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Change Alternator
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userham
Posted: 8 April 2017 7:20 AM
Subject: Change Alternator
 
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Any one changed their alternator on a Ducato 2007?
, I've heard you have to remove the front body to get at the fixing bolts of the Alternator
userRobbo
Posted: 8 April 2017 8:36 AM
Subject: RE: Change Alternator
 
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Location: West Sussex - 2010 Carthago Chic, Fiat 3.0 litre


On my 3 litre Fiat Ducato X250 the alternator is mounted on the rear of the engine.

Perhaps the smaller engines have the alternator mounted at the front?

I know on my Ducato X244 (2.8 litre engine) it was mounted on the front. The X244 was discontinued mid 2006.

Suggest you confirm Ducato model type and engine size.
userAlanb
Posted: 8 April 2017 12:55 PM
Subject: RE: Change Alternator
 
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That is interesting, as on my X244 2.8 JTD the alternator is mounted at the RHS rear of the engine, that is to say, roughly under the driver's feet.

Ham,

This post is obviously related to your other thread relating to warning light and alternator output issues..

Before blaming the alternator, you would be well advised to investigate the issue of drive belt slipping/tension raised by me, and that of possible damage to vehicle wiring, which was raised by Witzend.

Both of our posts are based on personal experience, but I should add that my experience did not relate to a Ducato.

Further in the past when I did suspect an intermittant alternator alternator fault, and paid out good money to have it reconditioned, I was wrong. I eventually located and replaced a faulty radiator fan thermostat.

The decision, and expense, are of course yours.

Alan
userRobbo
Posted: 8 April 2017 1:59 PM
Subject: RE: Change Alternator
 
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Location: West Sussex - 2010 Carthago Chic, Fiat 3.0 litre


Alanb - 2017-04-08 12:55 PM

That is interesting, as on my X244 2.8 JTD the alternator is mounted at the RHS rear of the engine, that is to say, roughly under the driver's feet.


Alan, undoubtedly you are correct.

When I had my alternator replaced in Germany (2002 Ducato), I seem to recollect the alternator being mounted on the front RHS when I inspected the work being carried out whilst raised on a hoist.

It was a long time ago and I can't imagine later versions of the 2.8 JTD would have changed. So, I capitulate to your view that the alternator is mounted on the rear of the engine RHS.

userRobbo
Posted: 8 April 2017 2:37 PM
Subject: RE: Change Alternator
 
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Location: West Sussex - 2010 Carthago Chic, Fiat 3.0 litre


As suggested by Alanb, it would be worth carrying out further tests before replacing the alternator.

A simple test to check the functioning of the alternator would be to connect a jumper lead to the B+ terminal of the alternator to a multimeter set to volts. The neg lead of the multimeter connected to an earth point on the engine. The alternator output should show 14.4 volts.

I'm no electrical expert but Allan of aandncaravans has helped me gain a smidgen of knowledge (dangerous I know !!!).
userham
Posted: 9 April 2017 8:53 AM
Subject: RE: Change Alternator
 
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Thanks every one.Ihave changed and added earth straps,Can't see any wiring damage , I have tested the out put from the alternator.and there is now nothing .I suspect the regulators are faulty.I have now booked a local Garage to have a look. AT 70 it's time to pay out once in a while. Thanks again Oh yes the alternator is TH side rear of engine.
userAlanb
Posted: 9 April 2017 11:36 AM
Subject: RE: Change Alternator
 
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From my perspective 70 is young! However I do agree that there are times when it is easier to pay for the work required.

In the interests of the Forum, please post the final outcome.

Alan
userham
Posted: 9 April 2017 12:43 PM
Subject: RE: Change Alternator
 
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Yes I will . If I had access to a pit probally would have done it myself Same finding a garage that has a lift Most small garages around my location don't so its usually a trip to Cardiff.
userAirstream
Posted: 9 April 2017 4:35 PM
Subject: RE: Change Alternator
 
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Hi,
It is a good bet that the fault is the regulator,brush pack £15 and an hour to change with no need to remove the alternator and yes I am 70 years old
Put the van on the leveling ramps to access the lower screws and cables few screws and two nuts fit new reg unit in place replace screws and cables job done
RAC guy said I needed new alternator and quoted £400 at the approved garage he would tow me to
I declined and reverted to Google and discovered that 99% of this problem is the brush pack and the trade make a few bob replacing alternators and then reselling the old unit with a new brush pack

Good videos on YouTube showing how to do the brush pack replacement

Ray






useraandncaravan
Posted: 9 April 2017 7:15 PM
Subject: RE: Change Alternator
 
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We used to rebuild both Starter Motors and Alternators and for the majority of younger Cars and Vans the regulator or rectifier was the issue.
On higher mileage Cars and Vans add to that Brushes and sometimes Bearing issues as well.

However, most of the failures on Motorhomes were almost always regulator/rectifier failure and almost always related to overload by either over large battery banks, rubbish habitation batteries or both.

We did see two Motorhome Alternators with burnt coils. Never seen that with a Car or van generator.

Because Motorhomes tend to do much lower mileages than Vans, Cars or Lorries, rarely do the Brush pack or bearings get enough wear, just very high current draw.

