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Yuasa L36-EFB


weldted

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Will, I take your point, but the difference between something electrical working 'OK' and something being at optimum for the same cost can be a difference of 100%.

An example is Solar Power battery charging, we have seen 'working' solutions that deliver just 30% of their potential. Just simple, low cost changes can lead to a Solar harvest much greater than before.

 

 

 

Dipsticks the Yuasa L36-EFB is slightly better technology than the Yuasa CX - YuMicron batteries so has a slightly higher State Of Charge than those in the table below.

 

However, bear in mind that a new battery isn't usually near it's full capability for about 20 charge/discharge cycles.

You will see from the second graph below that a new fully charged Hankook is only 85% of it's potential when new, and takes nearly 60 charge/discharge cycles to reach full capability.

 

1043787480_BatteryYuasastateofChargeChart.jpg.a74e07be2db5bc68a9fa0ff1b53f5712.jpg

2144007355_Hankookdc31chargedischargecapacitygraphsmall.jpg.17281f7bdd1b73b026e384be26174db5.jpg

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The potential that the equipment may not be working favorably was the reason for posting the question!

It's is a know item ( batteries) being charged by a known item (charger) as to what results (may) be achevied. The batteries are approaching six months old and have had some 40 plus cycles with a minimum 70% of charge remaining.

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Hello Weldted, before I bought my new L36-EFB batteries I asked Yuasa directly some questions and subsequently received the following answers from their Technical Services Manager. I will be treating this as gospel in using my new batteries.

 

Here are the answers I received, I hope this helps:-

 

Quote

 

"Please find the answers to your questions below:

 

...Fully Charged 100% voltage - 12.75V (consult your controller manual on this, as this voltage represents stabilised battery voltage without surface charge. Surface charge voltage is likely to peak at 13.2V during charging).

 

 

 

...Voltage before re-charge required – ideally no lower than 12.2V to avoid over-discharge. This will ensure longer battery life by avoiding damage by excessive deep-cycling.

 

...Recommended bulk charge voltage. - 14.4V ± 0.2V on bulk/fast charge.

 

...Recommended float charge voltage. - 13.6V ± 0.2V.

 

...Maximum charge voltage permissible. - 14.8V.

 

Please note that these are only general guidelines for charging and results will vary depending on your equipment specification and usage habits."

 

End of quote

 

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dipsticks - 2019-01-13 10:18 PM

Hello Weldted, ...Voltage before re-charge required – ideally no lower than 12.2V to avoid over-discharge. This will ensure longer battery life by avoiding damage by excessive deep-cycling. ...End of quote

 

I'm a bit confused by the above comment and have been by several others that have quoted a minimum battery voltage that it is better not to go below.  Does this quoted voltage relate to the battery in its "resting" state or when under load?  I have a Waeco compressor fridge and when it is drawing power from my Yuasa efb the voltage can quite easily drop to 12.2 or less but when the fridge thermostat cuts the fridge off voltage rises again to much healthier looking value.  The fridge also has its own cutoff voltage value of 10.7v in common with some other 12v equipment.  I would have thought any battery down to 10.7 volts would be in trouble from what I've read in various threads on this forum.  But of course that 10.7v would be under load so fridge cuts out, batttery voltage rises, fridge cuts back in, voltage drops etc.

Clarification welcome

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Stuwsmith - 2019-01-14 5:40 PM

 

dipsticks - 2019-01-13 10:18 PM

Hello Weldted, ...Voltage before re-charge required – ideally no lower than 12.2V to avoid over-discharge. This will ensure longer battery life by avoiding damage by excessive deep-cycling. ...End of quote

 

I'm a bit confused by the above comment and have been by several others that have quoted a minimum battery voltage that it is better not to go below.  Does this quoted voltage relate to the battery in its "resting" state or when under load?  I have a Waeco compressor fridge and when it is drawing power from my Yuasa efb the voltage can quite easily drop to 12.2 or less but when the fridge thermostat cuts the fridge off voltage rises again to much healthier looking value.  The fridge also has its own cutoff voltage value of 10.7v in common with some other 12v equipment.  I would have thought any battery down to 10.7 volts would be in trouble from what I've read in various threads on this forum.  But of course that 10.7v would be under load so fridge cuts out, batttery voltage rises, fridge cuts back in, voltage drops etc.

Clarification welcome

 

 

Yes Battery State Of Charge (SOC) voltages are always taken with zero load after resting a while, like 4 hours.

