Hymer A Class headlamps

[Brian Kirby]

Can anyone please tell me whether the current generation, composite, "cat eye" shaped headlamps, can be switched from left dip to right dip without converters/masks?

Many thanks.

[Guest JudgeMental]

Wooooo moving up in the world:D

 

This may help..looks like your in luck

 

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/forum-printtopic-1-125921-0-0-asc-viewresult-1.html

[snowie]

Brian Kirby - 2013-02-18 11:23 AM

 

Can anyone please tell me whether the current generation, composite, "cat eye" shaped headlamps, can be switched from left dip to right dip without converters/masks?

Many thanks.

 

I don't know the answer to your query Brian, and am not wishing to divert the thread, but I suppose your remark about "cat eye" shaped headlamps could equally apply to the current Ducato?

 

As the whole Sevel range, Fords and Mercs are sold in LHD and RHD form I would have thought that the conversion would be relatively simple. An aftermarket solution (with appropriate type approval) could be a reasonable little earner; I would think?

 

Is the difference in the bulb, bulb carrier? surely all headlamp units are the same, LHD or RHD?

 

Could a French garage re-set the headlamp alignment of my RHD Ducato?

 

Sticky bits of plastic are such an inelegant solution.

 

regards,

alan b

 

 

[snowie]

snowie - 2013-02-18 12:09 PM

 

Brian Kirby - 2013-02-18 11:23 AM

 

Can anyone please tell me whether the current generation, composite, "cat eye" shaped headlamps, can be switched from left dip to right dip without converters/masks?

Many thanks.

 

Is the difference in the bulb, bulb carrier? surely all headlamp units are the same, LHD or RHD?

 

Sticky bits of plastic are such an inelegant solution.

 

regards,

alan b

 

 

I've just been out and fetched a headlamp unit! So I hope the photo's are relevant.

 

The adjusters are clearly visible (on a Ducato at any rate)

And I guess that's what the triangular panel is really for!

 

Hope this contributes to the understanding

 

Regards

alan b

[Derek Uzzell]

Based on the MHF link JudgeMental provided, it sounds like the headlamp-units Hymer use incorporate a projector-module for dipped beam. These look like a glass 'bulls-eye' and a (Skoda) example is shown here:

 

http://compare.ebay.co.uk/like/230929357282?var=lv

 

 

Dipping is carried out by a shield mechanism that moves to modify the beam pattern. My Skoda car has this type of headlamp and changing from UK (left dipping) pattern to Continental (right dipping) pattern is a simple matter of removing the rubber cover on the rear of the light-unit and moving a small lever. It takes just a few minutes to do this on my Skoda as the rear of each light-unit is easily accessible. The MHF thread suggests that this may not be the case with Hymer motorhomes.

 

I don't know if the dipped-beam pattern of all light-units that use projector modules can be altered from left-dipping to right dipping by simply moving a lever but (to the best of my knowledge) no 'conventional' headlight-unit can have its dipped-beam pattern modified in that manner.

 

I'm not up to date with the very latest commercial vehicles on which motorhomes are being built but, if they have not got headlamps with projector modules, it should be assumed they won't have a lever-switchable dipped-beam pattern.

 

Retro-fitting a projector module into a conventional light-unit would be a non-starter.

[euroserv]

Hello Campers,

 

I suspect that by now Brian has the answer to his question and knows that it is possible to rotate the Hella lamps on the Hymer, but due to the confined space that they are fitted in, it is not much fun to do...

 

The X250 van headlamps can be adjusted up and down, but the 'kick' up to the left or right is determined by the reflector and therefore these are either left hand drive or right hand drive units from new. If you want a permanent change you have to change the headlamp units completely.

 

Sorry.

 

Nick

[snowie]

euroserv - 2013-02-18 2:35 PM

 

Hello Campers,

The X250 van headlamps can be adjusted up and down, but the 'kick' up to the left or right is determined by the reflector and therefore these are either left hand drive or right hand drive units from new. If you want a permanent change you have to change the headlamp units completely.

 

Sorry.

 

Nick

 

Thanks Nick; that's a bit of a surprise; but not entirely unexpected. Must google "projector thingys"

so that I understand the original post,

alan b

[Guest JudgeMental]

snowie - 2013-02-18 4:31 PM

 

euroserv - 2013-02-18 2:35 PM

 

Hello Campers,

The X250 van headlamps can be adjusted up and down, but the 'kick' up to the left or right is determined by the reflector and therefore these are either left hand drive or right hand drive units from new. If you want a permanent change you have to change the headlamp units completely.