Exception to that might be a Motorhome driven long distance in somewhere like Morocco where Sand gets into everything and abrades everything.


I would suggest that, if the bearings are ok, that you get the Garage to replace both Rectifier and Voltage regulator, even if one is good?
The typical Motorhome, especially if more than one battery is fitted or one that has been running below par habitation batteries, really stresses these two components.

It is easier for the Garage to fit a cheap new Lithuanian Alternator than rebuild your old one so they might push this option, but they are not in the same league as the original fit Alternator.
Even a rebuilt Alternator with high mileage on it will usually outlast one of these cheap units.
A proper new Bosch unit is a good option but much more pricy than the copies.

Whatever you do, look really carefully at your habitation battery bank, as it is almost always the reason it died and the rebuilt unit will go the same way really quickly if you don't resolve it.



Edited by aandncaravan 2017-04-09 7:44 PM




(Alternator bits small.jpg)



Attachments
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Attachments Alternator bits small.jpg (62KB - 154 downloads)
userham
Posted: 9 April 2017 8:18 PM
Subject: RE: Change Alternator
 
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Thanks for the replies.all very interesting reading.
userham
Posted: 10 April 2017 11:28 AM
Subject: RE: Change Alternator
 
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Got to garage this morning . they put van on lift checked earths all ok . on checking the alternator they showed me there was no out from the alternator. So its a new Bosch alternator and fitting £385 with vat
userham
Posted: 10 April 2017 11:28 AM
Subject: RE: Change Alternator
 
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Got to garage this morning . they put van on lift checked earths all ok . on checking the alternator they showed me there was no out from the alternator. So its a new Bosch alternator and fitting £385 with vat
userAirstream
Posted: 10 April 2017 3:12 PM
Subject: RE: Change Alternator
 
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That's what they all say ie you need a new alternator

Have they tried a new brush pack, no chance , one hour labour and a 15 quid brush pack is probably all that's needed

Make sure they give you the alternator then fit a new brush pack or take it to an auto electrical firm who specialise in alternators who will try a brush pack firest keep as a sprare

Google is fully of tales re this type of scam on these alternators and ebay awash with folk selling brush packs

Good luck

Ray


userham
Posted: 10 April 2017 7:41 PM
Subject: RE: Change Alternator
 
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When we checked the alternator we got no output at all . so Mike the garage owner said give me an hour and I will remove it and we can test it on the bench. So when I called back there it was on the bench with the guy who repairs alternators from the unit next door . He laughed when he saw me as we did our electrical fitting apprenticeship together back in the 60s. so after a good chat . we agreed regulator / diodes all ok so lets have a complete new alternator .
If my family had not sold our Bus business and garage, I would have had the pit and lift to do the job my self but under a van on the road no thank you.
userjohnnyNorwich
Posted: 6 January 2019 12:26 PM
Subject: RE: Change Alternator
 


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Location: Norwich, Norfolk


Hi again Folks
I’d like to add my own story to this old thread, to perhaps assist someone else in the future?

Recently our Ducato [2009 2.3 JTD] has exhibited a high tickover irregularity, (1200 rather than the usual 800), with the battery light then coming on, and the voltage in the cab battery gradually but steadily dropping off. After some research, I was hoping the fault would be another (well documented) corroded engine earth strap, so I decided to fit an additional strap as a precaution, however after doing this, the above symptoms still remained.

Further checks with a multimeter (from the positive jump-start terminal under the bonnet to chassis and/or engine) both consistently gave 12.5v with the engine running, indicating no DC output from the alternator.

With dismay, I noted that a new Lucas alternator is currently £430 from ECP, and due to its location on my engine (underneath the drivers feet) is extremely inaccessible, and its removal requires partial disassembly of the exhaust and perhaps also the O/S drive shaft? Reassembly looks even trickier, involving re-fitting the belt & tensioner etc.
In short, any Alternator removal job looked like a real pain.

Finding this thread, I was encouraged by Airstreams (and others) comments, that the most common cause of this fault is with the voltage regulator, which “simply” (ha ha) bolts onto the back of the alternator, and on some variants can be changed in situ?
Spurred on, I thought I would take a chance, and ordered one online from a northern motor factor.
It arrived the next-day, and cost a modest £18.69 including vat and P+P.

Yesterday, I spent an interesting three hours under the van (mostly turning the air blue).
Access to the rear of the alternator in-situ on our van is very tight, and the component swap-over job (although possible) was slow and painstaking. The most important tool required is a 90 degree PZ2 screwdriver (I used a PZ2 bit in a 3/8 ratchet adaptor).
However, I’m pleased to say that (in my case) the new regulator has cured the fault.
I’m now getting 14.4v across the starter battery, tickover is back to normal, and the battery light no longer stays on.
For now the fault has been cured, and I celebrated with tea and biscuits.
One compressed photo attached.
Cheers J.N




Edited by johnnyNorwich 2019-01-06 12:39 PM




(MX0 Ducato 23 JTD Alternator view VERY SMALL.jpg)



Attachments
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Attachments MX0 Ducato 23 JTD Alternator view VERY SMALL.jpg (38KB - 20 downloads)
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