info on snow chains

[bob M]

Hi,

 

Visiting friends in Mid-Pyrenees shortly and possibly again in January and as I want to access Spain to line me up for the A23 I shall use the tunnel de Somport (N134 France) or tunnel de Biesla (D173 France) I think Pte del Portalet may be to risky.

 

Have not visited this area at these times of year so my queries are

 

Am I required to carry snow chains.

 

Are there chains in different materials now.

 

Will they damage aluminium wheels.

 

Are they best purchased in areas of snowy weather.

 

Have not used chains for over 30 years and then destroyed them when I hit main roads with patchy snow.

 

Any thoughts on this will be appreciated specially on damage to alloy wheels.

 

Bob

[rupert123]

bob M - 2008-11-01 1:31 PM

 

Hi,

 

Visiting friends in Mid-Pyrenees shortly and possibly again in January and as I want to access Spain to line me up for the A23 I shall use the tunnel de Somport (N134 France) or tunnel de Biesla (D173 France) I think Pte del Portalet may be to risky.

 

Have not visited this area at these times of year so my queries are

 

Am I required to carry snow chains.

 

Are there chains in different materials now.

 

Will they damage aluminium wheels.

 

Are they best purchased in areas of snowy weather.

 

Have not used chains for over 30 years and then destroyed them when I hit main roads with patchy snow.

 

Any thoughts on this will be appreciated specially on damage to alloy wheels.

 

Bob

 

Cannot help with the area but snow chains are still chains, their are alternatives now like snow socks but not sure if these would be regarded as legal in an area that requires you to carry chains. Chains will not damage alloy wheels if fitted correctly and many modern chains are easy and quick to fit, they will wear fast if you drive with them on roads with little or no snow cover. Best place to buy is certainly in supermarkets in an alpine area.

[vindiboy]

My understanding on snow chains is that if you are going up to the snow line / ski areas you MUST have snow chains in your vehicle, we have been through the various tunnels through the Pyrenees several winters running and never needed chains and were never challenged as to whether we had them on board,Hovever in January this year we attempted to go through the Bielsa tunnel from St Lary Soulan and we were unable to do so because of ice and snow and had to buy chains in St Lary Soulan in a local garage ,they cost me 150 euros which Iwas told was a reasonable price, cheaper inferior chains were available in supermarkets but it would have meant a long drive down the mountain to get them. Snow chains are no fun as you are crawling around in cold wet conditions to fit them, .My Fiat is front wheel drive with the bigger wheels and the chains went on reasonably easily ,but my friend who was with us has a Mercedes van,and putting the chains on his rear wheels was a real pain in the rear.You can only drive about 4 miles an hour and the ride is very bumpy with chains on ,we had to drive right through the tunnel into Spain before we could take the chains off,as we wouldn't have got into the tunnel mouth without the chains on . The Police were stiopping anyone without chains from going up to the tunnel too. Dont know about damage to Alloy wheels with chains but would have thought that if the chains are a proper fit they would be OK as the chains only go on the tyres and don't actually touch the wheels. The chains are very heavy and mine came in a plastic suitcase type box ,all very pretty but be aware of yoiur payload, hope this helps good luck Malc. *-) *-)

[rupert123]

Blimy Malc, 150 euro's for snow chains that was the worlds biggest rip off. You may pay this is UK but my last set cost 30 euro's from an intermarche supermarket and I still have them after tens weeks 'on and off' use. It is pointless going into any high mountain area in winter without them. Cheap and cheerfull work fine and are also fairly light. Obviously you have to be careful and keep an eye on wear if you are to tired to remove them when they are not needed. All snow chain routes in France are clearly marked as such and most have an area to fit them. Most tunnels also have an area where you can remove them. Tunnels like the Mont Blanc which have a steep drive up have clearly marked parking areas just before the tunnel, just use some common sense. I saw chains for sale in the Calais supermarkets last December. As I said in my last post have no knowledge of the route about which question was asked but if it goes into high mountains buy a cheap set of chains, it is not worth the risk of being without.