 

Sorry.

 

Nick

 

Thanks Nick; that's a bit of a surprise; but not entirely unexpected. Must google "projector thingys"

so that I understand the original post,

alan b

 

It gets worse.... If I PX my LHD 2011 for a new van, the latest ones now have running lights, so it means buying new headlights all over again!. Have the LHD ones boxed up in garage *-)

[Robinhood]

euroserv - 2013-02-18 2:35 PM

 

Hello Campers,

 

I suspect that by now Brian has the answer to his question and knows that it is possible to rotate the Hella lamps on the Hymer, but due to the confined space that they are fitted in, it is not much fun to do...

 

 

Nick

 

....whilst this was certainly true of the individual single-unit Hella lamps historically fitted to various A-class 'vans (including Hymer, Rapido, etc.), I fear Nick may be referring to these.

 

Brian specifically asked about the current, all-in-one tear-drop shape (the exploding ones B-) ), and I suspect he needs to wait for a positive or negative reply from a current-model owner in order to be sure.

 

I think the units he is talking about are as pictured.

 

[Brian Kirby]

Thank you all, folks, and well done Robin and Eddie! Haven't studied them that closely, but they look very similar.

 

I think Eddie's link to MHF + Derek's reference to projector type dips also ring true. I can see the projector dips in the picture (same principle as our Skoda Fabia, which I haven't tried switching, but guess will work the same as Derek's).

 

Not too bothered if it's a fiddle to do. If we end up with one, it'll only need switching after 3 years for MoT, and then once each way annually. May prove easier to remove the lamp than fiddle in-situ - er, or not, of course! :-) Besides, I don't drive the van after dark. That's eating time! Just poor visibility, rain, etc, so not very demanding.

 

I heard the exploding tendency had now been eliminated by using polycarbonate rather than glass. Seems obvious. No idea why they used glass!

[lennyhb]

Brian Hymer have made a point of saying on the new models the headlamps are easy to access, Hella have given the new lamps a nickname "Almond eyes" press release here but no mention of being able to adjust for drive side.

[BGD]

Having read through many of these tales of regular angst and faint-inducing ongoing extra expenses involved with ownership of the latest, "all-singing-all-dancing" white gin palaces, all I can say is thank the Lord for our ancient, mechanically simple, relatively dead-cheap-to-buy and really-dead-cheap-to-fettle 2001 motorhome on the Fiat Ducato 2.8 bog standard chassis cab.

:-D

[lennyhb]

But Bruce you are missing out on paying a 1000€ for a new headlamp when a stone cracks it. :D :D :D :D

[Derek Uzzell]

I notice that, on this MHFun thread

 

http://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/hymer/52572-exploding-headlamp-3.html

 

headlamp protectors for these light-units are said to be available nowadays.

 

Whatever the front cover of the Hymer headlamp is made of (glass or plastic) the unit is going to be expensive tp replace. So adding covers could be a really worthwhile investment.

 

The latest type of headlight-unit from Hella is a projector module that uses LEDs rather than traditional bulbs. There are no moving parts, with the high- or dipped-beam pattern produced by different sets of LEDs. Hella's advertising suggests that the dipped-beam pattern of these lights cannot be altered from left-dipping to right-dipping (or vice versa).

 

Certain types of Hella projector module incorporate what Hella calls a "Tourist Solution". This permits the dipped-beam pattern to be switched from left-dipping to right-dipping (or vice versa) by removing a waterproofing plug from the rear of the light unit, then using a Pozidriv screwdriver to 'click' an adjuster through 45°. It looks simple enough to do provided that the vehicle manufacturer has allowed for it to be done.

[Robinhood]

Derek Uzzell - 2013-02-19 8:51 AM

 

I notice that, on this MHFun thread

 

http://www.motorhomefun.co.uk/hymer/52572-exploding-headlamp-3.html

 

headlamp protectors for these light-units are said to be available nowadays.

 

 

 

.....indeed they are. I just happened to pinch my picture (above) from:

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Hymer-Motorhome-headlight-Protectors-Hella-Headlamps-on-Fiat-Mercedes-or-Ford-/181074078167?pt=UK_Campervan_Caravan_Accessories&hash=item2a28db29d7

 

....so, I suppose sharing the link is only fair. ;-)

[Derek Uzzell]

That explains the funny fittings.

