tringy Posted March 26, 2014 Share Posted March 26, 2014 Hi All Please can anyone identify these fault codes on a fiat 2.3 ducato 130 maxie multijet 07 plate. I have been having problems on and off for sometime with when I start the engine it seems to go into a limp mode and smoke comes out the exhaut and I can't rev more than a 1000rpm but sometimes just by turning off the ignition and restarting the engine all seems fine and it drives fine. I had to call out the AA who found out the problems were code nos p250a p0402 p0683 p0403 and I would like to know what these codes are so that I may tackle the problem myself. I am lothed to take it to a main dealer after not having had good experiences with them in the past and reading some posts makes me even more reluctant to take it to a dealer. I would be grateful if anybody has any ideas that may point me in the right direction. Thanking you all in advance Regards Tringy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billggski Posted March 26, 2014 Share Posted March 26, 2014 No need to take it to a main dealer, any independant garage should be able to sort you out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spospe Posted March 26, 2014 Share Posted March 26, 2014 Have you had a look at: http://www.fiatforum.com/tech-talk/197403-eobd-error-code-list.html ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onecal Posted March 26, 2014 Share Posted March 26, 2014 Hi,Check out you EGR,,,Regards,Brendan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 The error codes are related to EGR valve and Wastegate valve on Turbo, and you have another code 0863 indicating glow plug module malfunction. It is probably the glow plugs themselves and all 4 have burned out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 Information from the Fiat Forum suggests the following explanations for the quoted Ducato-related fault codes: P250A - Engine Oil Level Sensor P0402 - EGR circuit; Air-flow measured lower than the reference value. P0683 - Pre-Heater Module feedback. P0403 - EGR electrovalve; short-circuit to earth. The codes are also listed on Pages 69 and 70 of this file http://tinyurl.com/qzoqfc3 and described as follows: P250A - Engine oil level sensor P0402 - EGR valve P0683 - Preheating control unit (feedback) P0403 - EGR valve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tringy Posted March 27, 2014 Author Share Posted March 27, 2014 Many thanks.how do I correct these problems? By replacing them and is egr part of the throttle body? And would i have to replace the turbo?.i would appreciate any help on this. Regards. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 Derek, I have it as 520 is Engine Oil Pressure Sensor/Switch Circuit Malfunction Have you accidently tranposed 250 to 520 when you looked it up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 tringy. P0250 Turbocharger Wastegate Solenoid B High according to my list. So very unlikely you need to replace the turbo. It might be the waste gate valve is stuck and just needs operating a few times. Or might be a faulty solenoid but to be honest i am not sure exactly what this fault could refer to apart from being related to the solenoid and not the actual turbo. The EGR faults are most likely a failed valve but could be the control circuit for it. The preheat one is probably very easy and is blown glow plug heaters. Basically means starting in very cold weather is harder and emissions when warming up from cold will be higher. edit. The EGR valve is separate from the throttle body. Not sure where it sits on your vehicle but there wil be pipe running from the exhaust to it and then the valve controls what feeds back into the inlet manifold. It may be electrically or vacuum operated. I suspect electrically on your engine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 Brambles - 2014-03-27 8:54 AM Derek, I have it as 520 is Engine Oil Pressure Sensor/Switch Circuit Malfunction Have you accidently tranposed 250 to 520 when you looked it up? Come on - surely you cannot be serious? ;-) ;-) I did provide a link to a Fiat Ducato Traning Academy document (which one would hope would be accurate, but who knows?). If you look on Pages 69 and 70 on the following link http://tinyurl.com/qzoqfc3 you'll see the codes listed. P250A - Engine oil level sensor P0520 - Oil pressure switch (I did note that, in your first posting you seemed to have scrambled the "P0683" code to "0863" but, as your description "glow plug module malfunction" seemed to tally with the P0683 code, I concluded that it didn't matter.