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Sunderland
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userViolet1956
Posted: 16 January 2019 9:55 AM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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Yes indeed Dave, in our country. The big question remains, will the North East continue to receive this kind of support post Brexit and that will largely depend on there being enough money in the public coffers to fund it. A more prosperous UK is not what I see on the horizon.
userpelmetman
Posted: 16 January 2019 10:15 AM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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Violet1956 - 2019-01-16 9:55 AM

Yes indeed Dave, in our country. The big question remains, will the North East continue to receive this kind of support post Brexit and that will largely depend on there being enough money in the public coffers to fund it. A more prosperous UK is not what I see on the horizon.


Seeing as the NE received just a fraction of the money we gave to the EU, I suspect we'll be quids in when we leave .............

Although the bill for treating Remoaners PTSD could be expensive .........

usermalc d
Posted: 16 January 2019 10:18 AM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 
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Violet1956 - 2019-01-16 9:55 AM

Yes indeed Dave, in our country. The big question remains, will the North East continue to receive this kind of support post Brexit and that will largely depend on there being enough money in the public coffers to fund it. A more prosperous UK is not what I see on the horizon.





While we have been in the EU we have paid a lot of money into the EU - and some of it has been spent in the North of England.

After we leave the EU we won't be sending any more money to the EU - so it will all be available for investment in the South of England.

userpelmetman
Posted: 16 January 2019 10:20 AM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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malc d - 2019-01-16 10:18 AM

Violet1956 - 2019-01-16 9:55 AM

Yes indeed Dave, in our country. The big question remains, will the North East continue to receive this kind of support post Brexit and that will largely depend on there being enough money in the public coffers to fund it. A more prosperous UK is not what I see on the horizon.





While we have been in the EU we have paid a lot of money into the EU - and some of it has been spent in the North of England.

After we leave the EU we won't be sending any more money to the EU - so it will all be available for investment in the South of England.



So long as its not spent in London ...........

Its high time the UK taxpayers money was spent on the UK ..........

user747
Posted: 16 January 2019 11:23 AM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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Violet1956 - 2019-01-16 9:21 AM

747 - 2019-01-16 8:49 AM

Brian Kirby - 2019-01-15 7:50 PM

antony1969 - 2019-01-15 9:37 AM

Seems Brexit Barry is confused ... Despite telling us constantly how folk didn't know what they were voting for it now seems the good people of Sunderland who voted by 60% to leave now they are better informed would according to the latest Sunderland Echo poll vote by 70% to leave with no deal ... Oooops

So why did they vote Brexit, Antony? You seem to understand, but I still don't get it. Can you explain, for a bear of very little brain, please? No-one ever seems to want to say. If I knew, I might even begin to understand.


Well, understand this Brian:

Barrry keeps harping on about shooting ourselves in the foot because we will lose the Nissan factory in Sunderland. If Nissan does go (and it will), the biggest employer in the area will be Sunderland Council. This is the same Council who paid most of the costs to build the Nissan factory in the first place, which means WE (the local people) paid for it.

If you take into account a number of factors ..... traditional high unemployment, an influx of EU citizens, migrants from other parts of the World, shortage of housing (exacerbated by migrants) and no sign of any change in these circumstances ...... then no wonder there has been a revolt against the EU.

Perhaps if they were given the same prospects as those in East Sussex, it may have been a different result in the referendum. Our staple industries disappeared over a number of years. Mining, Shipbuilding and Steel, hundreds of thousands of jobs went, turning some areas into wastelands of high unemployment without hope.

You can preach about Brexit if you like but it is only from one perspective. Unless you understand what it is like to be in the position of the Sunderland (and other North East areas) people, then you just sound like a privileged Southerner with no clue. You sound like Barry in that you have never been in their position.



Something doesn’t add up 747. Why the influx of EU citizens, are they all on the dole? Here’s an article I found on what the EU has done for the North East. I am not denying that the decline of heavy industry hit the NE hard but will exiting the EU make anything better. Seems not if you read the article. And before you observe that I am one of the privileged Southerners I come from Scunthorpe originally and my dad was a steelworker and lost his job back in the 70s.

https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/what-european-union-ever-done-11480870


The Eu Citizens are actually quite hardworking. This can be seen by the explosion of kebab shops run by Eastern Europeans and staffed by asylum speakers. The profits financing rundown properties rented out to Eastern Europeans working in the numerous Car Washes.

