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We Must Help
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userBarryd999
Posted: 3 January 2019 11:27 AM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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Tracker - 2019-01-03 10:47 AM

As I have repeatedly stated - nobody needs to be in the EU to share information, security or any other, or to coperate with other governments on any matter.

Security is not an EU issue, it is a world wide issue not confined to the EU member states - or do we assume that no coperation exists between the EU and any other non member state? No wonder it is a mess?

If the EU choose to make it difficult that is purely down to the intransigence of the EU and their wish to make life as difficult as possible to discourage other leavers.

Simples.


They do when all the data is governed by the ECJ. Take for example The Schengen II database (one of many). It is used by police right across Europe to search for terrorist suspects and missing people and to check vehicle registrations and passport details. It contains information on 36,000 criminal suspects, 103,000 missing people and half a million non-EU citizens denied entry to Europe. Thats just one tool of 40 we stand to lose. We could keep them if we agreed to a soft Brexit with SM and CU with ECJ rule but the Brexiteers dont want to do that. Its not the EU being difficult. Its a well oiled machine developed over decades and the ECJ, Single market, Digital single market and customs union are all interlinked and out of the club you lose them all. Isnt that what you wanted?

It does however come at a price dropping all that and one of them without doubt will be security. You Brexiteers can call it remoaner propaganda as much as you like but the facts are we will lose access to all that info. We wont be able to check for example if someone trying to enter the UK is a known criminal or a suspected terrorist if that data is only held on the databases we will lose. How can that make us and our borders safer?

Its just one more aspect of how the entire ideology Brexit dream was simply not thought through and now the facts of exactly what we stand to lose are becoming ever more apparent with each passing day.
userpelmetman
Posted: 3 January 2019 11:37 AM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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Barryd999 - 2019-01-03 11:27 AM

Tracker - 2019-01-03 10:47 AM

As I have repeatedly stated - nobody needs to be in the EU to share information, security or any other, or to coperate with other governments on any matter.

Security is not an EU issue, it is a world wide issue not confined to the EU member states - or do we assume that no coperation exists between the EU and any other non member state? No wonder it is a mess?

If the EU choose to make it difficult that is purely down to the intransigence of the EU and their wish to make life as difficult as possible to discourage other leavers.

Simples.


They do when all the data is governed by the ECJ. Take for example The Schengen II database (one of many). It is used by police right across Europe to search for terrorist suspects and missing people and to check vehicle registrations and passport details. It contains information on 36,000 criminal suspects, 103,000 missing people and half a million non-EU citizens denied entry to Europe.


Well its pretty cr*p system then, seeing as we apparently have 25,000 potential terrorists just in the UK ........

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/islamist-extremists-uk-highest-number-europe-25000-terror-threat-eu-official-isis-islam-britain-a7923966.html

userTracker
Posted: 3 January 2019 11:57 AM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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Barryd999 - 2019-01-03 11:27 AM

They do when all the data is governed by the ECJ.



That is not a security issue, that is an ECJ issue.

Governance of the release and use of data by the ECJ is solely an EU/ECJ issue, which many people on both sides seem to conveniently want to hide behind and blame the UK for.

Or does that also mean the USA and other non EU allies are also met with the same reluctance to share 'data' and intel?

But getting EU remoaners to see that seems unlikely when in your eyes the EU can do no wrong and the UK can do no right.
userantony1969
Posted: 3 January 2019 12:07 PM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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The US , Canada , New Zealand , Australia and soon to be UK aren't in the EU so how come they manage to cooperate without the need of the dying club ??? ... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_Eyes ... From the link " The Five eyes relationship remains one of the most comprehensive known espionage alliances in history" ... Shut up Barry
userBarryd999
Posted: 3 January 2019 5:38 PM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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Oh ok then, I see. The head honchos at MI5/6 and the rozzers are just making it all up as they are all remoaners. We dont need the 40 shared EU tools and shared security databases then. The good ole USA will tell us everything thats going on in Europe instead. Thats that sorted then. Bloody UK intelligence experts huh! Clearly dont know what they are talking about. The USA is where its at clearly. They really know whats what.
userBulletguy
Posted: 3 January 2019 5:39 PM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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Tracker - 2019-01-03 11:18 AM

pelmetman - 2019-01-03 11:09 AM

Exactly Rich........do we not share intelligence with the USA ? ..........

Remoaner desperation gets more pathetic everyday ........