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will86 Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 And I thought life was supposed to be getting easier and stress free ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hallii Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 The codes are generated when a fault occurs. A fault with one item (like the EGR which I agree with Brendan on, it is the most likely culprit) can also cause other things to read out of parameters generating more codes. If it were me I would change the EGR valve first or at least remove it and check it, clear the fault codes and see how it goes. If you don't know where the valve is or what it looks like you might be better letting someone do it. Cheap parts (Ebay and the like) are usually poor quality, original parts are best. H Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 Hi Derek. This is the lists of generic codes I have. I have not copied them all as a massive long list but just those in the areas of interest. I got info from this list. However I see where you are coming from with the Fiat training manual and whilst it may well be correct it does seem confusing to use a P250 code sitting in a block of turbo charger faults. Mind you this is Fiat. Yes I did transpose the Preheater code...oops. Confusing or what! P0235 Turbocharger Boost Sensor A Circuit Malfunction P0236 Turbocharger Boost Sensor A Circuit Range/Performance P0237 Turbocharger Boost Sensor A Circuit Low P0238 Turbocharger Boost Sensor A Circuit High P0239 Turbocharger Boost Sensor B Circuit Malfunction P0240 Turbocharger Boost Sensor B Circuit Range/Performance P0241 Turbocharger Boost Sensor B Circuit Low P0242 Turbocharger Boost Sensor B Circuit High P0243 Turbocharger Wastegate Solenoid A Malfunction P0244 Turbocharger Wastegate Solenoid A Range/Performance P0245 Turbocharger Wastegate Solenoid A low P0246 Turbocharger Wastegate Solenoid A High P0247 Turbocharger Wastegate Solenoid B Malfunction P0248 Turbocharger Wastegate Solenoid B Range/Performance P0249 Turbocharger Wastegate Solenoid B Low P0250 Turbocharger Wastegate Solenoid B High P0251 Injection Pump Fuel Metering Control "A" Malfunction (Cam/Rotor/Injector) P0252 Injection Pump Fuel Metering Control "A" Range/Performance (Cam/Rotor/Injector) P0253 Injection Pump Fuel Metering Control "A" Low (Cam/Rotor/Injector) P0254 Injection Pump Fuel Metering Control "A" High (Cam/Rotor/Injector) P0255 Injection Pump Fuel Metering Control "A" Intermittent (Cam/Rotor/Injector) P0256 Injection Pump Fuel Metering Control "B" Malfunction (Cam/Rotor/Injector) P0257 Injection Pump Fuel Metering Control "B" Range/Performance (Cam/Rotor/Injector) P0258 Injection Pump Fuel Metering Control "B" Low (Cam/Rotor/Injector) P0259 Injection lump Fuel Metering Control "B" High (Cam/Rotor/Injector) P0503 Vehicle Speed Sensor Intermittent/Erratic/High P0505 Idle Control System Malfunction P0506 Idle Control System RPM lower Than Expected P0507 Idle Control System RPM higher Than Expected P0510 Closed Throttle Position Switch Malfunction P0520 Engine Oil Pressure Sensor/Switch Circuit Malfunction P0521 Engine Oil Pressure Sensor/Switch Range/Performance P0522 Engine Oil Pressure Sensor/Switch Low Voltage P0523 Engine Oil Pressure Sensor/Switch High Voltage P0530 A/C Refrigerant Pressure Sensor Circuit Malfunction P0531 A/C Refrigerant Pressure Sensor Circuit Range/Performance P0532 A/C Refrigerant Pressure Sensor Circuit Low Input P0533 A/C Refrigerant pressure Sensor Circuit High Input P0534 Air Conditioner Refrigerant Charge Loss P0550 Power Steering Pressure Sensor Circuit Malfunction Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 Analysis.breakdown of a code. EOBD and OBD II diagnostic codes are composed of five characters; one letter followed by 4 digits, e.g. P0101. The first character is a letter. It identifies the "main system" where the fault originated. This will be one of the following systems: Letter System B Body C Chassis P Powertrain U Network (UART) The second character is a numeric digit. This identifies the type of code. Code type Explanation Generic (normally P0xxx) The definition for the code is defined in the EOBD / OBD-II standard and will be the same for all manufacturers. Manufacturer-specific (normally P1xxx) Where manufacturers feel that a code is not available within the generic list, they can add their own codes. The definitions for these are set by the manufacturer. In general, codes that begin with P0 are Generic codes, whereas codes that begin with P1 are manufacturer-specific. Additional code groups are however available to allow for expansion of these code lists. The full breakdown of the code groups is shown below: Powertrain codes P0xxx - Generic P1xxx - Manufacturer-specific P2xxx - Generic P30xx-P33xx - Manufacturer-specific P34xx-P39xx - Generic Chassis codes C0xxx - Generic C1xxx - Manufacturer-specific C2xxx - Manufacturer-specific C3xxx - Generic Body codes B0xxx - Generic B1xxx - Manufacturer-specific B2xxx - Manufacturer-specific B3xxx - Generic Network Communication codes U0xxx - Generic U1xxx - Manufacturer-specific U2xxx - Manufacturer-specific U3xxx - Generic The third character defines the specific system or sub-system within the car where the problem is located: Third character System or sub-system 1 Fuel and Air Metering 2 Fuel and Air Metering (injector circuit malfunction only) 3 Ignition System or Misfire 4 Auxiliary Emission Control System 5 Vehicle Speed Control and Idle Control System 6 Computer Output Circuits 7 Transmission 8 Transmission It should be noted that manufacturers are not required to follow the generic numbering system above for their manufacturer-specific codes (many do appear to follow these though). The fourth and fifth characters identify the section of the system causing the fault. There is no detailed list of the components indicated by these digits, as each system or sub-system will have many different components. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tringy Posted March 27, 2014 Author Share Posted March 27, 2014 Not sure whats the best way to tackel these probs, but is it best to buy parts from fiat dealers then? thanks . Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