Yeah, I am going a bit over the top but there is some truth in that.

We have what is probably an average amount of incomers from the EU and rest of the World. On the few occasions that I have had to attend A&E in the past few years, the waiting area largely comprised these people. I am just giving an observation here, not a Political statement (although I have been called racist umpteen times on forums for stating that I voted leave). If I was Romanian, Lithuanian or even Albanian (and yes, some have false papers) I would jump at the chance of a move to the UK for myself and my family if it meant an improvement in my living standards and to get away from genuine racism (as in the case of the Roma people).
usermalc d
Posted: 16 January 2019 11:55 AM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 
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pelmetman - 2019-01-16 10:20 AM


So long as its not spent in London ...........

Its high time the UK taxpayers money was spent on the UK ..........




You can bet your life that London will get priority ( such as HS2 so Londoners can get to Birmingham a bit quicker ).

Don't hold your breath for equal distribution of funds around the country.

userViolet1956
Posted: 16 January 2019 12:00 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


2000500100


So it seems like a lot of them set up small marginal businesses 747. A bit like my dad who bought a flat bed lorry when he was made redundant and became a "totter" of sorts, necessity being the mother of invention.
What you say about A&E departments chimes with my own experience as our nearest hospital is situation in an area which has a large influx of migrants from the EU and outside the EU and Ive visited recently with very poorly relatives. I don't see you as having been racist at all. We have to face facts- there have been disadvantages associated with free movement which cannot all be put down to a failure of government. It seems likely from both yours and my experience that some migrants don't understand the role of A&E departments, though it's true some Brits don't either.
userantony1969
Posted: 16 January 2019 12:03 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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Spending the money in London will be just the same as giving it the EU to spend ... One way or another it will still get spent on foreigners
userViolet1956
Posted: 16 January 2019 1:58 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


2000500100


antony1969 - 2019-01-16 12:03 PM

Spending the money in London will be just the same as giving it the EU to spend ... One way or another it will still get spent on foreigners


Ever the xenophobe.
userBarryd999
Posted: 16 January 2019 2:09 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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747 - 2019-01-16 8:49 AM

Brian Kirby - 2019-01-15 7:50 PM

antony1969 - 2019-01-15 9:37 AM

Seems Brexit Barry is confused ... Despite telling us constantly how folk didn't know what they were voting for it now seems the good people of Sunderland who voted by 60% to leave now they are better informed would according to the latest Sunderland Echo poll vote by 70% to leave with no deal ... Oooops

So why did they vote Brexit, Antony? You seem to understand, but I still don't get it. Can you explain, for a bear of very little brain, please? No-one ever seems to want to say. If I knew, I might even begin to understand.


Well, understand this Brian:

Barrry keeps harping on about shooting ourselves in the foot because we will lose the Nissan factory in Sunderland. If Nissan does go (and it will), the biggest employer in the area will be Sunderland Council. This is the same Council who paid most of the costs to build the Nissan factory in the first place, which means WE (the local people) paid for it.

If you take into account a number of factors ..... traditional high unemployment, an influx of EU citizens, migrants from other parts of the World, shortage of housing (exacerbated by migrants) and no sign of any change in these circumstances ...... then no wonder there has been a revolt against the EU.

Perhaps if they were given the same prospects as those in East Sussex, it may have been a different result in the referendum. Our staple industries disappeared over a number of years. Mining, Shipbuilding and Steel, hundreds of thousands of jobs went, turning some areas into wastelands of high unemployment without hope.

You can preach about Brexit if you like but it is only from one perspective. Unless you understand what it is like to be in the position of the Sunderland (and other North East areas) people, then you just sound like a privileged Southerner with no clue. You sound like Barry in that you have never been in their position.


Its not just Nissan though is it? The North East is the only net exporter in the UK and as result stands to be the worst hit with a predicted 16% drop in GDP in a no deal Brexit according to the governments own figures.

For nearly a decade I worked across the entire region with hundreds of businesses from sole traders with no employees up to businesses with up to a £50m turnover as part of a team of ten with a multi million pound budget much of which was often EU money. So I have seen first hand how that region ticks at least from an SME point of view and I lived in Darlington most of my life so Ive seen what recession and massive unemployment can do although it never effected me personally.

