Importing v. buying here - food for thought?

[Guest Ruth]

Thought our experience of price comparisons might be might be of interest to anyone thinking of importing a new van. I’ve spent all weekend looking into this and read lots of postings about the money saved and the practicalities. It’s clear to see that in some cases it is possible to make a big saving, more so on some makes than others, and perhaps especially Hymer. This relates to all sorts of things, doesn’t it, such as availability, continental pricing, the euro, the pricing policy of the equivalent UK dealer, and so on. Therefore I realise that my experience may not equate to a different set of circumstances. We are buying a new German A-Class (Carthago) delivery time is next May/June as it will be on the new Iveco166 with automatic transmission. I obtained a (very attractive) quote from Urbano in Ostend and calculated all my extra costs and English VAT. I also approached other continental dealers to compare. I could exactly match the spec to that supplied by the UK dealer. The only differences would be the reg plates, road fund etc. and the headlamps, speedo and socket. Identical in every other way spec for spec. After negotiations with the UK dealer I ended up with a difference of £2600 more to buy here. So you can have fun thinking what you would have done if you were me. I’ll tell you what I opted to do and why. I’d be interested in your comments. Don’t worry if you disagree, I’m happy with my decision! I opted to buy here (shame as it might have been fun!) Why? 1. The exchange rate is good at the moment so I figured I could wipe out much of that if it deteriorates between now and then. I could buy some now if I was a risk taker but I can’t get them all anyway until I’ve sold my current van. 2. I have done my homework on the import costs and whilst they are fairly low they have to come off that as does going to get it. 3. There’s the time and hassle to bear in mind however easy it is. 4. I would need to return to Belgium for all warranty work and servicing for the first 3 years as the only UK dealer (the one I would be walking away from) is known not to co-operate in this situation. 5. There’s a convenience and piece of mind factor of having the aftersales with dealt with here even though they are 2 ½ hours away. 6. I retain a PX option should I be unable to sell my van privately. Unlikely given 5+ months and a good margin but nonetheless it’s a safety net. 7. Last but not least a UK supplied van holds a higher resale value, how important this is will depend how long I keep it, but again, it’s a consideration So, food for thought? Any comments or experiences of your own? Regards, Ruth

[Guest Dave]

Unfortunately, Ruth, nothing I can help you with, just writing to thank you for the helpful information! My wife and I are still recovering from six hours at Earl's Court on Friday looking around at many of the possibilities for our new motorhome. One of the options was to bring in from abroad - I picked up a free issue of a German magazine that is coming out in the UK soon and it was galling to see how much lower the prices are in Deutschland (OK they were for Left and not Right Hand Drive). But, while we aren't in the same league as you in terms of make, your findings are just as relevant to us, and I will most certainly heed your implicit warnings. I think numbers 4 to 7 are the most important for me. Thanks for passing on your research!

[Guest Ruth]

Hi Dave Is it to be your first motorhome, or do you have a past, so to speak? Just interested in your own particular dilemma. It's mind blowing looking round a show if you have not yet narrowed down your requirements, but it helps very much as well. I am shattered after Friday at the show and several sleepless nights before and after, so I sympathise!

[Guest Dave]

Its going to be our first so you can imagine the stress! However, we do have time and are doing a phased introduction (still working fulltime at this stage but open to offers - may start part time for six months a year) so have over the last year or so treated it as a hobby but now are able to home in on a few makes. As I said, we are in a (much) lower league to you (eg McLouis, Kentucky Camp) but certainly also more interested in foreign makes mainly because we have a 3500kg restriction due to having converted our licences from overseas (and not wanting to upgrade to higher grade licences) and the continental manufacturers seem to do a better job as far as that aspect goes. And of course that's what got me looking at the possibility of importing, but I think your advice has quite rightly stopped any idea of that. Thanks again!

