Slavery.....the real history.....

[Guest pelmetman]

Just thought it's about time we started educating those who went to university and learn't F*ck all *-) .......

 

Slavery has been about since someone had a bigger club or gang than you :-| ......

 

But how far back do I start? :-S .....

 

Perhaps with the Romans gangbanging Queen Boudicca daughters and enslaving us first Brits :-| .......

 

I could of course go back to the Vikings & Saxons ;-) .....

 

But hey.......I don't live in the past :D ........

 

 

[Brian Kirby]

Here you go, Dave. Further back than you think: https://tinyurl.com/ns6re4x So, your point is?

[StuartO]

That the transportation of black slaves from Africa to America and the Carribean was neither the biggest nor the most recent example of slavery in history and that all races have been both victims and perpetrators of slavery?

 

Or that an essential part of the slave trade to America and the Carribean was the capture and sale of blacks by other blacks in Africa to those slave traders who bought and shipped them?

 

Or that the employment of slaves in America and the Carribean involved a hierarchy of "slave bosses" which included blacks?

[Barryd999]

Brian Kirby - 2020-06-11 5:12 PM

 

Here you go, Dave. Further back than you think: https://tinyurl.com/ns6re4x So, your point is?

 

Accept your lot and stop making a fuss and upsetting us little Englanders I think Brian.

[Brian Kirby]

I don't know, which is why I asked Dave.

[Birdbrain]

Good post ... The hate mob , well Barry spews his usual hate

[Guest pelmetman]

Brian Kirby - 2020-06-11 5:12 PM

 

Here you go, Dave. Further back than you think: https://tinyurl.com/ns6re4x So, your point is?

 

So are you jumping on the latest soon to be Boris bashing wagon? ;-) .......

 

 

[Guest pelmetman]

Brian Kirby - 2020-06-11 5:12 PM

 

Here you go, Dave. Further back than you think: https://tinyurl.com/ns6re4x So, your point is?

 

Here you go, Brian ;-) .......And the feckers are still at it 8-) ........

 

"Slavery has historically been widespread in Africa, and still continues today in some African countries."

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slavery_in_Africa

 

Yet they have the gall to pull down our statues *-) ........

 

HYPOCRITES >:-) .......

[Brian Kirby]

Yes, but I thought that was common knowledge, which is why I asked what your point was. It seems your point was simply to justify calling them hypocrites. So that's all solved then? :-S

[Guest pelmetman]

Brian Kirby - 2020-06-11 9:01 PM

 

Yes, but I thought that was common knowledge, which is why I asked what your point was. It seems your point was simply to justify calling them hypocrites. So that's all solved then? :-S

 

Not amongst BAME folk apprently *-) .......

 

 

[StuartO]

Brian Kirby - 2020-06-11 6:19 PM

 

I don't know, which is why I asked Dave.

 

But you then ignored my response, that his points might include:

 

That the transportation of black slaves from Africa to America and the Carribean was neither the biggest nor the most recent example of slavery in history and that all races have been both victims and perpetrators of slavery?

 

Or that an essential part of the slave trade to America and the Carribean was the capture and sale of blacks by other blacks in Africa to those slave traders who bought and shipped them?

 

Or that the employment of slaves in America and the Carribean involved a hierarchy of "slave bosses" which included blacks?

[jumpstart]

You can’t alter history by tearing down statues. It happened,good and bad. Who gets to decide who is racist, Gandhi apparently made racist comments, Mandela was declared a terrorist. One persons terrorist is another persons freedom fighter.

[Brian Kirby]

pelmetman - 2020-06-11 9:05 PM

Brian Kirby - 2020-06-11 9:01 PM

Yes, but I thought that was common knowledge, which is why I asked what your point was. It seems your point was simply to justify calling them hypocrites. So that's all solved then? :-S

Not amongst BAME folk apprently *-) .......

Apparently so. But they are mostly young, and educated where? The UK doesn't exactly highlight our role in the slave trade in ordinary schools, and I'd guess that those educated in countries that were also involved don't find that top of their reading lists either. So their problem is liable to be that they are uninformed as to the extent to which their own forbears may also have had their fingers in the poo. To blame people for not knowing something that no-one has bothered to tell them about is unreasonable. The truth needs to be spoken, but that is going to be very difficult to do under present circumstances, because it will merely be seen as an attempt to whitewash our own past by deflecting the blame onto them. Doesn't mean it shouldn't be done, but it will be necessary to walk on eggshells if it doesn't have the effect of throwing petrol on a fire.

