Buying a Motorhome in uk or europe

[Phillip]

Hi we are looking to purchase a motorhome to go traverling in europe,

but we dont know if its better to buy in the uk or europe ?

we may not even come back to the uk we are hoping to travel for at least 1yr if not 3yrs we have no time limit, Any advise please ?

[smifee]

you will need an address in whichever country you register it in.

 

if uk and it needs an MOT you will have to return each year anyway.

 

i have imported new vans twice. the last time i saved £12,000 on a UK price of £48,000.

 

the exchange rate was a lot better then though. (lol)

[Guest JudgeMental]

Still savings to be made from buying LHD and IMO pointless buying UK RHD for your purposes, unless you find a good LHD deal here. The MOT & health service etc position is one that you will need to look into either way.

 

Have a look on www.mobile.de for price comparisons. Remember quoted prices are without discounts, I shop about and expect to get approx 18%

 

[Brian Kirby]

If you are considering buying in Europe be aware of the still unresolved insurance complication on your return to UK with the new van.  Your van will have to be registered somewhere, and that somewhere will usually be where you have your home address.  That same somewhere will also be where you will have to buy your motorhome insurance.  In most cases, if that is the UK, you will find you cannot get insurance cover for any journeys you make outside the UK, until the vehicle has been registered in the UK.  Also, you cannot register the vehicle in UK until it is physically in the UK, and insured.  To register it, if new, it must have its headlights changed for UK left dipping units (not masks), its speedometer must read in MPH and not KPH, and the dial must be visible at night, and the rear fog light must be on the centreline, or the UK offside.  If it is second hand, all the above plus, if more than three years old, it must have an MoT test before it can be registered.  So, once you get it back, some work has to be done before it can be registered.  Several, but not all, UK insurers will insure you against the VIN, to allow you to drive from the UK port of entry to your home/a garage for the mods/an MoT test station.

If you buy in Germany, you will have temporary German export plates and, if you are exporting the vehicle will get a 30 day export insurance that is third party only under German law.  The insurance will be written in German, and I am unaware of any translations.  If you buy in France, and I believe Belgium, you will have temporary export French/Belgian registration plates, but will be unable to obtain temporary insurance, third party or otherwise.  For this reason, I would advise, until this matter is properly resolved, that you buy close to a channel port and get the seller to drive you to the port of embarkation on his insurance, or - and I have no idea how legal this is - some dealers may be prepared to lend you their trade plates under which, I believe on the understanding you have been notified as a temporary driver, the vehicle will be more or less (but do check with the dealer) fully insured.

You will buy either without paying the local VAT, or you will pay the local VAT and have to reclaim it, or you will have to write a separate cheque for the VAT which the dealer will hold until you send him a UK MHCE receipt for the UK VAT, when he will either destroy your cheque, or return it to you, depending on what you agree with him.  On registering your vehicle you will have to attach your cheque for the UK VAT, calculated at 15% of the purchase price converted to Sterling at HMCE's daily rate of exchange.  All details of the procedure, and all the necessary forms, are obtainable from the DVLA in an excellent little "personal importation of vehicles" pack.  It is a slightly time consuming, but reasonably simple, step by step process.

My general comment would be to buy quality, because you want, as far as possible, to eliminate the prospect of getting a "Friday" van, and these even exist in Germany!  Your main problem in buying abroad apart from the above and the obvious one of language, is if your van develops problems.  Despite what the warranty may say, you are likely to find that the only dealer who will touch warranty repairs is the dealer who actually sold it.  This comment applies to all parts of the conversion, though not to the base vehicle manufacturer's (Fiat, Ford, Mercedes etc) warranty.  Additionally, if you buy in Germany and your vehicle develops a major fault necessitating its return to the factory, it is likely to be your responsibility, and not the dealer's, to get it there.  Something else to check before buying, as well as where in Germany the factory is located.  Burstner are in Kehl, which is almost a suburb of Strasbourg, so relatively handy.  Hobby are in Fockbeck, which is almost in Denmark, so far from handy!

