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Cost of running blown air heating from ELH


Axholme Wanderer

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Good Morning,

 

I'm enquiring if anyone has costed out running a blown air heating system from home ELH if the beast from the east or any of its mates return and temperatures plummet, is it worth the exercise ? do the dealers bother with the empty motorhomes left on their forecourts over winter, as they must be an indicator of what I should do.

This is our first winter as owners and so a little nervous Thanks

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The Motorhomes heating system has a finite life, and when it's time for replacements/maintenance the cost is high, blower motors or water pumps can be hundreds to get replaced. Boiler costs can be 3 or 4 times that.

 

A £12 generic 230v Fan heater from Argos is peanuts by comparison, so rather than wear out the motorhome/Caravans own heating components, treat the generic Fan heater as disposable.

The electricity cost is similar, or maybe slightly cheaper for the Fan heater option.

Set the thermostat at about 5 degrees Celsius, you don't need it warm, just above freezing is fine if you ventilate it well.

 

Don't buy a 'Still Air' heater, like a an Oil filled radiator, as you want something that not only gets warmth into the vehicles corners, but circulates the air to reduce the risk of condensation in those 'pockets' of cold. The more air movement the better.

 

Drain down all the water and leave all the taps open.

Very important to leave the taps open, even if you think there is no water remaining in the system.

 

Leave open all the blinds, including the roof as you want as much Sun solar gain inside the vehicle as you can get. This helps warm the van and reduce Black Mould.

 

Leave all the cupboards slightly ajar and pull the seat cushions away from the wall slightly to allow air to circulate up the cold walls.

Put the cushions from the Backs upside down on top of the Seat cushions, again in such a way that air circulates, as this stops Solar fade of the fabrics.

 

When people talk about leaving the cupboards open, this includes those at foot level as well.

 

Turn off the mains charger and put it back on about every 3 weeks, or whatever is required to keep the battery above 12.6v.

 

 

Dealers don't heat vans but they do leave all the Blinds open to let in as much Sun as possible during the day, this makes a big difference.

 

 

If you have a wet heating system like the Alde, remember to run the heating every month or so in Winter for about 10 minutes to stop the pump, and other components, from 'sticking'.

It needs the same sort of care as a Cars Air Con in Winter.

 

 

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Anyone used their Alde heating system set a at a low level to keep temperatures from dropping to the low zones? "Assumption" the motorhome stays hooked up to the mains. Pros and Cons?

 

Ah yes the mice. Read a useless article where the motorhome magazine said you should take active measures against such incursions without one salient example. Best ideas (cos I have this problem - the mice)??

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Since heating the interior of the van just increases the ability of the air to hold more moisture and therefore increase the risk of condensation unless you can guarantee to keep it heated consistently, I never bother with heating and just ensure that the van is adequately ventilated.
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Last Christmas - our hot water supply failed in our house, - the Pressure return valve broke, fortunately we had heating as it's on a different circuit. - It took several days for the plumber to get the part and schedule to fit it.

 

To combat this - we parked our motorhome outside our house, - it was pretty cold outside, we plugged it into our Hookup and left the heating and hot water on so we could shower in comfort and left it that way for several days.

 

In the house we have a Smart Meter, it really did ramp up our electricity usage over the period, I've never seen us use so much over a prolonged period of several days. It certainly impacted our bills in a bad way.

Fortunately repairs where made and the van was returned to it's store.

 

Generally we follow the good advice in the previous thread, opening cupboards, fridge on the latch etc, while the van is in store there is no hook-up so we leave the heating off, Generally I close the blinds, don't want anyone looking in although I can see the point of leaving them open to collect whatever heat can be had from the environment in winter.

 

I have a max - min thermometer in the van - Our record for the internal area was -8.5 last winter and 45.2 degrees in the height of summer. - The water was carefully drained, all the taps open, etc and no problems at all seem to have resulted, the van wasn't damp, it was cold, - as verified by a thorough habitation check later in the year.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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The heater in our van is 2Kw and our charge for gas is 2.622p/kWh so it will cost 2.622p/hour. The heater can be run at 2kw, 1kw or 0.5kw so if you ran it at the lowest setting to take the chill off it would cost 0.66p/hour or about £1/week if it was running constantly. I would not think about running the heater for this length of time for the reasons already given.
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Don636 - 2018-11-14 1:39 PM

 

The heater in our van is 2Kw and our charge for gas is 2.622p/kWh so...

 

BUT, the heater would be running on electricity which likely costs over 10 p/kWh so very different running cost per week!

 

Running at 0.5 kW and assuming on 24/7 then cost (@10 p/kWh) would be:

 

0.5 x 10 x 24 x 7 = £8.40 per week

 

I run an oil filled radiator through a frost stat set at 5 °C so it only comes on when temp falls significantly.

 

PS Using a time clock for a heater is IMO a waste of time as the time clock doesn't know when it's hot or cold outside!

 

PPS And I agree entirely with Allan, the built in heater will have a finite life and cost a lot to repair/replace. Stand alone heaters are cheap and throw away by comparison. Save your built in heater for when you really need it.

 

Keith.

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curdle - 2018-11-14 12:19 PM  Ah yes the mice. Read a useless article where the motorhome magazine said you should take active measures against such incursions without one salient example. Best ideas (cos I have this problem - the mice)??

