Alko spare wheel carrier

[Barcobird]

In a further effort to remove weight from the back of my motorhome I am now trying to find a new home for the spare wheel.

 

When ordered this should have been mentioned and they would have fitted a rail with a cut out to accommodate a special carrier.

 

As this is no longer possible I am looking at the hangars used on the Alko caravan chassis. Part number 1555943.

 

Has anyone ever fitted one of these to a motorhome and if so is it man enough and would it accommodate a 16 inch wheel and tyre ?

[Derek Uzzell]

AL-KO offers spare-wheel carriers for their caravan chassis in 4 different ‘length ranges'

 

https://www.al-ko.com/shop/uk_vt/products/caravan-accessories-1/spare_wheel_carriers.html

 

with the 1555943 version being the shortest.

 

The carrier for AL-KO AMC motorhome chassis is offered for 15” or 16” wheels and (as you’ve mentioned and is highlighted here)

 

https://www.al-ko.com/shop/uk_vt/products/motorhome-accessories/spare-wheel-carriers-motorhome/spare-wheel-carrier-for-16inch-wheels-1.html

 

the chassis needs to have a specialised crossmember for the carrier to be fitted.

 

The caravan and motorhome AL-KO spare-wheel carriers operate differently, and as will be clear from the 1st attached image (caravan carrier) and the 2nd attached image (motorhome carrier), the latter is by far the sturdier.

 

I’m very doubtful that anyone will have attempted to graft an AL-KO caravan carrier on to an AMC motorhome chassis, simply because it’s such a patently unwise thing to do.

 

Where were you proposing to carry the spare-wheel under the chassis? If it goes behind the rear axle, by the time the weight of a suitably strong carrier is factored in, I doubt there’d be much wortwhile rear-axle load saving. If the spare-wheel were to be carried well in front of the rear-axle, you could reduce the rear-axle load, but would there then be adequate ground clearance beneath the wheel + carrier?

[Barcobird]

Thanks Brian but why is it patenly obvious, because of a weight issue ?

 

Incidentally 934 is the shortest 943 is the one to suit my chassis width but it’s manufactured for a caravan not a motorhome, so hence my question.

 

There is a space just forward of the centre line between the rear and front wheels.

 

Why Alko have to over complicate and make everything so expensive I don’t know. Why can’t they fit this rail with the cut out to all motorhomes which gives the opportunity of fitting a rack at a later date.

[Derek Uzzell]

Barcobird - 2019-06-01 3:09 PM

 

Thanks Brian but why is it patenly obvious, because of a weight issue ?...

 

 

Who is “Brian”?

 

I would have thought that considering fitting a carrier that is purpose-designed for an AL-KO caravan chassis to a motorhome AMC chassis that the carrier is not intended for must be a dubious proposition to begin with.

 

Then (as you touch on in your original posting) there’s the possibility that the caravan carrier won’t be strong enough to reliably support the weight of the 16” wheel/tyre combination used on your motorhome - a very real and obvious risk in my view when the heavyweight motorhome ‘cradle' is compared with the spindly '2-pieces-of-wire’ caravan carrier.

 

There are also several on-line criticisms of the practicality of the AL-KO caravan carrier (examples here)

 

https://www.practicalcaravan.com/forum/technical/34314-alko-spare-wheel-carrier-is-problematic-beware

 

https://www.caravantalk.co.uk/community/topic/52425-dangerous-lethal-al-ko-spare-wheel-carriers/

 

If you chose to fit the caravan spare wheel carrier to your motorhome, modifications would presumably need to be made to the motorhome’s chassis to accommodate the carrier. (Would you be DIY-ing this, as I suspect any reputable tradesman would be very wary of taking on the task?) This 2013 forum thread

 

https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Hints-and-Tips/Spare-wheel-carrier-for-Alko-heavy-chassis-D-I-Y/30732/

 

described a DIY approach (employing the Fiat Ducato ‘winch down’ mechanism) that you might want to think about instead.

 

At least you’ve got a spare wheel! The norm for Fiat-based motorhomes nowadays is for them to be delivered with just a Fix&Go kit and no spare wheel even as an option. And, if the motorhome has no rear garage and the underfloor space has been exploited for water tanks, etc. nowhere on/in the motorhome to subsequently carry a spare wheel.