[Guest jstuart]

Just to add my two penny worth....... I (we) bought a vw Camper in holland and its £5000 less than here. The base price -before any taxes is cheaper than either UK (the most expensive) or Germany.All the options/extras are cheaper too. In addition to the saving we have had fun visiting Amsterdam and meeting some very good people at the dealers.I am sure we will enjoy picking it up in the spring. For servicing-- this will will not be needed for two years or so as it is on a "variable service interval"After my experience having vw's serviced in the uk, I would rather book it into a Dutch or German main agent and have the work done en route for our European trip. As for the Guarantee We get two years (as the European standard)& will buy what we think we need after that from our savings. Regards to all jstuart

[Guest Ruth]

Well, to be fair, you may wish to satisfy yourselves about the deal open to you for your make and model and do your own calculations. As I said this is on a pre-ordered model from a relatively small manufacturer, and has yet to be built...so whilst dealers at home and abroad havepre-bought their chassis quotas and obviously need to take orders it's not as if they are stuck with stuff on their forecourt that they need to shift...added to which they clearly are having a lot of interest on this 2006 range. So, my situation may not be yours. Good luck and do post any questions . I have learned that it is important to separate fact from opinion (both are useful in their own way, but there's a bias element in the latter which can be incredibly subjective of course) My own best tip would be to condsider buying a second hand model for your first as you rarely get it perfect first time, you can try to imagine, but it's never the same as living with it. If you choose wisely say a UK best seller( Swift? Autosleepers?) and say a couple of years old, do your homework carefully on prices and buy well,privately, you will learn a lot and know what you really really want. You should then if you are clever not lose very much if you sell on privately months or a year down the line. Regards, Ruth

[Guest Clive]

It would be nice if after all those above have complete their transactions and had a "shake down cruise" to be able to post the actual costs, delays, frustrations, enjoyments or whatever at a later date. I pondered similarly about purchasing a car via the web or from a main dealer a couple of months back. In the end the fact that the car was available within a week from the dealer and 3 months via the web and the convergance (not totally) of the costs brought them within spitting distance of each other plus all the other reasosn Ruth has given mean I now have the car, with the fitted extras I wanted from a local main dealer. But, isn't it exciting? Have fun C.

[Guest Derek Uzzell]

Ruth: Given the high cost of an Iveco-based A-Class Carthago, the £2600 price gap between buying one in the UK or abroad makes it (in my opinion) well worth paying the extra to minimise the hassle. The points you make are all valid and, of course, you will be purchasing the vehicle under the umbrella of UK consumer law. I bought our latest LHD motorhome from Germany and was lucky with exchange-rate shifts. The process went smoothly enough, but to say that I enjoyed the experience would be a lie. However, I'm 100% certain I wouldn't have enjoyed buying the thing in the UK either. Among the reasons I chose to purchase abroad were a) the Continental versus UK price difference was very significant, b) I actively didn't want the UK specification that seemed obligatory for RHD versions and c) I lacked confidence in the UK vendor's knowledge of the vehicle (a new model in 2005) and didn't have any faith in the delivery date that was being quoted. Clive: I'm considering writing an Owner's Report that would obviously outline the purchasing process and aftermath. Not sure how much of the detail you are interested in to include though. I'm sure I could fill a complete copy of MMM if I really worked at it - but then there are the libel laws to consider!!

[Guest Ruth]

I'm sure it would make very interesting reading Derek, I would love to hear all about it. How long was the gap between ordering and collection, in other words how long were you biting your nails about the exchange rate? 5-6 months of that was not an attractive proposition but if your margin was much bigger than mine it's a different set of risks! I was also lucky that I haver used this dealer before and they were very fair about meeting my belgian quote to a point acceptable to us both. Regards, Ruth

[Guest Clive]

Derek (and Ruth) There is no point asking me if you should contribute to the mag. All I do occasionally is put something together if I think its worthy of printing and send it into the Editorial at the PO box number given in every edition of the magazine. I have zero clout! Sometimes thay say NO and occasionally they say YES (but it will take ages to appear). But if you ask my personal opinion if its worth puting together an article then I would say that if you think its worth printing then put in on paper (for your own satisfaction) and send it in together with a goodly selection of quality supporting photographs. But I would also add that from my personal jaundiced viewpoint not many people are prepared to spend loads of cash on something this expensive then go public and say they made an expensive mistake! Most will justify their purchase if not to themselves then to their spouses and the world at large. Hence the independant reports from Dave Hurrell and co will be more convincing. (Dave has a Rapido on a Merc for himself and Suzane) I know that some complain that the reports can be a bit polite when it comes to pointig out deficiencies but the law of the land does come down quite heavily on organisations who print derogatory comments which affect others businesses. So If you want to give you words a chance of being printed be prudent. I conceede your spelling is far better than mine! Good luck C.