With all that knowledge its as clear as day to me what Brexit will do to that region that has always seemed to be crawling out of a hole only for something or someone to stomp on its fingers as it reaches the top so it has to start again. Newcastle city centre is fantastic now as are many areas that were once total s**t holes. Remember what much of it was like in the early 80s where ironically many went off to look for work abroad. It did give the world the best comedy series of all time though, Auf Wiedersehen Pet!

For the record, Ive never thought upon you as being "thick as mince" Stew or an onion soup perhaps.

Edited by Barryd999 2019-01-16 2:11 PM
userpelmetman
Posted: 16 January 2019 2:09 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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Violet1956 - 2019-01-16 1:58 PM

antony1969 - 2019-01-16 12:03 PM

Spending the money in London will be just the same as giving it the EU to spend ... One way or another it will still get spent on foreigners


Ever the xenophobe.


He's prolly right though isn't he Veronica?...........seeing as back in 2011 Brits barely made up more than 50% of London's population ...........

I guess that makes me a xenophobe to? ............

A xenophobe that chooses to spend 5 months of the year surrounded by funny foreigners .........

userpelmetman
Posted: 16 January 2019 2:12 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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Barryd999 - 2019-01-16 2:09 PM


For nearly a decade I worked across the entire region with hundreds of businesses from sole traders with no employees up to businesses with up to a £50m turnover as part of a team of ten with a multi million pound budget much of which was often EU money. .


Correction OUR MONEY ............

user747
Posted: 16 January 2019 2:44 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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There is no need to call me stewpid Barry.
userBrian Kirby
Posted: 16 January 2019 2:58 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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747 - 2019-01-16 8:49 AM..................Well, understand this Brian:

Barrry keeps harping on about shooting ourselves in the foot because we will lose the Nissan factory in Sunderland. If Nissan does go (and it will), the biggest employer in the area will be Sunderland Council. This is the same Council who paid most of the costs to build the Nissan factory in the first place, which means WE (the local people) paid for it.

If you take into account a number of factors ..... traditional high unemployment, an influx of EU citizens, migrants from other parts of the World, shortage of housing (exacerbated by migrants) and no sign of any change in these circumstances ...... then no wonder there has been a revolt against the EU.

Perhaps if they were given the same prospects as those in East Sussex, it may have been a different result in the referendum. Our staple industries disappeared over a number of years. Mining, Shipbuilding and Steel, hundreds of thousands of jobs went, turning some areas into wastelands of high unemployment without hope.

You can preach about Brexit if you like but it is only from one perspective. Unless you understand what it is like to be in the position of the Sunderland (and other North East areas) people, then you just sound like a privileged Southerner with no clue. You sound like Barry in that you have never been in their position.

OK, so now explain to me how those events relate to membership of the EU, and how leaving the EU will make the north east more prosperous. But please try to do so without making so many simplistic assumptions about other people based merely on where they live.
userantony1969
Posted: 16 January 2019 3:17 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


The special one

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Violet1956 - 2019-01-16 1:58 PM

antony1969 - 2019-01-16 12:03 PM

Spending the money in London will be just the same as giving it the EU to spend ... One way or another it will still get spent on foreigners


Ever the xenophobe.[/QUOTE

London's not full of foreigners ??? ... It's a lie is it ??? ... I'm not ashamed to say I would prefer to spend our UK money on UK pensioners , hospitals , military , police , prisons etc ... If that makes me a xenophobe in your book Veronica I'll wear that as a badge of honour ... Thank you
userBrian Kirby
Posted: 16 January 2019 3:53 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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pelmetman - 2019-01-16 2:09 PM
Violet1956 - 2019-01-16 1:58 PM
antony1969 - 2019-01-16 12:03 PM
Spending the money in London will be just the same as giving it the EU to spend ... One way or another it will still get spent on foreigners

Ever the xenophobe.

He's prolly right though isn't he Veronica?...........seeing as back in 2011 Brits barely made up more than 50% of London's population ...........
I guess that makes me a xenophobe to? ............
A xenophobe that chooses to spend 5 months of the year surrounded by funny foreigners ......…

Dave, it might well make you a xenophobe, unless you start to read and check some of the random Daily Mail "statistics" you pick out and quote!

2014 figure for Greater London population? 8.6 million. Not born in UK? 3 million. So, about 35% (and not nearly 50%) born outside the UK. Of those 35%: 40% were from the EU, and 60% non-EU. 40% of 3 million = 1.2 million - for which the EU might be held responsible (but you'd have to determine who actually let them in, and why. See below). That leaves 1.8 million from the rest of the world, for whose presence the EU cannot be blamed. So, who let them in?