[Casimir]

I fitted an Al-Ko spare wheel carrier to my motorhome about three years ago. I purchased it direct from Al-Ko. The part number was 1610973 but this was for a 15" wheel. It is specifically for a motorhome, not a caravan. As mentioned above the chassis needs to have a specialised crossmember for the carrier to be fitted.

[Barcobird]

Derek Uzzell - 2019-06-02 8:21 AM

 

Barcobird - 2019-06-01 3:09 PM

 

Thanks Brian but why is it patenly obvious, because of a weight issue ?...

 

 

Who is “Brian”?

 

I would have thought that considering fitting a carrier that is purpose-designed for an AL-KO caravan chassis to a motorhome AMC chassis that the carrier is not intended for must be a dubious proposition to begin with.

 

Then (as you touch on in your original posting) there’s the possibility that the caravan carrier won’t be strong enough to reliably support the weight of the 16” wheel/tyre combination used on your motorhome - a very real and obvious risk in my view when the heavyweight motorhome ‘cradle' is compared with the spindly '2-pieces-of-wire’ caravan carrier.

 

There are also several on-line criticisms of the practicality of the AL-KO caravan carrier (examples here)

 

https://www.practicalcaravan.com/forum/technical/34314-alko-spare-wheel-carrier-is-problematic-beware

 

https://www.caravantalk.co.uk/community/topic/52425-dangerous-lethal-al-ko-spare-wheel-carriers/

 

If you chose to fit the caravan spare wheel carrier to your motorhome, modifications would presumably need to be made to the motorhome’s chassis to accommodate the carrier. (Would you be DIY-ing this, as I suspect any reputable tradesman would be very wary of taking on the task?) This 2013 forum thread

 

https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Hints-and-Tips/Spare-wheel-carrier-for-Alko-heavy-chassis-D-I-Y/30732/

 

described a DIY approach (employing the Fiat Ducato ‘winch down’ mechanism) that you might want to think about instead.

 

At least you’ve got a spare wheel! The norm for Fiat-based motorhomes nowadays is for them to be delivered with just a Fix&Go kit and no spare wheel even as an option. And, if the motorhome has no rear garage and the underfloor space has been exploited for water tanks, etc. nowhere on/in the motorhome to subsequently carry a spare wheel.

 

Sorry Derek, I was thinking of Brian Kirby 8-) another senior moment!

 

The reason I mentioned the caravan carrier was because a lot of this stuff is over manufactured and generally carry a lot more than they are designed to. With regards to fitting it involves drilling 4 holes, and it won't affect the guarantee because Alko's warranty isn't worth diddly squat after 2 years. Also with your other concerns, if you maintain the carrier properly it shouldn't give any problems. Unless I was really really desperate I wouldn't attempt changing the wheel that's why I have breakdown cover.

The reason for carrying the spare is because if it's needed ( the other tyre is shredded and not gunk repairable) I have a wheel to go straight back on and it will match all the other tyres, I don't have to wait for days for them to source a new one.

I am not a lover of the wind down mechanism because after reading posts on this and other forums there seems to be a tendency (remote maybe)of failure and your spare wheel is jangling about on the end of a safety wire and then causes damage as it let's go.

Originally this has been kept in the garage which is the safest and cleanest place but as it appears weight is an issue then I thought it would be better in between the front and rear wheels.

[Barcobird]

Casimir - 2019-06-02 10:15 AM

 

I fitted an Al-Ko spare wheel carrier to my motorhome about three years ago. I purchased it direct from Al-Ko. The part number was 1610973 but this was for a 15" wheel. It is specifically for a motorhome, not a caravan. As mentioned above the chassis needs to have a specialised crossmember for the carrier to be fitted.

 

At the time of ordering our motorhome we requested a spare wheel which was about 200 quid. The dealer mentioned a carrier and from memory it was something like £500. What wasn't mentioned was the fact that during the build they have to install a special cut out section to accomodate the carrier. As weight apparently wasn't an issue we decided to keep it in the garage.

