Jump to content

off grid leisure battery, durite VSR setup


n1nja

Recommended Posts

I am looking for a wet acid off gid leisure battery, but it is so confusing.

I have a Durite VSR setup, 2002 hiace with 70 amp Alternator

 

Some people are saying ignore the NCC rating it dose not mean anything?

Yet others say you need a class A battery for of grid. I dont have a electric hook up.

 

Can you help please which of these is the better battery?

 

12v 100AH Exide ET650 Semi Traction Leisure Battery NCC Class A

https://www.alpha-batteries.co.uk/12v-100ah-exide-et650-leisure-battery-ncc-class-a/

 

or

12V 140AH Exide Leisure Battery (ER650) NCC Class C

https://www.alpha-batteries.co.uk/140-ah-exide-deep-cycle-leisure-battery/

 

Or is there a better wet acid battery for off grid?

 

is the class important or the aH?

 

running led lights, charging iphone and ipad

 

Thanks

Vincent

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi and welcome,

 

I would opt for a Varta LFD90.

 

https://www.tayna.co.uk/leisure-batteries/varta/lfd90/

 

They have been mentioned many, many times on the forum and always seem to get good reviews.

 

I have been using one as my leisure battery for around nine years now and still seems to be holding up well, although not used mush for the last twelve months :-(

 

Keith.

 

PS And the NCC Class ratings are basically 'paid for' ratings and AIUI the manufacturers quoted figures where used without any verification.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The late-Allan Evans liked the Exide ET650 battery ("Best Buy Heavy Duty”)

 

http://www.aandncaravanservices.co.uk/battery-technology.php

 

but Allan was much less fond of the NCC Verified Leisure Battery Scheme

 

http://www.aandncaravanservices.co.uk/campaign-for-battery-change.php

 

http://www.aandncaravanservices.co.uk/resources/NCC%20Verified%20Battery%20Scheme%20v5.0%20A%20and%20N%20Caravan.pdf

 

The current NCC listing is here

 

https://www.thencc.org.uk/downloads/Leisure%20Battery%20Register%20Aug2020.pdf

 

but I can’t see any sign of the Exide ER650 battery (or of any Exide battery with similar dimensions for that matter).

 

To some extent the choice is likely to come down to dimensions, weight and (perhaps) price.

 

The ER650 is tall (290mm) and heavy (35kg), whereas the ET650 is a good deal lower (190mm) and lighter (27kg). If the size/weight of the ER650 can be accommodated in Vincent’s Hiace camper, when fully charged it should then provide 12V power for a longer period than the ET650. On the other hand, if an ER650 were discharged well down, recharging it to 100% state would take a while.

 

As Keith has said, Varta’s LFD90 has gained a good reputation on this forum (and is relatively inexpensive).

 

https://www.batterymegastore.co.uk/product/varta-lfd90-dual-purpose-leisure-battery/

 

As alternative would be the Halfords HLB700

 

https://www.halfords.com/motoring/batteries/leisure-batteries/halfords-leisure-battery-hlb700-682063.html

 

that was mentioned here recently

 

https://forums.outandaboutlive.co.uk/forums/Motorhomes/Motorhome-Matters/Exploding-leisure-battery/56298/

 

and is essentially a re-badged Yuasa L36-EFB battery

 

https://www.alpha-batteries.co.uk/12v-yuasa-100ah-efb-leisure-battery-l36-efb/

 

The Exide ET650, the Varta and Halfords/Yuasa batteries all have much the same dimensions.

 

(I recently replaced my Rapido’s Banner-made leisure battery with a Varta LFD90 as a precautionary measure as the Banner battery was over 5 years old. I chose the LFD90 as it has a good reputation, had the same dimensions as the Banner battery, and I could obtain it locally for a discounted price. Waste of time really as the Rapido has only travelled about 17 miles since March this year and now seems unlikely to move more than a few metres before March 2021.)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thank you so much guys this brilliant information. feel like i am starting to get somewhere now thanks to your help

 

So looks like my choices are:

 

100ah Exide ET650 class a

100ah Yuasa L36-EFB class b

100ah Halfords HLB700 class b

90ah Varta’s LFD90 (no class)

 

these have also been recommend

12v 115AH Numax XDT30MF class (1200 cycles) Expensive

BANNER ENERGY BULL LEISURE BATTERY 95901 12V 115AH Class b

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

n1nja - 2020-09-30 6:00 PM

So looks like my choices are:

 

100ah Exide ET650 class a

100ah Yuasa L36-EFB class b

100ah Halfords HLB700 class b

90ah Varta’s LFD90 (no class)

 

these have also been recommend

12v 115AH Numax XDT30MF class (1200 cycles) Expensive

BANNER ENERGY BULL LEISURE BATTERY 95901 12V 115AH Class b

And my recommendations:

 

Forget about the NCC class, as I said above it is paid for marketing.