For the base vehicle warranty you will normally have to notify the manufacturer's UK customer services department of the VIN (chassis number) and registration number, or possibly visit a service centre for the make to allow them to record the vehicle onto the UK database.  This will allow any recall notifications to go to you.  You will get the standard "Euro" 2 years warranty, and not the UK norm of an insurance backed third year's warranty.  If you buy on a Renault Master base, which seems to have been a relatively trouble free base, you will need to know whether it has been sourced from Renault's trucks division, or their cars division, as vehicles supplied by the one are not warranted by the other.  You must also be prepared for Renault to insist that the warranty commenced when the vehicle left their factory, and not when it is first registered in UK.  This has caused some concern and heartache, and more than a little correspondence, for several buyers but in all cases, so far as I am aware, Renault has eventually relented and applied their own rules properly.  The important thing with Renault is to contact the right division of Renault, then get to the right person, and the make a careful note of their name and contact details.

If your favoured motorhome will be on any of the X250 SEVEL base vans (Fiat Ducato, Peugeot Boxer, Citroen Jumper), do read the "juddering" string on this forum and then draw your own conclusions.

[Guest JudgeMental]

 

If you buy from a Belgian dealer most will drive van to channel port, so insurance not an issue. Plenty have driven back from Germany on third party insurance without mishap. You can always ask dealer to lend you his trade plates and post them back, some say this is not legal but my Belgian dealer checked with his insurance company and said it was OK....It was his idea not mine. But I was only 1 hour from port.

 

Headlights don’t need adjusting until first MOT. Just use beam benders whilst in UK. Speedo can be done at chassis dealers. My ford was £280 supplied and fitted. Or some use the cheaper method of using transfers. The Belgian dealer changed the fog light for me.

 

I saved over 12k on my van so a little inconvenience was nothing. I could have had is registered within a week as I have done this a few times previously. But Ford had to order in the speedo cluster which delayed registration by two weeks.......

 

I am thinking of changing my van and priced a Hymer in Belgium late last year and it was still £10.000 cheaper then here with a better specification as well. So worth looking into....unless you find a suitable LHD van here with all this done for you already.

 

 

 

[colinfrier]

Try mobile.de German web site with thousands of Motorhomes new and used.I have purchased 2 new vehicles and saved a lot of money but the pound was 1.45 last time still its crept up I got 1.1258 yesterday for £5000.

As Brian says you have to register somewhere and to that end of course you would need an address, if UK then there is some mods needed Brian lists them but I know of cases where headlight masks were accepted for MOT and there is no MOT check on MPH/KPH spedos rear fog light may need atention.Since you propose to spend some considerable time in Mainland europe any UK mods would need to be undone when in Europe?

Whatever you do don't choose Spain tp register it's a nightmare and very expensive thousands of Euros.

[Brian Kirby]

I'll try to clarify the headlamp business, as both Eddie and Colin are right, and wrong!

To register the vehicle legally in UK, you are required to have left dipping headlamps, and not masks.  This, and the requirement for a MPH speedometer and UK specific rear fog lamp position come from the UK Construction and Use Regulations.  These requirements are singled out, and clearly stated, in the booklet from DVLA to which I referred above.  The booklet, entitled "How to Import a Vehicle into Great Britain", is published by the Department for Transport, under the reference No P15.  The relevant section is on p11 of my copy, dated April 2004, section 2.6 "modifications necessary for use in Britain".  The section reads: "Headlamps will need to be replaced or adjusted to produce the required dipped beam for left-hand traffic.  The alignment requirements must be met without the use of masks, beam converters or adapters unless they are an integral part of an approved headlamp."

The point is that whereas registration is often completed without a formal inspection of the vehicle, inspections are required from time to time and place to place.  These will normally be carried out by VOSA and may, or may not, involve checking the headlamp beams.  So, you pays your money, and takes your chance, as you sees fit.

The final perversion is that to pass a subsequent MoT test all that is required is to demonstrate the beam will not dazzle oncoming traffic, and this can be met by application of masks etc - provided they achieve the required beam pattern.  However, even if the vehicle passes the test it remains illegally registered because the requirements of the C&U regs have not been met, and that is down to you.  You can't subsequently claim ignorance, or that DVLA weren't interested, or that it passed its MoT test.

I guess the only circumstances under which this might become significant would be if your vehicle was involved in, or caused, an accident where defective lighting was an issue.  What effect that might have on your insurance at the time I know not, I am not legally qualified, but even if I were I'd hardly be likely to give legal opinion on here, especially free!!  :-)

Hope this helps.

[Guest JudgeMental]

I don’t think this helps at all...you will probably frighten them into buying a caravan! *-)

 

It is worth mentioning seeing as we are going into detail here that registering a motorhome with the DVLA is something of a postcode lottery, with some offices more relaxed than others. One will register without an inspection, another with a cursory inspection, and some who think they are CSI and give it the full forensic treatment (unlikely IMO)

 

Normally it is the speedo they are interested in but not always. So sometimes you can address the other issues afterwards. I registered mine in Wimbledon which has a strict reputation and they never looked at lights front or back just the speedo.

