Brian Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 An A/S Symbol I am looking at has a Heki roof light. I have not yet had a test drive but the owner said that there was a 'whistle' from the roof light when the van was driven at speed. Does anyone else have experience of this? A/S say they recommend winding the handle an extra half turn to seal the roof light. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peter lambert Posted October 24, 2008 Share Posted October 24, 2008 Brian, that is one answer. Another is to fix a wind deflector in front of the Heki. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 I had a feeling Auto-Sleepers usually fitted as standard some sort of deflector in front of big roof-lights. If the Heki roof-light is raised and lowered by a winding-handle, then it's likely to be a Heki 3. These come with or without 'permanent ventilation', the difference being in the number of seals used. If the extra half-turn method doesn't silence the whistling noise (and one might well think that the vehicle's present owner will have tried this obvious ploy by now), then it would be worth checking whether a full complement of seals are fitted. There is a need for motorhomes to have adequate internal ventilation, but some manufacturers tend to go over the top providing it, particularly when large roof-lights are part of the specification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel E Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 There are three basic sizes of Dometic Seitz Heki Rooflight - Mini, Midi and the large Heki 1, 2 ,3 and 4 series. The Minis come in two forms - with and without ventilation. Do NOT get the with ventilation model as it is draughty (even when completely closed) when driving and the closed concertina blind rattles awfully in anything but no breeze at all. The purpose of the ventilation is to ensure an adequate air supply for any gas heater and for you to breathe. The Midi, if that is what you have, is fine and noisless. Some of the larger Hekis (heki 2 and 3) are designed for fitting to caravans since noise during travelling is not an issue and they are speed limited to a mx of 60mph anyway. It is likely that you have one of these as they are considerably cheaper. For a motorhome you need a Heki 1, Heki 3Plus or Heki 4Plus. According to the Dometic brochure, all three of these models are supposed to have a 'robust locking mechanism'. If you check which model you have we'll be able to help you better. Mel E ==== Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 Mel E: Not strictly accurate regarding Heki 3. Heki 3 was produced with motorhomes OR caravans in mind and fell, in weight and price, between the very heavy and expensive Heki 1 that was aimed primarily at the motorhome market and the light, cheap (and rattly) Heki 2 - intended for caravans but sadly often fitted to motorhomes. Heki 4 was essentially a tarted up version of Heki 3 with remote electric operation, rain sensor and in-built lighting. It would appear from Dometic's website that Heki 3 and Heki 4 have now been re-named as Heki 3 Plus and Heki 4 Plus to reflect recent improvements (eg. a pleated fly-net) to the original designs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted October 25, 2008 Share Posted October 25, 2008 Not sure which model is which or how you tell but some rooflights do not raise more than an inch or two as they are 'designed' to slide forwards rather than rise. As far as I can see you can't fit a deflector to these types - which coincidentally seem to be the noisiest and draughtiest available and were obviously not designed by a motor home user, that's for sure! These wretched things also seem to have what is euphemistically known as 'positive ventilation', whereby there is no draught proof rubber strip on the front and rear edges of the frame - only on the sides. You can overcome this a number of ways with various types of draught excluder or seal but one of the best ways to see whether that is what is needed is to cut two narrow strips of carpet to fit along the front and back frame edges to bridge the gap twixt frame and vent and shut and secure the vent onto them. Not a perfect solution but enough to road test and see what happens and best of all it's free - as long as you have some odds and ends of carpet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted October 25, 2008 Author Share Posted October 25, 2008 Thanks for the helpful replies - we haven't bought the van yet - just looking! The Heki is fairly large and opens a long way - I would have thought that A/S would fit the correct model. There is a moulded wind deflector. Perhaps any Symbol owners on here will know which model it is. I think the most likely reason and solution for the noise (if indeed it is a problem) is that suggested by Tracker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted October 26, 2008 Share Posted October 26, 2008 Brian: I admire your faith in Auto-Sleepers over fitting the 'correct' type of Heki roof-light. You haven't said what vintage of Symbol you are looking at, but (as A-S owners tend to keep their vehicles a reasonable amount of time) I'd guess it's 3 to 5 years old. I've dug out some late-2003 A-S literature that reveals that the company was then fitting Heki 2 or Heki 3 units seemingly based on whim. An example was the top of the range Midas model that appeared to come as standard with a Heki 2 above the dinette (with the extra-cost option of swapping this for a Heki 3), plus the option (£200) of having a Heki 2 over the rear bed. I've deliberately said "appeared", as prising hard facts from A-S advertising documentation is often tricky and, where Symbol is concerned, the A-S glossy brochure indicates that a Heki 3 roof ventilator was both standard and optional! However the related price-list suggests that it was standard. Either way, if the Heki on 'your' Symbol is operated by winding a handle, then it's near as dammit certain that a Heki 3 has been installed. As the Heki 3 winding-handle folds to allow it to be 'parked' tidily when the roof-light is shut, if it turns out that A-S's advice to apply an extra half turn of closure does stop the whistling, then you'd likely need to reposition the handle to permit it to fold neatly - probably a simple enough task. You'd also need to be careful not to over-stress the opening/closing mechanism, as leisure-vehicle roof-lights