DVLA Classification - Motor Caravan or Panel Van?

[david lloyd]

Hi everyone,

 

If a campervan is classified 'Panel Van' on the V5 (D3 Body Type) is there any advantage in having it re-classified as a motorcaravan?

 

David

[Mel E]

Yes there is. Panel vans are subject to lower speed limits on dual and single carriageways, for example. There are also insurance issues, and a number of other reasons for doing so.

 

It's especially important if the vehicle has a MAM/GVW of over 3500 Kgs since, from 1st January 2009, all such vehicles (except motorhomes) will be limited to 60 mph on motorways and banned from the outside lane of 3-lane motorways, and require to be fitted with governors.

 

Mel E

====

[david lloyd]

Thanks Mel E

 

This is an IH Savannah Tio R with a MAM of 3300kg - not sure why the converter is not registering them as motor caravans.

 

I presume the re-classifiacation is a simple matter of informing the DVLA - or will they need proof such as photographs etc?

 

David

[Elliot]

How do motorhomes get on in the proposed government road tax increases are they classed as cars? Or by some miracle they are going to be classed as leisure vehicles so they will be exempt from tax I have tried to find out what the CO2 emissions are on the various engines available but to no avail.

[twooks]

david lloyd - 2008-08-04 6:55 PM

 

Thanks Mel E

 

This is an IH Savannah Tio R with a MAM of 3300kg - not sure why the converter is not registering them as motor caravans.

 

I presume the re-classifiacation is a simple matter of informing the DVLA - or will they need proof such as photographs etc?

 

David

 

Go back to IH - they should know better - and can ensure you get the correct reclassification - they will have made the original error - and you will need documentation from them to prove your case.

If you are Guisborough - then I presume your 'local' DVLA is Beverly -

they are very helpful - if in doubt try giving them a ring - or have a day out and drive down - tis a lovely spot

 

back OT - there have been a lot of posts on various forums on this - one of which gave very explicit instructions - I will try and dig it out

watch this space

 

B-)

[twooks]

try this link

http://www.ukmotorhomes.net/motorhome_road_tax.shtml

 

B-)

[passionwagon]

8-) Motorhomes are classed as either Private HGV (over 3500kg) at £165 or Private LGV (under 3500kg) at £185. Emission VED scales do not apply but the low emission zone in greater London (area within M25) does have a charge depending on your vehicle age. Many threads on this and try TFL website for definitive information.

If mh is a small van conversion e.g. like Romahomes or Mercedes Vito then the emissions do apply. ;-)

[david lloyd]

Thanks Twooks,

 

The V5 shows the taxation class as Light Goods Vehicle and, according to the link you kindly provided, could be £180 (TC39), £185 (TC11) or £120 (if the vehicle is Euro 4 compliant - TC36).

 

I'm not sure if all IH vans are registered as Panel Van rather than motorcaravan either. My local DVLA office is Stockton on Tees but I think the telephone number is a national answering service so I may just give that a call to check the procedure for re-classification.

 

David

[twooks]

can't recommend Swansea - never found them that helpful - suggest you have a trip upto Stockton.

But I would try IH - I had to go back to Bilbos [the converters of mine] to get the necessary paperwork - their response was _ 'oh yeah know exactly what you mean and what you want - will send you the paperwork' got it by return of post. [we bought the van from a VW dealer who Bilbos were trying out as a northern agent for their vans - it was actually their error]

 

don't forget that the call to DVLA will be at premium rate unless you can catch their proper number ['saynoto0870 is ok - but I've noticed that the geographic numbers keep changing!]

I would guess you'll be £185 TC11

although I'm sure I read somewhere that VW T4s are euro IV compliant

 

 

 

 

good luck

 

B-)

[twooks]

 

 

ps - any problems get back to me - I've still got the paperwork somewhere

try PM 'cos I don't always manage to log in - but I've set 'notify of PM' to the on position

 

pps -ooops - keep hitting duff keys must be that red stuff :$

[Derek Uzzell]

Passionwagon:

 

Your comments are intriguing.

 

An over-3500kg MAM motorcaravan naturally falls into the "Private HGV" taxation class. Essentially, there is a comfortable and exact 'fit' between that VED class and that 'chassis weight' of motor caravan.

 

The reason the DVLA normally places an up-to-3500kg MAM motor caravan into the Private/Light Goods (PLG) class when it's first registered in the UK is more complex.