euroserv Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 Hello. Don't be overly concerned with the fault codes. Think of it as; Symptom Likely cause Action. The symptom of smoking and not being willing to rev up points directly at the throttle body. This can be proved by removing the right hand air pipe from the back of the solenoid valve that hides behind the metal plate that drops down from the windscreen scuttle over the engine. Start the engine again and there should be no smoke and it will rev freely. This means that you will definitely need a new throttle body and the updated wiring connector for it. The codes that you are seeing may be just stored events and may be nothing to worry about. After you have replaced the throttle body; delete the codes and see what happens. No new codes and no engine management light means happy days. If you still get some codes coming up the next thing to do is fit an additional earth strap from the end of the gearbox to where the existing one fits to the chassis. If you still have a problem with odd warning lights you have a wiring problem which will be in the loom that sits below the nearside headlamp and in particular the connecting block that is located just under the fuse box. Do it in that order and you will minimise the cost. Replace sensors and other items before checking earths and wiring and you will be flushing your money down the drain. There are previous articles on this forum regarding these subjects and others here are better at signposting them than I am plus I have to do some work! I will be around most days and will help as quickly as I can. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 The voice of sensibility above. Just in case, tringy, you are not aware ... Nick is the resident expert and vioce of reason having a large fleet he maintains and service. Where abouts are you in the country? I just ask as you never know you might be near someone who can help or a good garage someone knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 Brambles - 2014-03-27 10:47 AM Hi Derek. This is the lists of generic codes I have. I have not copied them all as a massive long list but just those in the areas of interest. I got info from this list. However I see where you are coming from with the Fiat training manual and whilst it may well be correct it does seem confusing to use a P250 code sitting in a block of turbo charger faults. Mind you this is Fiat... Whether it's a Fiat peculiarity or not, it's evident that a Ducato (and other makes/models of vehicle) can record a "P250A" fault code (which is what tringy reported his Ducato has done and, in my book, is not the same as a "P0250" code). This 2009 Fiat Forum thread refers http://www.fiatforum.com/ducato/220263-duacto-2006-2-3-liter-does-not-start.html and a GOOGLE-search on "fault code P250A" clearly indicates its meaning. For example http://www.aboutautomobile.com/DTC/P250A This earlier thread (that includes input from Nick) may help http://www.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/FIAT-X250-2-3Ltr-Engine-problem/34024/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 Sorry Derek, Penny has finally dropped, I am reading as p0250 not p250A. Silly Billy me, you are right it is the oil level sensor which is not covered by other oil pressure switch codes assignment. Sorry to lead everyone up the garden path -- So you can forget the turbo. What a fool I am. edit - But as Nick has said often codes are spurios and are stored form history going way back. Possibly from when oil change was done and ignition was switched on with oil level too low before being fully refilled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tringy Posted March 27, 2014 Author Share Posted March 27, 2014 Thanks again to all who have helped.l will sitdown and decide what I will do. I live near luton bedfordshire. Tringy. Dave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJay Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 tringy - 2014-03-27 2:44 PM Thanks again to all who have helped.l will sitdown and decide what I will do. I live near luton bedfordshire. Tringy. Dave. Do you live in TRING ? That's not far from Luton, but is in Hertfordshire Don't you know someone who works for/or did work for Vauxhall truck division? They may have an answer Just a thought PJay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sss Posted March 27, 2014 Share Posted March 27, 2014 If you are near Luton, I can recommend King St Motors in Barton Le Clay. We had a spot of bother with our Iveco. Iveco dealers were dire, long story short, they were happy to take money but not so keen on fixing! We then used King St and they were excellent and found the fault with our turbo, although the codes did point towards the EGR initially. They are very used to m/h's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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