FCO and travel to France

[hallii]

It seems that the FCO advice not to travel to France means that my Eurotunnel insurance offers no cover if I travel against that advice.

 

Quote from Eurotunnel Insurance site:- "COVID-19: We would like to highlight that travel insurance only protects against unforeseen circumstances and whilst the Foreign and Commonwealth Office advise against all but essential travel, you will not be covered under our travel insurance policies if you decide to go ahead with your trip."

 

Not just Covid cover but any and all cover.

 

So, without insurance cover for anything, ( I would happily accept no cover for Covid 19 in France, they seem to have it sorted) I cannot travel, so I wonder if I can get my money back. I think I will ask Eurotunnel.

 

I do hope that Mr Macron's and Boris's talks are not only about air travel and include ferry/tunnel travel as well.

 

I would feel very safe on my field, no neighbours to speak of, (unless cows get Covid-19) with a fortnightly trip to the local Lidl I could stay for months and wait out the inevitable second wave of Covid in the UK.

 

Fingers crossed they will agree something and I will be free to travel soon.

 

H

[weldted]

I must admit whilst I can see the FO point I fail to see where unrelated incidents are not covered? Obviously no cover for any Covid-19 cause, but it you have an accident, breakdown and miss your ferry get, robbed or lose your luggage, where is this affected by the virus. Before the righteous brigade start I understand that any event that brings you into contact with other people can put them and yourselves at risk, the insurance companies are not as far as I am aware offering partial refunds or extending your period of cover.

[paul2]

Hi

 

When I canceled by booking Eurotunnel gave me a credit voucher that has to be used for booking by next May travel may be later. As I used Tesco clubcard voucher to pay plus £6 it seamed fare to me.

 

Paul

[hallii]

Eurotunnel won't or can't answer! Just tell me to phone the insurance on the premium phone number. I will find a normal number and have another go.

 

H

[Agaric]

Many areas in France have had quite low levels of covid because of the bigger areas of agriculture compared to England, much less density of population, so in your field you would be pretty safe.

 

Whether those cows are safe, so far so good, but look at all those mink farms in Holland that had to destroy all their animals.

 

One of the questions for travel between Boris and Macron to clear the way may be the low level of testing in France so far, France has only tested just over 2% of the population where the UK it's just over 10%, this is one of the key cornerstones forward that the WHO has said is a must.

 

It's always been the case as soon as the FCO puts a country on its list of do not to travel to, all insurance is null and void. I know this as my sister a few years ago went to a country on said list and I hunted high and low to find any travel insurance for her.

[Derek Uzzell]

hallii - 2020-06-18 12:45 PM

 

Eurotunnel won't or can't answer! Just tell me to phone the insurance on the premium phone number. I will find a normal number and have another go.

 

H

 

On the “Which?” website there is a longish article entitled "Coronavirus: what it means for your travel insurance”.

 

https://www.which.co.uk/news/2020/06/coronavirus-what-it-means-for-your-travel-insurance/#cover

 

EuroTunnel’s website indicates that its travel insurance is provided via Allianz Assistance and the Which? article says

 

Eight more insurers would only cover you if you were making an essential trip. These are Allianz, Axa, Columbus Direct, Debenhams, Direct Travel, Flexicover, Nationwide and TopDog.

 

Allianz Assistance’s travel insurance webpage is here

 

https://www.allianz-assistance.co.uk/travel-insurance.html

 

and carries the following COVID-19 advice

 

We’d also like to highlight that travel insurance only protects against unforeseen circumstances getting in the way of your travel plans, so any policy you buy now will have very limited insurance coverage. While the Foreign and Commonwealth Office have advised against all but essential travel indefinitely, you will not be covered under our travel insurance policies if you decide to go ahead with your trip.

 

[BruceM]

Agaric - 2020-06-18 12:49 PM

One of the questions for travel between Boris and Macron to clear the way may be the low level of testing in France so far, France has only tested just over 2% of the population where the UK it's just over 10%,

 

I’m interested in your your 10% figure, where did you find it? According to the UK government as of 22nd May approx 2m people had been tested (so approx 3.25% of the population) . No further government figures have been issued since then ( source BBC https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51768274 ) .

