Question Time fruit loops

[Bulletguy]

 

Staggering! 8-)

 

 

and just for good measure.....another loon;

 

 

undoubtedly a regular overstayer who goes and sits in someone elses borders, such as Benidorm Barry and Diane, courtesy of the EU. *-)

[Birdbrain]

More hatred from the chief hater on here ... Then folk wonder why the forums dead

[Bulletguy]

 

QT motormouth exposed.

 

[Birdbrain]

She has an opinion she's allowed quite properly by the Beeb to put across on Question Time and because Chief Chatterbox hater doesnt like her opinion she's a "motormouth" ... Such hatred

[Birdbrain]

Looks like Question Time panelist Ars Kraash is the haters hero ...

... She seems to be saying assault is OK on a woman because the woman was wearing a hat she didn't like ... Such hate

[Barryd999]

Question time has been a joke for some time now. More plants than Homebase.

[Birdbrain]

Barryd999 - 2020-02-22 7:42 AM

 

Question time has been a joke for some time now. More plants than Homebase.

 

Und the panel without doubt over the last few years has been remain bias as we know

[Barryd999]

Birdbrain - 2020-02-22 7:46 AM

 

Barryd999 - 2020-02-22 7:42 AM

 

Question time has been a joke for some time now. More plants than Homebase.

 

Und the panel without doubt over the last few years has been remain bias as we know

 

Hasnt Farage been on it more than any other politician?

 

Anyway its been proper taken over by the Tories now. Fiona Bruce even announced the other week in liverpool that from now they would have more Tories in the audience because that is now what the country favoured which was odd as in Liverpool they stayed red.

 

The Beeb is finished now. It cant win. If it does anything a bit lefty its shot down in flames and if it wants any hope of surviving under the threats now posed to it by Cummings it will surely have to come under more and more Tory control.

[John52]

Here we go again :-S

[Bulletguy]

John52 - 2020-02-22 2:34 PM

 

Here we go again :-S

Quite. *-)

 

However it's undoubtedly gone downbank since Dimbleby finished and Bruce took over but on the flip side, giving the bigots and racists a platform exposes them for what they are and a good example of that was Nick Griffins appearance which quickly descended into utter farce. Little has been heard of him ever since as he scurried off into obscurity. :-D

 

A good article here on Thursdays QT;

 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/feb/21/normalise-bbc-racism-hate-crimes-question-time

[Birdbrain]

Bulletguy - 2020-02-22 4:10 PM

 

John52 - 2020-02-22 2:34 PM

 

Here we go again :-S

Quite. *-)

 

However it's undoubtedly gone downbank since Dimbleby finished and Bruce took over but on the flip side, giving the bigots and racists a platform exposes them for what they are and a good example of that was Nick Griffins appearance which quickly descended into utter farce. Little has been heard of him ever since as he scurried off into obscurity. :-D

 

A good article here on Thursdays QT;

 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/feb/21/normalise-bbc-racism-hate-crimes-question-time

 

Mr Griffin was on the programme 11 years ago princess ... One thinks you need to get over your hate issues ... is that your microwave I can hear ??? ... Chuckle

[Brian Kirby]

Bulletguy - 2020-02-21 6:45 PM

Staggering! 8-)

and just for good measure.....another loon;

undoubtedly a regular overstayer who goes and sits in someone elses borders, such as Benidorm Barry and Diane, courtesy of the EU. *-)

But No 2, kind of, had a point - several, in fact. (No 1 was off with the fairies!)

 

Immigration has resulted in a substantial rise in the population of the UK over a relatively short period of time, mainly coinciding with the 2008 crash and its aftermath. That rise in population has not been met by increases in transport infrastructure, housing availability, health service expansion, or increased school places.

 

She also has a point that because of their nature, that migrant groups have tended to ghettoise themselves, and have not integrated.

 

This has led to "native" resentment, not I think, as a result of racial prejudice, but as a result of tribal, cultural, clashes.

 

People speaking poor English irritate a lot of native English speakers. Ditto people with slightly different manners: the failure to use please and thank you, for example. Ditto groups of "foreigners" congregating in streets. We haven't done particularly well at teaching migrants how to behave without causing friction, and many are completely unaware that the way they live in their own countries is not, generally, acceptable in the UK, and causes frictions and resentments.