Indeed, as far as I can tell our relationship with the USA regarding security matters will not change on 30th March, neither will the USA's relationship with any member state of the EU, or with the EU itself?

So why should our relationship with the EU change when state security is largely an individual state issue and not an overall EU matter - unless the EU decide to be obstructive?

I used to be undecided, but having seen the way the EU appears to want to see itself as an omnipotent control freak empire in control of all aspects of everyone's life, I am starting to think the sooner we are out of it the better.

The EEC was maybe a good idea in 1973 but it seems to have outlived it's original purpose and outgrown it's original role.

US and Europe have differing laws on data protection and EU law is more stringent than US....former CIA man Snowden and his 'wikileaks' being a good example of that.

https://www.pensar.co.uk/blog/data-protection-in-the-us-vs-europe
userTracker
Posted: 3 January 2019 6:09 PM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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Bulletguy - 2019-01-03 5:39 PM

US and Europe have differing laws on data protection and EU law is more stringent than US....former CIA man Snowden and his 'wikileaks' being a good example of that.



What a load of old borrox and obfuscation that does nothing to explain why the EU is so bloody minded towards the UK - unless it really is just petulance and sour grapes?
userteflon2
Posted: 3 January 2019 6:31 PM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 
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Is everybody overlooking Interpol it's been in existence much longer than Europol and is global as opposed to Europol who seem to be parochial. If you look up Interpol you will see that they were involved in a French criminal roundup and using there global data were able to identify criminals from outside the EU. Don't take my word for it look it up for yourselves. I know which organisation I would prefer if it was a choice between them but as others have said cooperation will continue unless the EU play stupid.
userBarryd999
Posted: 3 January 2019 6:35 PM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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Tracker - 2019-01-03 6:09 PM

Bulletguy - 2019-01-03 5:39 PM

US and Europe have differing laws on data protection and EU law is more stringent than US....former CIA man Snowden and his 'wikileaks' being a good example of that.



What a load of old borrox and obfuscation that does nothing to explain why the EU is so bloody minded towards the UK - unless it really is just petulance and sour grapes?


Whats the point of having a club membership if you let any tom dick and harry in it without being a member? The UK have decided to go rogue and for reasons that are beyond most people (and countries for that matter) think we can be the only country in the world to forge ahead on WTO rules without being part of a trading bloc. Its not sour grapes, its maintaining standards. We are about to become Europe's Tramp, sitting in the corner drinking White lightning (Can you still get that?) out of a bottle in a bag while shouting over at the clean and tidy club members over the road in the shiny club house "Give us some food ya Bastas! Belch!). I think they are quite right to tell us to sod off.

Edited by Barryd999 2019-01-03 6:41 PM
userTracker
Posted: 3 January 2019 7:19 PM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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Barryd999 - 2019-01-03 6:35 PM

Whats the point of having a club membership if you let any tom dick and harry in it without being a member? The UK have decided to go rogue and for reasons that are beyond most people (and countries for that matter) think we can be the only country in the world to forge ahead on WTO rules without being part of a trading bloc. Its not sour grapes, its maintaining standards. We are about to become Europe's Tramp, sitting in the corner drinking White lightning (Can you still get that?) out of a bottle in a bag while shouting over at the clean and tidy club members over the road in the shiny club house "Give us some food ya Bastas! Belch!). I think they are quite right to tell us to sod off.


Whatever Bulletbrain is on you must be having some too now Barry as now you too are talking a load of old borrox!

Club membership has nothing to do with international security cooperation. I don't expect some numpties to understand that but I do expect better from you.

The UK is not going rogue, merely ceasing to contribute to a club that has outlived it's usefullness to us and were it not for the petulance of said club leaders the transition would have been smooth and seamless and it is the UK who should be telling the EU to Sodde off and pay for their own folllies not expect us to.
userBulletguy
Posted: 3 January 2019 8:54 PM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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Tracker - 2019-01-03 6:09 PM

Bulletguy - 2019-01-03 5:39 PM

US and Europe have differing laws on data protection and EU law is more stringent than US....former CIA man Snowden and his 'wikileaks' being a good example of that.



What a load of old borrox and obfuscation that does nothing to explain why the EU is so bloody minded towards the UK - unless it really is just petulance and sour grapes?

Eh??