 

Basically, it's because the vehicles on which most motor caravans are based (Ducatos, Transits, Sprinters, etc.) don't have a measured CO2 emissions figure recorded in their Type Approval documentation. No available CO2 emissions datum means that it's impossible to place such vehicles into any of the UK's CO2 emissions-related VED classes, so they 'default' into the PLG class that's more properly appropriate for vehicles registered prior to March 1, 2001 when CO2 emissions-related VED was first introduced. (This can be clarified by reference to the DVLA's leaflet V355/1 "Notes About Taxation Classes")

 

Now, vehicles that the DVLA accepts as being “motor caravans" are exempt from the DVLA's UK-registration Type Approval-related rules. Hence it could be argued that, due to this exemption, even if a CO2 emissions datum WERE recorded in a motorcaravan's Type Approval documentation, this figure shouldn't 'count', thus causing all up-to-3500kg MAM motor caravans to continue to fall into the PLG VED class indefinitely.

 

I've always thought this was wishful thinking. If a motor caravan's Type Approval documents did include a CO2 emissions figure, it was likely that the DVLA would (and, realistically, should) exploit the presence of that measurement to assign the motor caravan to the appropriate CO2 emissions-related VED class when the vehicle was registered. It would appear from what you've said about Romahomes and Mercedes Vito-based motor caravan conversions that the DVLA has been doing exactly that (though I'd bet good money they haven't been doing it consistently!)

 

I don't know why Ducatos, Transits, Sprinters, etc. don't have a CO2 emissions figure recorded in their Type Approval documentation. Presumably there's an EU agreement about this and, at present, this non-presence of a CO2 datum benefits most UK motor caravanners.

 

Motorhome motors are relatively large and fuel inefficient, and I would expect their CO2 emissions to be relatively high. It's not difficult to envisage (in a Europe increasingly concerned over 'green' issues) that CO2 emission data will soon be demanded during Type Approval for Ducato, Transit, Sprinter, and the like, vehicles. And, if that happens and the DVLA starts to employ those figures to assign motor caravans to emissions-related VED classes (that would most probably be at the 'gas-guzzler' end of the scale), then it's hard to see what logical defence there could be to prevent this.

 

When this came up before on the forum I was tempted to write to my local DVLA about it (it's usually a waste of time contacting Swansea about things like this as they devolve decisions on UK vehicle registration to DVLA local offices). I would have asked them whether - when a new up-to-3500kg MAM motor caravan was to be UK-registered - the Type Approval exemption took precedence over any CO2 figure recorded in the vehicle's Type Approval documentation, or vice versa. Eventually I decided it might be best to let sleeping dogs lie, but I've a strong suspicion someone's going to get painfully bitten in the not too distant future.

[tp002c784tp002c784tp]

Derek Uzzell - 2008-08-05 9:11 AM

 

Passionwagon:

 

Your comments are intriguing.

 

An over-3500kg MAM motorcaravan naturally falls into the "Private HGV" taxation class. Essentially, there is a comfortable and exact 'fit' between that VED class and that 'chassis weight' of motorcaravan.

 

The reason the DVLA normally places an up-to-3500kg MAM motorcaravan into the Private/Light Goods (PLG) class when it's first registered in the UK is more complex.

 

Basically, it's because the vehicles on which most motorcaravans are based (Ducatos, Transits, Sprinters, etc.) don't have a measured CO2 emissions figure recorded in their Type Approval documentation. No available CO2 emissions datum means that it's impossible to place such vehicles into any of the UK's CO2 emissions-related VED classes, so they 'default' into the PLG class that's more properly appropriate for vehicles registered prior to March 1, 2001 when CO2 emissions-related VED was first introduced. (This can be clarified by reference to the DVLA's leaflet V355/1 "Notes About Taxation Classes")

 

Now, vehicles that the DVLA accepts as being "motorcaravans" are exempt from the DVLA's UK-registration Type Approval-related rules. Hence it could be argued that, due to this exemption, even if a CO2 emissions datum WERE recorded in a motorcaravan's Type Approval documentation, this figure shouldn't 'count', thus causing all up-to-3500kg MAM motorcaravans to continue to fall into the PLG VED class indefinitely.

 

I've always thought this was wishful thinking. If a motorcaravan's Type Approval documents did include a CO2 emissions figure, it was likely that the DVLA would (and, realistically, should) exploit the presence of that measurement to assign the motorcaravan to the appropriate CO2 emissions-related VED class when the vehicle was registered. It would appear from what you've said about Romahomes and Mercedes Vito-based motorcaravan conversions that the DVLA has been doing exactly that (though I'd bet good money they haven't been doing it consistently!)