 

So, after all that, what was your point? Just to point out the obvious truth about what others don't know?

[Brian Kirby]

StuartO - 2020-06-12 8:38 AM

Brian Kirby - 2020-06-11 6:19 PM

I don't know, which is why I asked Dave.

But you then ignored my response, that his points might include:

That the transportation of black slaves from Africa to America and the Carribean was neither the biggest nor the most recent example of slavery in history and that all races have been both victims and perpetrators of slavery?

Or that an essential part of the slave trade to America and the Carribean was the capture and sale of blacks by other blacks in Africa to those slave traders who bought and shipped them?

Or that the employment of slaves in America and the Carribean involved a hierarchy of "slave bosses" which included blacks?

With respect, Stuart, I was interested in what Dave thought, so your response was of no interest to me, as you are not Dave. BTW, I didn't ignore your reply, I replied saying I didn't know why Dave had raised the issue, which was why I had asked him.

[StuartO]

Brian Kirby - 2020-06-12 11:42 AM

 

StuartO - 2020-06-12 8:38 AM

Brian Kirby - 2020-06-11 6:19 PM

I don't know, which is why I asked Dave.

But you then ignored my response, that his points might include:

That the transportation of black slaves from Africa to America and the Carribean was neither the biggest nor the most recent example of slavery in history and that all races have been both victims and perpetrators of slavery?

Or that an essential part of the slave trade to America and the Carribean was the capture and sale of blacks by other blacks in Africa to those slave traders who bought and shipped them?

Or that the employment of slaves in America and the Carribean involved a hierarchy of "slave bosses" which included blacks?

With respect, Stuart, I was interested in what Dave thought, so your response was of no interest to me, as you are not Dave. BTW, I didn't ignore your reply, I replied saying I didn't know why Dave had raised the issue, which was why I had asked him.

 

And there was me thinking this was a forum for open discussion.

[Brian Kirby]

StuartO - 2020-06-12 1:02 PM

 

Brian Kirby - 2020-06-12 11:42 AM

 

StuartO - 2020-06-12 8:38 AM

Brian Kirby - 2020-06-11 6:19 PM

I don't know, which is why I asked Dave.

But you then ignored my response, that his points might include:

That the transportation of black slaves from Africa to America and the Carribean was neither the biggest nor the most recent example of slavery in history and that all races have been both victims and perpetrators of slavery?

Or that an essential part of the slave trade to America and the Carribean was the capture and sale of blacks by other blacks in Africa to those slave traders who bought and shipped them?

Or that the employment of slaves in America and the Carribean involved a hierarchy of "slave bosses" which included blacks?

With respect, Stuart, I was interested in what Dave thought, so your response was of no interest to me, as you are not Dave. BTW, I didn't ignore your reply, I replied saying I didn't know why Dave had raised the issue, which was why I had asked him.

And there was me thinking this was a forum for open discussion.

It is, but that concept doesn't oblige me to respond to your every post: it leaves me free to choose those to which I wish to reply. Nothing I have posted denies anyone else from responding to your comments. The spirit, and the fact, of open discussion is thereby maintained, is it not? But perhaps I have misunderstood?

[mtravel]

Big gangs.

 

For someone to blame slavery on Africans is a good way to clear his conscience.

 

Since the world exists there is a market if there is a buyer.

And in America who were the buyers, if not the compassionate WASP all crinolines and laces ?

 

The slave ships arrived in the southern colonies, remember the Lords Proprietors, but a large part of the business was controlled by New England merchants.

To whom it was convenient to pretend that trafficking did not exist.

And we don't talk about Americans because the slave routes date back to the seventeenth century when independence was a long way off.

[StuartO]

Brian Kirby - 2020-06-12 1:36 PM It is, but that concept doesn't oblige me to respond to your every post: it leaves me free to choose those to which I wish to reply. Nothing I have posted denies anyone else from responding to your comments. The spirit, and the fact, of open discussion is thereby maintained, is it not? But perhaps I have misunderstood?

