More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
userpelmetman
Posted: 9 February 2019 3:40 PM
Subject: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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..........

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1084402/EU-news-Germany-Angela-Merkel-European-Commission-law-rule-Court-of-Justice

Under EU 'supremacy' laws Euro-legislation trumps national legislation in almost all cases.

But Germany has fiercely protected its own sovereignty thorough shrewd and uncompromising legal moves.

Ruddy hypocrites ..........
userFast Pat
Posted: 9 February 2019 4:04 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 
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pelmetman - 2019-02-09 3:40 PM

..........

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1084402/EU-news-Germany-Angela-Merkel-European-Commission-law-rule-Court-of-Justice

Under EU 'supremacy' laws Euro-legislation trumps national legislation in almost all cases.

But Germany has fiercely protected its own sovereignty thorough shrewd and uncompromising legal moves.

Ruddy hypocrites ..........


Did you actually read what you linked too? An academic "Dr Beck argues" that German laws MIGHT have supremacy. Fine he can test it just like Rees Mogg did at the Court of Appeal in 1993 over the signing of the Maastricht Treaty - I'll give you a clue he lost.
userpelmetman
Posted: 9 February 2019 4:11 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Fast Pat - 2019-02-09 4:04 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-09 3:40 PM

..........

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1084402/EU-news-Germany-Angela-Merkel-European-Commission-law-rule-Court-of-Justice

Under EU 'supremacy' laws Euro-legislation trumps national legislation in almost all cases.

But Germany has fiercely protected its own sovereignty thorough shrewd and uncompromising legal moves.

Ruddy hypocrites ..........


Did you actually read what you linked too? An academic "Dr Beck argues" that German laws MIGHT have supremacy. Fine he can test it just like Rees Mogg did at the Court of Appeal in 1993 over the signing of the Maastricht Treaty - I'll give you a clue he lost.



"Eurosceptic MPs said the treaty would give the EU greater powers at the expense of Westminster. They saw it as a step down the road to a centralised federal EU. And they were implacably opposed the UK joining a single European currency.

In the Lords, the former Conservative Prime Minister Baroness Thatcher said that the treaty would "diminish democracy and increase bureaucracy".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44924844

How right they were ...............



Edited by pelmetman 2019-02-09 4:18 PM
userBulletguy
Posted: 9 February 2019 5:06 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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pelmetman - 2019-02-09 4:11 PM

Fast Pat - 2019-02-09 4:04 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-09 3:40 PM

..........

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1084402/EU-news-Germany-Angela-Merkel-European-Commission-law-rule-Court-of-Justice

Under EU 'supremacy' laws Euro-legislation trumps national legislation in almost all cases.

But Germany has fiercely protected its own sovereignty thorough shrewd and uncompromising legal moves.

Ruddy hypocrites ..........


Did you actually read what you linked too? An academic "Dr Beck argues" that German laws MIGHT have supremacy. Fine he can test it just like Rees Mogg did at the Court of Appeal in 1993 over the signing of the Maastricht Treaty - I'll give you a clue he lost.



"Eurosceptic MPs said the treaty would give the EU greater powers at the expense of Westminster. They saw it as a step down the road to a centralised federal EU. And they were implacably opposed the UK joining a single European currency.

In the Lords, the former Conservative Prime Minister Baroness Thatcher said that the treaty would "diminish democracy and increase bureaucracy".

Selective quoting = major fail! From your own link;

Lord Rees-Mogg went to court to stop the Maastricht treaty from becoming UK law - but judges supported the government's position, on all the issues.

"The outcome was even better than our lawyers had expected," Sir Roderic Lyne wrote on a note.

John Major enjoyed the moment. "Good," he wrote on the document, "a full gloat is merited."


Getting the treaty through the Commons took a year. Those who opposed it, from the Labour as well as Conservative benches, were vocal and well organised. But by July 1993 the end of the process was in sight.


userFast Pat
Posted: 9 February 2019 5:07 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 
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pelmetman - 2019-02-09 4:11 PM

Fast Pat - 2019-02-09 4:04 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-09 3:40 PM

..........

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1084402/EU-news-Germany-Angela-Merkel-European-Commission-law-rule-Court-of-Justice

Under EU 'supremacy' laws Euro-legislation trumps national legislation in almost all cases.

But Germany has fiercely protected its own sovereignty thorough shrewd and uncompromising legal moves.

Ruddy hypocrites ..........


Did you actually read what you linked too? An academic "Dr Beck argues" that German laws MIGHT have supremacy. Fine he can test it just like Rees Mogg did at the Court of Appeal in 1993 over the signing of the Maastricht Treaty - I'll give you a clue he lost.



"Eurosceptic MPs said the treaty would give the EU greater powers at the expense of Westminster. They saw it as a step down the road to a centralised federal EU. And they were implacably opposed the UK joining a single European currency.

In the Lords, the former Conservative Prime Minister Baroness Thatcher said that the treaty would "diminish democracy and increase bureaucracy".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44924844

How right they were ...............



You realise that you have just contradicted the argument you put forward in your original post? So please confirm which of your posts you now agree with?
userpelmetman
Posted: 9 February 2019 5:19 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Fast Pat - 2019-02-09 5:07 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-09 4:11 PM

Fast Pat - 2019-02-09 4:04 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-09 3:40 PM

..........

