Insurance for importing.

[Brian Kirby]

Even in these credit crunched, Sterling diminished, times, there are still queries about personally importing vans from Europe.  For those wishing to do this, the best starting point is to get the guidance booklet, plus all the necessary application forms and notes, from the DVLA.  These take the form of an "importing pack", that will save you a lot of time and answer most questions on procedure, and what modifications are legally required for registration in UK.  The pack can be requested by phone from DVLA.

Leaving aside the choice of van, and dealership, the main problem you are likely to encounter is how to bring it back to the UK.  You have roughly three choices.

A.  You get the dealer to deliver the van to the nearest channel port.  You then take over, drive onto the ferry, and thence home.

B.  You employ someone else to drive the van from the dealer to your home, either on trade plates, or on a transporter.

C.  You drive the van from the dealer to your home.

In the case of A or C, you are likely to run into problems insuring your new acquisition. 

For A, you will need to find an insurer willing to insure the vehicle before it is registered in the UK, to allow you to drive from the UK port of entry to your home, possibly to a garage for modifications, possibly to an MoT test station, and/or possibly to your local DVLA office, or a VOSA test station, if DVLA wish to inspect the vehicle prior to registering it.  Your main problem, in this case, will be finding an insurer willing to issue insurance on this basis, usually against the vehicle's VIN, or chassis number.  The good news is that most of the insurers who advertise in MMM will do this, but do be vary careful to make absolutely clear what you will be doing at the time you obtain any quotes.

For C, the position is less clear cut.  There was a lengthy  discussion on this forum a while back on this same topic.  Donna Miller posted that she had obtained full comprehensive insurance from Caravanwise (a.k.a. Motorcaravanwise) for the whole of her trip home from Germany, but had not retained the original documents, so could not quote "chapter and verse".  The late Mel Eastburn and I, on the basis of information we had from the motor insurance industry, were both convinced such insurance was not obtainable in the UK, and might have been the consequence of a mistake.  Eventually, we agreed to differ, and I undertook to try to find out, if I could, exactly where things stood.  I started by following a couple of Donna's leads with HM Treasury, and latterly with Caravanwise.  The Treasury lead led to the Department of Transport team involved in implementation of the 5th Motor Insurance Directive, under which such insurance was legalised in June 2007.  Notwithstanding, the industry, in the form of the Motor Insurers Bureau, and the Association of British Insurers, maintained that there were further complications.  Pressed further, it became clear the problem was with the Motor Insurer's Database (MID), which could not accept a VIN or a foreign registration number.  However, by November 2008, that issue had been settled and the MID can now accept either identifier - although the vehicle will not show as insured if the police query the database before it is UK registered.  So, carry your insurance documents with you!  However, the story from the industry remained that such insurance cannot be issued.  Contacts with actual brokers/intermediaries has since revealed that most, if not all companies, need to make changes to their computer systems, software, or both, before they can transfer a VIN, or a foreign registration number, onto the MID.  Accordingly, most have decided the costs involved are too great in relation to the volume of business, and do not wish to take on the risks. 

There is a part exception to this, in the form of Caravanwise.  I am indebted to Mr Phil Holden, the Managing Director of Caravanwise, for pursuing this with his underwriters at NIG.  Whereas NIG has no objection to the risk in principle, they, too are caught by the need to make modifications to computer systems and software they judge presently uneconomic.  However, they do accept the legality of the insurance, and are prepared to constructively exploit the seven days time limit required under UK law for entering a motor insurance policy onto the MID.  That is to say, they will consider issuing a full comprehensive cover note, including cover for driving outside the UK, against a VIN,  on condition that the vehicle is registered in the UK within seven days of issue of the cover note.  This is a generous concession, as Caravanwise/NIG are liable to severe penalties if the vehicle is not registered within the required time.  Notwithstanding this concession, it has to be said that completing the entire registration procedure within 7 days of issuing the cover note is a very demanding target.  Remember that you must have the cover note with you, in case you are stopped by the police anywhere on your journey.  That is at least one day lost due to the post.  The seven days in question include one weekend, so your best hope will be to collect and drive home Saturday or Sunday, beginning the registration process on Monday, to complete Thursday.  In my view, that will not generally be achievable.

So what can you do?

In practical terms, until the insurance industry gets newer computer systems and software that would allow them to access the MID with VINs and foreign registration numbers, your best practical bet will be to adopt strategy A.  You will still need to get insurance on a VIN, and that insurance will have no validity outside the UK.  You can obtain temporary export insurance in Germany, but the document is in German and, so far as I know, there is no authenticated translation into English.  However, this insurance provides only the most basic third party cover, so there is considerable risk until you get to UK soil and your UK full comp takes over.  If an insurer tells you the accidental damage part of their full comprehensive insurance will cover your non third party risks outside the UK, leaving the third party element to be covered on the German insurance, my advice is that this is incorrect, but if you wish to proceed on this basis make absolutely certain you have this, in writing, in language a five year old could understand, before you pay the premium - you may have to rely on it.

