Mileage/Ferry calculations

[Guest Keith T]

I'm intrigues by the earlier posting about mielage costs using verious UK ports, which I notice excludes ferry costs. Surely that may more than make up for the actual mielage differences.. As we live in Cornwall it makes sense to tavel Plymouth/Roscoff, probably one of the most expensive crossings. We have discount through Brittany ferries and can usualy cross May/ back July for around £250/ 6hrs crossing. Friends told us they managed a crossing from Dover/Calais similar period for under £100. But if you take into account overall additional mielage/time/overnight sites in UK (330 miles each way approx) our preference is very much an dhour or so to the ferry here, then drive on the far superior french roads, with generall improved fuel performance. So the whole package needs to be checked out carefully.

[Guest peter goddard]

You are quite correct in what you say. There is more to extra mileage than just fuel costs, tyres and servicing for instance. We live in the north so mileage to Dover or Plymouth is quite similar and the extra distance from Dunqurke rather than Calais is more than made up for by the £58 return fare on Norfolk Line.

[Guest Brian Kirby]

You're both right, of course. What started me off was some of the "camels through the eye of a needle" arguments that were going on about who had the cheapest crossing from Dover. If you live north of London, then UK mileages to other ports aren't that different from the mileage to Dover. However, the mileages and toll costs in France are quite different so, instead of just assuming that because Dover gives the cheapest crossing it will be cheapest overall, (as some had seemed to) I calculated what the return mileages and till costs might be from Dieppe, Caen and Cherbourg. These were only, and were only intended to be, rough and ready figures. My purpose was to see how Dover (90 miles East but with the cheapest crossings), compared to Newhaven (7 miles South and about £30 more expensive each way) compared overall. Having done that, I thought it might stir the grey matter in an interesting way if I "posted" the results. As you both correctly say, it is the whole journey cost (and duration if that's important) that needs to be calculated, not just the ferry cost. As you both also say, the whole cost would also include campsites. However, to try adding in the various deals that come and go on ferries and the number of variables is far beyond what I could, or would, contemplate! Depending on how you then travel on across France, Peter, you just might find that the saving in tolls from Dover (which, if you use the autoroutes, is quite significant), might be sufficient to make one of the more westerly routes worth considering and, in addition, would save you quite a bit of travelling time in France. However, I had no intention to try to dictate, just to provoke a bit! Regards Brian

[Guest Yrkshire Tyke]

We tarvel From Hull to Zeebrugge -(as I have said before in other places) That delivers us 60 miles north of Calais on a non toll road We travel down the French west coast to Spain and if we are going via The Mediteranean (Italy/Spain) we go via Pottiers across France and avoid Paris I have measured this on the Autoroute map as being 150 miles shorter than going through Paris with less toll roads However from Zeebrugge you can go via belgium - Luxemburg into Germany then (Austria/Switzerland/Italy and beyond) Less mileage than Calais or Dunkirque We may go Portsmouth - Bilbao to Spain/Portugal This is a saving of mileage in France Much depends on the cost of the FERRY try www.autorutes.fr/voyage/itineraires.php It is a french site works out distances, mileage, fuel total and cost and TOLLS being a french government site it is kept up to date It will give you a printout of your route shwing the Mway signs

[Guest Ray Pead]

Hi Yorkshire Tyke (I am a Hampshire Hog!!) I found this subject very interesting as we are thinking about driving down to the Costa Del Sol. I tried, without success, to log on to the web site you mentioned. Is the spelling correct? Thanks for your help. Ray

[Guest Keith]

re the above comments about travel to spain, we cahkd prices last year to use Plymouth-Santander as we could then just cross the Spanish Border to the french Med area, and taking evrything into account - mileage, ferry etc, the net cost woulnd have been more than £200 greater than using Plymouth-Roscoff and driving through france. It pays to do the sums!

[Guest Mel B]

Ray The correct web address is: www.autoroutes.fr/voyage/itineraires.php T' Yorkshire Tyke spelt it wrong, but then, us Yorkshire lads 'n lasses knows what us means, there's nowt like being fluent in t'regional dialect!!!

[Guest Yorkshire Tyke]

Sorry missed an "o" owt Nowt to do wit Yorshire dialect though It wer't missus nattering for a cupa next Think? I said do yer sums - or intended to We cannot do a direct comparison as we dont travel steerage we allus take an outside cabin & double/or twin bed(s) We arent young chickens and dont like roosting on the top perch I keep copies of my routes on CD RW's for future use & plan to make up a spreadsheet to do the fuel costs Actually I use my own on disc MS Aoutroute 2004 for planning OK its out of date - but I am still using some 1960's maps Lakes, Dales, Peak District Some roads have changed - Like the one round "Mam Tor" that collapsed in 196x? and a few motorways We use new maps where necessary Like when walking over the LDNP fells & YDNP dales

[Guest Norma]

We travel down to Dover from Edinburgh. A stopover with rellies in York and a day's drive to Dover. Just over a tank of fuel and the lovely cheap fares from Dover. To travel from Rosyth (20 minutes from our door) would cost us over £600 and no subsidies. And we like the short time on the ferry - I don't cope at all well overnight! I cannot see any savings by leaving from Rosyth!