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1084402/EU-news-Germany-Angela-Merkel-European-Commission-law-rule-Court-of-Justice

Under EU 'supremacy' laws Euro-legislation trumps national legislation in almost all cases.

But Germany has fiercely protected its own sovereignty thorough shrewd and uncompromising legal moves.

Ruddy hypocrites ..........


Did you actually read what you linked too? An academic "Dr Beck argues" that German laws MIGHT have supremacy. Fine he can test it just like Rees Mogg did at the Court of Appeal in 1993 over the signing of the Maastricht Treaty - I'll give you a clue he lost.



"Eurosceptic MPs said the treaty would give the EU greater powers at the expense of Westminster. They saw it as a step down the road to a centralised federal EU. And they were implacably opposed the UK joining a single European currency.

In the Lords, the former Conservative Prime Minister Baroness Thatcher said that the treaty would "diminish democracy and increase bureaucracy".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44924844

How right they were ...............



You realise that you have just contradicted the argument you put forward in your original post? So please confirm which of your posts you now agree with?


How has highlighting that us eurosceptics were right back then, contradicted my opinion that Germany runs the EU? ...........

userpelmetman
Posted: 9 February 2019 5:23 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Bulletguy - 2019-02-09 5:06 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-09 4:11 PM

Fast Pat - 2019-02-09 4:04 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-09 3:40 PM

..........

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1084402/EU-news-Germany-Angela-Merkel-European-Commission-law-rule-Court-of-Justice

Under EU 'supremacy' laws Euro-legislation trumps national legislation in almost all cases.

But Germany has fiercely protected its own sovereignty thorough shrewd and uncompromising legal moves.

Ruddy hypocrites ..........


Did you actually read what you linked too? An academic "Dr Beck argues" that German laws MIGHT have supremacy. Fine he can test it just like Rees Mogg did at the Court of Appeal in 1993 over the signing of the Maastricht Treaty - I'll give you a clue he lost.



"Eurosceptic MPs said the treaty would give the EU greater powers at the expense of Westminster. They saw it as a step down the road to a centralised federal EU. And they were implacably opposed the UK joining a single European currency.

In the Lords, the former Conservative Prime Minister Baroness Thatcher said that the treaty would "diminish democracy and increase bureaucracy".

Selective quoting = major fail! From your own link;

Lord Rees-Mogg went to court to stop the Maastricht treaty from becoming UK law - but judges supported the government's position, on all the issues.

"The outcome was even better than our lawyers had expected," Sir Roderic Lyne wrote on a note.

John Major enjoyed the moment. "Good," he wrote on the document, "a full gloat is merited."


Getting the treaty through the Commons took a year. Those who opposed it, from the Labour as well as Conservative benches, were vocal and well organised. But by July 1993 the end of the process was in sight.




Yes your right ...........John Major did fail the UK when he stitched us up with the Maastricht treaty ..........

It also proves our judges were EU stooges back then as well ..........

userFast Pat
Posted: 9 February 2019 6:02 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 
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pelmetman - 2019-02-09 5:19 PM

Fast Pat - 2019-02-09 5:07 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-09 4:11 PM

Fast Pat - 2019-02-09 4:04 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-09 3:40 PM

..........

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1084402/EU-news-Germany-Angela-Merkel-European-Commission-law-rule-Court-of-Justice

Under EU 'supremacy' laws Euro-legislation trumps national legislation in almost all cases.

But Germany has fiercely protected its own sovereignty thorough shrewd and uncompromising legal moves.

Ruddy hypocrites ..........


Did you actually read what you linked too? An academic "Dr Beck argues" that German laws MIGHT have supremacy. Fine he can test it just like Rees Mogg did at the Court of Appeal in 1993 over the signing of the Maastricht Treaty - I'll give you a clue he lost.



"Eurosceptic MPs said the treaty would give the EU greater powers at the expense of Westminster. They saw it as a step down the road to a centralised federal EU. And they were implacably opposed the UK joining a single European currency.

In the Lords, the former Conservative Prime Minister Baroness Thatcher said that the treaty would "diminish democracy and increase bureaucracy".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44924844

How right they were ...............



You realise that you have just contradicted the argument you put forward in your original post? So please confirm which of your posts you now agree with?


How has highlighting that us eurosceptics were right back then, contradicted my opinion that Germany runs the EU? ...........



There is either EU supremacy or there isn't. Your opening post suggested some fella reckoned there wasn't, you contradictory post states that there is.

Do try to keep up.

With yourself.
userBrian Kirby
Posted: 9 February 2019 6:13 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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pelmetman - 2019-02-09 5:19 PM
Fast Pat - 2019-02-09 5:07 PM
pelmetman - 2019-02-09 4:11 PM
Fast Pat - 2019-02-09 4:04 PM
pelmetman - 2019-02-09 3:40 PM
*-) ..........
https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1084402/EU-news-Germany-Angela-Merkel-European-Commission-law-rule-Court-of-Justice
Under EU 'supremacy' laws Euro-legislation trumps national legislation in almost all cases.
But Germany has fiercely protected its own sovereignty thorough shrewd and uncompromising legal moves.
Ruddy hypocrites >:-) ..........

Did you actually read what you linked too? An academic "Dr Beck argues" that German laws MIGHT have supremacy. Fine he can test it just like Rees Mogg did at the Court of Appeal in 1993 over the signing of the Maastricht Treaty - I'll give you a clue he lost.