Now, back to those 1.2 million from the EU. Many will have come from the post 2004 enlargement (which the UK championed), on which all EU states except the UK imposed legally permissible migration restrictions.

So, UK government refusal to apply permissible controls, and not the EU, is the culprit there - which is also true for all of the non-EU migrants. Why do they come? Because they see job opportunities, and/or are recruited. Who by? UK employers. How do they get through the border? Because UK employers persuade government that they need the extra labour. So who is really responsible? Your business owning neighbour.

So, don't leave the EU, go out and persecute your local businesses for employing migrants, or better still, go out and get a job with one of the businesses yourself and stop a migrant - as you're so bothered by them!
userBarryd999
Posted: 16 January 2019 5:45 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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pelmetman - 2019-01-16 2:12 PM

Barryd999 - 2019-01-16 2:09 PM


For nearly a decade I worked across the entire region with hundreds of businesses from sole traders with no employees up to businesses with up to a £50m turnover as part of a team of ten with a multi million pound budget much of which was often EU money. .


Correction OUR MONEY ............



Well it is and it isn't., its way more complex than that. If you believed any of the stuff put out by the remain campaign in 2016 we get ten times back in terms of trade, jobs, investment etc by being members than what we pay in.
Of course you wont believe any of that, you just look at the bottom line of what goes out.


I can tell you though from first hand experience of working on funding and funded ICT / business projects in outreach and rural areas or places like the North East the EU are far more likely to fund stuff than our government who pretty much slashed most of the public sector funding in 2008-10 in all those places. If the economy tanks and there is even less money to fund important projects or to inject money into areas that are suffering in your post Brexit world what chance of it coming from our Austerity obsessed feckwit Tory party?


Don't get me wrong, the EU funding schemes are as big a PIA to deal with as UK government funding schemes at times and the irony is a lot of the key areas that voted out received more EU Funding than areas that voted to remain without doubt. Trouble is most of them probably had no idea. Im pretty sure most of the businesses I helped fund had no idea where the money was coming from or cared.


Edited by Barryd999 2019-01-16 5:47 PM
userantony1969
Posted: 16 January 2019 6:06 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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Barryd999 - 2019-01-16 5:45 PM

pelmetman - 2019-01-16 2:12 PM

Barryd999 - 2019-01-16 2:09 PM


For nearly a decade I worked across the entire region with hundreds of businesses from sole traders with no employees up to businesses with up to a £50m turnover as part of a team of ten with a multi million pound budget much of which was often EU money. .


Correction OUR MONEY ............



Well it is and it isn't., its way more complex than that. If you believed any of the stuff put out by the remain campaign in 2016 we get ten times back in terms of trade, jobs, investment etc by being members than what we pay in.
Of course you wont believe any of that, you just look at the bottom line of what goes out.


I can tell you though from first hand experience of working on funding and funded ICT / business projects in outreach and rural areas or places like the North East the EU are far more likely to fund stuff than our government who pretty much slashed most of the public sector funding in 2008-10 in all those places. If the economy tanks and there is even less money to fund important projects or to inject money into areas that are suffering in your post Brexit world what chance of it coming from our Austerity obsessed feckwit Tory party?


Don't get me wrong, the EU funding schemes are as big a PIA to deal with as UK government funding schemes at times and the irony is a lot of the key areas that voted out received more EU Funding than areas that voted to remain without doubt. Trouble is most of them probably had no idea. Im pretty sure most of the businesses I helped fund had no idea where the money was coming from or cared.


Ehhh ??? ... "our Government who pretty much slashed most of the public sector funding in 2008-2010" ... Not a mention that was a Labour Government yet further down the rant "our Austerity obsessed feckwit Tory party" ... Go figure

Edited by antony1969 2019-01-16 6:09 PM
userBulletguy
Posted: 16 January 2019 6:07 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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747 - 2019-01-16 8:49 AM

Brian Kirby - 2019-01-15 7:50 PM

antony1969 - 2019-01-15 9:37 AM

Seems Brexit Barry is confused ... Despite telling us constantly how folk didn't know what they were voting for it now seems the good people of Sunderland who voted by 60% to leave now they are better informed would according to the latest Sunderland Echo poll vote by 70% to leave with no deal ... Oooops

So why did they vote Brexit, Antony? You seem to understand, but I still don't get it. Can you explain, for a bear of very little brain, please? No-one ever seems to want to say. If I knew, I might even begin to understand.


