cid Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 Hi Derek, over the years I have come to respect your knowledge and research skills. I am having a hell of a time finding the correct gearbox oil for my fiat motorhome. there is so much coflicting info. Vehicle details- 1996 ducato 1.9td. x230 3000 engine. vin zfa23000005324717 or zfa2300000s324717. (transcription error on registration certificate. first vin on vehicle) I know it's an old chestnut but i'm hoping you have some insight into this matter All the Best, ian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caddies104 Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 Maybe 10w 40 semi Synthetic, but will wait for Derek Another Derek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 Logically, the oil to use is the one specified in a vehicle’s handbook (or an oil that meets the specification given in the handbook). It would appear from online comments (example here) https://www.fiatforum.com/ducato/428163-engine-oil-1997-ducato.html that the Fiat handbook in the early/mid 1990s was recommending for diesel-fuelled Ducatos 15W/40 mineral oil, but nowadays 15W/40 semi-synthetic should be OK too. I note that Halfords currently have the latter on offer (£15.99 for 5 litres) but you’d need to check the specification. If you don’t have the relevant Fiat handbook for your Ducato, you might ask about this on the Fiat Forum https://www.fiatforum.com/ as someone there may have access to the handbook and be able to confirm what it says. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spirou Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 Not to argue with Derek but the OP is asking for gearbox oil, not engine oil. My search leads me to 75W-90, API GL4/5, MT1, MIL-L-2105 E Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 spirou - 2021-08-30 7:39 PM Not to argue with Derek but the OP is asking for gearbox oil, not engine oil. My search leads me to 75W-90, API GL4/5, MT1, MIL-L-2105 E Have he been known to be wrong ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cid Posted August 31, 2021 Author Share Posted August 31, 2021 Hi Spirou, Many thanks for your reply. Your gearbox oil recommendation is in line with some of the information I've found and I think you may be right. However, if anyone out there can confirm this before I purchase and change the oil I would be very grateful. I, also, believe the quantity required to be 2.7ltrs but I will measure what I remove. Thanks to everyone for your help. All the Best, Ian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 witzend - 2021-08-30 8:32 PM spirou - 2021-08-30 7:39 PM Not to argue with Derek but the OP is asking for gearbox oil, not engine oil. My search leads me to 75W-90, API GL4/5, MT1, MIL-L-2105 E Have he been known to be wrong ? Seldom wrong - occasionally myopic. ;-) The oil specification advised by Spirou seems to be universally quoted online as being appropriate for a 1996 Ducato with 1.9TD motor (example here) https://www.opieoils.co.uk/f/706233/19917/1996/gearbox-oil.aspx but I think the 2.7litres quantity mentioned by Ian relates to later Ducatos. This link suggests 1.9 litres. https://talbotoc.com/gearbox-oil-change-t15096.html (In 1964 I bought a Turner kit-car (two previous owners) and decided to change the oil in the engine, gearbox and rear axle. There was a data-plate in the engine compartment that stated the grade of oil to be used in each case, with 30-grade oil given for the gearbox - so that’s what I put in. Turners were fitted with BMC or Ford motors and mine had a 1340cc Ford powerplant - but I hadn’t appreciated that the data-plate related to the BMC version and the Ford gearbox should have had 80-grade oil. The gearbox tolerated the thin oil and survived my unmerciful thrashing until (a long time later) I realised my error and swapped the oil to the correct 80-grade. With hindsight It had been noticeable that, when 30-grade oil was in the gearbox, all the ‘cogs’ kept spinning merrily between gearchanges, and it says a lot for the resilience of old Ford 4-speed transmissions.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cid Posted August 31, 2021 Author Share Posted August 31, 2021 Hi Derek, Thanks for the update. My van has the 5 speed manual gearbox where the 5th gear was a later addition. The extra oil capacity is to allow the oil to splash onto the newly added gear. I know it sounds a bit Heath Robinson but that's Fiat for ya. The same as neglecting to design a proper filling point and expecting me to find a suitable orifice in which to pour the new oil.This information was gleaned from several online sites so i'm hoping it is accurate. Anyway, here goes. I'll order the oil and proceed with caution. Thanks once again to all. I would shout Geronimo but, sadly, the government has just shot him. Ian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 I'm aware of the 5th gear 'add-on' (and the many complaints about it) but I was under the impression that it was the 5-speed gearbox fitted to the 2.8litre motor that had a 2.7litre oil capacity not the 1.9TD's gearbox. Anyway (assuming there are no signs of oil leakage having occurred and the right amount was put in the last time the oil was changed) if around 2.7 litres of oil drain out you'll know that's the correct quantity to put back in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cid Posted August 31, 2021 Author Share Posted August 31, 2021 Cheers Derek, You may be right, however, I've ordered 3ltrs of oil and will proceed with caution. I may end up with quite a bit of spare oil but it's only money. I will let the forum know of the result incase anyone else needs the information. Ian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cid Posted September 3, 2021 Author Share Posted September 3, 2021 Hi All, Just to let you know, I'm afraid I chickened out and went to see my garage. They cofirmed the 75w90 as being the correct gearbox oil and that it was a bitch of a job to do because of all the different cofigurations of gearbox. Plus, the work is best done with the van level. So, as I'd already bought the oil, they are going to do the job for £25. Big weight off my mind. Hope this helps anyone else thinking of doing a DIY gearbox oil change on a Fiat. Consult the pros. with right equipment. Thanks all for your help. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 I believe there was little doubt that the correct grade of oil was 75W-90 - the real issue was establishing the appropriate quantity of oil to put into your motorhome's gearbox. Hopefully your garage knows this... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cid Posted September 3, 2021 Author Share Posted September 3, 2021 Cheers Derek, They are going to measure what comes out because they were not sure of quantities. they are not doing the job until 20th Sept. but I will let the forum know the result for info. purposes. All the Best. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
23addy46 Posted September 3, 2021 Share Posted September 3, 2021 Hi All - Re these enquiries - From my experience with an early example of the "tagged on the side - 5th gear type gearboxes", May I offer the same excellent advise passed to me 20 + years ago following the 3rd set of the infamous '5th gear replacement' THIS IS AS SIMPLE AS - NEVER ENGAGE 5TH GEAR UNTILL THE VAN HAS BEEN DRIVEN APPROX 4 or 5 Miles FROM COLD ! This works because of the gearbox design - in that as anyone who worked on this gearbox type will know - The 5th gear set is 'outside' the main Gearbox Casting. With Its ONLY oil feed being a 'drip from above via a small 'gutter' that is splash fed from inside the main gearbox casting as and when the van is started to be driven, hence the 'dry' 5th gear set is put under load before having the benefit of the oil bath the main gearbox cogs have... This was ducumented many years past by THE most knowledgeable of Ducato mechanics (from Leciester) sorry my age/memory prevents remembering his name... Yet another example of 'Sleep Motor Home Syndrome' problems... Take Care, Dave Adams, Leyland Lancashire's Central Desert Area ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cid Posted September 22, 2021 Author Share Posted September 22, 2021 Hi all (again), Had oil changed but problem persists. Quantity used 1.85 ltrs. I am, therefore, confronted with the challenge of locating and purchasing a new 2nd gear. Part No 9627508788 for an18-35 ratio gearbox, unless someone has one lying around. This, also, is reliant on the gearbox being original. On a 24year old van this is not a given. However, the van is still driveable, with care, by double declutching, dropping the revs or missing out 2nd altogether. Any ideas would be very welcome. All the Best. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted September 22, 2021 Share Posted September 22, 2021 I don't recall any previous mention of a problem with the gearbox! If you have problems with engaging that gear it is most likely to be a bearing worn, or similar, that's a box out and rebuild, if you where in UK I would say contact someone like A1 gearboxes in St Neots who have rebuilt a couple of boxes for me in past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebishbus Posted September 22, 2021 Share Posted September 22, 2021 cid .The gearbox on your model has changed several times. If you need spares you will have to quote the type identification on your particular gearbox. Brian B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cid Posted September 22, 2021 Author Share Posted September 22, 2021 cheers Bishbus, At the risk of sounding a bit of an ignoramous, will the gearbox have identirication numbers on it? and, if so, where. At 68 I'm not as fit as I was but I have a pair of good commercial ramps (seldom used these days). What I am trying to avoid is taking the van into a local gearbox specialist, them taking it apart and then coming up with an extortionate quote for repair. I am from Yorkshire afterall. Plus, the less time the van is off the road the better as it is my only vehicle. All the Best. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 This link https://www.proxyparts.com/wiki/gearbox-codes/make/fiat/model/ducato/ suggests that the code for your gearbox would be 20KE08 Advice in this Fiat Forum thread https://www.fiatforum.com/ducato/431099-gearbox-model-number.html is "The code number is stamped on casing under the drives shafts output you need to jack it van up or use mirror”. See also https://vanservices.co.uk/product/boxer-relay-1-9-d-5-speed-gearbox-fits-1995-2000-20ke08/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebishbus Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 cid . Also have a look on the 5th gear extension cover. Brian B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hans Posted September 24, 2021 Share Posted September 24, 2021 Just crazy to read above comments 0n gearbox oil. The most important to replace it at right intervals By a Competent Dealer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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