"Eurosceptic MPs said the treaty would give the EU greater powers at the expense of Westminster. They saw it as a step down the road to a centralised federal EU. And they were implacably opposed the UK joining a single European currency.
In the Lords, the former Conservative Prime Minister Baroness Thatcher said that the treaty would "diminish democracy and increase bureaucracy".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44924844
How right they were *-) ...............

You realise that you have just contradicted the argument you put forward in your original post? So please confirm which of your posts you now agree with?

How has highlighting that us eurosceptics were right back then, contradicted my opinion that Germany runs the EU? :-S ...........

You really ought to read what you post, Dave, and even more importantly, read the links you include. :-D

The DE headline, as usual, is contradicted in their own article. They just rely on the fact that their average reader won't get below line three before their attention span is exhausted. The article doesn't say what the headline says. It is, as Pat says, the opinion of a German legal academic that German law has supremacy. However, as Germany is top of the countries currently awaiting ECJ judgement for law breaking, it is obvious the EU doesn't support the German legal academic's view.

Even more, it clearly demonstrates that far from "running" the EU, Germany is presently being held to account for breaking EU law by...…………………………..the EU, and the ECJ. Well, well! Poor Herr Beck!

BTW, what is it with you and Germany? You seem to be gripped by a paranoia about the country. Is it the beer that upsets you? :-D

Edited by Brian Kirby 2019-02-09 6:16 PM
userBulletguy
Posted: 9 February 2019 7:22 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Fast Pat - 2019-02-09 6:02 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-09 5:19 PM

How has highlighting that us eurosceptics were right back then, contradicted my opinion that Germany runs the EU? ...........



There is either EU supremacy or there isn't. Your opening post suggested some fella reckoned there wasn't, you contradictory post states that there is.

Do try to keep up. With yourself.

Pelmet parallel universe "logic" is enough to send anyone into a spin. He'd argue night is day and hot is cold.



Brian Kirby - 2019-02-09 6:13 PM

You really ought to read what you post, Dave, and even more importantly, read the links you include.

They're useful for shooting himself in the foot though his head would make a better target!

BTW, what is it with you and Germany? You seem to be gripped by a paranoia about the country. Is it the beer that upsets you?

It's a most peculiar obsession for someone who spends the majority of his time in Spain.
usermalc d
Posted: 10 February 2019 10:28 AM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 
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I don't really care who runs anything - as long as they do a good job.

userBrian Kirby
Posted: 10 February 2019 11:50 AM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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malc d - 2019-02-10 10:28 AM I don't really care who runs anything - as long as they do a good job.

Agreed, but this Germanophobia thing intrigues me, because it emerges (as well as a certain distain for Italy and France) from several posters.

I suspect that had the UK joined the EU from the outset, and then risen to the status of most influential member, as Germany has, none of the above posters would be complaining that the UK was over dominant.

While accepting that we are dealing with countries, and not individuals, if a random group of 28 people were assembled, and charged with sorting themselves out to deal with a particular problem, within about an hour they would have elected a chairperson to lead, and probably a series of sub groups to look in detail at each aspect of the problem an report back. Within that group, there would be bound to be someone who was resentful that they were not elected as chair.

So with the EU. Taking into account the UK's track record as a rather half hearted member, I just wonder if the dissenters ever pause to ponder why the UK has not become everyone's first choice for natural "leader of the gang"? What is it the Chinese say: "sow dragons teeth and reap the wind"?
userViolet1956
Posted: 10 February 2019 2:03 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Having read the article, and being a bit of a cynic, I think it likely that the Express deliberately abandoned its policy regarding fog index. I admit I suffer from a bit of Germanophobia at times, especially when they arrive in their massive luxurious rigs and take up more than their fair share of pallets on snowy campsites.
userantony1969
Posted: 10 February 2019 2:35 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Talking of Germany ... https://www.express.co.uk/finance/city/1071892/Euro-news-eurozone-finance-Germany-recession-Italy-France-budget-money ... Cripple France and Italy ya say ... They all blaming Brexit ???
userpelmetman
Posted: 10 February 2019 3:01 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Fast Pat - 2019-02-09 6:02 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-09 5:19 PM

Fast Pat - 2019-02-09 5:07 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-09 4:11 PM

Fast Pat - 2019-02-09 4:04 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-09 3:40 PM

..........

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1084402/EU-news-Germany-Angela-Merkel-European-Commission-law-rule-Court-of-Justice

Under EU 'supremacy' laws Euro-legislation trumps national legislation in almost all cases.

But Germany has fiercely protected its own sovereignty thorough shrewd and uncompromising legal moves.

Ruddy hypocrites ..........


Did you actually read what you linked too? An academic "Dr Beck argues" that German laws MIGHT have supremacy. Fine he can test it just like Rees Mogg did at the Court of Appeal in 1993 over the signing of the Maastricht Treaty - I'll give you a clue he lost.



"Eurosceptic MPs said the treaty would give the EU greater powers at the expense of Westminster. They saw it as a step down the road to a centralised federal EU. And they were implacably opposed the UK joining a single European currency.

In the Lords, the former Conservative Prime Minister Baroness Thatcher said that the treaty would "diminish democracy and increase bureaucracy".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44924844

How right they were ...............



You realise that you have just contradicted the argument you put forward in your original post? So please confirm which of your posts you now agree with?


How has highlighting that us eurosceptics were right back then, contradicted my opinion that Germany runs the EU? ...........