Well, understand this Brian:

Barrry keeps harping on about shooting ourselves in the foot because we will lose the Nissan factory in Sunderland. If Nissan does go (and it will), the biggest employer in the area will be Sunderland Council. This is the same Council who paid most of the costs to build the Nissan factory in the first place, which means WE (the local people) paid for it.

That's pretty difficult to believe given the population of Sunderland and the millions it cost to build the factory. Your rates must have gone stratospheric into the thousands per annum?

The 800 acres of land alone to build on was £1.45 million though that was helped by Thatchers government selling greenfield to Nissan at knockdown agricultural land costs (try doing that to build a private house on). I can't source any figures for the actual factory building and fitting out costs but we must be talking many millions. Are you seriously suggesting Sunderland rate payers funded "most of it" and therefore "paid for it"?

According to one of your local newspapers it seems EU membership has done quite a lot for the North East.

https://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/news/north-east-news/what-european-union-ever-done-11480870
user747
Posted: 16 January 2019 7:09 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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Brian Kirby - 2019-01-16 2:58 PM

747 - 2019-01-16 8:49 AM..................Well, understand this Brian:

Barrry keeps harping on about shooting ourselves in the foot because we will lose the Nissan factory in Sunderland. If Nissan does go (and it will), the biggest employer in the area will be Sunderland Council. This is the same Council who paid most of the costs to build the Nissan factory in the first place, which means WE (the local people) paid for it.

If you take into account a number of factors ..... traditional high unemployment, an influx of EU citizens, migrants from other parts of the World, shortage of housing (exacerbated by migrants) and no sign of any change in these circumstances ...... then no wonder there has been a revolt against the EU.

Perhaps if they were given the same prospects as those in East Sussex, it may have been a different result in the referendum. Our staple industries disappeared over a number of years. Mining, Shipbuilding and Steel, hundreds of thousands of jobs went, turning some areas into wastelands of high unemployment without hope.

You can preach about Brexit if you like but it is only from one perspective. Unless you understand what it is like to be in the position of the Sunderland (and other North East areas) people, then you just sound like a privileged Southerner with no clue. You sound like Barry in that you have never been in their position.

OK, so now explain to me how those events relate to membership of the EU, and how leaving the EU will make the north east more prosperous. But please try to do so without making so many simplistic assumptions about other people based merely on where they live.


I will explain in one short paragraph.

The doom and gloom merchants say that a no deal Brexit will impoverish and set this country back for 20 years. I expect that if it is true, East Sussex will be affected also.

Welcome to my World Brian.
userBrian Kirby
Posted: 16 January 2019 7:43 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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747 - 2019-01-16 7:09 PM...…………….I will explain in one short paragraph.

The doom and gloom merchants say that a no deal Brexit will impoverish and set this country back for 20 years. I expect that if it is true, East Sussex will be affected also.

Welcome to my World Brian.

I hope I'm misunderstanding your point, but you seem to be saying you'd like see East Sussex taken down a peg or two, and see Brexit as a way to do that. Is that correct, and if so why? After all, it won't do anything to benefit Northumberland or Durham.
user747
Posted: 16 January 2019 9:47 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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Not true, I don't want to see a return to the days of the Surrey and Sussex hunger Marches.
userpelmetman
Posted: 16 January 2019 10:20 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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Brian Kirby - 2019-01-16 3:53 PM

pelmetman - 2019-01-16 2:09 PM
Violet1956 - 2019-01-16 1:58 PM
antony1969 - 2019-01-16 12:03 PM
Spending the money in London will be just the same as giving it the EU to spend ... One way or another it will still get spent on foreigners

Ever the xenophobe.

He's prolly right though isn't he Veronica?...........seeing as back in 2011 Brits barely made up more than 50% of London's population ...........
I guess that makes me a xenophobe to? ............
A xenophobe that chooses to spend 5 months of the year surrounded by funny foreigners ......…

Dave, it might well make you a xenophobe, unless you start to read and check some of the random Daily Mail "statistics" you pick out and quote!

2014 figure for Greater London population? 8.6 million. Not born in UK? 3 million. So, about 35% (and not nearly 50%) born outside the UK. Of those 35%: 40% were from the EU, and 60% non-EU. 40% of 3 million = 1.2 million - for which the EU might be held responsible (but you'd have to determine who actually let them in, and why. See below). That leaves 1.8 million from the rest of the world, for whose presence the EU cannot be blamed. So, who let them in?

