Ketvrin Posted November 30, 2018 Share Posted November 30, 2018 When the wee blue button is pressed, nothing happens. Flush tank is full, waste cassette is empty. Fuse in cassette storage area is OK. There's no load appearing on the CBE control panel so I am sure there is no power to the switch... Any ideas? Another fuse? The switch itself? The van and so the toilet has not been regularly used for some months Any and all advice appreciated Thanks K Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alanb Posted November 30, 2018 Share Posted November 30, 2018 Hi. May I suggest that you consider the submersible pump, if your version is so equipped. This would be applicable to C402 C/X. If your system draws water from its own flushing water tank it will have a pump, if on the other hand it draws its flushing water tank, than it will have an electrically operated valve. Either could be the cause of your problem. Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 Ketvrin - 2018-11-30 6:46 PM The van and so the toilet has not been regularly used for some months We had that happen once when we left the van in storage for months, took it for a run and it started working again.......Electrics are like that some times ;-) ....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbo Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 I had a C400 (bench style toilet) in a 2002 van. It stopped flushing. I eventually tracked it down to a fractured electrical wire where the mechanism rotates to open and close the blade type valve. The mechanism is on the underside of the cassette enclosure. The electrical wiring (incorporating a reed switch) on the rotating mechanism, prevented the flush from working when the cassette was removed. Hopefully, in later versions of the C400, they've improved the design. The later Thetford models appear to have a sensing device at the back of the cassette enclosure to detect when the cassette has been removed, which prevents operation of the flush. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keithl Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 Ketvrin - 2018-11-30 6:46 PM Fuse in cassette storage area is OK. K The fuse may 'look' OK but is there 12 V at both ends of it? Keith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 Ketvrin Because it has its own integrated flush-water reservoir, your Thetford toilet will be a C-402 model. A ‘won’t flush’ problem with a C-402 was discussed in this Practical Motorhome forum thread https://www.practicalmotorhome.com/forum/tech/2372-flat-battery and some links that might be helpful were provided in that thread’s final posting. It should be quite simple to establish whether or not 12V power is present at the operating button and that’s clearly the 1st step to take. (I assume (as Keith has said) that you’ve confirmed that the fuse in the toilet’s cassette locker actually provides continuity, rather than just checked it visually?) If there's 12V power at the operating button, then (as Alanb advises) inspect the water-pump in the toilet’s flush-water tank and check that the pump’s impeller has not jammed. I’m not sure if there being 'no load’ showing on the CBE control-panel proves much (presumably when the toilet’s operating button is pressed). As your motorhome has a CBE control-panel, it probably also has a CBE Distribution Box and - if that’s the case - there will be a fuse on the Distribution Box for the vehicle’s water-pump, and it’s common practice for the fuse for the water-pump 12V power supply to also protect the 12V supply to the toilet. (It should be obvious if your motorhome’s main water-pump is operative or not.) I think your motorhome is an IH Motorhomes model, but it might help if you provided more details. https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/IDENTIFYING-YOUR-MOTORHOME/50765/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ketvrin Posted December 1, 2018 Author Share Posted December 1, 2018 Thanks for your suggestions and links... I had a similar problem on my previous IH and it turned out to be the pump was seized, which was freed up temporarily until I got a replacement. I have just bought this van, another IH and it had been standing for a while and I had noted that the flush did not work when I bought it ( at a very good price, privately). So, I followed the link you provided Derek, thanks and could see how to access the pump ( the previous, earlier one was below the toilet roll holder but this one is below the switch itself). The pump was seized solid and took a while with penetrant oil and wd40 to free up, but it did eventually, so all is well now. Well not quite, I now bought a replacement pump and will fit it Asap but only after cleaning out the flush tank of all the black sludgy grunge that is in there. It's probably that stuff that has blocked the pump. Any suggestions on what I can add to the flush water to dissolve the gunge? I don't want it blocking the new pump up too. Thanks again K ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alanb Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 My PVC is an IH 2006 conversion, and is fitted with a CBE DS520AN distribution board. I do not know how consistent IH are with their wiring practices, and I have found it necessary to correct some obvious errors, such as the Truma combi unit not being supplied via the correct fuse. In case it is of any help, on my vehicle, the toilet flushing is connected to connector 20 pin 5 (20/5) with a blue/brown wire. The fridge control supply is connected to 20/6, blue/green wire, and the toilet extractor fan to 20/8, grey/blue wire. Incorrectly a 12V socket was connected to 20/9. (Pin 7 is not allocated) All of the above functions are fed by CBE fuse 10, designated as 3A, and increased to 7.5A, which eventually blew, due to the 12V socket load, which has been moved, and the fuse reduced to 5A. These outlets from the DS520 are permanently live, as may be deduced by the inclusion of the fridge control supply. I have experimented with the PC200 current indication in this context. The current display is not dynamic, in that it does not update after it is selected. This endorses what Derek has suggested. If you wish to check the the toilet current, you will have to select the current indication before and then again while the toilet flush button is pressed. A coordinated two person task, and not a good practice to hold the button pressed, if the pump motor is stalled. Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 K See “I get black bits in my flush water, what can I do?” in FAQ section here https://www.thetford-europe.com/international/en-001/products/toilet-care-products/waste-holding-tank-products/cassette-tank-cleaner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ketvrin Posted December 1, 2018 Author Share Posted December 1, 2018 Derek Uzzell - 2018-12-01 2:50 PM K See “I get black bits in my flush water, what can I do?” in FAQ section here https://www.thetford-europe.com/international/en-001/products/toilet-care-products/waste-holding-tank-products/cassette-tank-cleaner Thanks again Derek, fluid ordered. K ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ketvrin Posted December 1, 2018 Author Share Posted December 1, 2018 Alanb - 2018-12-01 2:39 PM My PVC is an IH 2006 conversion, and is fitted with a CBE DS520AN distribution board. I do not know how consistent IH are with their wiring practices, and I have found it necessary to correct some obvious errors, such as the Truma combi unit not being supplied via the correct fuse. In case it is of any help, on my vehicle, the toilet flushing is connected to connector 20 pin 5 (20/5) with a blue/brown wire. The fridge control supply is connected to 20/6, blue/green wire, and the toilet extractor fan to 20/8, grey/blue wire. Incorrectly a 12V socket was connected to 20/9. (Pin 7 is not allocated) All of the above functions are fed by CBE fuse 10, designated as 3A, and increased to 7.5A, which eventually blew, due to the 12V socket load, which has been moved, and the fuse reduced to 5A. These outlets from the DS520 are permanently live, as may be deduced by the inclusion of the fridge control supply. I have experimented with the PC200 current indication in this context. The current display is not dynamic, in that it does not update after it is selected. This endorses what Derek has suggested. If you wish to check the the toilet current, you will have to select the current indication before and then again while the toilet flush button is pressed. A coordinated two person task, and not a good practice to hold the button pressed, if the pump motor is stalled. Alan Cheers Alan, yes I checked the shared fuse and it was fine, as was the 3 amp fuse in the cassette storage area. I had previously just looked at it (as it was lashing down with rain at the time) but decided to replace it anyway. As you can read above the problem is now diagnosed as a seized pump. I have freed it for now and ordered a new replacement, which I will fit after I can clean the flush tank of the gunge which likely seized the first pump. Thanks for your input, so far I have not found a problem with IH wiring, fingers crossed. K ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monique.hubrechtsgm Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 Thank you all.Have the one whit its own pump on my van. Very strong flush and practical. Very nice looking toilet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monique.hubrechtsgm Posted December 2, 2018 Share Posted December 2, 2018 Correction not sure about the pump. Converter was rapido on my van. I am half way of it checking. But all looks fine. Incredible fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted December 3, 2018 Share Posted December 3, 2018 Monique My understanding is that your Westfalia motorhome was produced in France at Fleurette’s factory at Benêt in the Vendée, not by Rapido at its factory at Mayenne. (OK, I am aware that Fleurette is part of the Rapido Group, but Fleurette is the Westfalia converter not Rapido.) It is a simple matter to tell the difference between a Thetfoird C402 toilet that has its own flush-water tank and its own water-pump, and the C403 model that flushes using water delivered from the motorhome’s main fresh-water tank by the motorhome’s onboard water pump. The 1st attached photo is of a C402 and the swing-out water-filler will be apparent at the top of the photo directly above the cassette’s emptying ‘elbow'. A water-level sight-tube will be seen on the left of the photo. The 2nd attached photo is of a C403 and it will be obvious that there is no swing-out water-filler and no sight-tube as neither of these items is necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceM Posted December 3, 2018 Share Posted December 3, 2018 What’s the rational behind having a separate flush water supply for the toilet? On the face of it it strikes me a over engineering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alanb Posted December 3, 2018 Share Posted December 3, 2018 BruceM - 2018-12-03 12:18 PM What’s the rational behind having a separate flush water supply for the toilet? On the face of it it strikes me a over engineering. 1. No need to make a connection to the MH water supply. 2. No possibility of polluting main water supply, and able to add "the pink stuff", if so desired. 3 Additional water carrying capacity. My previous MH had a 100L water tank, which also supplied the toilet However on the current PVC, water tank capacity is only 67L, so the integral flushing tank has its benefits, despite needing filling separately. Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted December 3, 2018 Share Posted December 3, 2018 Another potential advantage is that a motorhome’s main water system can be completely drained down to protect against frost damage, but a toilet with its own flush-water supply can still be kept operative with not much effort. The downside is that some Thetford toilets with their own flush-water reservoir have proven to be difficult to drain down fully and have become frost-damaged as a consequence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monique.hubrechtsgm Posted December 3, 2018 Share Posted December 3, 2018 Excellent Alanb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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