There is either EU supremacy or there isn't. Your opening post suggested some fella reckoned there wasn't, you contradictory post states that there is.

Do try to keep up.

With yourself.


There's nothing contradictory in my posts at all ..........

But seeing as you don't believe Corbyn is a Communist either ..........

That alone indicates that your grasp on reality is suspect ........

userpelmetman
Posted: 10 February 2019 3:04 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Brian Kirby - 2019-02-09 6:13 PM


Even more, it clearly demonstrates that far from "running" the EU, Germany is presently being held to account for breaking EU law by...…………………………..the EU, and the ECJ. Well, well! Poor Herr Beck!



Has Germany been found guilty of breaking the rules? .........Has Germany paid any fines? .......

userpelmetman
Posted: 10 February 2019 3:14 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Brian Kirby - 2019-02-09 6:13 PM

BTW, what is it with you and Germany? You seem to be gripped by a paranoia about the country. Is it the beer that upsets you?


Perhaps another example of how Germany runs the EU ........

The migrant crisis was started when Mrs Merkel invited refugees to Germany .......

https://news.sky.com/story/germany-no-limit-to-refugees-well-take-in-10347281

She clearly didn't expect so many to arrive and cause so many problems in Germany so she demands other EU countries take them .........

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/11820738/Germany-expected-to-demand-Britain-take-greater-share-of-migrants.html

When they refuse........She gets her stooges in Brussels to sue them ..........

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-42270239

Do you want anymore proof that Germany runs the EU????? ...........

userpelmetman
Posted: 10 February 2019 3:15 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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malc d - 2019-02-10 10:28 AM

I don't really care who runs anything - as long as they do a good job.



Which is the point .........Germany are only doing a good job of running the EU for themselves .......

userBulletguy
Posted: 10 February 2019 5:50 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Violet1956 - 2019-02-10 2:03 PM

Having read the article, and being a bit of a cynic, I think it likely that the Express deliberately abandoned its policy regarding fog index. I admit I suffer from a bit of Germanophobia at times, especially when they arrive in their massive luxurious rigs and take up more than their fair share of pallets on snowy campsites.

They can afford them as their mh prices are way more realistic than UK. The build quality also is far superior.

It's not uncommon now though to see German plated pvc's in Europe and last year a couple parked up next to me on a site in Serbia in a really cracking pvc conversion by Pössl. First time i'd seen the inside of one and they really are a quality build. https://www.poessl-mobile.de/en/
usermalc d
Posted: 10 February 2019 5:57 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 
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pelmetman - 2019-02-10 3:15 PM

malc d - 2019-02-10 10:28 AM

I don't really care who runs anything - as long as they do a good job.



Which is the point .........Germany are only doing a good job of running the EU for themselves .......




If we asked nicely , do you think they would run the U.K. for us - as we currently have no-one here who can do it.

But then again, I'm surprised that you think they are running the EU well " for themselves " when they opened their doors to a million immigrants.
Didn' t seem to go down too well in Germany to me.

userFast Pat
Posted: 11 February 2019 12:09 AM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 
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pelmetman - 2019-02-10 3:04 PM

Brian Kirby - 2019-02-09 6:13 PM


Even more, it clearly demonstrates that far from "running" the EU, Germany is presently being held to account for breaking EU law by...…………………………..the EU, and the ECJ. Well, well! Poor Herr Beck!



Has Germany been found guilty of breaking the rules? .........Has Germany paid any fines? .......



Yes.
userBrian Kirby
Posted: 11 February 2019 4:38 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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pelmetman - 2019-02-10 3:14 PM

Brian Kirby - 2019-02-09 6:13 PM

BTW, what is it with you and Germany? You seem to be gripped by a paranoia about the country. Is it the beer that upsets you?


Perhaps another example of how Germany runs the EU ........

The migrant crisis was started when Mrs Merkel invited refugees to Germany .......

https://news.sky.com/story/germany-no-limit-to-refugees-well-take-in-10347281

She clearly didn't expect so many to arrive and cause so many problems in Germany so she demands other EU countries take them .........

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/11820738/Germany-expected-to-demand-Britain-take-greater-share-of-migrants.html

When they refuse........She gets her stooges in Brussels to sue them ..........

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-42270239

Do you want anymore proof that Germany runs the EU????? ...........

Have a look here, Dave, it gives some facts, and some perspective. http://tinyurl.com/y547qyrr
The migrant crisis did not start with Germany. It's all there, it's all checkable. You can also see the number taken into Britain. Makes you wonder what all the Brexit migrant phobia was about, doesn't it?
userBulletguy
Posted: 11 February 2019 5:39 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Brian Kirby - 2019-02-11 4:38 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-10 3:14 PM

Brian Kirby - 2019-02-09 6:13 PM

BTW, what is it with you and Germany? You seem to be gripped by a paranoia about the country. Is it the beer that upsets you?


Perhaps another example of how Germany runs the EU ........

The migrant crisis was started when Mrs Merkel invited refugees to Germany .......

https://news.sky.com/story/germany-no-limit-to-refugees-well-take-in-10347281

She clearly didn't expect so many to arrive and cause so many problems in Germany so she demands other EU countries take them .........

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/11820738/Germany-expected-to-demand-Britain-take-greater-share-of-migrants.html

When they refuse........She gets her stooges in Brussels to sue them ..........