 

I can’t see you ever being prosecuted as long as you use beam benders and are not blinding other traffic, and many say they eventually pass the MOT with only beam benders anyway. some headlights are easily adjusted some need replacing. If I had needed to change the headlights I would have.

 

[BGD]

OK guys - here's another thought just to add something to the mix:

 

Why register it in the UK?

 

Seriously; if you're gonna be touring, maybe use an accommodion address (any friends in France/Spain etc, or the EU country that you might buy it from?)

[Guest JudgeMental]

BGD - 2009-02-24 5:59 PM

 

OK guys - here's another thought just to add something to the mix:

 

Why register it in the UK?

 

Seriously; if you're gonna be touring, maybe use an accommodion address (any friends in France/Spain etc, or the EU country that you might buy it from?)

 

maybe worth investigating but if buying new.......German Vat 19% Belgian 21% and UK 15% :-D

[rupert123]

Phillip - 2009-02-23 6:21 PM

 

Hi we are looking to purchase a motorhome to go traverling in europe,

but we dont know if its better to buy in the uk or europe ?

we may not even come back to the uk we are hoping to travel for at least 1yr if not 3yrs we have no time limit, Any advise please ?

 

You will have to be more specific to be given exact advice on this one. I only have experience on importing from Europe and Japan to UK. If you buy in Europe any dealer should be able to arrange things to get you to channel port. Most insurance companies in UK will insure on VIN number, arrange beforehand. As it is a Europeon spec vehicle it does not need type approval. DVLA office will just kick the tyres and look at speedo, you will of course need mot if more than three years old, the speedo does not figure in mot but will at DVLA. Personally I do not feel it is worth importing now, with the discounts on offer in UK and the weak pound plus the aggravation if things go wrong all need to be considered. You will probably get a shorter warrenty and left hand drive will hit the value if you sell the van in the UK. I prefer R/H drive in Europe, not sure why but just do. I drive over their for around four months every year, sometimes in LHD hire cars and do not like them, what you get used to I suppose.

[Randonneur]

JudgeMental - 2009-02-24 7:11 PM

 

BGD - 2009-02-24 5:59 PM

 

OK guys - here's another thought just to add something to the mix:

 

Why register it in the UK?

 

Seriously; if you're gonna be touring, maybe use an accommodion address (any friends in France/Spain etc, or the EU country that you might buy it from?)

 

maybe worth investigating but if buying new.......German Vat 19% Belgian 21% and UK 15% :-D

 

France 19.6%

[derek500]

BGD - 2009-02-24 6:59 PM

 

OK guys - here's another thought just to add something to the mix:

 

Why register it in the UK?

 

Seriously; if you're gonna be touring, maybe use an accommodion address (any friends in France/Spain etc, or the EU country that you might buy it from?)

 

No road tax in Spain, just local taxes which should be less. Also, no MOT (ITV) for first four years and then only every two up to ten years old. And my main Fiat dealer only charges 31€ per hour labour.

 

I don't know how other European countries compare.

[Phillip]

Hi Thanks for all your advise but i think i have been misunderstood,

we plan on selling up in england and never coming back we are planning to tour for a few years then maybe buying a house in our choosen country so before we leave and buy a motorhome would it be best to buy from england and take with us or buy in europe and we are planning to buy a new motorhome not second hand any advise ?

Thanks

[Petra]

You can buy a new LHD motorhome in the UK if you go to the right dealer. We bought our new Chausson last year from RDH. Although we have a UK address for where it is registered we also have a Greek address. Our van has KPH speedo which we need when driving on the continent and everything else is set up for continental use as that is where we use it. The dealer had no trouble registering it. We have 365 days insurance cover abroad and we go back to UK for servicing and habitation checks. It is much easier in the UK than doing this abroad. Also UK insurance is a lot more comprehensive than the insurance we could get in Greece. Comprehensive cover only applies if you are hit by a third party and you know who hit you!! Dealing with dealers and insurance companies in your own language is much easier. We have had so many problems in Greece with our car that we eventually sold it. One thing about being abroad it teaches you that you dont always have to follow the rules all the time.