 

I don't know why Ducatos, Transits, Sprinters, etc. don't have a CO2 emissions figure recorded in their Type Approval documentation. Presumably there's an EU agreement about this and, at present, this non-presence of a CO2 datum benefits most UK motorcaravanners.

 

Motorhome motors are relatively large and fuel inefficient, and I would expect their CO2 emissions to be relatively high. It's not difficult to envisage (in a Europe increasingly concerned over 'green' issues) that CO2 emission data will soon be demanded during Type Approval for Ducato, Transit, Sprinter, and the like, vehicles. And, if that happens and the DVLA starts to employ those figures to assign motorcaravans to emissions-related VED classes (that would most probably be at the 'gas-guzzler' end of the scale), then it's hard to see what logical defence there could be to prevent this.

 

When this came up before on the forum I was tempted to write to my local DVLA about it (it's usually a waste of time contacting Swansea about things like this as they devolve decisions on UK vehicle registration to DVLA local offices). I would have asked them whether - when a new up-to-3500kg MAM motorcaravan was to be UK-registered - the Type Approval exemption took precedence over any CO2 figure recorded in the vehicle's Type Approval documentation, or vice versa. Eventually I decided it might be best to let sleeping dogs lie, but I've a strong suspicion someone's going to get painfully bitten in the not too distant future.

 

Derek

Whilst on holiday a fortnight ago a chap in I think was an Autocruise or bessacar parked for only one night the vehicle was a 2004 Ducato 2.8jtd and I noticed that he had just renewed his vehicle tax and it was £145 pound I do not know what the weight of his vehicle is but should imagine it is at least 3500kg, as my tax is due this month I was rather pleased if my vehicle will be in the same tax bracket, My vehicle is a Fiat 2.8 jtd Lunar Roadstar registered in 2007 my vehicle weight is 3400kg.

 

Terry

[Derek Uzzell]

Terry:

 

I'm afraid you are going to be disappointed!!

 

If you check your 3400kg-chassis Lunar's tax disk, I'm sure you will find that the vehicle will have been registered in the Private/Light Goods (PLG) VED class. The Autocruise/Bessacarr motorcaravan you saw would also have been registered in the PLG class if its 'MAM' was up to 3500kg, or in the Private HGV class if its MAM was over 3500kg. As passionwagon said, the current annual rates of VED for these two classes are £185 for PLG or £165 for Private HGV.

 

Both £185 and £165 can be misread quite easily as £145 if the amount is poorly written on the tax disk (as it often is) and I expect that's what happened in your case. So you'll need to budget for an extra 40 quid...

 

You can check the current VED rates by referring to:

 

http://www.dvla.gov.uk/media/pdf/forms/v149.pdf

 

Regarding my earlier comments about CO2 emissions-related VED and motorhomes, it seems that my fears were essentially unfounded. While GOOGLE-ing to check VED rates in order to respond to your posting I came across this:

 

http://www.ukmotorhomes.net/motorhome_road_tax.shtml

 

which very concisely explains the position. I'll post a link to it separately on the forum as it does clarify the situation.

[david lloyd]

Hi Derek

 

Thanks for the further information. It appears that the IH Savannah Tio R (2005 Fiat Ducato 15 LWB 2.8jtd) is classed as Light Goods Vehicle (Vehicle Category N1) and as such the VED will be £180. The notes relating to VED (note 2) says that this can be changed if "sufficient evidence is provided to warrant the change."

 

So it does seem possible to change the vehicle classification BUT - is there any advantage to doing so?

 

If the 'Body Type' is changed from 'Panel Van' to 'Motorcaravan' this is likely to mean a re-classification to Private Light Goods and the VED will rise to £185 (at current rates) and the extra £5 wouldn't worry me too much. Of more concern, but Mel E has pointed out that the present 'Panel Van' class has restrictions on speed on certain roads etc. Are there any other negative points that would encourage me to change it to a Motorcaravan?

 

Regards,David

[twooks]

david lloyd - 2008-08-06 10:58 AM

 

Hi Derek

 

Thanks for the further information. It appears that the IH Savannah Tio R (2005 Fiat Ducato 15 LWB 2.8jtd) is classed as Light Goods Vehicle (Vehicle Category N1) and as such the VED will be £180. The notes relating to VED (note 2) says that this can be changed if "sufficient evidence is provided to warrant the change."

