robdav Posted January 28, 2019 Share Posted January 28, 2019 Hi We have a Pilote van which came with a Pilote branded 105 Ah 12v leisure battery. It also came with a 120W solar panel and a Antarion charge controller. There is also an on-board CB 510 battery charger. I swapped the charge controller for a Photonic Universe U1024B charge controller because it allowed me to also add a remote meter/display MT50 which allowed me to see how much charge was coming in from the solar panel. We have just been away for two days and the leisure battery got down to well under 12v without excessive battery use and with bright enough weather for the solar panel to keep the battery topped up. What I fear has happened is when I leave the van plugged in at home (all the time because I though it was a good thing to do?) I think the battery charger and the solar panel have been charging the battery and possibly over charged/damaged it. Is this likely? I'm assuming I will need to replace the battery and find out how to stop the solar controller from dual charging the battery? Thanks for any advice. Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weldted Posted January 28, 2019 Share Posted January 28, 2019 A lot depends on what demand you make of the battery whilst you are using the van at this time of the year. A 100 amp battery in as new condition would at best give you 50 amps of usable power, a single 120 panel is not going to produce much even in clear sky at this time of year. You don't state how old the battery is, with ehu and solar connected at the same time both should sense the state of charge of the battery and reduce the charge as required. Depending on the mains charger it may not be ideal for it to be permantly on charge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robdav Posted January 28, 2019 Author Share Posted January 28, 2019 The battery is less than 12 months old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spirou Posted January 28, 2019 Share Posted January 28, 2019 With a battery that young it is also possible the battery has a manufacturing defect. Or Pilote just rebranded some junk product. Long term charging can certainly damage the battery but less than a year is quite a short period for that to happen. Any idea if you have any stand-by battery drain? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aandncaravan Posted January 28, 2019 Share Posted January 28, 2019 2 days from a single battery this time of year is actually very good because the heater fan/pump will take quite a bit of power on it's own. Solar gain in mid winter doesn't amount to more than about 6 Ah a day, which won't contribute anything useful, so I don't think you have a serious battery problem. While you may have an issue with the Solar regulators overcharging the battery ( do they drop to 13.4v Float like the best modern Solar chargers?) you should be ok with the CBE CB510 as it is very low power at only 10amps and is the only charger range we know that actually shuts down when the battery is full? The CB510 will Float at 13.6v for 10 hours then completely power off until the voltage drops, when it will restart, which with your Solar isn't going to happen very often. Most of the photonic universe regulators we have seen have been for House solar, which works in a very different way to motorhome Solar requirements so I would investigate disconnecting Solar during the Summer and only connecting it when the battery needs charging. 'House' Solar regulators are designed to start up and throw every amp it can at the battery/National grid to maximise every amp because you want to harvest everything all the time. The concept of low power float charging isn't usually a priority. A motorhome specific solution works on the basis that 80% of the year the motorhome will be idle and the batteries won't need charging so it's approach is the opposite of a House Solars 'throw everything into the battery whether it needs it or not' approach. Suggest you monitor how well yours deals with a full battery so it isn't overcharged? Also have a look at the actual voltages output by the charger as the manual is wrong re the voltages for wet batteries, most of the manuals we have see show the Gel and Wet settings transposed. This can lead to wet acid battery being under charged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted January 28, 2019 Share Posted January 28, 2019 https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Can-you-over-Solar/49775/ I always switch off solar when not using batterys Switching them on when on site with no EHU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robdav Posted January 28, 2019 Author Share Posted January 28, 2019 Thanks for the advice. I'm looking to fit a second leisure battery and I know neither of the existing solar charge controllers can charge dual batteries. What motorhome specific charge controllers can you recommend please? aandncaravan - 2019-01-28 4:01 PM 2 days from a single battery this time of year is actually very good because the heater fan/pump will take quite a bit of power on it's own. Solar gain in mid winter doesn't amount to more than about 6 Ah a day, which won't contribute anything useful, so I don't think you have a serious battery problem. While you may have an issue with the Solar regulators overcharging the battery ( do they drop to 13.4v Float like the best modern Solar chargers?) you should be ok with the CBE CB510 as it is very low power at only 10amps and is the only charger range we know that actually shuts down when the battery is full? The CB510 will Float at 13.6v for 10 hours then completely power off until the voltage drops, when it will restart, which with your Solar isn't going to happen very often. Most of the photonic universe regulators we have seen have been for House solar, which works in a very different way to motorhome Solar requirements so I would investigate disconnecting Solar during the Summer and only connecting it when the battery needs charging. 'House' Solar regulators are designed to start up and throw every amp it can at the battery/National grid to maximise every amp because you want to harvest everything all the time. The concept of low power float charging isn't usually a priority. A motorhome specific solution works on the basis that 80% of the year the motorhome will be idle and the batteries won't need charging so it's approach is the opposite of a House Solars 'throw everything into the battery whether it needs it or not' approach. Suggest you monitor how well yours deals with a full battery so it isn't overcharged? Also have a look at the actual voltages output by the charger as the manual is wrong re the voltages for wet batteries, most of the manuals we have see show the Gel and Wet settings transposed. This can lead to wet acid battery being under charged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aandncaravan Posted January 28, 2019 Share Posted January 28, 2019 Have a look at the Solar pages which suggests a solution along with Hints and Tips : http://www.aandncaravanservices.co.uk/solar-power.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robdav Posted March 11, 2019 Author Share Posted March 11, 2019 aandncaravan - 2019-01-28 6:47 PM Have a look at the Solar pages which suggests a solution along with Hints and Tips : http://www.aandncaravanservices.co.uk/solar-power.php Hi Allan I've fitted two Varta LFD90 batteries and also a Votronic MPP 250 charge controller as per your vey helpful advice on your website and all seems good. Two days off grid this weekend and batteries were fully charged when we got home. I now no longer leave the van plugged into EHU and am leaving the solar to keep the batteries topped up which it manages well. My question is, should I even have the solar trickle charging the batteries or is this too much? Thanks again for all your advice. Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aandncaravan Posted March 11, 2019 Share Posted March 11, 2019 Hello Robdav, I honestly don't think you could have created a more efficient Solar solution. The Votronic is different to most Solar chargers in that it's 'Float'/'Maintenance' rate is not the usual 13.8v of most others but a lower 13.4v, so unlikely two LFD90's will suffer at all. Especially as the Varta LFD90 contains 'overcharge' resistant anti corrosion technology. The Votronic is one of only a handful of Solar chargers that are designed specifically for motorhomes, hence the sophisticated Starter and Habitation battery charging capability, which you will note the Victron doesn't have, and the lower long term Float rate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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