 

After reading the e-bay description it's now evident that what looked like 'suckers' on your headlamp-unit photo are just that.

[BGD]

lennyhb - 2013-02-19 9:48 AM

 

But Bruce you are missing out on paying a 1000€ for a new headlamp when a stone cracks it. :D :D :D :D

 

 

 

One for a 2001 Ducato is all of about 40 squids brand new on fleabay.

 

So that £1,000 cost for a similar item for a Hymer A-class headlight is what the salesman would call........................ "progress".

 

But what does it do so much more wonderfully than my Ducato headlights that justifies the replacement cost being not a bit more than mine; not a lot more, not even a ridiculous amount more; but an utterly lunatic TWENTY FIVE times more expensive?

[malc d]

BGD - 2013-02-19 11:01 AM

 

lennyhb - 2013-02-19 9:48 AM

 

But Bruce you are missing out on paying a 1000€ for a new headlamp when a stone cracks it. :D :D :D :D

 

 

 

One for a 2001 Ducato is all of about 40 squids brand new on fleabay.

 

So that £1,000 cost for a similar item for a Hymer A-class headlight is what the salesman would call........................ "progress".

 

But what does it do so much more wonderfully than my Ducato headlights that justifies the replacement cost being not a bit more than mine; not a lot more, not even a ridiculous amount more; but an utterly lunatic TWENTY FIVE times more expensive?

 

 

 

I have always assumed that these absurd prices are to redress the shortfall in motor industry income due to the fact that vehicles break down less often these days.

Three year, five year, ten year, life warranties have to be paid for somehow.

 

 

;-)

[Brian Kirby]

Derek Uzzell - 2013-02-19 8:51 AM................The latest type of headlight-unit from Hella is a projector module that uses LEDs rather than traditional bulbs. There are no moving parts, with the high- or dipped-beam pattern produced by different sets of LEDs. Hella's advertising suggests that the dipped-beam pattern of these lights cannot be altered from left-dipping to right-dipping (or vice versa).

 

Certain types of Hella projector module incorporate what Hella calls a "Tourist Solution". This permits the dipped-beam pattern to be switched from left-dipping to right-dipping (or vice versa) by removing a waterproofing plug from the rear of the light unit, then using a Pozidriv screwdriver to 'click' an adjuster through 45°. It looks simple enough to do provided that the vehicle manufacturer has allowed for it to be done.

Hi Derek

Interesting information, thank you! I assume it came from the Hella website somewhere? I've been looking and can't find it. Could you possibly post a link, please? Thanks.

[Derek Uzzell]

Information on the HELLA LED projector module is here:

 

http://www.hella.com/MicroSite/soe/sites/default/files/J00353_KI_90mm_Premium_GB.pdf

 

Regarding the "Tourist Solution" thing, if you visit this webpage

 

http://www.myhellalights.com/index.php/default/auxiliary-lamps/modules/headlamp-modules/90mm-bi-halogen-headlamp-module/

 

then download the installation guide (90mm Mounting.pdf) mentioned at the bottom of the page you'll find references to it.

 

I went to the NEC Show today and asked at the Hymer stand whether their current A-Class headlamps' beam-pattern could be switched easily between left- or right-dippng, but the chap I spoke to didn't know. I also mentioned reports of the headlamps shattering and the unpleasant cost of replacement.

 

You said earlier "I heard the exploding tendency had now been eliminated by using polycarbonate rather than glass. Seems obvious. No idea why they used glass!"

 

The Hymer rep and I examined closely the headlamps of one of A-Class modefs on display and we both concluded that the front of the headlamp was glass.

 

I'm guessing that your reference to revised light-units with polycarbonate fronts was based on this MHF thread

 

http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopicp-1345342.html

 

As the relevant MHF posting mentions the 2011 Dusseldorf Show, I would have thought that, if polycarbonate lights had been made available to Hymer, they would have been on the NEC exhibition vehicles by now.

 

Nothing to do with Hymer or headlamps, but Steve Wood (of Roy Wood Transits) told me that, after 2010, Transit-based motorhomes marketed outside the UK have had a Ford 3-year duration base-vehicle warranty like Transit-based motorhomes marketed in the UK. He said that 'commercial' Transits marketed outside the UK continue to have a 2-year Ford warranty.

 

Apparently Westfalia plan to build a "Nugget" based on the latest Ford Transit Custom and the vehicle should become available in 2014. No information on the 'big' Transit Mk 8 - Steve claimed that the vehicles exhibited at shows were prototypes and it was still not known when the Mk 8 would begin to be produced.