 

This sounds silly but.... If you have mice in the van then they've got in somewhere - probably underneath. 
Why have they come in?
a) because you've left an attractant (food) in the van
b) to find a warm safe place to live
Preventing the problem is therefore obvious:-
Block all ingress holes and gaps with wire wool or a 1/4" weldmesh - (a squirt of fill and fix foam will keep it in place.)
Don't leave any attractant in your vehicle - and this includes mouse bait or traps with bait on them!

If you already have mice in then break back traps are best - don't use cheese, use chocolate or raisins/sultanas or even better smear peanut butter over the bait holder of the trap. (Mice actually are not particularly attracted to cheese) 

Don't place the trap in the middle of the floor or cupboard, place it along a wall or panel. (Mice are usually nocturnal and move by touch using their whiskers and specialised guard hairs along their sides - their eyesight is very poor.)

Never use the so called "humane" traps. They are technically illegal if you don't monitor them twice a day. If you do catch a mouse in one you are legally obliged to kill it, it is illegal to release them. Most people who use these never check them and the animal dies a long painful death from starvation - and allowing that is also illegal!

Check your break back traps regularly to remove the dead mice if any before they start to pong

You will be given all sorts of silly advice and old wives tales, but them's the facts!
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Hi Jeremy

 

No food at all, just a roll of plastic bin liners which had been chewed and fluffed as a nest, fortunately with no offspring within. I removed the liners of course but wonder if they will start on the mattress or cushions. I do not live in the UK, so can only check every few months on my stored MH. at loss to see where they enter.

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Deneb - 2018-11-14 1:31 PM

 

Since heating the interior of the van just increases the ability of the air to hold more moisture and therefore increase the risk of condensation unless you can guarantee to keep it heated consistently, I never bother with heating and just ensure that the van is adequately ventilated.

 

 

We agree with you that using electricity to heat the van is usually not beneficial, which is why we say that if you must heat it, set the Fan heater to no more than 5 degrees,

 

 

Using the Solar day to warm the van is very different to heating a vehicle continuously, because it produces significant temperature differentials.

 

During a sunny day in Decemebr a motorhome interior can warm significantly. This air takes up any moisture in the vehicle.

Late afternoon the temperature outside drops significantly and fast creating a temperature 'pressure differential' where the warm air wants to rise and the very cold, dense external air wants to drop.

 

What then happens is the warm air rises and goes out the roof vents, provided the blinds are open, and it is replaced by cold dense air coming in from outside through lower level vents.

This Cold dense air will have lost all it's moisture which condenses as Dew on cold vehicles, etc. so is very 'dry'.

 

The next sunny day the cold dense air warms and sucks up any moisture left in the vehicle, taking it out through the roof, etc, etc.

 

Warm sunny days are usually followed by very cold afternoons/nights because the lack of cloud that gave the sunny day, also ensures the temperature drops very quickly and very low.

 

It's nature working for you, you just need to let in that Sun, just like the Dealers do.

 

 

 

 

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curdle - 2018-11-14 2:03 PMHi JeremyNo food at all, just a roll of plastic bin liners which had been chewed and fluffed as a nest, fortunately with no offspring within. I removed the liners of course but wonder if they will start on the mattress or cushions. I do not live in the UK, so can only check every few months on my stored MH. at loss to see where they enter.
In that case I would use half a dozen or more break back traps as described with just a smear of peanut butter on the bait holder. (USE more traps than you think you need - once sprung they are useless!)

 If the mice are still currently in, they will shred anything to make a nest. Their teeth are continually growing g and they keep them short by chewing things like plastic/wood/etc. When looking for entry points you have to think small. If you can slide a pencil into a gap, an adult mouse will be able to get through it. They can flatten their skulls to squeeze through. Round holes under about 15 mm are therefore OK and don't need blocking. 
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laimeduck - 2018-11-14 1:49 PM ... If you have mice in the van then they've got in somewhere - probably underneath. 
Why have they come in?
a) because you've left an attractant (food) in the van
b) to find a warm safe place to live
Preventing the problem is therefore obvious:-
Block all ingress holes and gaps with wire wool or a 1/4" weldmesh - (a squirt of fill and fix foam will keep it in place.)
Don't leave any attractant in your vehicle - and this includes mouse bait or traps with bait on them!...

Motorhomes are riddled with floor-level openings and mice can get in via the smallest of holes - anything big enough to poke a pencil into is big enough to allow a mouse through.  I can't see it being practical to prevent mice getting in if they want to.  It is enough for a mouse that a MH is a drier and less windy shelter from what's outside, even if it isn't heated.  Hence I  favour setting mouse traps (the Little Nipper" type, baited with chocolate raisins) and I don't bother heating at all.

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I can remember the worries associated with my first winter with the van. Fortunately the van was stored on a farm with no EHU and I doubt solar panels were invented for motorhomes. I didn't heat the van in the first winter and I haven't since unless I am staying in it. I agree with Deneb that heating a van may increase condensation.

 

If the van is on the drive or within easy reach, I suggest you check inside once a week at first to ensure everything is OK.

 

It's good to use the van during the winter even if it is just for the occasional day out.

 

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You are right of course Keith, what a wally I am! I was running some calculations yesterday comparing the cost of running the central heating v a gas fire and had gas on the brain. Our electricity costs 12.53p/kWh which works out at £10.50/week.
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