 

 

"But of course that 10.7v would be under load so fridge cuts out, batttery voltage rises, etc. Clarification welcome".

 

 

Many battery manufacturers are now on the same wave length with SOC voltages. We have charts from Yuasa, Banner and Atlabx/Hankook that show pretty much the same SOC's for the various technologies, just minor differences as to what construction, etc is in their batteries.

 

They all agree that 50% Depth Of Discharge is the ideal compromise between long life and usability and that equates to around 12.2v to 12.5v depending on the technology.

The BS EN 50342 leisure battery standard also uses 50% discharge as the limit the battery is discharged to when assessing the number of charge/discharge cycles a battery will deliver.

 

Exide list one of their batteries at about 250 cycles at 50% DOD but only 90 cycles at 80% DOD, so you can see how much going past 50% hits cycle life and why the manufacturers list this as the 'ideal' maximum.

 

 

If 12.4v (50%) is the ideal compromise between life and usability and 11.8v - 12.0v is regarded as fully discharged, you can see how much damage will be done by a discharge down to 10.7v.

 

Some of the battery 'protection' features in Motorhomes are woeful. Sargent use 9.5v before they shutdown some of their systems.

 

Attached is an AtlasBX chart (Lucas, Numax, Hankook, etc) demonstrating what we say above.

 

Compare that to the Yuasa chart also published above.

 

995641263_AtlasbxbatterySOCsmall.jpg.7ab1b5b73ed1eb74aa5dca28745517ed.jpg

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Strewth, thank you aandncaravan for answering Stuwsmith’s post it was way above my pay scale.

 

I quoted only the bare data I was given, as stated directly from Yuasa. For me, I have never let my voltage go below 12.3 in the past (though I don’t have a Compressor Fridge) and have for some time benefited from excellent battery life. Fortunately that has given me all the power I have required without inconvenience. I’m sure though others, need more and others, will just take more and replace batteries as required and think no more of it. Batteries and their use and lifespan just simply interest me, hence following all these threads.

 

I’m not sure but I’m thinking maybe, Allan typed Dipsticks instead of weldted above, but irrespective, the information given by him, was exactly the same when he said “ Yuasa L36-EFB is slightly better technology than the Yuasa CX-YuMicron” ie 12.75V as opposed to 12.7V…….and……exactly as stated by Yuasa’s Technical Manager, so as usual, Allan is correct.

 

So long as weldted got the answer he needed all is well, but I agree wholeheartedly when he mentioned ‘dismissive comments’ resulting in people being reluctant to post a question.

 

Quote

 

When I read comments as above I never understand how anything can be predictable with the varying weather and different makes of equipment that we all use, as long as an object works favourably over a period of time is that not good enough ?

 

Unquote

 

What is all that about ? Utter tosh in my opinion.

 

Good luck weldted.

 

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Thanks for the clarification Allan, now i just have to work out how, with my compressor fridge cutting in and out all day but never off for long, I can determine  that my Yuasa battery is down to the 12.2v halfway mark!! I have a BM1 monitor so will have to experiment by turning off the fridge when I am seeing say 12v on the monitor and see what voltage the battery recovers to.   
The other problem I have is that even with fridge off and everything else too there is a 35mA drain on the battery from the BM1, solar charger (I can disconnect the panels) and diesel heater.  So the battery is never truly has no load unless I disconnect one of the terminals
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Stuwsmith - 2019-01-15 8:22 AM

 

Thanks for the clarification Allan, now i just have to work out how, with my compressor fridge cutting in and out all day but never off for long, I can determine  that my Yuasa battery is down to the 12.2v halfway mark!! I have a BM1 monitor so will have to experiment by turning off the fridge when I am seeing say 12v on the monitor and see what voltage the battery recovers to.   

The other problem I have is that even with fridge off and everything else too there is a 35mA drain on the battery from the BM1, solar charger (I can disconnect the panels) and diesel heater.  So the battery is never truly has no load unless I disconnect one of the terminals

 

Dipsticks, you are right, I did type the name wrong!!

 

 

Stuwsmith, Having a very light 35ma draw on the battery will only drop the battery slightly, so won't be far offf the real SOC figure. But you will soon get to know that, maybe, 35ma draw takes about 0.2v 'off'' the real value.

It should be consistent enough that you can just 'add' 0.2v, or whatever, to the figure you see on the BM1 once you get to see the difference a couple of times.

 

 

 

 

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