 

You have a choice, of course. But there may be implications or consequences either way, may there not?

[Brian Kirby]

StuartO - 2020-06-12 4:14 PM

Brian Kirby - 2020-06-12 1:36 PM It is, but that concept doesn't oblige me to respond to your every post: it leaves me free to choose those to which I wish to reply. Nothing I have posted denies anyone else from responding to your comments. The spirit, and the fact, of open discussion is thereby maintained, is it not? But perhaps I have misunderstood?

You have a choice, of course. But there may be implications or consequences either way, may there not?

Of course. Everything one does, or does not do, carries implications or consequences. But beyond the obvious? Do you have something in mind? I'm not sure I'm following you.

[jumpstart]

mtravel - 2020-06-12 2:26 PM

 

Big gangs.

 

For someone to blame slavery on Africans is a good way to clear his conscience.

 

Since the world exists there is a market if there is a buyer.

And in America who were the buyers, if not the compassionate WASP all crinolines and laces ?

 

The slave ships arrived in the southern colonies, remember the Lords Proprietors, but a large part of the business was controlled by New England merchants.

To whom it was convenient to pretend that trafficking did not exist.

And we don't talk about Americans because the slave routes date back to the seventeenth century when independence was a long way off.

 

For Africans to ignore their part eases their conscience.

[Birdbrain]

Brian Kirby - 2020-06-12 11:36 AM

 

pelmetman - 2020-06-11 9:05 PM

Brian Kirby - 2020-06-11 9:01 PM

Yes, but I thought that was common knowledge, which is why I asked what your point was. It seems your point was simply to justify calling them hypocrites. So that's all solved then? :-S

Not amongst BAME folk apprently *-) .......

Apparently so. But they are mostly young, and educated where? The UK doesn't exactly highlight our role in the slave trade in ordinary schools, and I'd guess that those educated in countries that were also involved don't find that top of their reading lists either. So their problem is liable to be that they are uninformed as to the extent to which their own forbears may also have had their fingers in the poo. To blame people for not knowing something that no-one has bothered to tell them about is unreasonable. The truth needs to be spoken, but that is going to be very difficult to do under present circumstances, because it will merely be seen as an attempt to whitewash our own past by deflecting the blame onto them. Doesn't mean it shouldn't be done, but it will be necessary to walk on eggshells if it doesn't have the effect of throwing petrol on a fire.

 

So, after all that, what was your point? Just to point out the obvious truth about what others don't know?

 

Errr ... Hands up if you dont know about Britains part in the slave trade ... Even those like me who never really went to school know all about our part ... So what ... We've gone from US police brutality to UK slavery to Fawlty Towers all in about 14 days ... Blame , blame , blame , blame etc etc ... When do the whingers and those that support the whingers take some responsibility for their lot ??? ... Thats right they never will ... Poor darlings

[jumpstart]

We were certainly taught about slavery and that was in the 60’s.

[Birdbrain]

jumpstart - 2020-06-12 6:11 PM

 

We were certainly taught about slavery and that was in the 60’s.

 

Were you taught to apologise for it daily though ... Taught to beg forgiveness from every black person you met ... I think thats what they want and not just the blacks

[jumpstart]

I went to a boarding school at age 13 where the prefects had fags,which were basically their slaves. In our first year we would have to do anything they required,clean their shoes, clean their studies, make meals ,all sorts of things. You would be punished for not doing it on time or correctly, they were 16 and could have you caned. It was certainly no fun.

[Barryd999]

Birdbrain - 2020-06-12 6:17 PM

 

jumpstart - 2020-06-12 6:11 PM

 

We were certainly taught about slavery and that was in the 60’s.

 

Were you taught to apologise for it daily though ... Taught to beg forgiveness from every black person you met ... I think thats what they want and not just the blacks

 

I Dont think it is. I dunno why everyone and the media has latched onto this statue thing. Well I do as it causes division and headlines but the protests initially were about the here and now and the future. The inequality, safety, police and justice system, not being angry about statues from two hundred years ago.

 

It makes no difference now though, its all going to end badly it seems.