Newbie MH purchaser after buying advise.

[stagger321]

Hi all,

 

Looking to purchase a used Motorhome, sometime next year, but after a bit of advice from you fine knowledgeable people.

 

There will be three of us using it (including my 6ft son). so I am after a min of 3 or 4 berth unit with 3/4 belted seats.

As we are likely to take our dog with us, we will likely need sufficient usable space, so I guess we are likely looking at an end U-Lounge, or at least on not set up with a fixed double bed?

We would be looking for something suitable to travel to/from mainland Europe as well as for UK based vacations (assuming Brexit would allow this - but lets not go down that wormhole).

 

I have concerns about life expectancy of the Motorhome, mainly due to increasingly restrictive Euro and UK Low-Emission regulations, so want some that will last a few years.

Having said that initially I have a limited budget - in the £20-30k area. I may be able to squeeze to a bit more for the right motorhome.

So, I don't want something I can't use in a few years due to regulations, or sell, because its LEZ restricted. But I can't go mad money wise.

 

Having said all that I am aiming to have a rental MH holiday first, so we are happy we have made the right choice on this ongoing choice of vacation.

 

Any advice gratefully accepted.

[Will86]

Good morning Stagger and family and welcome.

 

You seem to have set off as a wise owner by hiring first. Do take your time as there are many variations and when you consider you've found one that suits the family then post on here with the make and year and ask the owners of that make (and others) for their thoughts. If you search you may find there's an owners group of the same make.

 

From what we read many have water problems and as the basic construction of many M/H's start off with wooden supports they can become prone to absorbing water and therefore rotting either costing the owner or reselling at a loss.

 

Also judge if you or the family are good at DIY as there is almost always something to be adjusted, even on new expensive types very little is perfect. One advantage with a used vehicle is that many of the problems have been sorted.

 

Above all take your time ... I took several years and hired twice, I was also a self employed van drive of many sizes so there's a lot to be considered here.

 

 

[Zydeco Joe]

Best to take your time and look at as many motorhomes as you can , go to shows etc but don't buy on first look. Go back a couple of times if you can but I know that is not as easy as it sounds. Great that you are renting first especially if you have no MH experience. Think where you are going to park it home is by far the best place if you can. Will you son be going with you in 2 or 3 years time ?. Do you only plan on summer trips if so he might be able to use a small tent to sleep in so the van could be a smaller one and the smaller the better as far as I'm concerned (parking driving ferrys etc)). Lots of good vans out at dealers, also don't just go for low mileage its not always a sign of a good van !!!. Most vans will do 200000 or more in its life so going for one with say just 5000 after 5 years is not really any advantage. Me I did 50000 in about 6 years and no real problems and that was on a 2005 model. Now have a new Carado from purchased Telford (I see you are Midlands based). B-)

[Brock]

Hello Stagger, and welcome.

 

I suggest, if you haven't already done so, you look at the advice already on the internet such as:

 

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/motorhomes/content/motorhome-buyers-guide

 

https://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/motorhomes/buyers-guide/motorhomes/

 

It will help provide context to the experiences of motorhomers on this forum.

 

I will often start the search for a motorhome by determining what I cannot have. There is just too much choice in motorhomers so excluding some at the outset is worthwhile. You've already started this by determining budget, family size, and the type of holiday you intake to enjoy. Without a C1 licence entitlement you are limited to a maximum authorised mass of 3500kg. This will reduce your options for a family of 3 plus dog significantly.

 

https://www.gov.uk/driving-motorhome

 

Length and width and where will your store the van can also limit your choice..

 

 

[Tracker]

Maybe start by visiting dealers and shows where there are lots to see to determine which layouts might work for you and which will not, and probably better if all three of you look together initially.

 

Get the layout wrong and you probably won't keep the van long but get it right and you will hopefully love it for a long while?

 

Every used van is on sale for a reason, some because the layout did not work and some because they were troublesome or unreliable or leaky!

 

There are some because the owners have 'retired' from touring and some because the owners wanted to update their holiday experiences, best to bear that all in mind when looking!

[Brian Kirby]

As everyone else has said, you're doing it right! All I would add is to be very wary of payload allowances, and be certain that you have fully understood exactly how they are calculated for any vans that interest you. The figures used, how they are derived, and what the terminology means, trips may buyers - not limited to those buying for the first time - and don't assume they will all follow the same rulebook - they don't!

 

I would also endorse the advice to look at as many as you can, irrespective of price, to judge what internal layout you all think would suit you, and then try to hire something similar to evaluate not just whether motorhoming suite you, but also that type of layout. For example, you mention that your son is a six footer, he may find the average motorhome bed too short so he should ideally showroom test his perch to be sure. There is a huge choice of makes and models, and choosing is a long and winding road!

 

Good luck, and do come back for further details of any you are drawn to, for insights into the pros and cons as experienced by owners.

[stagger321]

Morning all,

 

Thanks for the advice, as I said it is appreciated. I will bear it in mind and hopefully choose wisely.

Its in my nature to do quite a bit of analysis anyway before I pull the trigger.