 

So the natives become hostile, the migrants feel that hostility and become defensive, the defensiveness is seen as rejection, and causes more resentment, and so on.

 

That seems to me to be what she was expressing. She had just got ratty about it, and let it all out with visible passion. But, underlying her obvious exasperation, she nevertheless had fair points about the way in which the government had pocketed the kudos for the economic benefits of migration (which is why most are here) while not spending to remedy the things that grate on most people day to day.

 

In short, they have banked the added income, and spent far too little of it on enhancing our national infrastructure to meet the increased demands brought by an increased population. I don't think she really deserves condemnation, she was just clumsy getting it across. I suspect it was her anger that gave her the courage to speak out in public, but it wasn't her best ally once she'd started! Give her a break, a lot of what she said will have rung true for many people - even if it wasn't particularly diplomatic! :-)

[Bulletguy]

To me Brian she typified the insular Little Englander with her wails of "completely close all the borders" and people "flooding in" etc (remember Camerons gaff on describing "swarms" of migrants? And they never came!). This kind of xenophobic hyperbole is straight off the front pages of the DM and Brexpress. She's the type who no doubt has spent years sitting inside another countries borders thanks to what she rails against here.

 

Fine, lets start closing ALL borders everywhere and deny Brits access to the privileges they've previously enjoyed....we are already a good way to achieving that from Brexit but watch the howls and wails of protest when they see their own fom become a thing of the past.

 

Migrant labour generates somewhere in the region of £27 billion a year to UK's economy. Who is going to make up that shortfall when Brits have hounded them all out? Are British prepared to have their taxes hiked up. Noooo......more howls and wails of protest!!

 

And lets not forget this which i've linked before;

https://www.bruegel.org/2017/02/questionable-immigration-claims-in-the-brexit-white-paper/

 

As for integrating i remember watching a very good documentary about this and one young Asian lad in particular stood out as what he said was interesting. He described how as a kid at school all played together irrespective of nationality/ethnicity but once the school bell had rung, everyone went their separate ways and by that i mean the indigenous British too. He'd since made attempts to bring the community together, but came up against a brick wall with folks closing ranks. It's not just ethnic minorities that won't integrate....it's also the indigenous Brit.

 

I'm generalising as obviously some people do integrate well and have friends from all nations but we cannot continue scapegoating migrants for the failings of the country....it just won't wash.

 

Brits living in France or Spain behave just the same....few speaking the language and no intention of doing so, form insular little enclaves and call themselves "ex-pats" because they don't like the "immigrant" word....which is what they are. Finding a Brit immigrant in a foreign country that speaks the language is indeed a rarity but finding a foreign migrant to Britain that speaks English is commonplace and in some cases, multi-lingual. My ex-wife spoke five languages fluently.

 

When people like that woman on QT finally wake up to vent their anger and rage against a government thats continually failed to invest on infrastructure instead of scapegoating migrants, then we might just be getting somewhere, but it's easier to use migrants as an excuse so government sets about throwing folk into detention centres after they've done a lifetimes work paying taxes into the country.

 

What sort of country have we become?

[Bulletguy]

 

Brian....this is what that bigoted harridan is really about.

 

 

[Birdbrain]

Brian Kirby - 2020-02-22 7:01 PM

 

Bulletguy - 2020-02-21 6:45 PM

Staggering! 8-)

and just for good measure.....another loon;

undoubtedly a regular overstayer who goes and sits in someone elses borders, such as Benidorm Barry and Diane, courtesy of the EU. *-)

But No 2, kind of, had a point - several, in fact. (No 1 was off with the fairies!)

 

Immigration has resulted in a substantial rise in the population of the UK over a relatively short period of time, mainly coinciding with the 2008 crash and its aftermath. That rise in population has not been met by increases in transport infrastructure, housing availability, health service expansion, or increased school places.

 

She also has a point that because of their nature, that migrant groups have tended to ghettoise themselves, and have not integrated.

 

This has led to "native" resentment, not I think, as a result of racial prejudice, but as a result of tribal, cultural, clashes.