[Guest JudgeMental]

If its a case of importing a LHD A class and you cant adjust the head lights...UK registration is going to be very expensive indeed *-)

[Brian Kirby]

JudgeMental - 2013-02-20 8:00 PM

 

If its a case of importing a LHD A class and you cant adjust the head lights...UK registration is going to be very expensive indeed *-)

That little thought had passed my mind! Hence the question. :-)

 

Thanks again Derek. Interestingly, the installation guide does not deal with adjusting the LED units, only halogen and xenon. Ominous, maybe?

[Guest JudgeMental]

Brian Kirby - 2013-02-20 9:43 PM

 

JudgeMental - 2013-02-20 8:00 PM

 

If its a case of importing a LHD A class and you cant adjust the head lights...UK registration is going to be very expensive indeed *-)

That little thought had passed my mind! Hence the question. :-)

 

Thanks again Derek. Interestingly, the installation guide does not deal with adjusting the LED units, only halogen and xenon. Ominous, maybe?

 

If yous asks a dealer in say Belgium (used to selling to the UK) they should be able to tell you straight away...

[Derek Uzzell]

Brian Kirby - 2013-02-20 9:43 PM

 

...Interestingly, the installation guide does not deal with adjusting the LED units, only halogen and xenon. Ominous, maybe?

 

The installation guide does not cover the LED projector modules but, if you scroll down to the penultimate page of the file that does

 

http://www.hella.com/MicroSite/soe/sites/default/files/J00353_KI_90mm_Premium_GB.pdf

 

you'll see that the low-beam-only and low-beam-&-high-beam LED modules are offered in EITHER "right-hand traffic" OR "left-hand traffic" format. It's evident therefore that the dipped-beam of the LED units cannot be switched between UK and Continental patterns.

 

The illumination patterns (plainly for a right-hand traffic headlamp-unit) shown on Page 2 of the .pdf file indicate strong asymmetry for low-beam. As the LED units are small in diameter, and are not intended to be fitted behind a cover, it's difficult to see how the low-beam pattern for left-hand traffic could be effectively alterd (by masks or 'beam benders') to be suitable for right-hand traffic (or vice versa). If a LHD motorhome with these Hella LED modules in right-hand traffic format were to be legally registered in the UK, the modules would need to be replaced by 'left-hand traffic' equivalents. I've no idea of the cost that would be involved, but it would just be the module that needed replacement, not (as in the case of a shattered Hymer A-cless light-unit) the complete headlamp. As far as I'm aware, no motorhome manufacturer currently fits the Hella LED module.

 

When I spoke to the salesman on the NEC stand (Lowdham Leisureworld?) where the Hymer motorhomes were being exhibited, he seemed very happy to check and get back to me regarding the issue of switching-over the dipped-beam pattern. However, it seems probable from MHF comments that the lights on current Hymer A-class models can be switched over.

[Robinhood]

Derek Uzzell - 2013-02-21 10:07 AM

 

The installation guide does not cover the LED projector modules but, if you scroll down to the penultimate page of the file that does

 

http://www.hella.com/MicroSite/soe/sites/default/files/J00353_KI_90mm_Premium_GB.pdf

 

you'll see that the low-beam-only and low-beam-&-high-beam LED modules are offered in EITHER "right-hand traffic" OR "left-hand traffic" format. It's evident therefore that the dipped-beam of the LED units cannot be switched between UK and Continental patterns.

 

The illumination patterns (plainly for a right-hand traffic headlamp-unit) shown on Page 2 of the .pdf file indicate strong asymmetry for low-beam. As the LED units are small in diameter, and are not intended to be fitted behind a cover, it's difficult to see how the low-beam pattern for left-hand traffic could be effectively alterd (by masks or 'beam benders') to be suitable for right-hand traffic (or vice versa).

 

....I'm not sure that you can make a firm conclusion based on this, Derek.

 

The similarly designed "Classic" Halogen lamps show the same assymetry of pattern, and are also available in RH or LH versions, BUT, the RH ones at least could be converted to a LH beam pattern by rotating the light in the mount. (many people have done it).

 

I suspect the RH and LH versions of these simply reflect the initial positioning in the mount as they leave the factory.

 

In principle, at least, if the process was possible with the halogen lamps, then I see no reason why it could not be mirrored with an LED light source (and, having achieved a solution with the halogen source, one might expect Hella to try to replicate it).