER vengence *-) ........

 

Don't bother looking in the mirror......it'll prolly crack (lol) (lol) (lol) ...........

 

Just as you "thought"? Thats an oxymoron if ever I saw one. You think wrong of course. Revenge for what? Brexit? Screwing the country over? Corruption? Lies? Failing to protect the country from Covid? The list goes on and on.

 

People are allowed differing viewpoints.

 

As for failing to protect the country from Covid - to be honest, by giving the go ahead and putting up the cash rather than delaying everything as the EU did by trying to drive down costs - I would say that if you think Boris is guilty in this regard than so is every country in the world and most certainly China.

 

And you can add the EU to that by as I point out above, delaying the vaccine distribution to its member States and their populations because they wanted to save a few € was not a good decision.

 

Nor was invoking Article 16 when they realised they had made a monumental cook up.

 

Im not sure it was anything to do with saving money why the roll out in Europe was delayed. They signed their deal with AZ for example the day before we did contrary to what the media claimed. There were huge distribution and production issues and Britain got preferential treatment. As to why is a bit fuzzy but it appears to have been down to the difference in contract law between Belgium and the UK. There was also an issue where some countries had concerns over the AZ vaccines in the over 65s (nothing to do with the Eu of course).

 

They never invoked article 16 either, they threatened to but backed down. Since then Johnson has threatened to use it and still is despite it being "his oven ready deal" that he wants to break over NI.

 

 

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Gremlin - 2022-01-11 7:25 PM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-11 5:57 PM

 

Gremlin - 2022-01-11 2:18 PM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-11 1:49 PM

 

pelmetman - 2022-01-11 11:36 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-11 9:50 AM

 

pelmetman - 2022-01-11 8:59 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-10 4:50 PM

 

I never thought I would post a "Sun" link or even an article from Piers Morgan.

 

This has got to be the most damaging press coverage for Johnson in his entire shambles of a premiership. Surely thats the end of him now.

 

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/17268563/boris-johnson-shambles-quit-piers-morgan-uncensored/

 

Oh dreary dreary me *-) ...........

 

You do know that if Boris gets the push.......The Tories will still be in power? ;-) .........

 

Keep on Hating & Hoping (lol) (lol) (lol) ............

 

Really? Oh I thought they would all clear off and go home. *-)

 

There is a risk of course that the Tufton street mob could put in a bonkers puppet like Liz Truss but Im not sure even they would get away with that. My money would be on Rishi and I can live with that for now but your hero has to go as he is a disgrace and a totally despicable human being. He has dragged this country into the gutter and we are the laughing stock of the world as a result. Worse than that his horrendous handling of the pandemic, the lies and corruption are unforgivable. Not only do I want him gone, I want him locked up but ill settle for the former for now. Anyone (like you) still supporting this clown after everything he has done needs to take a good long look at themselves.

 

So just as I thought ;-) .........

 

It's all about LOSER vengence *-) ........

 

Don't bother looking in the mirror......it'll prolly crack (lol) (lol) (lol) ...........

 

Just as you "thought"? Thats an oxymoron if ever I saw one. You think wrong of course. Revenge for what? Brexit? Screwing the country over? Corruption? Lies? Failing to protect the country from Covid? The list goes on and on.

 

People are allowed differing viewpoints.

 

As for failing to protect the country from Covid - to be honest, by giving the go ahead and putting up the cash rather than delaying everything as the EU did by trying to drive down costs - I would say that if you think Boris is guilty in this regard than so is every country in the world and most certainly China.

 

And you can add the EU to that by as I point out above, delaying the vaccine distribution to its member States and their populations because they wanted to save a few € was not a good decision.

 

Nor was invoking Article 16 when they realised they had made a monumental cook up.

 

Im not sure it was anything to do with saving money why the roll out in Europe was delayed. They signed their deal with AZ for example the day before we did contrary to what the media claimed. There were huge distribution and production issues and Britain got preferential treatment. As to why is a bit fuzzy but it appears to have been down to the difference in contract law between Belgium and the UK. There was also an issue where some countries had concerns over the AZ vaccines in the over 65s (nothing to do with the Eu of course).

 

They never invoked article 16 either, they threatened to but backed down. Since then Johnson has threatened to use it and still is despite it being "his oven ready deal" that he wants to break over NI.