For France and Belgium, so far as I am aware, there is no temporary insurance of any kind available, so your only options are the dealer drives you to the port, someone else collects on trade plates, or the transporter.

I hope this is now, just a tiny bit, clearer!

[Rainbow-Chasers]

Well posted Brian! I feel this post will reguarly be called upon for many years to come - nice to see the time and effort that you have put in to help others! :-D

[Brian Kirby]

Thank you, but I forgot one thing.  I believe it will be necessary to obtain a green card if driving abroad on a cover note.  This should be carefully checked, and confirmed, before paying the premium.

[rupert123]

Brian your post is imformative but wrong on a couple of points. I have a motor traders policy and register cars with the MID database all the time. the requirement under the EU directive is 14 days, although most brokers like you to do it in seven. You have been able to register on this database with just a vin number for quite a while, I was doing it three years ago with Jap. imports but you need to make a telephone call something that a lot of people seem unwilling to do.

[Derek Uzzell]

rupert123 - 2009-03-05 12:31 AM

 

you need to make a telephone call

 

Could you say, please, to whom you need to telephone and the phone number required?

[rupert123]

Derek Uzzell - 2009-03-05 8:33 AM

 

rupert123 - 2009-03-05 12:31 AM

 

you need to make a telephone call

 

Could you say, please, to whom you need to telephone and the phone number required?

 

Sorry Derek my numbers will be of no use to anyone else. First in the normal manner if I want a cover note I log on and use pass codes to get it, in a similar way to access an on line bank account. To register a car with vin number I telephone but still have to use pass codes. I was talking about the broker using the telephone for you. If you take out an insurance with a company using vin number it is up to them to register that vehicle within the 14 days, not the person taking out the insurance. However once you have that insurance, you still, as Brian has said, have to comply with the rules regarding the vehicles use. I have no idea how this applies in Europe but as I also have trade plates it does not effect me. When I imported a car from Japan, depending on the age of it, it took anything up to six weeks to get a registration number, it has to be insured for this time.

[Brian Kirby]

rupert123 - 2009-03-05 12:31 AM Brian your post is imformative but wrong on a couple of points. I have a motor traders policy and register cars with the MID database all the time. the requirement under the EU directive is 14 days, although most brokers like you to do it in seven. You have been able to register on this database with just a vin number for quite a while, I was doing it three years ago with Jap. imports but you need to make a telephone call something that a lot of people seem unwilling to do.

I do not wish to disagree with what you say, Rupert, but my post is intended for those who do not have motor trader's policies, who are inevitably dependent on their broker/intermediary for their insurance. 

The brokers/intermediaries are in turn limited by their underwriters, and it is here that both the 7 days requirement, and means of access to the MID, seem to arise.

It seems the way the brokers/intermediaries are required to communicate their new policies to their underwriters is electronic, via company IT systems, and the monitoring of compliance is also electronic so, in the absence of systems that permit the transmission of VIN or foreign registration numbers, the broker/intermediary cannot comply with the instructions of his underwriter.  I was informed that telephoning the information around is not allowed, as it does not provide all parties with the required feedback to satisfy compliance.  Make of that what you will, but that seems to be the situation so far a Joe Public is concerned. 

Now, if you want to offer a public service using your trade plates, for a nominal fee, you may have a few takers...................... :-)

[Brian Kirby]

A sequel.  My original post provoked a reaction from an unexpected quarter, in the form of a telephone call I had earlier today.  Can't name names, but it seems insurance companies, or their underwriters, are becoming more and more edgy about issuing cover notes against a foreign registration number, or a VIN.  Although this has been acceptable in the past, though not that widely acceptable, it seems word is now going out that this must not be done.  It is the same problem as Phil Holden explained, if insurance is issued it must be entered on the MID within 7 days, or the insurer faces a substantial fine, or even banning for repeated offences.  So, a big risk for the insurer.  This is leading insurers to conclude that the risk is not worth the revenue, and they are refusing to issue cover notes for any unregistered vehicle.  It was pointed out that this would pose potential problems even for those paying for a vehicle to be delivered on a transporter, since it would still need to be UK registered before it could be insured.  If it could be parked on private land it would not need to be insured, whereas on the road it would, but even if off road insurance against theft or damage would be pretty essential on a new, or nearly new, van, and you can't register in the UK without UK insurance: catch 22?

My informant also added that as the only apparent solution was change to the insurers' systems, software, or both, to allow them to communicate foreign registrations or VINs to the MID, and these mods are regarded as too costly to be worthwhile, there is little prospect of this happening in the foreseeable future.

In practical terms, therefore, the only routes available appear to be to buy in Germany and accept the risk of third party only insurance until the vehicle is UK registered (but see catch 22 above), or to pay someone else with a motor trader's insurance and trade plates to handle the importing and registration for you.  For example, Bundesvan (and it wasn't them who phoned me, cynical lot that you are! :-)).  Don't get any easier, do it?