 

People speaking poor English irritate a lot of native English speakers. Ditto people with slightly different manners: the failure to use please and thank you, for example. Ditto groups of "foreigners" congregating in streets. We haven't done particularly well at teaching migrants how to behave without causing friction, and many are completely unaware that the way they live in their own countries is not, generally, acceptable in the UK, and causes frictions and resentments.

 

So the natives become hostile, the migrants feel that hostility and become defensive, the defensiveness is seen as rejection, and causes more resentment, and so on.

 

That seems to me to be what she was expressing. She had just got ratty about it, and let it all out with visible passion. But, underlying her obvious exasperation, she nevertheless had fair points about the way in which the government had pocketed the kudos for the economic benefits of migration (which is why most are here) while not spending to remedy the things that grate on most people day to day.

 

In short, they have banked the added income, and spent far too little of it on enhancing our national infrastructure to meet the increased demands brought by an increased population. I don't think she really deserves condemnation, she was just clumsy getting it across. I suspect it was her anger that gave her the courage to speak out in public, but it wasn't her best ally once she'd started! Give her a break, a lot of what she said will have rung true for many people - even if it wasn't particularly diplomatic! :-)

 

Good post Brian ... Given the reply you got hes taken nothing on board what youve said ... His hatred eyes see "Little Englander" and "xenophobic hyperbole" ... When you cant discuss you dismiss with hate and insults as we've seen time and again , stunningly brave to do so

[thebishbus]

Too true.I see some of it is starting to migrate from Chatterbox to Motorhome Matters.

Brian B.

[Barryd999]

You have to wonder what the motivation of putting in a plant like her was. Brian says she might have a point and perhaps to some extent she has but of course now her background is exposed its clear why she went off on one and had a bit of a little Englander Rant. All its done is spread more division when I thought we were supposed to be trying to move away from that. Of course given the Rogue state path the Government appears to be taking and the hostile environment that is also being created there is little to no chance of the country healing over Brexit. I fear it will simply get worse.

[Birdbrain]

Barryd999 - 2020-02-23 12:06 PM

 

You have to wonder what the motivation of putting in a plant like her was. Brian says she might have a point and perhaps to some extent she has but of course now her background is exposed its clear why she went off on one and had a bit of a little Englander Rant. All its done is spread more division when I thought we were supposed to be trying to move away from that. Of course given the Rogue state path the Government appears to be taking and the hostile environment that is also being created there is little to no chance of the country healing over Brexit. I fear it will simply get worse.

 

Question Time was last week , its now Sunday afternoon ... The only ones spreading "more division" over it with names and insults are you and the hate squad members , just like youve been doing since and before the Brexit vote ... Mirror , use it

[Bulletguy]

Barryd999 - 2020-02-23 12:06 PM

 

You have to wonder what the motivation of putting in a plant like her was. Brian says she might have a point and perhaps to some extent she has but of course now her background is exposed its clear why she went off on one and had a bit of a little Englander Rant. All its done is spread more division when I thought we were supposed to be trying to move away from that. Of course given the Rogue state path the Government appears to be taking and the hostile environment that is also being created there is little to no chance of the country healing over Brexit. I fear it will simply get worse.

Well she didn't exactly help herself with her opening line of "68 million people now live in England...." but this is the plus side of QT having folk like her on in that it exposes their nonsense and possibly the reason QT chose this clip to post up on Twitter. Fiona Bruce fails to correct audience members on certain claims though, unlike Dimbleby who was much more aware and sharp on current affairs and politics.

 

Giving them a platform inevitably ends with them shooting themselves in the foot and Nick Griffins disastrous appearance is testimony to that. Whatever happened to the BNP anyway....they seem to have disappeared into obscurity after Griffins farce?!! Last i heard of him he was a bankrupt with ideas of emigrating to Hungary....but they didn't want him and he was banned as "a security threat". (lol)

[Barryd999]

Bulletguy - 2020-02-23 3:45 PM

 

Barryd999 - 2020-02-23 12:06 PM

 

You have to wonder what the motivation of putting in a plant like her was. Brian says she might have a point and perhaps to some extent she has but of course now her background is exposed its clear why she went off on one and had a bit of a little Englander Rant. All its done is spread more division when I thought we were supposed to be trying to move away from that. Of course given the Rogue state path the Government appears to be taking and the hostile environment that is also being created there is little to no chance of the country healing over Brexit. I fear it will simply get worse.