Tracker - 2019-01-03 7:19 PM

Barryd999 - 2019-01-03 6:35 PM

Whats the point of having a club membership if you let any tom dick and harry in it without being a member? The UK have decided to go rogue and for reasons that are beyond most people (and countries for that matter) think we can be the only country in the world to forge ahead on WTO rules without being part of a trading bloc. Its not sour grapes, its maintaining standards. We are about to become Europe's Tramp, sitting in the corner drinking White lightning (Can you still get that?) out of a bottle in a bag while shouting over at the clean and tidy club members over the road in the shiny club house "Give us some food ya Bastas! Belch!). I think they are quite right to tell us to sod off.


Whatever Bulletbrain is on you must be having some too now Barry as now you too are talking a load of old borrox!

Club membership has nothing to do with international security cooperation. I don't expect some numpties to understand that but I do expect better from you.


Eh again? Are you disputing what the parliament link i posted last night said on that?

The UK is not going rogue, merely ceasing to contribute to a club that has outlived it's usefullness to us and were it not for the petulance of said club leaders the transition would have been smooth and seamless and it is the UK who should be telling the EU to Sodde off and pay for their own folllies not expect us to.

If as you believe it's "outlived it's usefulness to us"........then why is government so anxious to take whatever it can get from it? Why have businesses continually warned of the foolishness of 'no deal' and the catastrophic damage you will do to the country and economy? The fact you've been burying your heads in the sand is the reason many have simply given up and moved their operations out of the UK......and then you talk about the EU should pay for their follies!! Couldn't make that last one up if i tried...that's hilarious....you were having a laugh weren't you?

Even that arch flag waving "patriot" Brexiter (flag of convenience) Dyson sealed the deal to build his electric cars in Singapore just days after Singapore negotiated FTA's with the EU. I wonder why? It certainly wasn't for cheap labour as Singapore has one of the highest labour rates along with the most expensive land costs for industry.
userpelmetman
Posted: 4 January 2019 9:12 AM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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Bulletguy - 2019-01-03 5:39 PM

US and Europe have differing laws on data protection and EU law is more stringent than US....former CIA man Snowden and his 'wikileaks' being a good example of that.

https://www.pensar.co.uk/blog/data-protection-in-the-us-vs-europe


"The files also make clear that GCHQ played a leading role in advising its European counterparts how to work around national laws intended to restrict the surveillance power of intelligence agencies."

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2013/nov/01/gchq-europe-spy-agencies-mass-surveillance-snowden

.............

Seems to me GCHQ will benefit from being outside of the EU wet laws ...........

userantony1969
Posted: 4 January 2019 11:53 AM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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They don't come to improve their English or the weather ... https://www.gov.uk/asylum-support/what-youll-get ... Thats without all the help from local councils and charities of which we have many in my area ... Lordy
userantony1969
Posted: 7 January 2019 2:00 PM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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Public safety video of what to do if you stumble across a young male migrant type in Dover ... https://twitter.com/Dontshutusupp/status/1082250427176050689 ... Or ya could drop em off at Barrys gaffe ... Bye bye Ireland ... https://twitter.com/lorraineSW1/status/1082265975490269185 ... Wonderful cultural enrichment

Edited by antony1969 2019-01-07 2:08 PM
userantony1969
Posted: 7 January 2019 6:13 PM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


The special one

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More young French fellas fleeing the war that ravages Europe ... https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6564707/Police-launch-hunt-migrants-abandoned-inflatable-boat-Kent-coast.html ... Here to help we are
userBarryd999
Posted: 7 January 2019 7:06 PM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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Britain has been put on the highest alert possible after intelligence reached joint chiefs of staff that a small rubber dinghy with a family of four on-board has left a secret location in France bound for Britain.

It is understood that those risking their lives in a attempt to find safety are a desperate father, mother and two terrified children all fleeing terrible oppression and persecution, and all hellbent on getting to Britain to carry out atrocities such as saving their own lives and then possibly holding down worthwhile taxpaying jobs as good and decent members of our society.

So grave and sinister is this development that Home Secretary, Sajid Javid, has taken charge of the operation to hunt the dinghy down personally, and is is believed to be aboard a naval vessel on standby ready to authorise the launch of ‘whatever force is necessary’ should it be spotted in The Channel.

Speaking to reporters invited onto the vessel to blanket-cover just how much of a dynamic figure he really is Mr Javid said: ‘This is a national emergency of immense proportions. If these four manage to get to the UK, then by my reckoning that will make a total of very nearly eight or possibly as many as ten altogether. It really is that bad!’