 

 

The most certainly DID invoke Article 16 - but then revoked it when the whole world went WTF?

 

And as for the price negotiations check out the Poltico article “How Europe fell behind on vaccines”

 

Sun title “The EU secured some of the lowest prices in the world. At what cost?”

 

The article is by Jillian Deutsch and Sarah Wheaton

 

Published Jan27th 2021

 

It’s a good article outlining exactly how the EU managed to always be two or three steps behind which resulted in a great deal of frustration due to the Commission concentrating on “process over speed”.

 

As for the false criticism of the AZ vaccine not working as well in the over 60/65’s - this is and was never the case as the AZ vaccine follows old school methodology that was known and has now be proved to stimulate the memory T-cells that provide longer term immunity.

 

Whereas the new (wonderful!) mRNA technology vaccines certainly trigger a greater antibody response but this falls off and so the AZ vaccine is no slouch when it comes to protecting any age group.

 

Certain EU leaders were most certainly guilty of “misunderstanding” this, for reasons best known to themselves.

 

The FT in the 14th April 2021 reported the research that showed that the “AZ vaccine elicits stronger T-cell response in the elderly than the Pfizer jab”.

 

Then on the 23rd November 2021 The Guardian carried the story that because of the superior T-cell response from the AZ vaccine and the rejection of the AZ Vaccine by Europe is the link as to why there was such a Covid Surge in the EU.

 

Whilst the Guardian tries to “poo-poo” the idea - The AZ vaccine is now recognised as having a VERY good protective effect for the elderly, for this very reason.

 

Article 16 was never triggered

 

https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/explainers/northern-ireland-protocol-article-16

 

As to T cell response the jury is still out in terms of longer term effectiveness, anyone saying otherwise is either banging a nationalism or commercial drum. Ninety percent of the jabs I delivered were AZ and I'd obviously like to claim its super duper, but there are two reasons why it is no longer being used in this country 1.There are more side effects with adenovirus vaccines like AZ and Johnson and Johnson, even the UK government accepted this when they ruled out the use of AZ for those between 18 and 40. Although for obvious reasons they haven't highlighted this too much.

2. A mixed vaccine schedule provokes the immune system into the best response, or at least that's current thinking.

 

https://www.sciencemediacentre.org/expert-reaction-to-today-programme-interview-with-pascal-soriot-and-comments-made-about-t-cell-immunity-generated-from-the-oxford-astrazeneca-vaccine-compared-to-mrna-vaccines-and-the-impact-on-risk-o/

 

 

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Gremlin - 2022-01-12 6:45 AM

 

CurtainRaiser - 2022-01-11 9:45 PM

 

Gremlin - 2022-01-11 7:25 PM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-11 5:57 PM

 

Gremlin - 2022-01-11 2:18 PM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-11 1:49 PM

 

pelmetman - 2022-01-11 11:36 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-11 9:50 AM

 

pelmetman - 2022-01-11 8:59 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-10 4:50 PM

 

I never thought I would post a "Sun" link or even an article from Piers Morgan.

 

This has got to be the most damaging press coverage for Johnson in his entire shambles of a premiership. Surely thats the end of him now.

 

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/17268563/boris-johnson-shambles-quit-piers-morgan-uncensored/

 

Oh dreary dreary me *-) ...........

 

You do know that if Boris gets the push.......The Tories will still be in power? ;-) .........

 

Keep on Hating & Hoping (lol) (lol) (lol) ............

 

Really? Oh I thought they would all clear off and go home. *-)

 

There is a risk of course that the Tufton street mob could put in a bonkers puppet like Liz Truss but Im not sure even they would get away with that. My money would be on Rishi and I can live with that for now but your hero has to go as he is a disgrace and a totally despicable human being. He has dragged this country into the gutter and we are the laughing stock of the world as a result. Worse than that his horrendous handling of the pandemic, the lies and corruption are unforgivable. Not only do I want him gone, I want him locked up but ill settle for the former for now. Anyone (like you) still supporting this clown after everything he has done needs to take a good long look at themselves.

 

So just as I thought ;-) .........

 

It's all about LOSER vengence *-) ........

 

Don't bother looking in the mirror......it'll prolly crack (lol) (lol) (lol) ...........