[Agaric]

Testing numbers are here on a Government site updated from those old ones on the BBC. https://www.gov.uk/guidance/coronavirus-covid-19-information-for-the-public

 

These are updated every day by the Government

 

Global figures can also found here. https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

[BruceM]

I guess it comes down to how important the travel insurance is to you (I’m speaking as someone who has never bothered in the past and now has it accidently via my bank account).

 

For health treatment the E111 is still in force until the end of the year so we’ll continue to receive country equivalent free treatment until then. This means we’d have to bear some risk ourselves and self-insure any cost difference.

 

As for stuff that might get stolen, cancelled crossings etc – again, it’s a matter of self insuring the risk – which can always be mitigated by not carrying high value items.

 

As far as I can see, the key thing is to ensure that our fully comp European motor insurance remains valid (I’ve yet to check the T&Cs).

[BruceM]

Agaric - 2020-06-18 3:12 PM

 

Testing numbers are here on a Government site updated from those old ones on the BBC. https://www.gov.uk/guidance/coronavirus-covid-19-information-for-the-public

 

Thanks. I think the figure you used is the number of tests, not how many people have been tested. So for instance, when a relative of mine went for a test they took a nose and throat swab. That counted as two tests. Also, some people are subject to multiple tests. Apparently (and I’d like to see some factual confirmation) the figure also includes tests sent out but not returned. The cumulative government figure for people tested at Pillar1 (in hospital) is approx 1.6m . No figures are supplied for Pillar 2 (wider population). No idea why, but if anyone spots that information buried somewhere I’d be grateful to receive an alert.

[Will86]

I've been 'chosen' to take part in COVID 19 test study by Imperial Collège London, I will be sent a package with a swab for the nose and throat test, collected by a courier. l will post a comment when done.

[Derek Uzzell]

If it’s comparative data that are of interest, try this website

 

https://ourworldindata.org/coronavirus/country/france?country=FRA~GBR

[Bop]

BruceM - 2020-06-18 3:22 PM

 

As far as I can see, the key thing is to ensure that our fully comp European motor insurance remains valid (I’ve yet to check the T&Cs).

 

This may be of interest to you Bruce. It's an email response recieved today by a motorhome fun member from Comfort insurance:

 

"I asked Comfort Insurance if the van was covered if we travelled against FCO advice. Here is there response

 

With regards to your email, we would advise that we do not have any restrictions on our motorhome policy with regards to going against government advice so technically your policy will be valid. However, as stated in our policy wording, it is the customers responsibility to protect their asset so going against government advice could be concluded as not taking care of that asset".

[jumpstart]

Me too Will, just agreed to do it this morning. They are aiming for 700,000 to take part to test the test.

[Brian Kirby]

BruceM - 2020-06-18 3:22 PM

I guess it comes down to how important the travel insurance is to you (I’m speaking as someone who has never bothered in the past and now has it accidently via my bank account).

For health treatment the E111 is still in force until the end of the year so we’ll continue to receive country equivalent free treatment until then. This means we’d have to bear some risk ourselves and self-insure any cost difference...…………

Which is fine if you are happy to do that. However, the really expensive thing is repatriation and, if you had somehow been rendered unfit to travel in your van, that would be at your entire cost. Your only alternative to that would be to stay in your van, or take alternative temporary accommodation, until you were able to undertake the journey. Which, in turn, requires there to be two drivers. Which might be the available option would depend on the severity and nature of your illness/injury.

[BruceM]

Bop - 2020-06-18 4:10 PM

"I asked Comfort Insurance if the van was covered if we travelled against FCO advice. Here is there response

 

With regards to your email, we would advise that we do not have any restrictions on our motorhome policy with regards to going against government advice so technically your policy will be valid. However, as stated in our policy wording, it is the customers responsibility to protect their asset so going against government advice could be concluded as not taking care of that asset".