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-42270239

Do you want anymore proof that Germany runs the EU????? ...........

Have a look here, Dave, it gives some facts, and some perspective. http://tinyurl.com/y547qyrr
The migrant crisis did not start with Germany. It's all there, it's all checkable. You can also see the number taken into Britain. Makes you wonder what all the Brexit migrant phobia was about, doesn't it?

Indeed it does but we always knew part was fueled by xenophobia and racism whipped up by the usual lot. Eight times the number of applications in Switzerland in comparison to UK's pathetic effort of just 60.

I'd also suggest Pelmethead starts looking at the root cause, the reasons which led to the migrant crisis rather than whining about the EU and Germany with his wacked out Germanophobia, but it's beyond his thought process.
userpelmetman
Posted: 11 February 2019 6:37 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Brian Kirby - 2019-02-11 4:38 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-10 3:14 PM

Brian Kirby - 2019-02-09 6:13 PM

BTW, what is it with you and Germany? You seem to be gripped by a paranoia about the country. Is it the beer that upsets you?


Perhaps another example of how Germany runs the EU ........

The migrant crisis was started when Mrs Merkel invited refugees to Germany .......

https://news.sky.com/story/germany-no-limit-to-refugees-well-take-in-10347281

She clearly didn't expect so many to arrive and cause so many problems in Germany so she demands other EU countries take them .........

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/11820738/Germany-expected-to-demand-Britain-take-greater-share-of-migrants.html

When they refuse........She gets her stooges in Brussels to sue them ..........

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-42270239

Do you want anymore proof that Germany runs the EU????? ...........

Have a look here, Dave, it gives some facts, and some perspective. http://tinyurl.com/y547qyrr
The migrant crisis did not start with Germany. It's all there, it's all checkable. You can also see the number taken into Britain. Makes you wonder what all the Brexit migrant phobia was about, doesn't it?


So does that not prove that they all headed too Germany as per Merkel's invite???? ..........

userBrian Kirby
Posted: 11 February 2019 6:39 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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pelmetman - 2019-02-11 6:37 PM

Brian Kirby - 2019-02-11 4:38 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-10 3:14 PM

Brian Kirby - 2019-02-09 6:13 PM

BTW, what is it with you and Germany? You seem to be gripped by a paranoia about the country. Is it the beer that upsets you?


Perhaps another example of how Germany runs the EU ........

The migrant crisis was started when Mrs Merkel invited refugees to Germany .......

https://news.sky.com/story/germany-no-limit-to-refugees-well-take-in-10347281

She clearly didn't expect so many to arrive and cause so many problems in Germany so she demands other EU countries take them .........

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/11820738/Germany-expected-to-demand-Britain-take-greater-share-of-migrants.html

When they refuse........She gets her stooges in Brussels to sue them ..........

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-42270239

Do you want anymore proof that Germany runs the EU????? ...........

Have a look here, Dave, it gives some facts, and some perspective. http://tinyurl.com/y547qyrr
The migrant crisis did not start with Germany. It's all there, it's all checkable. You can also see the number taken into Britain. Makes you wonder what all the Brexit migrant phobia was about, doesn't it?


So does that not prove that they all headed too Germany as per Merkel's invite???? ..........

Dave, DTFL! Read the f'ing link.
userpelmetman
Posted: 11 February 2019 6:39 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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malc d - 2019-02-10 5:57 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-10 3:15 PM

malc d - 2019-02-10 10:28 AM

I don't really care who runs anything - as long as they do a good job.



Which is the point .........Germany are only doing a good job of running the EU for themselves .......




If we asked nicely , do you think they would run the U.K. for us - as we currently have no-one here who can do it.

But then again, I'm surprised that you think they are running the EU well " for themselves " when they opened their doors to a million immigrants.
Didn' t seem to go down too well in Germany to me.



I never said they were perfect ............

userpelmetman
Posted: 11 February 2019 6:43 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Brian Kirby - 2019-02-11 6:39 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-11 6:37 PM

Brian Kirby - 2019-02-11 4:38 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-10 3:14 PM

Brian Kirby - 2019-02-09 6:13 PM

BTW, what is it with you and Germany? You seem to be gripped by a paranoia about the country. Is it the beer that upsets you?


Perhaps another example of how Germany runs the EU ........

The migrant crisis was started when Mrs Merkel invited refugees to Germany .......

https://news.sky.com/story/germany-no-limit-to-refugees-well-take-in-10347281

She clearly didn't expect so many to arrive and cause so many problems in Germany so she demands other EU countries take them .........

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/11820738/Germany-expected-to-demand-Britain-take-greater-share-of-migrants.html

When they refuse........She gets her stooges in Brussels to sue them ..........

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-42270239

Do you want anymore proof that Germany runs the EU????? ...........

Have a look here, Dave, it gives some facts, and some perspective. http://tinyurl.com/y547qyrr
The migrant crisis did not start with Germany. It's all there, it's all checkable. You can also see the number taken into Britain. Makes you wonder what all the Brexit migrant phobia was about, doesn't it?


So does that not prove that they all headed too Germany as per Merkel's invite???? ..........

Dave, DTFL! Read the f'ing link.


I did ........

2. Where are migrants going?
Although not all of those arriving in Europe choose to claim asylum, many do. Germany received the highest number of new asylum applications in 2015, with more than 476,000.

But far more people have arrived in the country - German officials said more than a million had been counted in Germany's "EASY" system for counting and distributing people before they make asylum claims.