‘That’s why I’m out here strutting around on the high seas to ensure that Britain is kept safe from these people who would otherwise overrun us. It’s what the Daily Mail and its readership would want and expect me to do, and as I know it will play well with the electorate I do not intend to shirk my duty by missing such a golden opportunity.’

‘Oh and who knows, with a bit of luck might see you all in No. 10 in time for the Summer Season.’
userantony1969
Posted: 7 January 2019 7:39 PM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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Barryd999 - 2019-01-07 7:06 PM



Britain has been put on the highest alert possible after intelligence reached joint chiefs of staff that a small rubber dinghy with a family of four on-board has left a secret location in France bound for Britain.

It is understood that those risking their lives in a attempt to find safety are a desperate father, mother and two terrified children all fleeing terrible oppression and persecution, and all hellbent on getting to Britain to carry out atrocities such as saving their own lives and then possibly holding down worthwhile taxpaying jobs as good and decent members of our society.

So grave and sinister is this development that Home Secretary, Sajid Javid, has taken charge of the operation to hunt the dinghy down personally, and is is believed to be aboard a naval vessel on standby ready to authorise the launch of ‘whatever force is necessary’ should it be spotted in The Channel.

Speaking to reporters invited onto the vessel to blanket-cover just how much of a dynamic figure he really is Mr Javid said: ‘This is a national emergency of immense proportions. If these four manage to get to the UK, then by my reckoning that will make a total of very nearly eight or possibly as many as ten altogether. It really is that bad!’

‘That’s why I’m out here strutting around on the high seas to ensure that Britain is kept safe from these people who would otherwise overrun us. It’s what the Daily Mail and its readership would want and expect me to do, and as I know it will play well with the electorate I do not intend to shirk my duty by missing such a golden opportunity.’

‘Oh and who knows, with a bit of luck might see you all in No. 10 in time for the Summer Season.’[/QU

Take it you still wont be putting any of those "decent" folk up Barry ... Let em go to the usual suspects ... Hypocrite
userantony1969
Posted: 10 January 2019 6:42 AM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


The special one

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Praise the Lord ... They made it ... https://news.sky.com/story/police-search-lorries-as-m6-shuts-between-j15-and-j16-due-to-ongoing-incident-11603101 ... More vital young male doctors and teachers fleeing the fires of France ... Anyone on here who can spare money or a room to shelter these poor darlings please step forward and help
userantony1969
Posted: 11 January 2019 6:23 AM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


The special one

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I thought Barry said it was easy to get rid of these chancers now ... https://news.sky.com/story/fewer-than-half-of-failed-asylum-seekers-are-removed-from-the-uk-study-says-11603672
userpelmetman
Posted: 11 January 2019 8:35 AM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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antony1969 - 2019-01-11 6:23 AM

I thought Barry said it was easy to get rid of these chancers now ... https://news.sky.com/story/fewer-than-half-of-failed-asylum-seekers-are-removed-from-the-uk-study-says-11603672


Barry like his fellow Wets on here talk complete Tosh .........

As the FACTS PROVE ..........

userantony1969
Posted: 20 January 2019 11:42 AM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


The special one

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Praise the Lord they made it ... https://news.sky.com/story/border-force-seen-escorting-suspected-migrant-dinghy-into-dover-kent-11612650 ... A young child of 32 supposedly one of those rescued after fleeing war ravaged France ... Really , really good news ... Really good
user747
Posted: 20 January 2019 1:02 PM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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Tens of thousands of immigrants have entered the EU via Italy and Greece. They came over from Libya, mostly fit young men.

Therefore, how is it we are safer inside the EU with all of this movement of people with no ID? It has already been proven that the perpetrators of European terror attacks came in that way.

If there is to be no hard border in Ireland, that will quickly become the route of choice for asylum seekers/economic migrants.
userantony1969
Posted: 20 January 2019 6:09 PM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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Desperate to reach us , too right they are ... https://news.sky.com/story/rough-crossings-the-migrants-desperate-to-reach-britain-11604892 ... Running from war in France and a fantastic benefits package here who can blame em ... I think they enrich us ... Defo
userantony1969
Posted: 27 January 2019 10:19 AM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


The special one

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Great ... More young male professionals who've managed to flee burning France ... https://twitter.com/Kent_999s/status/1089162447875985408 ... Heart warming stuff for a Sunday morning ... Coming to a school near you soon ... Or maybe not
userTracker
Posted: 27 January 2019 10:28 AM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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747 - 2019-01-20 1:02 PM
If there is to be no hard border in Ireland, that will quickly become the route of choice for asylum seekers/economic migrants.