 

WHY can't they fit this cross beam as standard so if you want to fit a rack at a later date it's not a problem. I can't see how it affects the integrity of the chassis

[Derek Uzzell]

There seems to be no obvious ‘technical’ reason why every AL-KO AMC chassis should not have the specialised cross-member as standard, but even if your Pilote had this crossmember and you obtained the correct spare-wheel carrier, as will be apparent from the attached images, you’d not get any appreciable rear end weight-saving as the spare-wheel + carrier would still be behind the vehicle’s rear axle.

 

I understand what you are trying to do and, realistically, to gain a useful rear-end weight reduction you will need to move the spare wheel in front of the rear axle and towards the motorhome’s front end as far as is practicable.

 

I don’t think you’ll find anybody who has pioneered what you are contemplating doing, and I wouldn’t do it as I believe the caravan carrier isn’t up to the task.

 

I vividly remember a spare-wheel dropping off the underside of a small Renault car coming towards me. Fortunately this was on a straight road and the wheel stayed flat, just skidded along the road at 40mph or so with a stream of sparks behind it. So before you consider fitting the caravan carrier, I siggest you ask your insurance provider how they feel about your idea. (You might also want to ask AL-KO what their view is.)

[Barcobird]

Derek Uzzell - 2019-06-02 3:17 PM

 

There seems to be no obvious ‘technical’ reason why every AL-KO AMC chassis should not have the specialised cross-member as standard, but even if your Pilote had this crossmember and you obtained the correct spare-wheel carrier, as will be apparent from the attached images, you’d not get any appreciable rear end weight-saving as the spare-wheel + carrier would still be behind the vehicle’s rear axle.

 

I understand what you are trying to do and, realistically, to gain a useful rear-end weight reduction you will need to move the spare wheel in front of the rear axle and towards the motorhome’s front end as far as is practicable.

 

I don’t think you’ll find anybody who has pioneered what you are contemplating doing, and I wouldn’t do it as I believe the caravan carrier isn’t up to the task.

 

I vividly remember a spare-wheel dropping off the underside of a small Renault car coming towards me. Fortunately this was on a straight road and the wheel stayed flat, just skidded along the road at 40mph or so with a stream of sparks behind it. So before you consider fitting the caravan carrier, I siggest you ask your insurance provider how they feel about your idea. (You might also want to ask AL-KO what their view is.)

 

I don’t know if the rail sits behind the rear wheels on all of their chassis or can be moved around depending on the particular model (mine has extensions).

 

Incidentally I have a “spot” underneath which is well forward of the rear wheels. As you say if it’s behind the rear wheels then I wouldn’t even bother.

 

I don’t intend to fit anything that might be “dodgy” as although access is not that important safety is paramount! What ever way I go contacting Alko in my opinion is a complete waste of time as I think they are. If you don’t have the cut out, you can’t fit a carrier and the cut out can’t be fitted retrospectively, I have already asked them.

[Derek Uzzell]

It’s evident from images of AL-KO spare-wheel carriers that they are intended to be installed behind a caravan’s or motorhome’s rear axle, with the respective AL-KO chassis being designed for the carrier to be located only in that position.

 

The only motorhomes I’m aware of where the spare-wheel was carried underfloor between the rear and front axles were Ford Transit-based FWD Hymer Vans. With motorhomes and cars, when the spare-wheel is carried beneath the vehicle, it’s almost always behind the rear axle. In that position the wheel will be reasonably accessible and (as I touched on above) if the wheel does detach from the vehicle there’s a sporting chance damage won’t result. With the spare-wheel mounted between the front and rear axles as you are considering doing, if the carrier fails while your mototrhome is being driven and the carrier + spare-wheel detaches from the chassis, you’d be very lucky not to have the failed assembly smash into the rear axle.

 

I’m confident that neither AL-KO nor Pilote would approve fitting an AL-KO caravan spare-wheel carrier to your motorhome. I’m also pretty sure that no motorhome owner will have done this and (so far) no O&AL forum-member has contradicted that. You could try copying your original posting to the larger forums (MHFacts, MHFun etc.) just in case someone has made the mofification and/or has an informed opinion about the strength of the caravan carrier.If you don’t get any trustworthy feedback, you’ll just have to go it alone and decide whether or not to go ahead with the caravan carrier idea.