[Guest Brian Kirby]

But Norma, the original game was never to compare Dover-Calais with such long sea trips as from Rosyth, just (as I originally did it) the channel crossings from Dover, Newhaven and Portsmouth. You can travel all of these by day, maximum crossing is, I believe, 5 hours Portsmouth-Caen, the other two being around 4 hours. Edinburgh to Newhaven or Portsmouth would take around the same time as to Dover, you'd pay a bit more for the ticket but you'd save on tolls and fuel across France. My point was that these potential savings in fuel and motorway (autoroute) tolls across France can equal or (if you're lucky with a special offer) exceed the extra cost of the ferry ticket on these longer crossings. It gives a greater choice of ways to cross France, and a different route in UK, so the journey "wallpaper" is different, it shortens the driving time in France to boot and, overall, costs about the same. Variety, at no extra cost, that was the idea! The same objection applies to those who have wanted to compare the direct routes to northern Spain. They're much more expensive, so I left them out as not truly comparable on cost grounds. Homo Yorkshirensis above goes Hull to Zeebrugge to cut down his UK mileage: it'll cost him more in ferry than he saves in fuel, even if it does save him an overnight stop in UK, but that is his preferred route. As with Rosyth or Bilbao/Santander, it isn't comparable as a trip. I have tried to compare (roughly) like with like: apples and oranges are different, though they are both fruit. So with ferry crossings. Have fun, however you travel! Brian

[Guest Ray]

Thanks Mel and Yrkshire Tyke for the info. It's tuf on us southerners who can't speak the lingo. Best wishes Ray

[Guest john]

we too have done our sums and if we go from santander to mojacar mileage approx 600 we can save 700 miles driving through france about 11 hours according to AA a saving of about £100 fuel ferry crossing approx £305 including 2 recling seats , so £305 minus £100 ( fuel ) a crossing of £205 not bad i think or have i missed something..

[Guest Brian Kirby]

John The cost is presumed to be for a single journey. Fuel saving indicates better than 25 mpg, so economical motorhome, good! However, and just for example, a one way ticket from Newhaven to Dieppe (because I know that one and it's not Dover!) for a 6M motorhome costs £80. Portsmouth to Caen/Cherbourg presumed a bit more expensive - haven't checked. However, neither route presumably convenient for you, as you've chosen to sail from Plymouth. Don't forget youve got to come back though - or have you??! Regards Brian

[Guest Yorkshire Tyke]

Hi was it John you get to understand different dialects as you travel around like Oi be able to get onwi' a bit'o Zomezet mi boy The worst would be for you southerners to listen to the Geordies (from Newcastle) Actually this has set me off to make up a spreadsheet for use with the Autoroute {{ To avoid going through towns I add a stop off on an alternative road - We avoid Paris & go via Caen or Rouen so put these towns or a road close as stops}} I am at the stage of adding constants for petrol prices MPG or km/l for the vehicle etc into the calculations

[Guest Nigel G]

If you go through Dover-Calais route drive south you do not have to use the toll roads, may be some toll bridges, but you get to see some nice country side to look at as you travel,and it do not cost a lot to stop off at places. I was in Brittany last year(05) and was to use my brother-in-laws as a stop site but things went wrong and had to make other arrangements for stays at in France.That did not cost me only diesel.So I was happy to be on the Dover-Calais route,because I had made enquires at going from Newheaven,Portsmouth,and Plymouth and the cost of travel with the ferry companies was to high compared with driving on the roads in France.Or driving in Europe any where come to think of it.

[Guest Brian Kirby]

Nigel All absolutely true. But I was trying to illustrate how the fuel costs and tolls mount up if you do what so may do, and hurtle off to Spain trying to minimise time spent in France. Given the additional cost of travel in terms of tolls and fuel from Calais, I just got the impression that some folk may not be taking these eztra expenses into account when jubilantly comparing various Dover crossings and finding a £10 saving! It seemed to me that some folk weren't looking at the whole journey cost; possibly assuming that the tolls/fuel costs from other channel ports would work out about the same, whereas they do not. However, even if you don't use the Autoroutes (or if you just avoid the toll ones), the extra time and fuel cost to W or SW France from Calais is likely to involve one additional overnight stay as well as extra fuel. The true saving in financial terms is not that great, but add in the time saved as well, and some of the more Western crossings can look much more appealing than the cost of the tickets alone may suggest. I live near Newhaven, and Transmanche have reduced fares for a motorhome in 2006 to between £120 and £187 return with singles and 5 day returns also available. New ferries (newly built) due in service in April and JUne. Dieppe is nicer than Calais (we didn't destroy so much of it during the war!) and it saves me hacking up to Dover in order to hack all the way back on the other side. Also, (declared interest!) I admit it, I want Newhaven Dieppe to survive as a route and think Dover gets far too much of the traffic! It's all horses for courses, you see? I do agree about the Autoroutes, though. The D, and less busy N, roads are far pleasanter to drive, and you see so much more of the country as you go. But, you'll never persuade those folk who think the French are all, to a man and woman robbers and vagabonds, awaiting your arrival with huge gas cylinders intent on robbery, rape and who knows what else! Regards Brian

[Guest Ian]

Hi Brian, You are quite correct in saying that it is the whole cost that is important. I used to live close to where you are (I was at Pevensey)and when we travelled to Spain some years ago we went Portsmouth - Le Havre to save travelling through that part of France from Calais down. The route we were taking meant that we were to be on the same roads from about Rouen if memory serves. But the next time, travelling from where we are now (in Lowestoft), Dover is only any good to us if we our eventual destination is east of a line south from Calais. This was fine for us when going to Geneva last year. I think that looking at it this way works and will continue until such times as we have to start worrying about road tolls in the UK. But sometimes you have to balance cost against time. Bringing time into the equation alters everything. Horses for Courses, I believe. Regards, Ian.