We did attend the large Brum/NEC Caravan/Motorhome show a few years back, but for reasons I won't bore you with, we never went any further. This time things are more committed.

WRT MH storage - we don't have the space outside our current house, but we are looking at moving next year anyway, and better outside parking is one of the absolute musts. I have looked into Caravan/MH storage sites, but don't want to go down that route unless absolutely necessary.

WRT payloads, I did check this and being in my fifties I do have C1 on my license. Having said that I will try to keep to the 3500kg limit if I can - so that my son would be able to use at some time in the future.

The choice people have these days is fantastic, but also extremely daunting.

 

I'll post, when we get something, or ask advice beforehand, as we choose.

 

Thanks again

[Tracker]

Speaking from experience, finding a suitable home in an acceptable location with motorhome parking space can in itself be quite a challenge.

Many newer homes have restrictive covenants prohibiting caravan boat or motorhome parking and some sellers and agents are delightfully vague when asked.

You may need to be quite firm before making an offer based on no covenants and find out for sure before conveyancers start work, making sure the conveyancers know your criteria before they start.

I wish you luck!!

[Brian Kirby]

stagger321 - 2018-10-26 7:38 AM...............WRT payloads, I did check this and being in my fifties I do have C1 on my license. Having said that I will try to keep to the 3500kg limit if I can - so that my son would be able to use at some time in the future...………..Thanks again

How much payload you will need will depend on how you end-up using your van. You will be three adults plus one dog. If you end up using it for extended periods in the "off" seasons, as we and many others do, you will inevitably need to carry more "stuff" (mainly clothing and bedding, to cope with seasonal as well as geographical climate changes), so will need more payload. Ditto if you get round to considering skiing trips, where you will need a lot of gas for heating, plus a lot more warm clothing - and don't for get that Alpine winter temperatures go way below our UK winter range, especially on clear nights at altitude, where -40C is not unusual!

 

Manufacturers usually only allow a nominal 75kg for the driver, whereas it is the actual weight of the driver and passengers that counts.

 

They also install a 100 litre water tank, but calculate payload on the basis that the user will travel with only 20 litres on board. Few (if any!) provide a way of determining when the tank contains 20 litres. Fill the tank, and you lose 80kg of payload (@ 1kg/litre).

 

Most determine payload with fuel tank 90% full, but no tank meter shows 90% full. In real life most of us fill the tank when we re-fuel (diesel is about 0.85kg/litre). Most fuel tanks are in the region of 80/90 litres, so bang goes another 8 or so kg. Small, but, as they say, every little helps.

 

The size of the gas locker will determine how many cylinders of what size can be carried. My personal view is that single cylinder gas lockers are pretty much useless and that carrying a connected spare is essential. I also very much favour automatic changeover between service and reserve cylinders for that time when the gas runs out half way through cooking a meal when it is tipping rain - trust me, it will happen! :-) Personal view is that two 6kg cylinders is the practical working minimum, with a strong preference for 2 x 13kg.

 

Back to payload, the nominal weight of the gas cylinder is merely the weight of the gas. The commonly available UK 6kg cylinder itself weighs about 10kg, and a 13kg cylinder about 15kg. So, the actual all-in weight of cylinders plus gas will be in the region of 16kg total for a nominal 6kg cylinder, and 28kg for a nominal 13kg cylinder. Where payload is concerned, manufacturers (I think invariably) allow in their calculations for only a single cylinder, so the reserve must be deducted from payload. In addition, German vans tend to quote payload with a single 11kg aluminium cylinder (common German cylinder) on board, with an all-in weight in the region of 17kg, so substituting two 13kg steel cylinders will reduce payload by 43kg!

 

Apologies if your researches have already told you these little things, but so many folk buy vans plated at 3,500kg and then have to get them re-plated to a higher MAM to make them workable which, in my opinion, is never as satisfactory as getting the van on the right chassis at the outset. The main residual problem is then that uprating the MAM does nothing to increase the permissible axle loads, and it is invariably the case that one or other (usually the rear) axle becomes overloaded well before the van hits its new, increased, MAM limit, so much of the expected advantage is lost.

 

What I'm really arguing, is that for use exceeding the odd weekend of fortnight, and bearing in mind your passenger manifest, I think you really need a van exceeding 3,500kg MAM, with higher axle load limits than any up-plated 3,500kg van can offer.

 

The extra cost on a Fiat based van if ordered new, for specifying the "maxi" chassis option, is not great even if you then decide to have it delivered down plated to 3,500kg so your son could drive it. Then, if you find it doesn't work at that 3,500kg, uprating to 3,850kg or even 4,000kg will work properly - because the maxi has higher axle load limits than the standard 3,500kg chassis. I appreciate that you are not thinking of buying new, but prioritising vans on the maxi chassis (they are a distinct minority) will at least reduce the pool you have to evaluate to get what you want in other respects. If you can't find one, you'll have to look at the possibility of up-rating a 3,500kg van, but at least you'll have some idea of what to expect down that route. Hope this helps a bit! :-)