 

That caused me to laugh outloud. Must have been written by a Claims Handler.

[Deneb]

Will86 - 2020-06-18 4:03 PM

 

I've been 'chosen' to take part in COVID 19 test study by Imperial Collège London, I will be sent a package with a swab for the nose and throat test, collected by a courier. l will post a comment when done.

 

I've already been to Imperial College to undergo several tests and procedures related to Covid-19 antigen and antibody testing. The antigen swab test requires that swabs are taken from the tonsils or back of the throat if they have been removed, and from as far as comfortably possible within both nostrils. The samples are taken with a single swab and the four swabs comprise a single test. The swab stick is sealed in a single sample container for testing on completion of the swabs. There is no way that nostril and throat swabs taken for a single test sample would be separately counted as individual tests.

[breakaleg]

Just had my invitation to renew my red pennant annual multi trip insurance with the c&m c including both health and vehicle breakdown cover for £405.00 (pre existing conditions) it stated that it didn't include cover for covid 19.

So I won't bother with it this year.lol

Pete

[Bop]

Yes, it's a funny one for sure but my reading of Comfort's yes-no answer is that ultimately they appear to have an escape clause to avoid payment.

 

 

[Derek Uzzell]

Bop - 2020-06-18 4:10 PM

 

BruceM - 2020-06-18 3:22 PM

 

As far as I can see, the key thing is to ensure that our fully comp European motor insurance remains valid (I’ve yet to check the T&Cs).

 

This may be of interest to you Bruce. It's an email response recieved today by a motorhome fun member from Comfort insurance:

 

"I asked Comfort Insurance if the van was covered if we travelled against FCO advice. Here is there response

 

With regards to your email, we would advise that we do not have any restrictions on our motorhome policy with regards to going against government advice so technically your policy will be valid. However, as stated in our policy wording, it is the customers responsibility to protect their asset so going against government advice could be concluded as not taking care of that asset".

 

I assume your quote came from this MHFun thread

 

https://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/forum/threads/nationwide-won%E2%80%99t-cover-eu-travel.221343/

 

(The relevant posting in that thread in which the Comfort Insurance-related statement appears was evidently copied from another (long) MHFun discussion ("Guinea Pig Eurotunnel”) that appears to have some sort of Administrator/Moderator block on it.)

 

In my view, asking an insurance provider about the potential effects on a VEHICLE insurance policy of travelling abroad contrary to FCO advice deserves exactly the answer that Comfort Insurance gave.

 

I can’t find anything in my Comfort Insurance MOTORHOME policy’s wording that matches the “... it is the customers responsibility to protect their asset..” statement, but I can well imagine that if a vehicle owner’s wilful stupidity or carelessness (say, by carrying out a ridiculously ill-advised DIY task or failing to have an obligatory MOT-test done) provoked an accident, the insurer might well contest a claim.

 

In the event of a vehicle being taken abroad for ‘non essential’ purposes when the FCO is advising against this and an accident occurring abroad, it could be argued that - if the FCO’s advice had been followed - obviously that accident could not have taken place. Plainly the driver of the vehicle, by deliberately ignoring the FCO’s advice, contributed to the accident so must be considered blameworthy. I’m not sure that view would hold up in Court, but if I were an insurer I’d definitely try it.

[Deneb]

As I understand it, there is a history of stated case law which concludes that an insured person is free to act in any way that he perceives to be in his best interest, but it does not follow that an insurer is necessarily liable to cover any or all losses sustained as a result.

 

An insured is required to act reasonably. Whether he has done so is a matter of fact, not law.

 

So the test would likely be "Is it reasonable for a person to have travelled to a foreign country for a holiday at a time when he has been advised by his government that he should not travel abroad other than for essential purposes?"

 

I can't see an insurer being able to avoid covering any third party damages in those circumstances, but they may well be able to avoid compensating the insured for any losses to himself or his own property as a result.