 

(The attached images show a simple underfloor spare-wheel carrier used by Autocruise at one stage. The wheel was carried behind the rear axle, but there’s no obvious reason why it could not have been fitted within the wheelbase if there were room. (I’m wary of the threaded vertical bolt that seems to be very close to the ground in the 1st image, but thiis does not appear in the 2nd image.) Anyway, if you were comfortable with carrying the spare-wheel forward of the rear axle, even if you didn’t use the AL-KO caravan carrier, it ought to be practicable to have a suitable carrier fabricated.)

 

[Barcobird]

This looks a more robust system which is similar to the Alko

 

Link to YouTube

 

(Edit - Link shortened - Keithl)

[Derek Uzzell]

Nothing wrong with the principle and, as the BAL Hide-A-Spare is marketed as appropriate for carrying the size/weight of a spare-wheel+tyre suitable for a USA RV, it should be plenty strong enough for the wheel//tyre used on your Pilote. The USA price is also attractive.

 

https://www.rvupgradestore.com/Hide-A-Spare-70-I-Beam-Frame-Underslung-Mount-p/92-0153.htm

 

But you were asking about the AL-KO caravan carrier and seeking confirmation from anyone who had fitted this to a motorhome that the carrier was strong enough. As I’ve said, I doubt you’ll get that confirmation and, just looking at the caravan carrier, it doesn’t seem particularly substantial.

 

It should be practicable to fit the AL-KO caravan carrier to your motorhome (or to fit the more robust BAL carrier) but I believe you’ll have to decide for yourself about the former’s strength.

[Robbo]

A guy (Techno) on Motorhomes Fun forum built a screw down system, located between front and rear axles on his Rapido with AL-CO chassis. The depth of the 16" wheel is contained within the depth of the chassis.

 

This thread may be of interest https://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/forum/threads/alko-diy-wheel-carrier.63164/

[Barcobird]

Robbo - 2019-06-03 5:49 PM

 

A guy (Techno) on Motorhomes Fun forum built a screw down system, located between front and rear axles on his Rapido with AL-CO chassis. The depth of the 16" wheel is contained within the depth of the chassis.

 

This thread may be of interest https://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/forum/threads/alko-diy-wheel-carrier.63164/

 

Yes I saw that post a long time ago but as mentioned in this thread what happens if it let’s go? I feel metal bars underneath the wheel are going to be more secure.

[Derek Uzzell]

Robbo - 2019-06-03 5:49 PM

 

A guy (Techno) on Motorhomes Fun forum built a screw down system, located between front and rear axles on his Rapido with AL-CO chassis. The depth of the 16" wheel is contained within the depth of the chassis.

 

This thread may be of interest https://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/forum/threads/alko-diy-wheel-carrier.63164/

 

The guy was Andy Waters, who was an occasional participant here from 2010-2014 (posting as “Techno100”). I referred to Andy’s modification in my posting of 2 June 2019 8:21 AM above, but Barcobird wasn’t keen on Andy’s method.

 

Andy’s approach involving grafting Fiat’s ‘winch’ mechanism on to an AL-KO AMC motorhome chassis would appear to be more challenging than installing the AL-KO caravan carrier, but I suspect that fitting the latter to an AMC chassis (that was never designed to accept it) will be trickier than Barcobird envisages (“...fitting it involves drilling 4 holes”).

 

These two YouTube videos relate to the AL-KO caravan carrier and show how this attaches to a caravan. It also warns that the carrier’s tubular ‘bars' may damage the spare-wheel’s tyre (which shouldn’t happen when the purpose-designed motorhome ‘cradle’ is used).

