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Leisure battery failure


yoko8pups

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My leisure battery has failed. We had gone the longest we ever have without ehu and been staying in a council run aire type site in Porto Covo in Portugal. There is no ehu on the site. The reading looked OK when we put the tv on tonight at 12.6, the tv is 45w and we used a transformer. We watched about 45 mins and suddenly all the 12v lights and power except the tv went out. We knew we had 2 leisure batteries so it seems the TV runs on one and the tv runs on another. I have 2 questions, can we put any charge on by driving home or is the battery now ruined and can we disable the electric step alarm by taking the fuse out or does anyone know how to retract the step without 12 volt? We could buy a new battery as we have had it 3 years and I think it was a year old when we bought the van. Thanks for any suggestions.
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A TV running from an Inverter could take quite a few amps and run down a battery at a rate more than most other devices in a motorhome. However, normally a healthy battery at 12.6v would have quite a bit of capacity left so I am guessing the battery has lost a 'lot of capacity' , but doesn't yet have any other 'mechanical' issue like shorting of the Plates?

But discharging it so low, may have degraded it further and caused damage?

 

Don't know what make the battery is, but at two years old many budgets have given their best, so unless it is a big name make like Yuasa, Exide, Varta, Bosch, etc. then I would say it is well overdue for replacement.

 

 

It may take a small charge from the engine if you run it at fast idle for 10 minutes, enough to bring in the step maybe?

 

So try starting the engine and letting it run for 10 mins. After 10mins turn on the 12v and try and retract the step. Suggest you are not tempted to turn on the 12v earlier than 10 mins running because the Alternator/12v will be working flat out, so adding the load of the step, etc might overload things so they break.

 

 

You can put charge into the battery by driving home, but it is possible you will create other issues as an Alternator is not designed to charge flat batteries without strain.

 

I would suggest that you either protect the Alternator, Power Controller and wiring from harm by removing the Fuses at the battery or replace the batteries before you leave.

 

See our recently rewritten 'Battery Technology' page for advice on selecting quality big name batteries that are cheaper than many budgets : http://www.aandncaravanservices.co.uk/battery-technology.php

 

 

 

 

 

 

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If you have two leisure batteries they will be connected in parallel but you could replace two with one if necessary simply by leaving the other terminals unconnected as long as they are well insulated from contact with anything else - but don't try to leave the other old battery  connected in parallel with the new one because that will compromise things.  If necessary put the unwanted battery terminals separately inside two or three plastic bags ti insulate them; do not allow the terminals to touch each other, whatever you do.

And don't delay buying a replacement battery or batteries because that could lead to your charging system failing, which will be much more difficult and expensive to fix.

I had a starter battery failure in France a few years ago and even on a bank holiday weekend I was able to buy a good quality Fulmen battery from a supermarket (and five years later it's still going strong) but as Allan has advised, don't make the mistake of buying a cheap own-brand or no-name battery.  Ideally you want a Varta LFD90 or the Bosch equivalent.  Ideally you would install the new batteries and then move to a campsite where there is an EHU and charge for 24 hours before continuing your touring or heading home.

Good luck.
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I had the same problem last year, but with one battery. I drove for a few miles with the step warning buzzer sounding, and it eventually had enough power to retract. I put it on hook up overnight and was able to use all facilities after that as long as I had overnight hook up. Replaced the battery when I got home
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Billggski - 2018-09-26 9:13 AMI had the same problem last year, but with one battery. I drove for a few miles with the step warning buzzer sounding, and it eventually had enough power to retract. I put it on hook up overnight and was able to use all facilities after that as long as I had overnight hook up. Replaced the battery when I got home

The risk of doing that is that your mains charger fails under the strain of trying to charge a duff battery/bateries so you have to replace that too.  You probably got away with it because you only had one leisure battery.
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I don't hear it mentioned but do they need topped up with Distilled water. If they are acid batteries o course. My two on motorhome went flat/out/gone even though they were being powered by a roof lecy panel. Sealed yes 2 off but wee plastic cover snapped off. No liquid on plates so that didn't help. Filled them up, my your a thirsty pair. Reading 4 volts but came back up with my 20A Ring charger.