The Banner is a HIGH maintenance battery that will require at least monthly checking. If it is under a seat or similar you will soon regret it.

IMO the Numax is a budget battery.

 

So pick one from your top four and you should get good results from it.

 

Keith.

 

PS Some bedtime reading from the late Allan Evans...

http://www.aandncaravanservices.co.uk/campaign-for-battery-change.php

http://www.aandncaravanservices.co.uk/battery-technology.php

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have used Numax leisure batteries for the last 12 years without problem. Saying that. one of the pair I fitted in Feb 2019 has developed a fault (manufacturing fault?).

 

Just a word of warning if buying online ... Keep the box, the plastic bag and the packing that your battery came in. Tayna have strict rules about returning batteries. The packaging has to be just right and if you get a clumsy Courier who damages the packaging (and battery), you are stuffed for making a warranty claim. I decided just to buy a replacement elsewhere and cut my losses.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

NCC class is largely irrelevant. Ah number is quite relevant. However, it's also often a number that is not so easy to compare as capacity changes based on discharge current and some brands label their batteries at very small currents (like C100), most label at C20 and some go for "worst case" at C5. So if you see three batteries in same physical size and weight, but one is labeled as 100Ah, another as 90Ah and third as 120Ah, there's probably something not quite right if they don't also specify under what conditions. They are all most likely about the same when it comes to capacity. Cycling ability is a different matter.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

ok guessing im down to these 3 now as the battery will sit under the rock n roll bed

 

100ah Exide ET650 class a

100ah Yuasa L36-EFB class b

90ah Varta’s LFD90 (no class) (Maybe a Class b)

 

not sure what thier dischager Current is(c100, c20 or c5) ?

 

What about venting the batteries?

 

100ah Yuasa L36-EFB class b - This would need venting (which puts me off a bit)

 

90ah Varta’s LFD90 (no class) - Does not need venting

 

But I dont know if the 100ah Exide ET650 class a needs venting or not?

 

thanks again

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Quality brands mostly label capacity at C20 so these are comparable.

 

I have non vented LFDs under a (vented) bench. In theory hidrogen could accumulate within the entire van but I consider that largely unlikely as there are plenty of holes for air to go in/out, plus the large door opening every time you go in.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

how many vent holes are there on the following

 

100ah Exide ET650 class a

100ah Yuasa L36-EFB class b

90ah Varta’s LFD90 (no class) (Maybe a Class b)

 

Think some batteries have two vent holes so would i need 1 or 2 pipes?

 

guessing i would need to drill a hole in the floor to vent the pipe through too

Link to comment
Share on other sites

so thank you so much everyone.

 

based on everyone comments

 

looks like this order

 

1st Place - 100ah Exide ET650 class a

2nd Place - 100ah Yuasa L36-EFB class b

3rd Place - 90ah Varta’s LFD90

 

They all seem like really good batteries and will all need vent pipe/tube

 

Also definantley think any of the above would be suitable,

but I think I have place them in order of performance based on everyones help.

 

I guess the other factor is also the cost of the batteries.

 

Is the ET650, EFB technology? or something else?

 

thanks again

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is also strange the Yuasa L36-efb has Up to 1200 watt hours

And the Exide ET650 has upto 650 watt hour

not sure what the Varta LFD90 watt hour is?

 

does that mean the Yuasa L36-efb is better?

 

1st Place - 100ah Yuasa L36-EFB class b

2nd Place - 100ah Exide ET650 class a

3rd Place - 90ah Varta’s LFD90

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On this link Yuasa explains the rationale behind Enhanced Flooded Battery (EFB) technology

 

https://www.yuasa.it/en/information/automotive-commercial-leisure-marine/agm-efb-automotive-batteries-explained/#efb

 

The Exide ET650 is a ‘conventional' wet-acid battery (not EFB) with a 90Ah (20h) capacity.