[Don Madge]

If you see this sign snow chains are compulsory so be prepared.

[panagah]

Don Madge - 2008-11-01 6:57 PM

 

If you see this sign snow chains are compulsory so be prepared.

 

yes, but you never know when you are going to come accross this sign. If you have any doubt buy BEFORE you go. Practice how to put them on sevreal times. If you need them you will probably find its too late to be thinking about getting some.

I have alloy wheels and used chains without a problem or damage.

 

In some areas police do check that you have them even in summer.

[handyman]

have a look at your base van instruction book. My 06 transit requires the front drive 205 tyres to be reduced to 195 when using snow chains.

[Guest JudgeMental]

 

Bob

 

it may be an Idea to add your vehicle details to your Avatar, that way you will get more informed advice.

 

if you have a FWD Ford based camper you cannot fit chains as standard tyres are to wide.....

 

the choice is to change for narrower tyres and chains or buy "spike spiders"

 

 

 

 

[Patricia]

If anyone is interested I have a set of snow chains for sale which cost me about 120€ from a French supplier. As far as I can remember they have never been used and, as I certainly would not be able to fit them myself, I might as well sell them. If I got caught in snow I would just have to park up and wait for it to clear as I have no intention of driving on it. I will attempt to attach a photo to this post but may not be successful as I have never tried before.

[bob M]

Thanks to rupert123

vindiboy

Don

panagah

handyman

JudgeMental

Patricia

for replying, I can form some options now.

 

The socks I had never heard of so looked them up and at 79euros for my size sounded okay but I will stick to chains.

I am on a Renault Master 225/65/16 and that size in the handbook is okay.

The sign was good.

Thanks again.

[Hughmer]

Feu Vert (French Halfords) literally "Green lights" also good value.

 

[Mike Hol]

If your handbook says that snow chains are NOT to be used with alloy wheels, then would alternatives, such as Spikes spiders or Go claws, be legally acceptable within Europe?

This point doesn't appear to be covered on any of the Q&A sections of websites selling such products.

 

Has anyone had experience of using such alternatives on a motorhome?

 

Mike Hol.

 

[Patricia]

Hughmer thanks for info on Feu Vert - spend half my life in France but never heard of that chain before.

[rupert123]

Mike Hol - 2008-11-03 8:37 AM

 

If your handbook says that snow chains are NOT to be used with alloy wheels, then would alternatives, such as Spikes spiders or Go claws, be legally acceptable within Europe?

This point doesn't appear to be covered on any of the Q&A sections of websites selling such products.

 

Has anyone had experience of using such alternatives on a motorhome?

 

Mike Hol.

 

Spike Spider Sport and Alpine are both chains, they just use a differant fitting method. how can chains damage alloy wheels, they do not touch the wheel?

[Rapido-lass]

I found out that you can hire snow chains in England if it is a one off journey and you want to go prepared. However, if you are a frequent snow traveller then buying will be cheaper in the long run.

[neillking]

Be careful over tyres too, some areas require you to run on winter tyres and to have a minimum or 4mm tread as well as carrying snow chains.

[michele]

We use Konig the best as far as we are concerned .

Do the job with plenty of grip got us out of a few situations in the past .

 

We looked at other such as spikes and socks they were no good didnt do the job we wanted better to be safe than sorry .

Konig fair company to deal with and easy ordering they were here in a few days .

 

www.skidrive.co.uk/snow-chains/chainfocus.php?partno=F060

[rupert123]

neillking - 2008-11-06 12:56 PM

Be careful over tyres too, some areas require you to run on winter tyres and to have a minimum or 4mm tread as well as carrying snow chains.

Really where? I have certainly not come across this one in over twenty years of Alpine travel.