Well she didn't exactly help herself with her opening line of "68 million people now live in England...." but this is the plus side of QT having folk like her on in that it exposes their nonsense and possibly the reason QT chose this clip to post up on Twitter. Fiona Bruce fails to correct audience members on certain claims though, unlike Dimbleby who was much more aware and sharp on current affairs and politics.

 

Giving them a platform inevitably ends with them shooting themselves in the foot and Nick Griffins disastrous appearance is testimony to that. Whatever happened to the BNP anyway....they seem to have disappeared into obscurity after Griffins farce?!! Last i heard of him he was a bankrupt with ideas of emigrating to Hungary....but they didn't want him and he was banned as "a security threat". (lol)

 

They are running the country now. I think they are called "The Conservatives". (lol)

 

A lot of them and the Britain First lot joined up, claiming to be the new "Momentum" arm of the Tory party.

[Brian Kirby]

Bulletguy - 2020-02-22 9:04 PM

 

To me Brian she typified the insular Little Englander with her wails of "completely close all the borders" and people "flooding in" etc (remember Camerons gaff on describing "swarms" of migrants? And they never came!). This kind of xenophobic hyperbole is straight off the front pages of the DM and Brexpress. She's the type who no doubt has spent years sitting inside another countries borders thanks to what she rails against here.

 

Fine, lets start closing ALL borders everywhere and deny Brits access to the privileges they've previously enjoyed....we are already a good way to achieving that from Brexit but watch the howls and wails of protest when they see their own fom become a thing of the past.

 

Migrant labour generates somewhere in the region of £27 billion a year to UK's economy. Who is going to make up that shortfall when Brits have hounded them all out? Are British prepared to have their taxes hiked up. Noooo......more howls and wails of protest!!

 

And lets not forget this which i've linked before;

https://www.bruegel.org/2017/02/questionable-immigration-claims-in-the-brexit-white-paper/

 

As for integrating i remember watching a very good documentary about this and one young Asian lad in particular stood out as what he said was interesting. He described how as a kid at school all played together irrespective of nationality/ethnicity but once the school bell had rung, everyone went their separate ways and by that i mean the indigenous British too. He'd since made attempts to bring the community together, but came up against a brick wall with folks closing ranks. It's not just ethnic minorities that won't integrate....it's also the indigenous Brit.

 

I'm generalising as obviously some people do integrate well and have friends from all nations but we cannot continue scapegoating migrants for the failings of the country....it just won't wash.

 

Brits living in France or Spain behave just the same....few speaking the language and no intention of doing so, form insular little enclaves and call themselves "ex-pats" because they don't like the "immigrant" word....which is what they are. Finding a Brit immigrant in a foreign country that speaks the language is indeed a rarity but finding a foreign migrant to Britain that speaks English is commonplace and in some cases, multi-lingual. My ex-wife spoke five languages fluently.

 

When people like that woman on QT finally wake up to vent their anger and rage against a government thats continually failed to invest on infrastructure instead of scapegoating migrants, then we might just be getting somewhere, but it's easier to use migrants as an excuse so government sets about throwing folk into detention centres after they've done a lifetimes work paying taxes into the country.

 

What sort of country have we become?

Yes, I know, Paul ('though I was not aware of her political associations) but I didn't say I agreed with her, just that I thought she had some valid points! :-D

 

Politics is mostly about perceptions, not realities. You may find her rabid (I do too!), but there are a substantial number of people who share, by degrees and by topics, her opinions. Little of what she had to say actually related to the EU, it mostly related to the actions and inactions of HMG, both in its dealings with the EU, and in its press briefings on those dealings.

 

The resentments about foreigners in the UK are long-standing. (There's a "Wiki" here that gives some context https://tinyurl.com/y4yz5x67 ) Remember the Notting Hill riots and Enoch's infamous "rivers of blood speech"? We live on an island, and don't have day to day contact with foreigners as the mainlanders do, especially now with open borders. We have to pay to see how the others live, while the mainlanders only have to drive a few miles in their jalopy to see "foreign" at first hand.

