JoeJoe Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Hi, I have a CI Carioca 200 low profile and the offside front roof marker light is not working. I have checked with a meter and there is no feed getting to the light. Doe's anyone know how the wires are routed to the roof please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Sorry can't help with wiring but my understanding is that if you have marker lights they have to work but it is not a legal requirement to have them so you can replace them both with clear reflectors? You might be able to reroute the cable from the other light internally if you can't find the problem? You can use your meter to check the live feed and use a nearby bare metal part of the engine / van as an earth return that should identify whether it is a live or an earth fault and if it is an earth fault it will not be a fuse problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeJoe Posted July 30, 2014 Author Share Posted July 30, 2014 Yes have checked the fuses, they ok also done the earth to live test (no live feed ) so must be a problem somewhere in between. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 My guess would be the wiring going up a hollow cab door pillar, or just maybe a windscreen pillar? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Hi Joe and welcome to the forum, First off marker lights ARE a legal requirement if the vehicle is over a certain width. I can't remember the figure but I'm sure Google would come to the help if you really wanted to know. The wiring to the marker lights will almost certainly have been added by CI so my guess would be that they run up the 'B' pillar around the joint between the rear edge of the cab and the coachbuilt body. Try looking underneat at the bottom of the 'B' pillar for a bundle of wires. There is usually a fusebox/junction box supplied by the chassis manufacturer (Fiat?) where the coachbuilder joins into the chassis wiring. The wiring will then most probably have been laid over the roof before the top layer is affixed so unfortunately impossible to get to after being built (at least that is how Auto-Trail build theirs). If you cannot find the fault my suggestion would be to run a new power feed either from the opposite side or from below up the 'B' pillar to the offending item, either option unfortunately will not be easy! I assume from your comments that you have proved it is a live fault and not an earth fault? Keith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tracker Posted July 30, 2014 Share Posted July 30, 2014 Apologies - https://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d12/vc25100.htm The old Talisman that we blanked 'em on must have been narrower than 80" because it was an MOT station that advised me to do it rather than faff about! Those lights were white and now, it seems, they have to be amber? If you have to run new surface mounted cable this stuff makes it easier to keep it tidy and unobtrusive - http://www.screwfix.com/p/tower-self-adhesive-mini-trunking-12mm-x-8mm-x-2m/73354 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 Tracker The first link you have provided relates to a Californian website! The UK legal requirement for ‘end-outline marker lamps’ was discussed here http://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/upper-marker-light/34727/ and (as Robinhood rightly said) such lamps are obligatory for vehicles more than 2.1 metres wide. The UK’s Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations advise that the colour of the light emitted by end-outline marker lamps must be white towards the front and red towards the rear. The two lamps which emit white light towards the front, and the two lamps which emit red light towards the rear, shall in each case form a matched pair. The white front lamp and red rear lamp on one side of a vehicle may be combined into a single lamp with a single light source. There are exceptions to the ‘over 2.1 metres wide’ rule, with end-outline marker lamps not being legally needed when a motor vehicle - was first used before 1st April 1991 - is an incomplete vehicle proceeding to a works for completion or to a place where it is to be stored or displayed for sale - has a maximum speed not exceeding 25 mph - has an overall width not exceeding 2100 mm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeJoe Posted August 1, 2014 Author Share Posted August 1, 2014 Thanks to all who replied, sadly no-one seems to know where the wires are routed though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted August 1, 2014 Share Posted August 1, 2014 Keithl - 2014-07-30 6:28 PM The wiring to the marker lights will almost certainly have been added by CI so my guess would be that they run up the 'B' pillar around the joint between the rear edge of the cab and the coachbuilt body... The wiring will then most probably have been laid over the roof before the top layer is affixed so unfortunately impossible to get to after being built (at least that is how Auto-Trail build theirs). I assume from your comments that you have proved it is a live fault and not an earth fault? Keith. As I said earlier you are going to need to do some detective work to find the routing. Did you ascertain for certain that it is a live fault and not an earth fault? Keith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted August 1, 2014 Share Posted August 1, 2014 JoeJoe You haven’t said how old your motorhome is, but (based on on-line images) all Carioca 200 models appear to have a similar design with the front end-outline marker lamps perched on the top-rear of the overcab glass-fibre moulding as shown in this advert’s first two photos http://www.motorhomesuk.co.uk/motorhome-hire/Lincolnshire/55/Carioca-200-4-berth-Grimsby-NE-Lincolnshire/ Images of Carioca 200 interiors give no real help as to the route cables take to these lamps, but the advice given that CI may have run them downwards to the rear of the cab-doors is logical given the lamps’ position. (I’m not sure if you have actially removed the faulty lamp from the roof, but if you have not, doing so might give an clue to the wiring’s routing.) It’s often very difficult to identify how a motorhome manufacturer has provided power to supplementary lamps. I could make logical guesses where the cables for my Hobby’s end-outline marker lamps went, but I never needed to prove whether those guesses were correct. When the Hobby’s high-level brake-light played up I could not identify the route the cabling took to it and, if I had chosen to replace the brake-light, I would have run a new power-feed to it as Keith suggested above. Even if you took your motorhome to a dealership specialising in the CI marque, it’s quite likely they would not be able to tell you immediately where the wires go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted August 1, 2014 Share Posted August 1, 2014 JoeJoe - 2014-07-30 1:39 PM Hi, I have a CI Carioca 200 low profile and the offside front roof marker light is not working. I have checked with a meter and there is no feed getting to the light. Doe's anyone know how the wires are routed to the roof please. Since both lights should come on together, I'd guess that for simplicity there is only one power feed up to the roof, and that this is then extended across from one side to the other. As one lamp is working, that suggests it is likely to be the side where the power feed arrives, but also the location of the fault. So, why not explore that lamp, and see if you find a detached wire on the back of the lamp holder, or a plug in connector that has become unplugged. Just ease it out of place gently in case all the connections are a bit precarious, as it may be there was a failure there before, and someone was a bit ham-fisted resolving that and detached the feed to the opposite light in the process. Make sure you tie something to the end of any wires you find, and leave the tie trailing outside the roof, because if you don't, and the wires drop into the roof void, you will make a tricky job 10 times worse! :-) It may just be that the wiring between the two lights is a bit, short and tension has caused a connector to jump off. I'd suggest that before doing this you remove the duff light, and tie something to the wiring to that, leaving that tie also trailing outside the roof - in case removal of, and examining, the working light causes tension in the wiring and the wires to the duff one then disconnect and disappear. Hope this makes sense! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lennyhb Posted August 3, 2014 Share Posted August 3, 2014 Brian Kirby - 2014-08-01 11:21 AM Since both lights should come on together, I'd guess that for simplicity there is only one power feed up to the roof, and that this is then extended across from one side to the other. As one lamp is working, that suggests it is likely to be the side where the power feed arrives, but also the location of the fault. Modern vehicles normally have separate left and right side light circuits so I would expect each marker light to be fed from the relevant circuit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted August 3, 2014 Share Posted August 3, 2014 lennyhb - 2014-08-03 12:05 AM Brian Kirby - 2014-08-01 11:21 AM Since both lights should come on together, I'd guess that for simplicity there is only one power feed up to the roof, and that this is then extended across from one side to the other. As one lamp is working, that suggests it is likely to be the side where the power feed arrives, but also the location of the fault. Modern vehicles normally have separate left and right side light circuits so I would expect each marker light to be fed from the relevant circuit. Come now, this is a motorhome being discussed - and an Italian-made motorhome at that. ;-) While it’s to be expected, perhaps, that Ford will have run separate cables down the left and right hand sides of the vehicle to feed left and right parking and side-marker lights respectively, there’s certainly no guarantee that CI will have chosen to piggy-back the left roof-mounted lamp on to the left Ford-fitted cable and the right roof-mounted lamp on to the right Ford-fitted cable. It’s just as likely that CI will have connected a single cable to the Ford-fitted parking/side-marker light circuit, then run that cable into the roof area, connecting it first to one roof-mounted lamp and then on to the other (or ‘Y-ing’ that cable somewhere so that each branch of the Y feeds one roof-mounted lamp). Given how bloody-minded motorhome manufacturers can be, I’d bet on a single power-feed cable that’s run in a horribly inaccessible place. It would certainly be worth following Brian’s suggestion to check the cable-connections on the functioning roof-mounted lamp just in case there’s a cross-feed from that lamp to the other one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billggski Posted August 3, 2014 Share Posted August 3, 2014 ......and if there is, run an external wire across to your duff bulb to test it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lennyhb Posted August 4, 2014 Share Posted August 4, 2014 Derek Uzzell - 2014-08-03 8:47 AM lennyhb - 2014-08-03 12:05 AM Brian Kirby - 2014-08-01 11:21 AM Since both lights should come on together, I'd guess that for simplicity there is only one power feed up to the roof, and that this is then extended across from one side to the other. As one lamp is working, that suggests it is likely to be the side where the power feed arrives, but also the location of the fault. Modern vehicles normally have separate left and right side light circuits so I would expect each marker light to be fed from the relevant circuit. Come now, this is a motorhome being discussed - and an Italian-made motorhome at that. ;-) . Sorry Derek I'm only on my second Motorhome and both have been German Hymers. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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