[neillking]

Winter tyre info for EU countries

http://www.etyres.co.uk/winter-tyres-law

[peejay]

neillking - 2008-11-06 5:37 PM

Winter tyre info for EU countries

http://www.etyres.co.uk/winter-tyres-law

Hi Neil, I think that link is a bit out of date but you'reright about Austria. Its a bit of a minefield but..From Jan 08 there are new regs in Austria ref winter driving.It is now a mandatory requirement to have either winter or S+I tyres with 4mm min tread fitted for winter driving.The only other accepted combination is normal tyres with snowchains, but only when roads are completely covered in snow or ice, so, reading between the lines, legally, you pretty much need winter tyres in Austria in the winter, along with chains as a back up.::Austria Winter Driving Link with google translation::Pete

[neillking]

Thanks for the update, very helpful.

It's very British to want black or white answers so the usual reaction to the clear Austrian rules is to say "oh well, not going to Austria so don't need them". The reason I saved the other link was because of its helpful indications of more local issues like 'Switzerland: If an accident has been caused by the use of summer tyres during the winter months this can lead to liability on the part of the driver, regardless of whether or not they have fully comprehensive insurance', and 'Germany: Winter tyres are not compulsory in Germany but they are a legal requirement in some mountainous areas', and 'France: The use of winter tyres is not mandatory in France. Nevertheless in some situations special signs indicate that winter tyres should be used'.

Take care! 

[peejay]

You're right Neil.

 

Germany is another example, AFAIK there's no specifice rule requiring winter tyres to be fitted but if you cause an obstruction or an accident due to equipment fitted that is innapropriate to the conditions at the time, you could be subject to fines and/or liablilty.

To me, that is a clear message that when travelling in their country in winter, its highly adviseable to fit appropriate tyres and at the very least, carry chains.

 

Regards,

 

Pete

[George Collings]

I was working as a mechanic in the last really big freeze in 1963 and spent three months fitting, then mending chains.

The next three months after the thaw we were replacing tyres the chains had damaged.

 

The next nine months were spent dealing with the the pile of crashed cars that had skidded on the ice and snow.

 

Later I joined the police and spent the 70s on traffic when we still had lots of snow and had enough sliding about to last a lifetime.

 

Chains work really well on packed snow and to a lesser extent on ice. Studded tyres are similar but cope better on ice.

 

 

Drove RWD car with just a studded pair on the rear. Plenty of drive in a straight line but terminal understeer when cornering or braking. Chains and RWD have a similar effect. I have never used FWD with just front chains but anticipate the rear getting out of line under braking even with ABS as Iunderstand it is not that good at really low levels of grip.

 

Opposite lock and sideways in a 20 ft long van = multiple change of underwear

 

I still use my 'van in winter unless its frosty when I stay home and let all the ice/snow newbies get some experience and the salt wash away.

 

Still each to their own.

 

 

[neillking]

In UK snow and ice I always enjoyed rear wheel drive 'cos you could steer with the throttle and some opposite lock a la Clarkson et al!

I'm not sure I'd want to attempt it in a motorhome though and certainly not on serious mountains.

Anyway these days the fun/picnic police woud doubtless take a very dim view of such skillful adventuring!!!

[Patricia]

George Collings - 2008-11-06 8:40 PM

 

Opposite lock and sideways in a 20 ft long van = multiple change of underwear

 

I still use my 'van in winter unless its frosty when I stay home and let all the ice/snow newbies get some experience and the salt wash away.

 

Still each to their own.

 

 

My sentiments exactly George as per my earlier post: "If I got caught in snow I would just have to park up and wait for it to clear as I have no intention of driving on it." I remember driving a Rover Princess trying to get to work in the really heavy snow just before Xmas in 1980 (or was it 1981) and "leap-frogging" with another car. Started out just after 7, arrived at work 12.30, told to turn straight back round again and arrived home (fortunately still intact) at 6.30. Very hilly with narrow lanes in my neck of the woods. I vowed then that I would never willingly drive on snow again and have never done so unless caught out away from home. The thought of driving 3.5 tons in those conditions would give rise to more than changes of underwear!