aren't intended to tolerate World's Strongest Man handling. Tracker: I don't know which roof-lights you have in mind, but two of the 'sliding forward' type (made by Remis) are fitted to my Hobby motorhome. Despite (obviously) having no supplementary frontal wind-deflectors, I can assure you that these units produce no noticeable noise or internal draughts when the vehicle is being driven, no matter what the speed. The concertina blind on the smaller unit installed over the rear bed will vibrate in very high winds (that's rocking-the-'van-type wind strengths) if the blind is fully closed, as it lacks the guide-strings fitted to the larger front roof-light's blind, but I can't say this much concerns me. The main down-sides I've found are that it's much more difficult to clean around the Remis units externally than the hinge-up variety and (on my Hobby at least) that one needs to be at least 5' 6" tall (or have peculiarly long arms!) to be able to open/close the bigger one. Otherwise I've no real complaints. Generally speaking, any roof window having permanent ventilation - and my Remis units incorporate this feature - will have the potential to produce draughts if installed in a high air-pressure position on the motorhome's roof. Many motorhome designers just ignore this and, having 'fixed' a vehicle's interior layout, then stick a massive roof-light above the seating area or bed (or both) with no regard for roof shape and the inevitable aerodynamic consequences as the vehicle travels through the air. A 'fit for purpose' roof-light, thoughtfully installed, really shouldn't need subsequent DIY remedial treatment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted October 26, 2008 Share Posted October 26, 2008 I have not got the van yet but the Autocruise Starlet that we are buying has, what Derek advises, is the sliding Remis rooflight and I can assure you all that the volume of wind noise at 60 mph is very considerable and intrusive due mainly to the 'positive ventilation' cause by the absense of seals on the front and rear of the panel and it is so intrusive that it almost spoils the otherwise relatively peaceful driving environment. It does not bother me as it is so easy to cure but why did Autocruise fit the wretched thing in the first place if it patently ain't right for the job? And yes it is shutting properly and nothing is broken or missing! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted October 26, 2008 Author Share Posted October 26, 2008 Derek, thanks. The Symbol is a 2006 model. As the rooflight is operated by a handle I agree with you that it is probably a Heki 3 but I notice that current literature mentions inbuilt lighting. Don't know if this one has it but it may be a feature on later ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted October 26, 2008 Share Posted October 26, 2008 These are a couple of sample links to UK suppliers of leisure-vehicle roof-lights: http://www.rainbowconversions.co.uk/Equipment/Rooflights/rooflights.htm http://www.obrienscamping.co.uk/Heki.htm The price differences between the various full-size Heki models is very evident and graphically explains why motorhome manufacturers chose to use Heki 2 rather than Heki 1 when these were the only two models being marketed by Seitz. The fact that Heki 2 still finds its way on to motorhomes (see "The Heki Jingle" section on page 176 of November 2008 MMM) is difficult to forgive when one studies the Heki 2 specification. When I was considering buying a Chausson Welcome 74 in 2004, I discovered that the Heki 2 roof-light fitted as standard for the French market (with no option to upgrade) was replaced by a Heki 3 for Welcome 74s destined for sale in Germany. I never tried to find out why, but I wondered whether a roof-light advertised by Dometic/Seitz as speed-restricted to 130km/h (the maximum permissible speed on French roads) might be deemed unfit for purpose for a motorhome being marketed in a country with autobahns having no maximum speed limit. Brian: As far as I'm aware the Heki 3 design has always included a pair of 8W lights. This is stated in a January 2004 Dometic/Sietz brochure I have, so a 2006 Symbol's Heki 3 should certainly have integrated lighting. Whether Auto-Sleepers would have connected up the lights to a 12V power supply might be another matter! Tracker: I think the answer to your 2nd paragraph's question is simply that Remis roof-lights are cheaper to purchase than the Heki equivalents. I was under the impression that the Remis sliding units on my Hobby, when closed, passed air from interior to exterior through vents in their plastic frames but, having just checked the larger one, I notice that this (like yours) only has rubber seals on the sides of the frame. Whatever the case, it stays quiet at speeds up to 130km/h. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Posted October 26, 2008 Author Share Posted October 26, 2008 Derek, the one I am looking up has a winding handle so I think it is a Heki 3 as the Heki 2 is push-up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel E Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 Derek, I am merely quoting from Dometic's latest Seitz brochure the latest uses for which each Heki is designed. If I am wrong, then so is the brochure! (Not impossible where Dometic are concerned, I guess). Mel E ==== Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 Derek Uzzell - 2008-10-26 7:00 PM: I think the answer to your 2nd paragraph's question is simply that Remis roof-lights are cheaper to purchase than the Heki equivalents. I was under the impression that the Remis sliding units on my Hobby, when closed, passed air from interior to exterior through vents in their plastic frames but, having just checked the larger one, I notice that this (like yours) only has rubber seals on the sides of the frame. Whatever the case, it stays quiet at speeds up to 130km/h. I think that wind noise acceptability is a very subjective issue and what irritates one does not bother another. A lot depends on the location of the rooflight - the further back in the van the less noise - or rather the less you hear it. It's noise intrusion - or not - also depends on the levels of other noises like engine, transmission, tyre, wind and road noise which vary considerably from van to van Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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