 

That freedom also reminds them that those foreigners can just as quickly invade them by the same routes. I think that difference in outlook leaves them more realistic about the relative futility of borders, while we still see those 21 odd miles of sea as a giant defensive moat around the UK. We look across at "them" and many of us, having no contact with them, and being unable to communicate with "them" have become suspicious of "them".

 

Our press, for the most part, have carelessly enjoyed "Euro-bashing" since before we joined, because it has given them sales. In doing so, they have poisoned the well. It is futile, IMO, to blame those who drank from that well for taking in what they read. Correcting the lies and misreporting was a job for HMG, and they didn't do it (in fact under Blair/Brown they joined in, letting it be known that the Eastern European influx was a consequence of EU "free movement" regulations).

 

It is a pity that the Channel tunnel was not a bridge that we could drive across free of charge. Had that been so, I suspect that there would have been no referendum in 2016.

 

What have we become? I don't think we have changed that much. Whenever numbers of immigrants have come to the UK, we have tended to give them a rough time. Potted history here: https://tinyurl.com/v75ouev

 

Being trapped within our defensive moat, where are we to go when others come? So, we fight back. It's been going on for so long that I'm amazed that HMG repeatedly fails to recognise the danger signs, and act to head off the inevitable friction before it erupts - especially now that we have border controls that can control the flows - even when under the EU freedom of movement directives.

 

The history shows that waves of incomers create friction, and that short term financial benefit repeatedly trumps social harmony - so we haven't really changed that much in 6,000 years, have we? :-D

[Birdbrain]

Brian Kirby - 2020-02-23 5:19 PM

 

Bulletguy - 2020-02-22 9:04 PM

 

To me Brian she typified the insular Little Englander with her wails of "completely close all the borders" and people "flooding in" etc (remember Camerons gaff on describing "swarms" of migrants? And they never came!). This kind of xenophobic hyperbole is straight off the front pages of the DM and Brexpress. She's the type who no doubt has spent years sitting inside another countries borders thanks to what she rails against here.

 

Fine, lets start closing ALL borders everywhere and deny Brits access to the privileges they've previously enjoyed....we are already a good way to achieving that from Brexit but watch the howls and wails of protest when they see their own fom become a thing of the past.

 

Migrant labour generates somewhere in the region of £27 billion a year to UK's economy. Who is going to make up that shortfall when Brits have hounded them all out? Are British prepared to have their taxes hiked up. Noooo......more howls and wails of protest!!

 

And lets not forget this which i've linked before;

https://www.bruegel.org/2017/02/questionable-immigration-claims-in-the-brexit-white-paper/

 

As for integrating i remember watching a very good documentary about this and one young Asian lad in particular stood out as what he said was interesting. He described how as a kid at school all played together irrespective of nationality/ethnicity but once the school bell had rung, everyone went their separate ways and by that i mean the indigenous British too. He'd since made attempts to bring the community together, but came up against a brick wall with folks closing ranks. It's not just ethnic minorities that won't integrate....it's also the indigenous Brit.

 

I'm generalising as obviously some people do integrate well and have friends from all nations but we cannot continue scapegoating migrants for the failings of the country....it just won't wash.

 

Brits living in France or Spain behave just the same....few speaking the language and no intention of doing so, form insular little enclaves and call themselves "ex-pats" because they don't like the "immigrant" word....which is what they are. Finding a Brit immigrant in a foreign country that speaks the language is indeed a rarity but finding a foreign migrant to Britain that speaks English is commonplace and in some cases, multi-lingual. My ex-wife spoke five languages fluently.

 

When people like that woman on QT finally wake up to vent their anger and rage against a government thats continually failed to invest on infrastructure instead of scapegoating migrants, then we might just be getting somewhere, but it's easier to use migrants as an excuse so government sets about throwing folk into detention centres after they've done a lifetimes work paying taxes into the country.

 

What sort of country have we become?