My mobility scooter has been needing charged more and more often. So looked into electrolyte level by snapping off the, "your not allowed in here", plastic covers and hey presto needing liquid. What a job getting the liquid in a 6mm hole though. Speedy Gonzalez yet again.

Yes I know, I should buy new like you guys...

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yoko8pups - 2018-09-26 9:15 PM

 

........ Can anyone tell me why no lights work off the starter battery.

 

If you were to run the starter battery flat as well, you wouldn't be going anywhere.

 

If your vehicle still has a cab light, I would expect that to be connected to the starter battery.

 

Alan

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Thank you everyone, we drove 150k with the step alarm blaring, and our nerves fraying, to get to a motorhome specialist near home. He fixed it in about 10 mins! The 50w fuze in the 1st leisure battery had failed and a new fuze put in clicked everything into go mode, the leisure batteries showing 13.1. How wrong can you be? €7!

 

I would recommend him to anyone, Tommy is his name (Tucker is his surname!), he's an English man and he is near Loule, Central Algarve. The firm is called CamperServ about 100m off the 125 road. If you're planning a trip to Algarve take his name with you. http://www.camperserv.com/

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Did he give an opinion on why the 50A fuse blew, as that doesn't happen that often unless batteries are an issue?

 

50amps is way more than is normally ever drawn from the habitation battery, but 50 amps can be reached by the Alternator through poor batteries + 12v Fridge/Freezer?

 

What type of meter did he use to test the batteries?

 

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yoko8pups - 2018-09-28 8:58 PM

 

I was using a 45w tv and a 5w firestick,plus we had 2 2w lights on so I guess I overloaded it. As soon as he put the fuse in th batteries tested at 13.1, we are going to try it for a couple of days outing and then decide if we need to replace the batteries.

 

 

That is less than 60 watts and equates to less than 5 amps so not sure how you could have overloaded a 50 amp fuse?

 

 

 

 

 

 

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yoko8pups - 2018-09-28 8:58 PM

 

I was using a 45w tv and a 5w firestick,plus we had 2 2w lights on so I guess I overloaded it. As soon as he put the fuse in th batteries tested at 13.1, we are going to try it for a couple of days outing and then decide if we need to replace the batteries.

 

Is it possible that you have misunderstood, and that the fuse blown was actually that connecting to the starter battery, which is called B1 in CBE systems.

 

The total of the loads quoted above is less than 60W i.e about 5A at 12V, so there must be another reason for the fuse failure.

 

If the habitation battery had been run very low while off EHU, I would go go with Allan's suggestion of fridge load plus initial charging current for the habitation battery (B2).

 

Alan

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A possibility - has your split charge relay failed with its contacts closed? ie both batteries are permanently in parallel.

 

The fuse failure would then occur when you cranked the engine and part of the starter current (possibly 200 A?) would be drawn from the leisure battery through the 50 A fuse which would obviously blow.

 

Check the resting voltage of both batteries and if identical try pulling the 50 A fuse and measuring again. In theory they should not be identical voltages unless linked.

Also try measuring both battery voltages with the engine running when they should be near identical (allowing for losses in wiring, etc).

 

Keith.

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I am ignorant of the workings of electricity, sorry. My husband isn't at all curious about how anything works so I have to do it. When the 12 volt alarm went and then we were blacked out the TV which was connected to the other leisure battery kept going so they may not be parallel.
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Then I would suggest you get your local repair man to do a full 12v survey to tell you exactly how the batteries are wired and connected together. Should only take 30 mins, so shouldn't cost much.

 

He will then be able to make an assessment as to why the 50a fuse failed and give you an idea of what issues you have or are likely to crop up in the future.

 

 

 

 

 

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