 

Just as you "thought"? Thats an oxymoron if ever I saw one. You think wrong of course. Revenge for what? Brexit? Screwing the country over? Corruption? Lies? Failing to protect the country from Covid? The list goes on and on.

 

People are allowed differing viewpoints.

 

As for failing to protect the country from Covid - to be honest, by giving the go ahead and putting up the cash rather than delaying everything as the EU did by trying to drive down costs - I would say that if you think Boris is guilty in this regard than so is every country in the world and most certainly China.

 

And you can add the EU to that by as I point out above, delaying the vaccine distribution to its member States and their populations because they wanted to save a few € was not a good decision.

 

Nor was invoking Article 16 when they realised they had made a monumental cook up.

 

Im not sure it was anything to do with saving money why the roll out in Europe was delayed. They signed their deal with AZ for example the day before we did contrary to what the media claimed. There were huge distribution and production issues and Britain got preferential treatment. As to why is a bit fuzzy but it appears to have been down to the difference in contract law between Belgium and the UK. There was also an issue where some countries had concerns over the AZ vaccines in the over 65s (nothing to do with the Eu of course).

 

They never invoked article 16 either, they threatened to but backed down. Since then Johnson has threatened to use it and still is despite it being "his oven ready deal" that he wants to break over NI.

 

 

The most certainly DID invoke Article 16 - but then revoked it when the whole world went WTF?

 

And as for the price negotiations check out the Poltico article “How Europe fell behind on vaccines”

 

Sun title “The EU secured some of the lowest prices in the world. At what cost?”

 

The article is by Jillian Deutsch and Sarah Wheaton

 

Published Jan27th 2021

 

It’s a good article outlining exactly how the EU managed to always be two or three steps behind which resulted in a great deal of frustration due to the Commission concentrating on “process over speed”.

 

As for the false criticism of the AZ vaccine not working as well in the over 60/65’s - this is and was never the case as the AZ vaccine follows old school methodology that was known and has now be proved to stimulate the memory T-cells that provide longer term immunity.

 

Whereas the new (wonderful!) mRNA technology vaccines certainly trigger a greater antibody response but this falls off and so the AZ vaccine is no slouch when it comes to protecting any age group.

 

Certain EU leaders were most certainly guilty of “misunderstanding” this, for reasons best known to themselves.

 

The FT in the 14th April 2021 reported the research that showed that the “AZ vaccine elicits stronger T-cell response in the elderly than the Pfizer jab”.

 

Then on the 23rd November 2021 The Guardian carried the story that because of the superior T-cell response from the AZ vaccine and the rejection of the AZ Vaccine by Europe is the link as to why there was such a Covid Surge in the EU.

 

Whilst the Guardian tries to “poo-poo” the idea - The AZ vaccine is now recognised as having a VERY good protective effect for the elderly, for this very reason.

 

Article 16 was never triggered

 

https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/explainers/northern-ireland-protocol-article-16

 

As to T cell response the jury is still out in terms of longer term effectiveness, anyone saying otherwise is either banging a nationalism or commercial drum. Ninety percent of the jabs I delivered were AZ and I'd obviously like to claim its super duper, but there are two reasons why it is no longer being used in this country 1.There are more side effects with adenovirus vaccines like AZ and Johnson and Johnson, even the UK government accepted this when they ruled out the use of AZ for those between 18 and 40. Although for obvious reasons they haven't highlighted this too much.

2. A mixed vaccine schedule provokes the immune system into the best response, or at least that's current thinking.

 

https://www.sciencemediacentre.org/expert-reaction-to-today-programme-interview-with-pascal-soriot-and-comments-made-about-t-cell-immunity-generated-from-the-oxford-astrazeneca-vaccine-compared-to-mrna-vaccines-and-the-impact-on-risk-o/

 

 

T-cell response is key to long term protection. And the AZ jab does have a significant advantage here. But I totally agree that a mix gives the best overall protection. From what I have seen, for most people, AZ 1 and 2 then an m-RNA one works well but even better is if somewhere along that path the individual picks up antibodies from an actual infection as well.

 

As for what actually happened re the EU Triggering Article 16 it is worth looking at what happened as a timeline and the resulting reaction from the Irish Government, the U.K. Government and the entire political spectrum of N.I.