Now Germany is prolly sifting out the dross to dump in other EU countries .........

Or am I being cynical? ..........
userViolet1956
Posted: 11 February 2019 8:26 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


2000500100252525


But if you look where the majority of these migrants are coming from in paragraph 1 of Brian's link most are not "dross" as you put it Dave. Most come from some of the most dangerous places in the world.
userpelmetman
Posted: 11 February 2019 9:28 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Violet1956 - 2019-02-11 8:26 PM

But if you look where the majority of these migrants are coming from in paragraph 1 of Brian's link most are not "dross" as you put it Dave. Most come from some of the most dangerous places in the world.


Incorrect ...........The majority are economic migrants ..........

Its the fact that the EU/Germany have been unable to sort the deserving from the chance'rs that has caused the problems .........

userViolet1956
Posted: 11 February 2019 10:31 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


2000500100252525


Some are genuine refugees, some are economic migrants, some genuinely believe that they qualify for refugee status when they do not, I wouldn't regard any of them as "dross". Moreover, are you denying that Syria, Afghanistan, Iraq, some parts of Pakistan, Nigeria and Eritrea are not some of the most dangerous places in the world or have you just not bothered to read the article in Brian's link?

I've just watched "Inside Europe Ten Years of Turmoil" on BBC 2 tonight. You should get it on iplayer if you missed it. It is all to easy to criticise Angela Merkel but when you learn of the context in which she made her decision you may better understand that she was trying to avoid a pressing humanitarian crisis. Yes it was a decision that could not stem the flow of migrants and encouraged more to take their chance in the long term but it was a decision that she felt forced to make for reasons which I now understand.

userBrian Kirby
Posted: 12 February 2019 5:51 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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pelmetman - 2019-02-11 9:28 PM
Violet1956 - 2019-02-11 8:26 PM
But if you look where the majority of these migrants are coming from in paragraph 1 of Brian's link most are not "dross" as you put it Dave. Most come from some of the most dangerous places in the world.

Incorrect ...........The majority are economic migrants ..........
Its the fact that the EU/Germany have been unable to sort the deserving from the chance'rs that has caused the problems .........

Dave, how refugees are dealt with is laid down by the UNHCR. The UN is the post WW2 descendent of the post WW1 League of Nations, of which the UK was a founder member. So if you don't like the internationally agreed rules, you know who is primarily to blame - and it isn't Germany.

That you are able to determine who are the genuine refugees from your position in the UK, and so readily separate them from the economic migrants, who may well have genuine cases as displaced persons, even if not claiming asylum, is most impressive.

Since you can so clearly do this better than the people on the ground, have you considered a further career as a migrant assessor? I really can't think of anyone better equipped.
userBulletguy
Posted: 12 February 2019 6:06 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Brian Kirby - 2019-02-12 5:51 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-11 9:28 PM
Violet1956 - 2019-02-11 8:26 PM
But if you look where the majority of these migrants are coming from in paragraph 1 of Brian's link most are not "dross" as you put it Dave. Most come from some of the most dangerous places in the world.

Incorrect ...........The majority are economic migrants ..........
Its the fact that the EU/Germany have been unable to sort the deserving from the chance'rs that has caused the problems .........

Dave, how refugees are dealt with is laid down by the UNHCR. The UN is the post WW2 descendent of the post WW1 League of Nations, of which the UK was a founder member. So if you don't like the internationally agreed rules, you know who is primarily to blame - and it isn't Germany.

That you are able to determine who are the genuine refugees from your position in the UK, and so readily separate them from the economic migrants, who may well have genuine cases as displaced persons, even if not claiming asylum, is most impressive.

Since you can so clearly do this better than the people on the ground, have you considered a further career as a migrant assessor? I really can't think of anyone better equipped.

Perish the thought! His method of "selection" would class anyone with a sun tan as "a migrant".
userpelmetman
Posted: 13 February 2019 8:40 AM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Brian Kirby - 2019-02-12 5:51 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-11 9:28 PM
Violet1956 - 2019-02-11 8:26 PM
But if you look where the majority of these migrants are coming from in paragraph 1 of Brian's link most are not "dross" as you put it Dave. Most come from some of the most dangerous places in the world.

Incorrect ...........The majority are economic migrants ..........
Its the fact that the EU/Germany have been unable to sort the deserving from the chance'rs that has caused the problems .........

Dave, how refugees are dealt with is laid down by the UNHCR. The UN is the post WW2 descendent of the post WW1 League of Nations, of which the UK was a founder member. So if you don't like the internationally agreed rules, you know who is primarily to blame - and it isn't Germany.

That you are able to determine who are the genuine refugees from your position in the UK, and so readily separate them from the economic migrants, who may well have genuine cases as displaced persons, even if not claiming asylum, is most impressive.

Since you can so clearly do this better than the people on the ground, have you considered a further career as a migrant assessor? I really can't think of anyone better equipped.


What's any of that got to do with Germany causing the migrant problem......and Germany using its control of the EU to solve the problem Merkel caused? ............

As for my ability to spot a economic migrant from a refugee ............

I suspect I'm much better at it than the Home Office......... as I can tell the difference between a toddler and a 30 year old ..............

userViolet1956
Posted: 13 February 2019 9:33 AM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


2000500100252525


pelmetman - 2019-02-13 8:40 AM

Brian Kirby - 2019-02-12 5:51 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-11 9:28 PM
Violet1956 - 2019-02-11 8:26 PM
But if you look where the majority of these migrants are coming from in paragraph 1 of Brian's link most are not "dross" as you put it Dave. Most come from some of the most dangerous places in the world.