 

So it does seem possible to change the vehicle classification BUT - is there any advantage to doing so?

 

If the 'Body Type' is changed from 'Panel Van' to 'Motorcaravan' this is likely to mean a re-classification to Private Light Goods and the VED will rise to £185 (at current rates) and the extra £5 wouldn't worry me too much. Of more concern, but Mel E has pointed out that the present 'Panel Van' class has restrictions on speed on certain roads etc. Are there any other negative points that would encourage me to change it to a Motorcaravan?

 

Regards,David

 

 

re reclassification and body type info

imo has 2 basic advantages apart from fee

1 - speed limits are the same as cars - and so both faster and easier to remember

2 - resale - if I was buying 2nd hand conversion I'd want to know the reg details were correct

 

B-)

[Mel E]

David,

 

Of more concern is the fact that you are declaring the vehicle as a motor caravan to your insurers but it's registered as a panel van. Like it or not, that does give them an 'out' in the event of an accident . . .

 

Also, when it becomes due, the MoT for panel vans is different from that for motorhomes, whci are classed the same as cars for MoT purposes.

 

Is that enough reasons to be going on with?

 

Mel E

====

[david lloyd]

Hi twooks and Mel E

 

Many thanks for the information.

 

It's a crazy world isn't it?

 

Safeguard have happily insured the vehicle as a recognised convertion (and why wouldn't they?) but I'm sure you are right and, come the day, would be in a position to question whether they have insured a motorcaravan or a panel van. The onus, after all, is on the owner to declare everything to the insurers.

 

Given the situation with speed limits and MOT I will definitely make a visit to local DVLA office to make the necessary arrangements.

 

Regards, David

 

 

[david lloyd]

Have visited local DVLA office today armed with a variety of photograaphs of the vehicle and the vehicle itself.

 

The nice lady confirmed that the converter should normally ensure the van is registered as a motorcaravan at the time of first registration and that, as a panel van, will be subject to lower speed limits, a different MOT and also mentioned that the insurance company would have an interest.

 

The good news is that it is not too difficult to change the classification (especially as it is obviously a professional conversion) but the bad news is that my photographs were not enough to do it and I have to take it back for inspection which has been arranged for next wednesday. They will probably need to check the VIN etc but it does seem worth the extra effort.

 

Maybe other IH owners should check their V5?

 

David

 

 

[Stuart]

It is certainly worth checking your V5C, on one occasion after notifying DVLA of a change of address, mine came back with vehicle type shown as Snowplough, bit different. I did wonder if it would be exempt from VED.

 

Stuart

[twooks]

David,

still think you should contact IH they should be able to give you the necessary supporting paperwork - particularly since the original error is presumably theirs.

. . . or have they refused to help??

 

B-)

[david lloyd]

Twooks,

 

No, they haven't refused to help - I'm pretty sure they would deal with it if I asked. Since it seems like a simple matter to let the local DVLA office do the vehicle inspection (now arranged for tomorrow) I will just go through with that and the matter should be resolved without any harm done.

 

David

[david lloyd]

Had the (five minute) inspection done on Friday at the DVLA office - van details were checked against the VIN plate etc then a quick look around the interior to see that the build met the criteria for a motorhome.

 

New V5 will be sent out with the van re-classified as a Motor Caravan instead of panel van.

 

David

[twooks]

well done David, just don't hold your breath waiting for the Swansea part of the system to do their bit >:-)

 

B-)

[peter avalon]

Hi All,Ive just read this thread and decided to check my V5 and it says that Body type is Motorcaravan and taxation class is Private/Light Goods.

I know that my insurance is for Motorcaravan so I assume all is well--or is it?

 

Cheers *-)

[Derek Uzzell]

Peter:

 

Assuming your motorcaravan's Maximum Authorised Mass (MAM) is up to 3500kg, then the VED class of Private/Light Goods shown on your vehicle's registration document is correct. A motorcaravan with a MAM above 3500kg should be VED-classified as Private HGV. (But, as you've read this thread, you'll know that.)

 

I doubt if an error in VED-classification matters as far as insurance is concerned. If you own what is plainly a 'motorcaravan' and you've told your insurance provider that it's a 'motorcaravan' and what make/model/age, etc. it is, then, even if the vehicle has been wrongly VED-classified as (say) a motorbike, I don't see why your insurer should be concerned. Obviously, when a VED classification is incorrect, the issue should be addressed via the DVLA, but that's another matter...