Yes, I know, Paul ('though I was not aware of her political associations) but I didn't say I agreed with her, just that I thought she had some valid points! :-D

 

Politics is mostly about perceptions, not realities. You may find her rabid (I do too!), but there are a substantial number of people who share, by degrees and by topics, her opinions. Little of what she had to say actually related to the EU, it mostly related to the actions and inactions of HMG, both in its dealings with the EU, and in its press briefings on those dealings.

 

The resentments about foreigners in the UK are long-standing. (There's a "Wiki" here that gives some context https://tinyurl.com/y4yz5x67 ) Remember the Notting Hill riots and Enoch's infamous "rivers of blood speech"? We live on an island, and don't have day to day contact with foreigners as the mainlanders do, especially now with open borders. We have to pay to see how the others live, while the mainlanders only have to drive a few miles in their jalopy to see "foreign" at first hand.

 

That freedom also reminds them that those foreigners can just as quickly invade them by the same routes. I think that difference in outlook leaves them more realistic about the relative futility of borders, while we still see those 21 odd miles of sea as a giant defensive moat around the UK. We look across at "them" and many of us, having no contact with them, and being unable to communicate with "them" have become suspicious of "them".

 

Our press, for the most part, have carelessly enjoyed "Euro-bashing" since before we joined, because it has given them sales. In doing so, they have poisoned the well. It is futile, IMO, to blame those who drank from that well for taking in what they read. Correcting the lies and misreporting was a job for HMG, and they didn't do it (in fact under Blair/Brown they joined in, letting it be known that the Eastern European influx was a consequence of EU "free movement" regulations).

 

It is a pity that the Channel tunnel was not a bridge that we could drive across free of charge. Had that been so, I suspect that there would have been no referendum in 2016.

 

What have we become? I don't think we have changed that much. Whenever numbers of immigrants have come to the UK, we have tended to give them a rough time. Potted history here: https://tinyurl.com/v75ouev

 

Being trapped within our defensive moat, where are we to go when others come? So, we fight back. It's been going on for so long that I'm amazed that HMG repeatedly fails to recognise the danger signs, and act to head off the inevitable friction before it erupts - especially now that we have border controls that can control the flows - even when under the EU freedom of movement directives.

 

The history shows that waves of incomers create friction, and that short term financial benefit repeatedly trumps social harmony - so we haven't really changed that much in 6,000 years, have we? :-D

 

"Valid points" don't matter to Paul ... What many including you see as valid points Paul sees as sumat the BNP would produce ... His hatred for anything other than his/her view has been clear for years on here , the moderators tolerate his insults and vile name calling to those he disagrees with for reasons known only to them

[Bulletguy]

Brian Kirby - 2020-02-23 5:19 PM

 

Bulletguy - 2020-02-22 9:04 PM

 

To me Brian she typified the insular Little Englander with her wails of "completely close all the borders" and people "flooding in" etc (remember Camerons gaff on describing "swarms" of migrants? And they never came!). This kind of xenophobic hyperbole is straight off the front pages of the DM and Brexpress. She's the type who no doubt has spent years sitting inside another countries borders thanks to what she rails against here.

 

Fine, lets start closing ALL borders everywhere and deny Brits access to the privileges they've previously enjoyed....we are already a good way to achieving that from Brexit but watch the howls and wails of protest when they see their own fom become a thing of the past.

 

Migrant labour generates somewhere in the region of £27 billion a year to UK's economy. Who is going to make up that shortfall when Brits have hounded them all out? Are British prepared to have their taxes hiked up. Noooo......more howls and wails of protest!!

 

And lets not forget this which i've linked before;

https://www.bruegel.org/2017/02/questionable-immigration-claims-in-the-brexit-white-paper/

 

As for integrating i remember watching a very good documentary about this and one young Asian lad in particular stood out as what he said was interesting. He described how as a kid at school all played together irrespective of nationality/ethnicity but once the school bell had rung, everyone went their separate ways and by that i mean the indigenous British too. He'd since made attempts to bring the community together, but came up against a brick wall with folks closing ranks. It's not just ethnic minorities that won't integrate....it's also the indigenous Brit.

 

I'm generalising as obviously some people do integrate well and have friends from all nations but we cannot continue scapegoating migrants for the failings of the country....it just won't wash.