Incorrect ...........The majority are economic migrants ..........
Its the fact that the EU/Germany have been unable to sort the deserving from the chance'rs that has caused the problems .........

Dave, how refugees are dealt with is laid down by the UNHCR. The UN is the post WW2 descendent of the post WW1 League of Nations, of which the UK was a founder member. So if you don't like the internationally agreed rules, you know who is primarily to blame - and it isn't Germany.

That you are able to determine who are the genuine refugees from your position in the UK, and so readily separate them from the economic migrants, who may well have genuine cases as displaced persons, even if not claiming asylum, is most impressive.

Since you can so clearly do this better than the people on the ground, have you considered a further career as a migrant assessor? I really can't think of anyone better equipped.


What's any of that got to do with Germany causing the migrant problem......and Germany using its control of the EU to solve the problem Merkel caused? ............

As for my ability to spot a economic migrant from a refugee ............

I suspect I'm much better at it than the Home Office......... as I can tell the difference between a toddler and a 30 year old ..............



Ah but remember a while back I recall I posted links about age assessment and its complexity Dave. Even the experts at it can usually only provide an estimate of within +/– 2years when it comes to some adolescents and examination by physical characteristic alone can be five years out either side of a person’s true age around puberty. There is still no clinical research of sufficient depth and accuracy that covers all races as regards physical characteristics. Even amongst white British people there are boys under 18 that look in their late 20s and men in their late 20s that look like boys. A simple visual assessment is not sufficient. My son aged 29 still gets asked for ID on occasion. If you google “age-assessment in asylum cases” you will find lots of materials on how they are performed and in what circumstances. This BBC article below gives a reasonable overview with the caveat that it contains quotes from the twit David Davies MP for Monmouth who failed to ensure he was sufficiently informed before he made his comments on twitter.

And another thing - even if someone is assessed as being older than they said they are they might still qualify for refugee status, although of course if it turns out that their whole story is not credible they won't.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-37687916

Veronica
userBrian Kirby
Posted: 13 February 2019 8:14 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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pelmetman - 2019-02-13 8:40 AM...……………….What's any of that got to do with Germany causing the migrant problem......and Germany using its control of the EU to solve the problem Merkel caused? ............

It has nothing to do with Germany "causing" the migrant crisis because, as I explained earlier via that BBC link that you claimed to have read, the migrants were not fleeing Germany, but a number of countries in the middle east and Africa. The "causes" lie there.

So first, the migrants arrived, from Turkey and north Africa. Then, the crisis in Europe began.

It began, mainly, in Greece and Italy. Those countries allowed the migrants to pass through, rather than processing them on arrival (as I believe they should have), apparently on the basis that few, if any, of the migrants wanted to claim refugee status in Greece or Italy, most preferring Germany or Sweden. Can't blame them for that.

That fact alone lays your claim that Germany "used its control" of the EU to force the migrant crisis. Had it being doing that, it would have forced Greece and Italy to deal with them in situ, rather than watching them flooding through other countries en-route to Germany. The simple truth is that the EU did not have in place any systems for dealing with mass refugee migrations, presumably because no-one foresaw the possibility. So, they were caught out by the numbers, and in disarray.

All signatories to the UN convention undertake to deal with migrants claiming to be refugees. However, it is much heaper to wave them through to another country, especially if that other country is relatively prosperous, and you own relatively poor.

There are numerous faults in the way the crisis has been handled across Europe by all involved, but seeking to heap the entire blame on Germany simply ignores the facts. The intention is humanitarian - but most want it to be someone else's humanitarian rather then their own. You, of all people, must recognise that instinct!
userpelmetman
Posted: 13 February 2019 9:16 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Brian Kirby - 2019-02-13 8:14 PM

There are numerous faults in the way the crisis has been handled across Europe by all involved, but seeking to heap the entire blame on Germany simply ignores the facts. The intention is humanitarian - but most want it to be someone else's humanitarian rather then their own. You, of all people, must recognise that instinct!


Halo polishing is not without consequence ...........

Unfortunately the halo polishers prefer someone else to sort out the mess their good intentions create ..........

userpelmetman
Posted: 13 February 2019 9:19 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Violet1956 - 2019-02-13 9:33 AM

pelmetman - 2019-02-13 8:40 AM

Brian Kirby - 2019-02-12 5:51 PM

pelmetman - 2019-02-11 9:28 PM
Violet1956 - 2019-02-11 8:26 PM
But if you look where the majority of these migrants are coming from in paragraph 1 of Brian's link most are not "dross" as you put it Dave. Most come from some of the most dangerous places in the world.

Incorrect ...........The majority are economic migrants ..........
Its the fact that the EU/Germany have been unable to sort the deserving from the chance'rs that has caused the problems .........

Dave, how refugees are dealt with is laid down by the UNHCR. The UN is the post WW2 descendent of the post WW1 League of Nations, of which the UK was a founder member. So if you don't like the internationally agreed rules, you know who is primarily to blame - and it isn't Germany.

That you are able to determine who are the genuine refugees from your position in the UK, and so readily separate them from the economic migrants, who may well have genuine cases as displaced persons, even if not claiming asylum, is most impressive.

