Gas Bottle lockers

[Guest Mike C]

The gas bottle locker on my Sundance is metal and isolates the locker from the habitation area, except where the gas pipes enter the habitation area. The locker door has a Gas Bottle symbol on the outside. Are Gas Lockers subject to any standards or construction and use regulations? The reason for asking is that we have just looked at a Trigano Tribute and the gas locker is an ordinary wooden cupboard under the sink accessible from inside the vehicle and with two drop vents in the floor. There are no indications showing that this contains the gas bottle(s). Have looked at several other van conversions and found a similar situation. Can this be right? Thinking of the fire that Mel B had recently. Regards, Mike C.

[Guest Don Madge]

Mike My Timberland is the same, my gas bottle locker is quite large, it will hold two 6kg bottles. I have one 13kg refillable so there is plenty of extra space. To get into the locker I have to open the rear door and then open the door on the gas locker. I assume there is no legal requirement for the gas symbal to be displayed. I'm going to the Timberland factory tomorrow I'll ask around. Regards Don

[Guest Derek Uzzell]

Mike: Not sure there are any EU-wide standards for gas-locker construction and use. Certainly there's no standardisation on the 'warning symbol' (though current UK-built 'vans having lockers with external doors all seem to carry it). Every locker I've seen had a floor drop-vent of some sort, while lockers with exterior doors sometimes had door-vents while others hadn't. I've seen locker internal walls unlined, or lined with metal or plastic - so no standardisation evident there. Gas lockers should (obviously) be sealed from the motorhome's interior - some converters do this well, some less well. Risks increase when gas is stored within (and accessed from within) the motorhome itself, so doors/hatches into internal lockers need to have gas-tight seals. Again, as has been mentioned in past MMM tests, such sealing arrangements can lack credibility. MMM reports normally contain photos of gas lockers and the sheer variety is very apparent - it's another thing to consider carefully when choosing a motorhome. Interesting that you mention Mel B's gas-related accident. I don't think locker construction played any part, but Truma's recently introduced SecuMotion product might have helped minimise the damage. SecuMotion comprises a modified regulator/hose combination. Its primary objective is to act as a safety device permitting motorcaravanners to use gas heaters legally while driving their vehicles in countries (like France) that have historically prohibited this practice. However, its design function of shutting off the gas supply automatically in the event of a major leak occurring in a motorhome's fixed gas system (eg as a result of a serious road accident) means it will also protect against non-travel-related faults like a gas fitting coming apart (as I believe happened in Mel's case).

[Guest Mike C]

Hello Don and Derek, Thanks for the information. I have been looking for information on the internet but have not to date found any information on the construction and use of gas bottle lockers and installation. Certainly the cupboard door on the Tribute does not have a gas tight seal. What concerned me was that above the Gas Locker and sink is a 13 amp socket which being close to the washroom could be used for such as hair dryers. Gas leak and source of ignition? Don, I would be very interested in what Timberland have to say. The Tribute has a virtually identical layout to the Timberland for gas bottle access. Derek, Thanks for the info on Secumotion I will look it up on the web. I really am surprised that there does not appear to be a recognised safety standard for the notification of and storing of gas bottles in motor caravans or indeed caravans where there is in homes and commercial premises. Regards, Mike C.

[Guest Don Madge]

Mike, I visited Timberland this morning and it seems there is no legislation on gas bottle lockers. All members of NCC must have their gas lockers metal lined and gas proof doors. As timberland is not a member of the NCC hence the unlined lockers. Had my usual root around the factory while I was there and inspected some vans on the production line. I'm not going to trade mine in although the new vans are very nice. We were never ones for keeping up with the joneses. Hopefully barring unforseen happenings this van should see us out. To take some of the strain off the van we have ordered a Renault Scenic for collection on 1 June 06 on our return from our winter trip. Regards Don

[Guest Mike C]

Hello Don, Thanks for the information. I am not surprised about the NCC membership but I would have thought that all manufacturers would use their best endeavours to make their products as safe as possible. Since your and Derek's last postings I have been searching the internet for details and came across an article by Nicholas Greene of the The Self Build Motor Caravanners Club, SAFETY WITH GAS. He refers to British Standard BS 1646. Have tried to find this but the detail is not available on the web but it refers to BS EN 1646-2 which I will try to obtain. I will also talk to Calor on Monday. Nicholas's article states:- GAS STORAGE. "The BS1646 standards state (in simple terms) that gas bottles must be stored in a purpose built locker, this means accessible only from the outside or in a completely sealed locker if accessible to the interior. It must also be able to resist fire for a minimum of 20 minutes which means it has to be constructed from Steel, NOT aluminium as aluminium would melt under these (?) conditions. It must also have a DROP OUT hole at the lowest point. The gas bottles must be connected with a flexible hose to a coupling outlet running to the outside of the box sealed from the outside with a gas tight sealer. The shut off valve must be outside the box." Certainly most of the van conversions I have seen would not meet this standard. The reason for mentioning Mel B's fire was that it was gas fuelled and I wondered what would have happened if the gas locker had been close to the seat of the fire. Generally gas bottles will stand some considerable heat before venting but this can produce a fierce flame a bit like a flame thrower. I suppose that all the pipework could be vulnerable but the gas bottle is often the only part that we change over and therefore could be the most likely source of an incident. I have seen a caravanner disconnect the feed pipe from a bottle with the valve still open, frightenening but in this case nobody was hurt. Regards, Mike C.

[Guest Derek Uzzell]

There's an entry in MMM test reports' data section that says "Conversion NCC badged as EN1646 compliant", with either Yes or No following this statement. My understanding of ENs is that they are standards (norms) that define agreed 'best practice' but don't necessarily force compliance or compell people (in this case motorhome converters) to do things in a specific way. Casual observation at any leisure show certainly indicates there is plenty of latitude in how motorhome lockers are designed and made.