 

If you want to go down the EFB route, the Halfords HLB700 may well be cheaper to source than its Yuasa L36-EFB twin.

 

Neither of the above batteries has the long-term reliability/performance history of the Varta LFD90. (The LFD90 is essentially the same battery as the Bosch L5013 (NCC Scheme - Class B)

 

https://www.alpha-batteries.co.uk/12v-90ah-bosch-powerframe-leisure-battery-l5013-lfd90/

 

but the Varta version can usually be obtained more cheaply.

 

I bought the Varta LFD90 (and a Varta starter-battery at the same time) but my motorcaravanning does not involve much off-campsite usage nowadays. If I wanted to do more ‘off grid’ touring I’d have fitted a pair of LFD90s.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Derek Uzzell - 2020-10-01 1:26 PM

 

On this link Yuasa explains the rationale behind Enhanced Flooded Battery (EFB) technology

 

https://www.yuasa.it/en/information/automotive-commercial-leisure-marine/agm-efb-automotive-batteries-explained/#efb

 

The Exide ET650 is a ‘conventional' wet-acid battery (not EFB) with a 90Ah (20h) capacity.

 

If you want to go down the EFB route, the Halfords HLB700 may well be cheaper to source than its Yuasa L36-EFB twin.

 

Neither of the above batteries has the long-term reliability/performance history of the Varta LFD90. (The LFD90 is essentially the same battery as the Bosch L5013 (NCC Scheme - Class B)

 

https://www.alpha-batteries.co.uk/12v-90ah-bosch-powerframe-leisure-battery-l5013-lfd90/

 

but the Varta version can usually be obtained more cheaply.

 

I bought the Varta LFD90 (and a Varta starter-battery at the same time) but my motorcaravanning does not involve much off-campsite usage nowadays. If I wanted to do more ‘off grid’ touring I’d have fitted a pair of LFD90s.

 

Thank you

 

do you know what the Varta LFD90 watt hour is?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Derek Uzzell - 2020-10-01 3:45 PM

 

Varta and Bosch do not provide a Watt-hour datum, but a 12V battery with a 90Ah capacity = 1080Wh apparently.

 

https://convert-formula.com/ah-wh

 

Varta battey that is impressive!!

so there really isnt much betweeen any of these batteries really. thats crazy.......

 

The L36-EFB would be 1200 watt hours @ 100 ah

 

But if the exide et650 says it 650 Watt hours that would be 54ah not 100ah ?

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

n1nja - 2020-10-01 4:18 PM

 

Derek Uzzell - 2020-10-01 3:45 PM

 

Varta and Bosch do not provide a Watt-hour datum, but a 12V battery with a 90Ah capacity = 1080Wh apparently.

 

https://convert-formula.com/ah-wh

 

Varta battey that is impressive!!

so there really isnt much betweeen any of these batteries really. thats crazy.......

 

The L36-EFB would be 1200 watt hours @ 100 ah

 

But if the exide et650 says it 650 Watt hours that would be 54ah not 100ah ?

 

 

Exide are rating the watt hours usage at a 50% discharge level, not a full 100% discharge which the Yuasa and Varta is rated.

 

Tho exide will need topping up with water?

 

Probably can't really go wrong with any of the three batteries and a cost per cycle may be a good method of making a decision

Link to comment
Share on other sites

n1nja - 2020-10-01 4:18 PM

 

so there really isnt much betweeen any of these batteries really. thats crazy.......

 

The L36-EFB would be 1200 watt hours @ 100 ah

 

But if the exide et650 says it 650 Watt hours that would be 54ah not 100ah ?

 

Nope. The ET650 provides 650 Watt hrs without exceeding its recommended depth of discharge, 50%.

 

Keep in mind that Varta sell the LFD as ‘Designed for motorhomes, caravans and boats with lower energy requirements – ideal for starting and light service applications’.

 

The Yuasa web site is clear that the L36-EFB battery is for use with electrical hook-up and minimal off-grid habitation usage.

 

Vincent does not have electric hookup so is more likely to discharge his batteries more frequently.