Now, back to those 1.2 million from the EU. Many will have come from the post 2004 enlargement (which the UK championed), on which all EU states except the UK imposed legally permissible migration restrictions.


3 points .........

1.........Your 2014 figure is a guesstimate based on 2011 census figures........

2.........Greater London is not London ..........

3.........Those restrictions on the accession countries were removed in 2011...........

userpelmetman
Posted: 16 January 2019 10:26 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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Barryd999 - 2019-01-16 5:45 PM

pelmetman - 2019-01-16 2:12 PM

Barryd999 - 2019-01-16 2:09 PM


For nearly a decade I worked across the entire region with hundreds of businesses from sole traders with no employees up to businesses with up to a £50m turnover as part of a team of ten with a multi million pound budget much of which was often EU money. .


Correction OUR MONEY ............



Well it is and it isn't., its way more complex than that. If you believed any of the stuff put out by the remain campaign in 2016 we get ten times back in terms of trade, jobs, investment etc by being members than what we pay in.
Of course you wont believe any of that, you just look at the bottom line of what goes out.


I can tell you though from first hand experience of working on funding and funded ICT / business projects in outreach and rural areas or places like the North East the EU are far more likely to fund stuff than our government who pretty much slashed most of the public sector funding in 2008-10 in all those places. If the economy tanks and there is even less money to fund important projects or to inject money into areas that are suffering in your post Brexit world what chance of it coming from our Austerity obsessed feckwit Tory party?


Don't get me wrong, the EU funding schemes are as big a PIA to deal with as UK government funding schemes at times and the irony is a lot of the key areas that voted out received more EU Funding than areas that voted to remain without doubt. Trouble is most of them probably had no idea. Im pretty sure most of the businesses I helped fund had no idea where the money was coming from or cared.


Just goes to show the EU are no better at spending our money than our government ..........

At least we can sack our government ...........

userBarryd999
Posted: 17 January 2019 1:08 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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pelmetman - 2019-01-16 10:26 PM

Barryd999 - 2019-01-16 5:45 PM

pelmetman - 2019-01-16 2:12 PM

Barryd999 - 2019-01-16 2:09 PM


For nearly a decade I worked across the entire region with hundreds of businesses from sole traders with no employees up to businesses with up to a £50m turnover as part of a team of ten with a multi million pound budget much of which was often EU money. .


Correction OUR MONEY ............



Well it is and it isn't., its way more complex than that. If you believed any of the stuff put out by the remain campaign in 2016 we get ten times back in terms of trade, jobs, investment etc by being members than what we pay in.
Of course you wont believe any of that, you just look at the bottom line of what goes out.


I can tell you though from first hand experience of working on funding and funded ICT / business projects in outreach and rural areas or places like the North East the EU are far more likely to fund stuff than our government who pretty much slashed most of the public sector funding in 2008-10 in all those places. If the economy tanks and there is even less money to fund important projects or to inject money into areas that are suffering in your post Brexit world what chance of it coming from our Austerity obsessed feckwit Tory party?


Don't get me wrong, the EU funding schemes are as big a PIA to deal with as UK government funding schemes at times and the irony is a lot of the key areas that voted out received more EU Funding than areas that voted to remain without doubt. Trouble is most of them probably had no idea. Im pretty sure most of the businesses I helped fund had no idea where the money was coming from or cared.


Just goes to show the EU are no better at spending our money than our government ..........

At least we can sack our government ...........



Eh? How does it show that?
userBarryd999
Posted: 17 January 2019 1:14 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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antony1969 - 2019-01-16 6:06 PM

Barryd999 - 2019-01-16 5:45 PM

pelmetman - 2019-01-16 2:12 PM

Barryd999 - 2019-01-16 2:09 PM


For nearly a decade I worked across the entire region with hundreds of businesses from sole traders with no employees up to businesses with up to a £50m turnover as part of a team of ten with a multi million pound budget much of which was often EU money. .


Correction OUR MONEY ............



Well it is and it isn't., its way more complex than that. If you believed any of the stuff put out by the remain campaign in 2016 we get ten times back in terms of trade, jobs, investment etc by being members than what we pay in.
Of course you wont believe any of that, you just look at the bottom line of what goes out.