 

By Wednesday 27th Jan the EU was reeling from its failure to secure enough vaccines for its population. EU member States were in open revolt and threatening to “go it alone” to secure their own jabs.

 

The EU announces it will set up a “vaccine export transparency mechanism” to control the export of vaccines to non-EU countries.

 

Thursday 28th Jan - EU Council President Charles Michel (who is Belgium and who Government was truly reeling from the then infection rate and the virtual paralysation of Belgiums Health Service with no sign that the EU vaccine procurement programme was actually going to deliver anything) stated:-

 

“The EU needs to take robust action to secure its supply of vaccines and demonstrate concretely that the protection of its citizens remains our absolute priority”

 

This left the EU reeling as other non-EU countries had stumped up cash and signed supply contracts with International Pharmaceutical Companies who were now able to supply vaccine whereas the EU was way behind because it focused on cost rather than delivery.

 

This raised eyebrows in the International Community after the EU announced:-

 

“There is a possibility in certain circumstances not to allow the export to move forward. But the basic assumption is that the exports will take place as foreseen” - this raised alarm bells the world over. Not least when an Export of vaccine to Australia was stopped.

 

Friday 29th Jan

 

The EU publishes its contract with AZ and the debate about the exact meaning of “Best Available Efforts” starts.

 

The U.K. states that it will aid other countries where it can however it prioritises its own population.

 

Late afternoon that day the European Medicines Agency finally approves the AZ Vaccine for over 18’s. It is worth noting that the EU was trying to exert control of a vaccine that it had not, up until late on the 29th Jan, actually approved for use as a Covid vaccine.

 

Shortly after this, at about 5:30 reports started to emerge that the EU Commission had triggered Article 16 of the NI Protocol as part of the wider EU controls on vaccine exports. The move implemented a hard border for vaccines in the island of Ireland.

 

NI First Minister calls this “ an incredible act of hostility “

 

Irish Taoiseach Michael Martin - in a rare act of unity with the U.K. - expresses Irelands concern to Ursula Von der Leyen. In fact all parties on all sides of the Irish Sea are stunned by the EU action in triggering Article 16.

 

By 10:55 the EU has backed down after the Irish Taoiseach in particular expresses everyone’s anger at the EU unilaterally invoking Article 16 without any discussions with any of the Governments affected.

 

Both the U.K. and Irish Government as well as all Parties in NI were clear in their anger and disquiet at the EU invoking Article 16.

 

 

Triggering A16 is a formal process and has not happened by either parties. If the threat of triggering A16 is enough to say it's been actioned, then Mr Frost has so far triggered it 28 times and Ms Truss triggered it most recently in her Telegraph article at the weekend.

 

Even the HOC states this.

 

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-9330/

 

And its pointless arguing about the efficacy of AZ when you are only prepared to listen to one source, the link I provided earlier demonstrates that the scientific jury of peer review is still out.

 

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Gremlin - 2022-01-12 9:04 AM

 

CurtainRaiser - 2022-01-12 8:46 AM

 

Gremlin - 2022-01-12 6:45 AM

 

CurtainRaiser - 2022-01-11 9:45 PM

 

Gremlin - 2022-01-11 7:25 PM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-11 5:57 PM

 

Gremlin - 2022-01-11 2:18 PM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-11 1:49 PM

 

pelmetman - 2022-01-11 11:36 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-11 9:50 AM

 

pelmetman - 2022-01-11 8:59 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2022-01-10 4:50 PM

 

I never thought I would post a "Sun" link or even an article from Piers Morgan.

 

This has got to be the most damaging press coverage for Johnson in his entire shambles of a premiership. Surely thats the end of him now.

 

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/17268563/boris-johnson-shambles-quit-piers-morgan-uncensored/

 

Oh dreary dreary me *-) ...........

 

You do know that if Boris gets the push.......The Tories will still be in power? ;-) .........

 

Keep on Hating & Hoping (lol) (lol) (lol) ............