[PJay]

Phillip - 2009-02-24 7:34 PM

 

Hi Thanks for all your advise but i think i have been misunderstood,

we plan on selling up in england and never coming back we are planning to tour for a few years then maybe buying a house in our choosen country so before we leave and buy a motorhome would it be best to buy from england and take with us or buy in europe and we are planning to buy a new motorhome not second hand any advise ?

Thanks

Think you might have to look into Insurance etc, without a permanent address ( in UK or elswere) this could be a big problem. (Big Brother needs to be able to locate you somewhere)

[Randonneur]

How do the motorhomers who 'fulltime' go on with having a permanent address for Insurance/MOT etc? I resume most of them have UK registered vehicles.

[Guest JudgeMental]

Randonneur - 2009-02-24 8:14 PM

 

How do the motorhomers who 'fulltime' go on with having a permanent address for Insurance/MOT etc? I resume most of them have UK registered vehicles.

 

I think they use family or friends.....but best to check on full timing forum for definitive advice.

 

We have already advised regards buying abroad and best way of doing this. Have you a van in mind?

 

[Phillip]

we are looking into buying a Ci 656 what do you think ?

[colinfrier]

picking up on some of the points raised:

 

Don't register in Spain 12% import duty, Spain will only accept pan European type approval very very few motorhomes have it homogalation will cost about 1600 euros, yes you will save on road tax my x250 2.3 65euros a year.

Insurance from UK company on VIN number only valid when you hit uk soil not untill

LHD very sought after in UK will not detract from value.

[Brian Kirby]

Phillip - 2009-02-24 9:34 PM we are looking into buying a Ci 656 what do you think ?

The (presumably) Carioca 656 seems to have disappeared from the 2009 CI catalogue.  Nearest match seems to be an Eliott Easy E 655. 

If this is what you are interested in I think a) it is on a Fiat chassis, b) it is on a 3,300Kg MAM chassis and d) consequently it has an ex works payload of only 330Kg - so I hope you will be travelling alone!  :-)

[Guest JudgeMental]

below is from another recent thread:

 

I and a lot of people I believe prefer the quality associated with German motorhomes..,,,,..It's a bit like cars really

 

whats your budget? Here is result of german magazine Promobil survey of popular vans...... I would not touch latest Fiat chassis at the moment.

 

up to 45k Euro:

 

1 Hymer Camp 34,3 %

2 Dethleffs Advantage A 30.2%

3 Hobby Siesta AK 15.3%

4 Eura Mobil Profila A 14.2%

5 Bürstner Nexxo Family

 

up to 60k Euro range:

 

1 Dethleffs Fortero A 29.5%

2 Eura Mobil Terrestra A 25.0%

3 Dethleffs Advantage A-2 17.7%

4 Karmann Colorado 16.9%

5 Hobby Toskana AK 15.9%

 

Chausson and Adria are worth a look as well....: These are new prices (without discount) used can be found on sites like www.mobile.de for comparison.

 

 

[BGD]

My thoughts - don't buy new.

 

Save a bucketload of cash and buy (say) 1 year old secondhand with very low mileage:

 

Engine more or less fully run in; now should be totally reliable as all teething problems resolved by first owner and supplying dealer, lots of add-ones/extras probably included.

No requirement for ITV (or other national technical vehicle anuual/bi-annual check) for next 2 or 3 years.

 

Buy in Euroland, ensure it's LHD, and buy a lot bigger than you think you'll need. Register it at a mates address in that same country, insure it in that country with cover extension for travel all over Europe.

 

Enjoy.

[Losos]

JudgeMental - 2009-02-23 8:58 PM  IMO pointless buying UK RHD for your purposes,

Normally I would agree with you, but having been subjected to crime in unprecedented levels since living six months a year in Eastern Europe I will be buying RHD (And taxing / MOTing in UK) simply because it makes it unattractive to a thief to try and sell a RHD in Europe. 

Phillip, do please consider the possibility of having your lovely LHD MH stolen, I can assure youit happens far too frequently all over Europe and especially in the Eastern half.

 

[Losos]

Phillip - 2009-02-24 8:34 PM we plan on selling up in england and never coming back we are planning to tour for a few years then maybe buying a house in our choosen country

Phillip - From my own personal experience I would strongly advise against having no base at all in UK - It's hard to put it in 'short' form on a public forum but just don't do it.

Sell your house yes, but buy a small flat or something in a relatively low cost part of UK (There are some lovely places in Scotland) you will be amazed how much hassle and grief this will save you.