Since you can so clearly do this better than the people on the ground, have you considered a further career as a migrant assessor? I really can't think of anyone better equipped.


What's any of that got to do with Germany causing the migrant problem......and Germany using its control of the EU to solve the problem Merkel caused? ............

As for my ability to spot a economic migrant from a refugee ............

I suspect I'm much better at it than the Home Office......... as I can tell the difference between a toddler and a 30 year old ..............



Ah but remember a while back I recall I posted links about age assessment and its complexity Dave. Even the experts at it can usually only provide an estimate of within +/– 2years when it comes to some adolescents and examination by physical characteristic alone can be five years out either side of a person’s true age around puberty. There is still no clinical research of sufficient depth and accuracy that covers all races as regards physical characteristics. Even amongst white British people there are boys under 18 that look in their late 20s and men in their late 20s that look like boys. A simple visual assessment is not sufficient. My son aged 29 still gets asked for ID on occasion. If you google “age-assessment in asylum cases” you will find lots of materials on how they are performed and in what circumstances. This BBC article below gives a reasonable overview with the caveat that it contains quotes from the twit David Davies MP for Monmouth who failed to ensure he was sufficiently informed before he made his comments on twitter.

And another thing - even if someone is assessed as being older than they said they are they might still qualify for refugee status, although of course if it turns out that their whole story is not credible they won't.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-37687916

Veronica


..........and when they have been proved to have lied are they deported? ............

Seeing as only 12 of the 300 Iranians who have crossed the channel have been sent back to France.......I'd say unlikely ...........

userViolet1956
Posted: 13 February 2019 9:45 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


2000500100252525


I have done enough research for you Dave. If you want to find out how many failed asylum seekers are sent back from whence they came then I suggest you look it up yer sen. I suspect it will not be enough to dissuade others from taking their chances but don’t underestimate the enormity of the task and the attendant expense of returning them.
As for halo polishing, I guess you didn’t catch up on the programme I mentioned. I think Angela Merkel has been much maligned by people who would have made the same decision if they were in her place, unless they consider other human beings at risk of exhaustion, malnutrition and suffering from despair merely as “dross”.
userBulletguy
Posted: 13 February 2019 9:57 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Violet1956 - 2019-02-13 9:45 PM

I have done enough research for you Dave. If you want to find out how many failed asylum seekers are sent back from whence they came then I suggest you look it up yer sen. I suspect it will not be enough to dissuade others from taking their chances but don’t underestimate the enormity of the task and the attendant expense of returning them.
As for halo polishing, I guess you didn’t catch up on the programme I mentioned. I think Angela Merkel has been much maligned by people who would have made the same decision if they were in her place, unless they consider other human beings at risk of exhaustion, malnutrition and suffering from despair merely as “dross”.

He won't read or view anything unless it has a far right xenophobic and/or racist agenda.
userpelmetman
Posted: 14 February 2019 8:45 AM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Bulletguy - 2019-02-13 9:57 PM

Violet1956 - 2019-02-13 9:45 PM

I have done enough research for you Dave. If you want to find out how many failed asylum seekers are sent back from whence they came then I suggest you look it up yer sen. I suspect it will not be enough to dissuade others from taking their chances but don’t underestimate the enormity of the task and the attendant expense of returning them.
As for halo polishing, I guess you didn’t catch up on the programme I mentioned. I think Angela Merkel has been much maligned by people who would have made the same decision if they were in her place, unless they consider other human beings at risk of exhaustion, malnutrition and suffering from despair merely as “dross”.

He won't read or view anything unless it has a far right xenophobic and/or racist agenda.


You'd best not read the Koran then ...........

userBulletguy
Posted: 14 February 2019 1:05 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


The special one

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pelmetman - 2019-02-14 8:45 AM

Bulletguy - 2019-02-13 9:57 PM

Violet1956 - 2019-02-13 9:45 PM

I have done enough research for you Dave. If you want to find out how many failed asylum seekers are sent back from whence they came then I suggest you look it up yer sen. I suspect it will not be enough to dissuade others from taking their chances but don’t underestimate the enormity of the task and the attendant expense of returning them.
As for halo polishing, I guess you didn’t catch up on the programme I mentioned. I think Angela Merkel has been much maligned by people who would have made the same decision if they were in her place, unless they consider other human beings at risk of exhaustion, malnutrition and suffering from despair merely as “dross”.

He won't read or view anything unless it has a far right xenophobic and/or racist agenda.


You'd best not read the Koran then ...........

Wtf has that got to do with any of the points Brian mentioned i notice you couldn't address?
userpelmetman
Posted: 14 February 2019 1:33 PM
Subject: RE: More proof that Germany runs the EU.........
 


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Violet1956 - 2019-02-13 9:45 PM

I have done enough research for you Dave. If you want to find out how many failed asylum seekers are sent back from whence they came then I suggest you look it up yer sen. I suspect it will not be enough to dissuade others from taking their chances but don’t underestimate the enormity of the task and the attendant expense of returning them.
As for halo polishing, I guess you didn’t catch up on the programme I mentioned. I think Angela Merkel has been much maligned by people who would have made the same decision if they were in her place, unless they consider other human beings at risk of exhaustion, malnutrition and suffering from despair merely as “dross”.


Sadly it wont be the Halo polishing Mrs Merkel who will having those migrants dumped in her neighborhood ...........