 

 

 

My Rapido has a Ducato camping-car chassis (not an AL-KO chassis). It would not be practicable to carry a spare-wheel behind the rear axle as Rapido has mounted the grey-water tank there, with a garage's dropped-floor to the rear of the tank. It MIGHT be possible to carry a spare-wheel underfloor towards the centre of the motorhome as there seems to be enough unused area there, but - thinking about Barcobird’s plan - I doubted whether (if an under-wheel carrier method were used) the spare-wheel could actually be loaded on to the carrier, never mind be removed from the carrier subsequently. So I could see why Andy Waters went for the winch approach as, although it has its drawbacks, it should (in principle) be no harder to raise or lower a spare-wheel if it is mid-mounted rather than rear-mounted.

 

[paul2]

Hi

If you are going to get a carrier that pulls out from the side you need to remember you do not choose where to get a puncture and you may be pulling out the carrier into the traffic or not have room due high kerb/verge. I found this out on a caravan many years ago!

 

Paul

[Barcobird]

paul2 - 2019-06-04 9:54 AM

 

Hi

If you are going to get a carrier that pulls out from the side you need to remember you do not choose where to get a puncture and you may be pulling out the carrier into the traffic or not have room due high kerb/verge. I found this out on a caravan many years ago!

 

Paul

Thanks Paul, already thought about that one (lol)

 

The only place it can go is in line with the step so it would have to pull out the other side. However as a uk registered vehicle this might be deemed illegal ( diligent mot tester) but as it’s LHD it might not be *-)

[tonyishuk]

My only experience with an Alko spare wheel carrier and puncture on our twin axle caravan was a saga of disaster.

 

As mentioned before, the business of extracting the carrier was a problem because of its length, the caravan had to raised on a jack to get clearance to get the carrier and wheel out. Getting close up and personal with a sticking wheel carrier on a wobbling jacked up caravan proved to much for me, I put the punctured tyre back on, prayed the second tyre would hold enough to take the strain of a few miles to a bigger lay-by then called for help from the professionals.

 

The professionals said "sod that" or words to that effect , and the caravan ended up on a low loader taken to garage that sorted the puncture, carrier and bank balance out!

 

Rgds !

[Barcobird]

Robbo - 2019-06-03 5:49 PM

 

A guy (Techno) on Motorhomes Fun forum built a screw down system, located between front and rear axles on his Rapido with AL-CO chassis. The depth of the 16" wheel is contained within the depth of the chassis.

 

This thread may be of interest https://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/forum/threads/alko-diy-wheel-carrier.63164/

 

Still debating which way to go *-)

 

With reference to this idea I seem to recollect there was a recall on the winding system. As this would be purchased secondhand or new secondhand how can I determine wether it is one of the faulty items ?

[Derek Uzzell]

This 2018 forum thread relates to the spare-wheel ‘winch’ mechanism

 

https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Ducato-2009-Spare-wheel-removal-tool-problem/50308/

 

Apparently the revised mechanism requires a 5-sided tool to operate the winch, whereas the earlier mechanism required a 6-sided tool (photos on above link).

 

Best of luck. I’m a fairly competent DIYer and reasonably mechanically fearless, but I wouldn’t consider trying to 'mid-mount' a spare wheel retrospectively. If I was absolutely desperate to reduce rearwards weight on a motorhome that carried a spare-wheel in its rear garage, I’d dispense with the spare-wheel altogther (and its in-garage mount) rather than what you are contemplating doing. If you want some degree of puncture ‘protection’, carry the tyre without the wheel in the garage and (if it’s practicable) store the wheel somewhere forwards within the motorhome’s habitation area.

[Barcobird]

to conclude this thread, I went down the fabrication route.

[Derek Uzzell]

Looks well engineered.

 

May I ask if that was a DIY exercise or done professionally, please?

[Barcobird]

Derek Uzzell - 2020-06-21 9:03 AM

 

Looks well engineered.

 

May I ask if that was a DIY exercise or done professionally, please?

 

Did it all myself except for a bit of welding :-D

 

It has since been through its mot and they were quite happy with it.

[Derek Uzzell]

Well done - I notice you ovecame your June 2019 concern over 'underslung’ spare wheels falling off ;-)

 

(I did see that happen 30 or so years ago. I was driving at dusk near Gloucester and a spare wheel dropped off a small Renault car approaching on the opposite carriageway. Fortunately the road was straight and the wheel stayed flat, skidding along in a shower of sparks.)