[Guest Derek Uzzell]

Ruth: I placed the order in January 2005 (5000 Euros deposit), took delivery of the vehicle on July 11 and the monetary side of the purchasing process was completed in mid-August when the German tax refund entered my bank account. Ultra-precise financial comparisons between buying a motorhome in the UK and buying a look-alike abroad are virtually impossible in my view. You'd have to buy exactly the same specification vehicle, negotiate a deal with a UK vendor and a 'foreign' one, then cost every pound spent on travel, food, transportation, phone-calls, etc. in both instances. I know that I spent £26269 including £208 DVLA registration/excise fees. However, this figure is vehicle-only and excludes the costs of an April reconnaissance visit to the German dealer and of the July collection trip. Before choosing to 'do the Continental' I inspected a (LHD) example of our motorhome at the UK agent's premises, but made no attempt to find out how much discount they might have offered me if I had been prepared to place an order then and there. As I said previously, knowledge of the vehicle was thin on the ground and the exact specification of forthcoming RHD UK models was still a bit of a mystery. My motorhome (which has various factory-fitted extras) has a more expensive equipment specification than a basic UK version. The UK windscreen-sticker price of a RHD equivalent with the same kit as mine would probably be in the region of £37500. So there was a fair bit of price-difference latitude to offset any adverse currency shifts. In fact the currency aspect didn't worry me unduly; I was far more concerned about the instant adaptation to LHD I would need to make when I collected the motorhome. I had driven just one LHD vehicle before - a 5 minute session in an Isetta bubble-car in 1962. I also obtained a price from a parallel importer and my motorhome dealer friend obtained trade and individual prices from an import agent. It's likely I could have paid sub-£30k if I had purchased via my dealer pal but, by then, I'd decided to go it alone. Clive: One would need to be a master of double-think to be so inept as to buy a motorhome that's totally wrong for one's needs and then write a magazine article about it in glowing terms. I'm sure that the motorcaravan owners who write reports praising their own 'perfect 'vans' really believe what they say even though many people might accuse them of wearing rose-tinted spectacles. Normally I write for fun not cash, but, where the Owner's Report is concerned, a bit of lolly wouldn't go amiss as compensation for the £50 and tens of man-hours I've just spent redesigning and re-installing my motorhome's blown-air system. Don't you think "prudent" is a mite boring? My objective will be to produce something that's factually accurate, entertaining, balanced and (as a justifiable kick in the pants for the heating-system fiasco) mildly malicious. Because of this last element MMM's long lead time for readers' submissions may not be a bad thing, as there would be a good chance the motorhome would be out of warranty by the time my vindictive observations got published.

[Guest Norma]

Never mind buying abroad. We can't think of changing our van. The thought that our local (10 minutes away) wouldn't service a van we didn't purchase from them is terrifying. They are very good to us and have said they can only cope with the vans they sell. We would be very selective about a replacement van anyway. The thought of any other dealer being a day and more away is unthinkable. Having said that we would probably buy on the continent as it would be just as easy to get there than most places here. Here being Scotland!

[Guest Clive]

Derek, The best judgement of how a new vehicle suits one is how long one keeps it. I kept a BMW 325i 2 years only, a Land Rover Disco nearly 14 years, the converted bus 8 and the Scout is now over 8 years old as well. Yes the BMW was a mistake and a knee jerk reaction, but I would have lost my license if I had kept it any longer and probably been threatened with a divorce! Oh and a Caravan, 2 years as well. We had to prove to ourselves for a second time that we were motorhome people, not tuggers. Your timing is about right for publication if you only got a 1 year warranty, but that would suprise me. I would expect you to command 3 years at least.I do most of my own servicing then at least I KNOW for sure what has been done! Good luck