I can tell you though from first hand experience of working on funding and funded ICT / business projects in outreach and rural areas or places like the North East the EU are far more likely to fund stuff than our government who pretty much slashed most of the public sector funding in 2008-10 in all those places. If the economy tanks and there is even less money to fund important projects or to inject money into areas that are suffering in your post Brexit world what chance of it coming from our Austerity obsessed feckwit Tory party?


Don't get me wrong, the EU funding schemes are as big a PIA to deal with as UK government funding schemes at times and the irony is a lot of the key areas that voted out received more EU Funding than areas that voted to remain without doubt. Trouble is most of them probably had no idea. Im pretty sure most of the businesses I helped fund had no idea where the money was coming from or cared.


Ehhh ??? ... "our Government who pretty much slashed most of the public sector funding in 2008-2010" ... Not a mention that was a Labour Government yet further down the rant "our Austerity obsessed feckwit Tory party" ... Go figure


Labour had little choice given the s**t storm that was bestowed upon us but funding under the Tories has been worse ever since and they have a track record of ignoring places like the North East and no doubt west Yorkshire. I suspect most of them wont even have heard of Huddersfield. Seems the EU have though. £20m you little feckers have had!!

https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/west-yorkshire-news/eu-referendum-huddersfield-brexit-remain-11460879
userantony1969
Posted: 17 January 2019 2:15 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


The special one

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Barryd999 - 2019-01-17 1:14 PM

antony1969 - 2019-01-16 6:06 PM

Barryd999 - 2019-01-16 5:45 PM

pelmetman - 2019-01-16 2:12 PM

Barryd999 - 2019-01-16 2:09 PM


For nearly a decade I worked across the entire region with hundreds of businesses from sole traders with no employees up to businesses with up to a £50m turnover as part of a team of ten with a multi million pound budget much of which was often EU money. .


Correction OUR MONEY ............



Well it is and it isn't., its way more complex than that. If you believed any of the stuff put out by the remain campaign in 2016 we get ten times back in terms of trade, jobs, investment etc by being members than what we pay in.
Of course you wont believe any of that, you just look at the bottom line of what goes out.


I can tell you though from first hand experience of working on funding and funded ICT / business projects in outreach and rural areas or places like the North East the EU are far more likely to fund stuff than our government who pretty much slashed most of the public sector funding in 2008-10 in all those places. If the economy tanks and there is even less money to fund important projects or to inject money into areas that are suffering in your post Brexit world what chance of it coming from our Austerity obsessed feckwit Tory party?


Don't get me wrong, the EU funding schemes are as big a PIA to deal with as UK government funding schemes at times and the irony is a lot of the key areas that voted out received more EU Funding than areas that voted to remain without doubt. Trouble is most of them probably had no idea. Im pretty sure most of the businesses I helped fund had no idea where the money was coming from or cared.


Ehhh ??? ... "our Government who pretty much slashed most of the public sector funding in 2008-2010" ... Not a mention that was a Labour Government yet further down the rant "our Austerity obsessed feckwit Tory party" ... Go figure


Labour had little choice given the s**t storm that was bestowed upon us but funding under the Tories has been worse ever since and they have a track record of ignoring places like the North East and no doubt west Yorkshire. I suspect most of them wont even have heard of Huddersfield. Seems the EU have though. £20m you little feckers have had!!

https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/west-yorkshire-news/eu-referendum-huddersfield-brexit-remain-11460879


£20 million over 10 years ... How many folk in Huddersfield Barry , do the maths on how much each Huddersfield type person has benefitted each year out of that £20 million and then take away how much Huddersfield as part of the UK has given that crookedy club over the 10 years ... Ye , not a good return is it
userBrian Kirby
Posted: 17 January 2019 2:37 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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Location: East Sussex. Motorhome: Knaus Boxstar 600 Street


747 - 2019-01-16 9:47 PM
Not true, I don't want to see a return to the days of the Surrey and Sussex hunger Marches.

Sorry, too arcane for me! I get the bitter, but not the flavour. Is this just the politics of (misplaced) envy, or what?
userBrian Kirby
Posted: 17 January 2019 3:04 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


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Location: East Sussex. Motorhome: Knaus Boxstar 600 Street


pelmetman - 2019-01-16 10:20 PM
Brian Kirby - 2019-01-16 3:53 PM
Dave, it might well make you a xenophobe, unless you start to read and check some of the random Daily Mail "statistics" you pick out and quote!