So if the Irish Sea becomes the new UK border with the EU and no border between France and Ireland, Ireland could become the new Calais with migrant camps, increased crime and all the associated multi cultural joy that these economic migrants bring.

Edited by Tracker 2019-01-27 10:29 AM
userteflon2
Posted: 27 January 2019 6:52 PM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 
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747 - 2019-01-20 1:02 PM

Tens of thousands of immigrants have entered the EU via Italy and Greece. They came over from Libya, mostly fit young men.

Therefore, how is it we are safer inside the EU with all of this movement of people with no ID? It has already been proven that the perpetrators of European terror attacks came in that way.

If there is to be no hard border in Ireland, that will quickly become the route of choice for asylum seekers/economic migrants.




It's more likely to become the preferred smuggling route for tariff free goods from the UK to the EU.
user747
Posted: 27 January 2019 11:07 PM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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teflon2 - 2019-01-27 6:52 PM

747 - 2019-01-20 1:02 PM

Tens of thousands of immigrants have entered the EU via Italy and Greece. They came over from Libya, mostly fit young men.

Therefore, how is it we are safer inside the EU with all of this movement of people with no ID? It has already been proven that the perpetrators of European terror attacks came in that way.

If there is to be no hard border in Ireland, that will quickly become the route of choice for asylum seekers/economic migrants.




It's more likely to become the preferred smuggling route for tariff free goods from the UK to the EU.



Agreed. The Irish (in the South) will have to sort it out. Well, the UK will not say no to a bit of Duty Free, whatever it is.

Edited by 747 2019-01-27 11:08 PM
userHarveyHeaven
Posted: 28 January 2019 7:49 AM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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Bulletguy - 2018-12-31 2:42 PM

malc d - 2018-12-31 11:50 AM

pelmetman - 2018-12-31 11:28 AM

Barryd999 - 2018-12-31 10:52 AM

We are not forced to give migrants access to our benefit system now Dave in case you didnt know and if they havent found work after three months we can send them home.




https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/dec/14/home-office-policy-deport-eu-rough-sleepers-ruled-unlawful

WE CANT EVEN DEPORT THEIR BEGGARS! .........and they might even be entitled to compo if we try ........




As I understand it, the article refers to workers - not beggars.


What's new? That pair never let fact stand in the way of pumping out more of their bile and hate.


Bile and hate is the life blood of every Brexiter and cognitive dissonance makes it impossible for them to acknowledge the evidence......evidence is 'project fear' don't expect anything different....they have to be like they are otherwise they have to face up to their own faillure and only the very brave can do that...these guys on here are far from that.
userHarveyHeaven
Posted: 28 January 2019 7:52 AM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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pelmetman - 2019-01-11 8:35 AM

antony1969 - 2019-01-11 6:23 AM

I thought Barry said it was easy to get rid of these chancers now ... https://news.sky.com/story/fewer-than-half-of-failed-asylum-seekers-are-removed-from-the-uk-study-says-11603672


Barry like his fellow Wets on here talk complete Tosh .........

As the FACTS PROVE ..........



'FACTS'' from the right wing Brexit pushing state run UK media....hardly... propaganda is all that is pumped by all the media in the UK....nothing is mentioned about the British funded wars which are causing all the refugees in the first place...not a single word....wonder why that is???

Edited by HarveyHeaven 2019-01-28 7:54 AM
userantony1969
Posted: 28 January 2019 9:07 AM
Subject: RE: We Must Help
 


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HarveyHeaven - 2019-01-28 7:52 AM

pelmetman - 2019-01-11 8:35 AM

antony1969 - 2019-01-11 6:23 AM

I thought Barry said it was easy to get rid of these chancers now ... https://news.sky.com/story/fewer-than-half-of-failed-asylum-seekers-are-removed-from-the-uk-study-says-11603672


Barry like his fellow Wets on here talk complete Tosh .........

As the FACTS PROVE ..........



'FACTS'' from the right wing Brexit pushing state run UK media....hardly... propaganda is all that is pumped by all the media in the UK....nothing is mentioned about the British funded wars which are causing all the refugees in the first place...not a single word....wonder why that is???


"Wonder" no more ... I'll tell you why that is ... It's because it's not reality but utter tosh ... "British funded wars which are causing ALL the refugees" ... Bet you believe in the tooth fairy too
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