 

Really? Oh I thought they would all clear off and go home. *-)

 

There is a risk of course that the Tufton street mob could put in a bonkers puppet like Liz Truss but Im not sure even they would get away with that. My money would be on Rishi and I can live with that for now but your hero has to go as he is a disgrace and a totally despicable human being. He has dragged this country into the gutter and we are the laughing stock of the world as a result. Worse than that his horrendous handling of the pandemic, the lies and corruption are unforgivable. Not only do I want him gone, I want him locked up but ill settle for the former for now. Anyone (like you) still supporting this clown after everything he has done needs to take a good long look at themselves.

 

So just as I thought ;-) .........

 

It's all about LOSER vengence *-) ........

 

Don't bother looking in the mirror......it'll prolly crack (lol) (lol) (lol) ...........

 

Just as you "thought"? Thats an oxymoron if ever I saw one. You think wrong of course. Revenge for what? Brexit? Screwing the country over? Corruption? Lies? Failing to protect the country from Covid? The list goes on and on.

 

People are allowed differing viewpoints.

 

As for failing to protect the country from Covid - to be honest, by giving the go ahead and putting up the cash rather than delaying everything as the EU did by trying to drive down costs - I would say that if you think Boris is guilty in this regard than so is every country in the world and most certainly China.

 

And you can add the EU to that by as I point out above, delaying the vaccine distribution to its member States and their populations because they wanted to save a few € was not a good decision.

 

Nor was invoking Article 16 when they realised they had made a monumental cook up.

 

Im not sure it was anything to do with saving money why the roll out in Europe was delayed. They signed their deal with AZ for example the day before we did contrary to what the media claimed. There were huge distribution and production issues and Britain got preferential treatment. As to why is a bit fuzzy but it appears to have been down to the difference in contract law between Belgium and the UK. There was also an issue where some countries had concerns over the AZ vaccines in the over 65s (nothing to do with the Eu of course).

 

They never invoked article 16 either, they threatened to but backed down. Since then Johnson has threatened to use it and still is despite it being "his oven ready deal" that he wants to break over NI.

 

 

The most certainly DID invoke Article 16 - but then revoked it when the whole world went WTF?

 

And as for the price negotiations check out the Poltico article “How Europe fell behind on vaccines”

 

Sun title “The EU secured some of the lowest prices in the world. At what cost?”

 

The article is by Jillian Deutsch and Sarah Wheaton

 

Published Jan27th 2021

 

It’s a good article outlining exactly how the EU managed to always be two or three steps behind which resulted in a great deal of frustration due to the Commission concentrating on “process over speed”.

 

As for the false criticism of the AZ vaccine not working as well in the over 60/65’s - this is and was never the case as the AZ vaccine follows old school methodology that was known and has now be proved to stimulate the memory T-cells that provide longer term immunity.

 

Whereas the new (wonderful!) mRNA technology vaccines certainly trigger a greater antibody response but this falls off and so the AZ vaccine is no slouch when it comes to protecting any age group.

 

Certain EU leaders were most certainly guilty of “misunderstanding” this, for reasons best known to themselves.

 

The FT in the 14th April 2021 reported the research that showed that the “AZ vaccine elicits stronger T-cell response in the elderly than the Pfizer jab”.

 

Then on the 23rd November 2021 The Guardian carried the story that because of the superior T-cell response from the AZ vaccine and the rejection of the AZ Vaccine by Europe is the link as to why there was such a Covid Surge in the EU.

 

Whilst the Guardian tries to “poo-poo” the idea - The AZ vaccine is now recognised as having a VERY good protective effect for the elderly, for this very reason.

 

Article 16 was never triggered

 

https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/explainers/northern-ireland-protocol-article-16

 

As to T cell response the jury is still out in terms of longer term effectiveness, anyone saying otherwise is either banging a nationalism or commercial drum. Ninety percent of the jabs I delivered were AZ and I'd obviously like to claim its super duper, but there are two reasons why it is no longer being used in this country 1.There are more side effects with adenovirus vaccines like AZ and Johnson and Johnson, even the UK government accepted this when they ruled out the use of AZ for those between 18 and 40. Although for obvious reasons they haven't highlighted this too much.