 

Brits living in France or Spain behave just the same....few speaking the language and no intention of doing so, form insular little enclaves and call themselves "ex-pats" because they don't like the "immigrant" word....which is what they are. Finding a Brit immigrant in a foreign country that speaks the language is indeed a rarity but finding a foreign migrant to Britain that speaks English is commonplace and in some cases, multi-lingual. My ex-wife spoke five languages fluently.

 

When people like that woman on QT finally wake up to vent their anger and rage against a government thats continually failed to invest on infrastructure instead of scapegoating migrants, then we might just be getting somewhere, but it's easier to use migrants as an excuse so government sets about throwing folk into detention centres after they've done a lifetimes work paying taxes into the country.

 

What sort of country have we become?

Little of what she had to say actually related to the EU, it mostly related to the actions and inactions of HMG, both in its dealings with the EU, and in its press briefings on those dealings.

Brexiteers won't agree with that....as far as they're concerned she was echoing what they most despise, migrants and the EU, and as long as we are in transition they will continue blaming EU for all their woes and everything that goes belly up re. Johnson et al which it already has and true to form, "it's the EU's fault".

 

The resentments about foreigners in the UK are long-standing. (There's a "Wiki" here that gives some context https://tinyurl.com/y4yz5x67 ) Remember the Notting Hill riots and Enoch's infamous "rivers of blood speech"? We live on an island, and don't have day to day contact with foreigners as the mainlanders do, especially now with open borders. We have to pay to see how the others live, while the mainlanders only have to drive a few miles in their jalopy to see "foreign" at first hand.

I remember it well......"No Blacks, No Irish, No Dogs" stuck up on inner city windows. Back then blacks and Irish were the whipping sticks, now it's blacks and brown skins so little has changed. I was never sure what the "no dogs" referred to other than dehumanising.

 

As i mentioned in the previous post, if we won't integrate, how or why should we expect ethnic minorities to? Brits by nature are notoriously insular. Outside UK Brit immigrants are even worse behaving like little colonialists as though they believe we are still building 'our' Empire! A few Brit immigrants i have met in various countries have bucked the trend and fully integrated but the one thing those examples shared in common, they were fluent in their host countries language, unlike their counterparts.

 

Our press, for the most part, have carelessly enjoyed "Euro-bashing" since before we joined, because it has given them sales. In doing so, they have poisoned the well. It is futile, IMO, to blame those who drank from that well for taking in what they read. Correcting the lies and misreporting was a job for HMG, and they didn't do it (in fact under Blair/Brown they joined in, letting it be known that the Eastern European influx was a consequence of EU "free movement" regulations).

For the Wail and Brexpress, their deed is done and the media barons are sitting laughing in their offshore tax havens whilst the proles pay. The referendum has been extremely divisive and i doubt will ever heal. The link you posted regards Euroscepticism, half way down shows the 1975 referendum result of 67% to join EC and 32% against. That's more the type of figure i'd have said is a decisive win rather than the divisive 'win' Brexiters were cock-a-hoop over. But thats been short lived as they're gradually finding Johnson and co have got to start delivering but they've been sold a pig in a poke off the back of packs of lies, disinformation and ludicrous 'promises'.

[Birdbrain]

Bulletguy - 2020-02-23 8:02 PM

 

Brian Kirby - 2020-02-23 5:19 PM

 

Bulletguy - 2020-02-22 9:04 PM

 

To me Brian she typified the insular Little Englander with her wails of "completely close all the borders" and people "flooding in" etc (remember Camerons gaff on describing "swarms" of migrants? And they never came!). This kind of xenophobic hyperbole is straight off the front pages of the DM and Brexpress. She's the type who no doubt has spent years sitting inside another countries borders thanks to what she rails against here.

 

Fine, lets start closing ALL borders everywhere and deny Brits access to the privileges they've previously enjoyed....we are already a good way to achieving that from Brexit but watch the howls and wails of protest when they see their own fom become a thing of the past.

 

Migrant labour generates somewhere in the region of £27 billion a year to UK's economy. Who is going to make up that shortfall when Brits have hounded them all out? Are British prepared to have their taxes hiked up. Noooo......more howls and wails of protest!!