2014 figure for Greater London population? 8.6 million. Not born in UK? 3 million. So, about 35% (and not nearly 50%) born outside the UK. Of those 35%: 40% were from the EU, and 60% non-EU. 40% of 3 million = 1.2 million - for which the EU might be held responsible (but you'd have to determine who actually let them in, and why. See below). That leaves 1.8 million from the rest of the world, for whose presence the EU cannot be blamed. So, who let them in?

Now, back to those 1.2 million from the EU. Many will have come from the post 2004 enlargement (which the UK championed), on which all EU states except the UK imposed legally permissible migration restrictions.

3 points .........
1.........Your 2014 figure is a guesstimate based on 2011 census figures........
2.........Greater London is not London ..........
3.........Those restrictions on the accession countries were removed in 2011...........

3 points in return.

1 Fine, so if you have a better figure, substitute that.
2 So, what is London? The traditional definition was just the City. Hardly relevant now. But, as above, do you have a better figure? Re-cast the figures for your own definition of London, and then reduce to the number of migrants from within the EU.

Then, answer the two questions. Who, actually let in 40% from within the EU (allowing for those who came from the post 2004 enlargement) and who let in the 60% from elsewhere around the world.

3 That the specific, post 2004 restrictions. were removed in 2011 still leaves all the "normal" restrictions on entry in force. The failure on the part of the UK government to use the post 2004 specific restrictions, as all other EU countries did, had the effect of funnelling a great number of "eastern European" migrants to the UK. After 2011, we merely reverted to the present rules, which do not grant every Tomasch, Ricardo, and Haroldo automatic entry.

So, guess who it was who let them all in?
userBarryd999
Posted: 17 January 2019 3:46 PM
Subject: RE: Sunderland
 


Forum master

Posts: 4771
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antony1969 - 2019-01-17 2:15 PM

Barryd999 - 2019-01-17 1:14 PM

antony1969 - 2019-01-16 6:06 PM

Barryd999 - 2019-01-16 5:45 PM

pelmetman - 2019-01-16 2:12 PM

Barryd999 - 2019-01-16 2:09 PM


For nearly a decade I worked across the entire region with hundreds of businesses from sole traders with no employees up to businesses with up to a £50m turnover as part of a team of ten with a multi million pound budget much of which was often EU money. .


Correction OUR MONEY ............



Well it is and it isn't., its way more complex than that. If you believed any of the stuff put out by the remain campaign in 2016 we get ten times back in terms of trade, jobs, investment etc by being members than what we pay in.
Of course you wont believe any of that, you just look at the bottom line of what goes out.


I can tell you though from first hand experience of working on funding and funded ICT / business projects in outreach and rural areas or places like the North East the EU are far more likely to fund stuff than our government who pretty much slashed most of the public sector funding in 2008-10 in all those places. If the economy tanks and there is even less money to fund important projects or to inject money into areas that are suffering in your post Brexit world what chance of it coming from our Austerity obsessed feckwit Tory party?


Don't get me wrong, the EU funding schemes are as big a PIA to deal with as UK government funding schemes at times and the irony is a lot of the key areas that voted out received more EU Funding than areas that voted to remain without doubt. Trouble is most of them probably had no idea. Im pretty sure most of the businesses I helped fund had no idea where the money was coming from or cared.


Ehhh ??? ... "our Government who pretty much slashed most of the public sector funding in 2008-2010" ... Not a mention that was a Labour Government yet further down the rant "our Austerity obsessed feckwit Tory party" ... Go figure


Labour had little choice given the s**t storm that was bestowed upon us but funding under the Tories has been worse ever since and they have a track record of ignoring places like the North East and no doubt west Yorkshire. I suspect most of them wont even have heard of Huddersfield. Seems the EU have though. £20m you little feckers have had!!

https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/west-yorkshire-news/eu-referendum-huddersfield-brexit-remain-11460879


£20 million over 10 years ... How many folk in Huddersfield Barry , do the maths on how much each Huddersfield type person has benefitted each year out of that £20 million and then take away how much Huddersfield as part of the UK has given that crookedy club over the 10 years ... Ye , not a good return is it


Its a fair chunk of money. If we pay in roughly 8 million a year to the EU thats about £13 each or summut I Reckon and if there are 140000 or so in Huddersfield its about 38 million over ten years so you have got over half of it back in development plus all the other benefits of trade and investment etc.

That was done on my Diane Abbot back of a fag packet calculator though so may not be totally accurate.
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