2. A mixed vaccine schedule provokes the immune system into the best response, or at least that's current thinking.

 

https://www.sciencemediacentre.org/expert-reaction-to-today-programme-interview-with-pascal-soriot-and-comments-made-about-t-cell-immunity-generated-from-the-oxford-astrazeneca-vaccine-compared-to-mrna-vaccines-and-the-impact-on-risk-o/

 

 

T-cell response is key to long term protection. And the AZ jab does have a significant advantage here. But I totally agree that a mix gives the best overall protection. From what I have seen, for most people, AZ 1 and 2 then an m-RNA one works well but even better is if somewhere along that path the individual picks up antibodies from an actual infection as well.

 

As for what actually happened re the EU Triggering Article 16 it is worth looking at what happened as a timeline and the resulting reaction from the Irish Government, the U.K. Government and the entire political spectrum of N.I.

 

By Wednesday 27th Jan the EU was reeling from its failure to secure enough vaccines for its population. EU member States were in open revolt and threatening to “go it alone” to secure their own jabs.

 

The EU announces it will set up a “vaccine export transparency mechanism” to control the export of vaccines to non-EU countries.

 

Thursday 28th Jan - EU Council President Charles Michel (who is Belgium and who Government was truly reeling from the then infection rate and the virtual paralysation of Belgiums Health Service with no sign that the EU vaccine procurement programme was actually going to deliver anything) stated:-

 

“The EU needs to take robust action to secure its supply of vaccines and demonstrate concretely that the protection of its citizens remains our absolute priority”

 

This left the EU reeling as other non-EU countries had stumped up cash and signed supply contracts with International Pharmaceutical Companies who were now able to supply vaccine whereas the EU was way behind because it focused on cost rather than delivery.

 

This raised eyebrows in the International Community after the EU announced:-

 

“There is a possibility in certain circumstances not to allow the export to move forward. But the basic assumption is that the exports will take place as foreseen” - this raised alarm bells the world over. Not least when an Export of vaccine to Australia was stopped.

 

Friday 29th Jan

 

The EU publishes its contract with AZ and the debate about the exact meaning of “Best Available Efforts” starts.

 

The U.K. states that it will aid other countries where it can however it prioritises its own population.

 

Late afternoon that day the European Medicines Agency finally approves the AZ Vaccine for over 18’s. It is worth noting that the EU was trying to exert control of a vaccine that it had not, up until late on the 29th Jan, actually approved for use as a Covid vaccine.

 

Shortly after this, at about 5:30 reports started to emerge that the EU Commission had triggered Article 16 of the NI Protocol as part of the wider EU controls on vaccine exports. The move implemented a hard border for vaccines in the island of Ireland.

 

NI First Minister calls this “ an incredible act of hostility “

 

Irish Taoiseach Michael Martin - in a rare act of unity with the U.K. - expresses Irelands concern to Ursula Von der Leyen. In fact all parties on all sides of the Irish Sea are stunned by the EU action in triggering Article 16.

 

By 10:55 the EU has backed down after the Irish Taoiseach in particular expresses everyone’s anger at the EU unilaterally invoking Article 16 without any discussions with any of the Governments affected.

 

Both the U.K. and Irish Government as well as all Parties in NI were clear in their anger and disquiet at the EU invoking Article 16.

 

 

Triggering A16 is a formal process and has not happened by either parties. If the threat of triggering A16 is enough to say it's been actioned, then Mr Frost has so far triggered it 28 times and Ms Truss triggered it most recently in her Telegraph article at the weekend.

 

Even the HOC states this.

 

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-9330/

 

And its pointless arguing about the efficacy of AZ when you are only prepared to listen to one source, the link I provided earlier demonstrates that the scientific jury of peer review is still out.

 

The EU did trigger Article 16 - yes they did then retract it. This is not the same as stating that triggering it is an option.

 

And please don’t hide behind the notion of “Peer Review” - the AZ Vaccine is excellent - especially as regards T-cell stimulation - this has been established by peer reviewed studies.

 

" the AZ Vaccine is excellent" so why is it no longer being used in the UK?

 

Do you ever bother to read the links others provide that might give you a more rounded picture

 

So you are right and the House of Commons library is incorrect on A16?

 

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-9330/

 

https://www.sciencemediacentre.org/expert-reaction-to-today-programme-interview-with-pascal-soriot-and-comments-made-about-t-cell-immunity-generated-from-the-oxford-astrazeneca-vaccine-compared-to-mrna-vaccines-and-the-impact-on-risk-o/

 

 

 

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