 

And lets not forget this which i've linked before;

https://www.bruegel.org/2017/02/questionable-immigration-claims-in-the-brexit-white-paper/

 

As for integrating i remember watching a very good documentary about this and one young Asian lad in particular stood out as what he said was interesting. He described how as a kid at school all played together irrespective of nationality/ethnicity but once the school bell had rung, everyone went their separate ways and by that i mean the indigenous British too. He'd since made attempts to bring the community together, but came up against a brick wall with folks closing ranks. It's not just ethnic minorities that won't integrate....it's also the indigenous Brit.

 

I'm generalising as obviously some people do integrate well and have friends from all nations but we cannot continue scapegoating migrants for the failings of the country....it just won't wash.

 

Brits living in France or Spain behave just the same....few speaking the language and no intention of doing so, form insular little enclaves and call themselves "ex-pats" because they don't like the "immigrant" word....which is what they are. Finding a Brit immigrant in a foreign country that speaks the language is indeed a rarity but finding a foreign migrant to Britain that speaks English is commonplace and in some cases, multi-lingual. My ex-wife spoke five languages fluently.

 

When people like that woman on QT finally wake up to vent their anger and rage against a government thats continually failed to invest on infrastructure instead of scapegoating migrants, then we might just be getting somewhere, but it's easier to use migrants as an excuse so government sets about throwing folk into detention centres after they've done a lifetimes work paying taxes into the country.

 

What sort of country have we become?

Little of what she had to say actually related to the EU, it mostly related to the actions and inactions of HMG, both in its dealings with the EU, and in its press briefings on those dealings.

Brexiteers won't agree with that....as far as they're concerned she was echoing what they most despise, migrants and the EU, and as long as we are in transition they will continue blaming EU for all their woes and everything that goes belly up re. Johnson et al which it already has and true to form, "it's the EU's fault".

 

The resentments about foreigners in the UK are long-standing. (There's a "Wiki" here that gives some context https://tinyurl.com/y4yz5x67 ) Remember the Notting Hill riots and Enoch's infamous "rivers of blood speech"? We live on an island, and don't have day to day contact with foreigners as the mainlanders do, especially now with open borders. We have to pay to see how the others live, while the mainlanders only have to drive a few miles in their jalopy to see "foreign" at first hand.

I remember it well......"No Blacks, No Irish, No Dogs" stuck up on inner city windows. Back then blacks and Irish were the whipping sticks, now it's blacks and brown skins so little has changed. I was never sure what the "no dogs" referred to other than dehumanising.

 

As i mentioned in the previous post, if we won't integrate, how or why should we expect ethnic minorities to? Brits by nature are notoriously insular. Outside UK Brit immigrants are even worse behaving like little colonialists as though they believe we are still building 'our' Empire! A few Brit immigrants i have met in various countries have bucked the trend and fully integrated but the one thing those examples shared in common, they were fluent in their host countries language, unlike their counterparts.

 

Our press, for the most part, have carelessly enjoyed "Euro-bashing" since before we joined, because it has given them sales. In doing so, they have poisoned the well. It is futile, IMO, to blame those who drank from that well for taking in what they read. Correcting the lies and misreporting was a job for HMG, and they didn't do it (in fact under Blair/Brown they joined in, letting it be known that the Eastern European influx was a consequence of EU "free movement" regulations).

For the Wail and Brexpress, their deed is done and the media barons are sitting laughing in their offshore tax havens whilst the proles pay. The referendum has been extremely divisive and i doubt will ever heal. The link you posted regards Euroscepticism, half way down shows the 1975 referendum result of 67% to join EC and 32% against. That's more the type of figure i'd have said is a decisive win rather than the divisive 'win' Brexiters were cock-a-hoop over. But thats been short lived as they're gradually finding Johnson and co have got to start delivering but they've been sold a pig in a poke off the back of packs of lies, disinformation and ludicrous 'promises'.

 

Like I said previously ... Hatred and living 24/7 with no contact with anyone takes its toll ... A very bitter individual with little or no grasp of what Brexiteers want or wish for the future ... Desperate stuff