 

The LFD lasts around 200 cycles, the EFB likewise. Exide claims 350 cycles for the ET650.

Surely the choice of battery is down to how it's used, how it's discharged and at what rate, and how it's recharged.

 

I’d plumb for the only real leisure battery in the list and that’s the ET650. I'd also think about installing a B2B to charge it adequately from the atlernator and put it on a multi-stage mains charger every so often.

 

Regards

Andrew

Link to comment
Share on other sites

ageingandrew - 2020-10-01 5:12 PM

 

n1nja - 2020-10-01 4:18 PM

 

so there really isnt much betweeen any of these batteries really. thats crazy.......

 

The L36-EFB would be 1200 watt hours @ 100 ah

 

But if the exide et650 says it 650 Watt hours that would be 54ah not 100ah ?

 

Nope. The ET650 provides 650 Watt hrs without exceeding its recommended depth of discharge, 50%.

 

Keep in mind that Varta sell the LFD as ‘Designed for motorhomes, caravans and boats with lower energy requirements – ideal for starting and light service applications’.

 

The Yuasa web site is clear that the L36-EFB battery is for use with electrical hook-up and minimal off-grid habitation usage.

 

Vincent does not have electric hookup so is more likely to discharge his batteries more frequently.

 

The LFD lasts around 200 cycles, the EFB likewise. Exide claims 350 cycles for the ET650.

Surely the choice of battery is down to how it's used, how it's discharged and at what rate, and how it's recharged.

 

I’d plumb for the only real leisure battery in the list and that’s the ET650. I'd also think about installing a B2B to charge it adequately from the atlernator and put it on a multi-stage mains charger every so often.

 

Regards

Andrew

thank you,

think I am leaning more towards the ET650, tho the other batteries are still very impressive

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Firstly thank you to everyone for your replies and helpful information.

 

I have placed an order with Alpha Batteries who have been extremlely helpful too.

 

Went for the 12v 100AH Exide ET650 Semi Traction Leisure Battery NCC Class A

 

Was £154.99 Now £139.98!

 

then got a 5% discount code

 

So paid £132.98 Total inc shipping

 

Also the ET650 comes with a 4 year warranty!

So a fair price for that type of battery and that amount of warranty

 

thanks again

 

:-D

 

in comparison pricing the other batteries

 

Warranty on the other batterries

yuasa l36-efb is 3 year warranty @ £119.99

varta L36-EFB is 2 warranty @ £104.99

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The Varta LFD90 battery is offered by Battery Megastore for £97.50 (including delivery) with a 4 years warranty.

 

https://www.batterymegastore.co.uk/product/varta-lfd90-dual-purpose-leisure-battery/

 

I collected my two Varta batteries from the Battery Megastore premises at Tewkesbury and received a £10 discount. Collecting meant a 50 miles round trip, but I wanted to see the batteries and check their age before accepting them.

 

Received wisdom seems to be that an Exide battery has an indicator (stamped/etched?) on its upper surface in the following format:

 

The 1st two characters of the indicator show the date of manufacture. The 1st character is a number that gives the year and the 2nd character (A, B, C, etc.) is a letter that indicates the month. (So “9D” = 2019 April). The rest of the indicator shows the battery type/model. (Presumably, if the battery were made in (say) August 2020, the code would be “0H”.)

 

I believe the Exide ET650 is ‘maintainable’ (ie. its cell caps can be unscrewed in order to check and, if necessary, top up the electrolyte-level. You’d be wise to check the electrolyte-level when you receive the battery and also its state of charge.

 

My Varta batteries have a vent-hole in each end, but only one vent plug is provided (the plug needs to be separated from the battery’s plastic handle). Presumably, if the batteries had been couriered to me, the vent-holes would have been taped over.

 

This Exide ET650-related Tayna link

 

https://www.tayna.co.uk/leisure-batteries/exide/et650/?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI5PLel9qV7AIViaztCh1-yQ8BEAQYASABEgLdLvD_BwE

 

includes a customer review that mentions leakage, so that’s another thing to look out for. Unlike gel batteries that can be oriented any way up without leaking, or AGM batteries that can happily be installed on their side, wet-acid batteries are designed to tolerate only a limited degree of ‘tilt’ and - if transported on their end, side, or upside down - their electrolyte will leak out.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...