Gaslow installation - what else do I need?

[Mel B]

Going to get a bottle fitted tomorrow afternoon - I know about the 2 adapters I need for France, Italy, Europe etc but is there anything else I'll need (apart form the basic kit)? Just want to make sure I get all the bits as I don't want to have to go back again before we set off on holiday in 11 day's time. B-)

 

Also, does anyone have any info on how to find places that do 'domestic' rate gas in the UK rather than the auto gas stuff? Trying to find them on the internet etc is like wading through treacle! Campbell ... yes it is!:D

[Big Momma]

Have you looked at the Gaslow website

 

www.gaslow.co.uk

 

This should you tell you what you need. I remember seeing something about an upgraded alluminium hose that stopped the black gunk that sometimes built up in the rubber hoses.

[kontiki]

If you use Countrywide they have a key type system that you can use for LPG. If you ring & tell them that you are using it in a motorhome for domestic use they will only charge the domestic rate. I filled up in Stratford for 43p a litre.

 

See website https://www.countrywidefarmers.co.uk/pws/Content.ice?page=AutogasHome&pgForward=businesshome

 

Only downside is they don't cover a lot of the country but it doesn't cost anything to set it up & if you are passing one of their outlets you can top up your bottles.

[Tony Jones]

Mel, unless you find a domestic LPG supplier very near home, or very near somewhere you pass quite often, it's really not worth the hassle.

Even buying the stuff at garage prices is SO much cheaper than exchanging bottles that the bit extra you'll save by getting the domestic duty rate is peanuts.

Even when our bottle is nearly empty, the most I've ever paid to fill it at my nearest LPG garage is about £6.50.

You're going to wonder how (and why!) you ever managed without it.

T x

[Clive]

Tony Jones - 2009-06-15 9:09 PM

 

Mel, unless you find a domestic LPG supplier very near home, or very near somewhere you pass quite often, it's really not worth the hassle.

Even buying the stuff at garage prices is SO much cheaper than exchanging bottles that the bit extra you'll save by getting the domestic duty rate is peanuts.

Even when our bottle is nearly empty, the most I've ever paid to fill it at my nearest LPG garage is about £6.50.

You're going to wonder how (and why!) you ever managed without it.

T x

I second that.

C.

[fjmike]

kontiki - 2009-06-15 8:00 PM

 

If you use Countrywide they have a key type system that you can use for LPG. If you ring & tell them that you are using it in a motorhome for domestic use they will only charge the domestic rate. I filled up in Stratford for 43p a litre.

 

See website https://www.countrywidefarmers.co.uk/pws/Content.ice?page=AutogasHome&pgForward=businesshome

 

Only downside is they don't cover a lot of the country but it doesn't cost anything to set it up & if you are passing one of their outlets you can top up your bottles.

Another advantage with Countrywide is that a lot of them are unmanned, you gain access via a keycoded gate (code in the book provided). This means that even if it is really late or early you can still get LPG

[Mel B]

Thanks guys. I just need to decide where in the locker I'm going to fit the filler point and I can go and put some gas in ... hubby's been reading all about the different connections and ways of using them. Interesting that on the first fill you have to be careful about how much gas you put in as the 80% limiter might not kick in!!! 8-)

[Mel B]

Just realised I forgot to tell you how much it cost me and where I had it done! :D

 

It was at Waudby's at South Cave just at the junction where the A63 changes to the M62.

 

For a large bottle with built in gauge (11kg), 1.5m filler & hoze, bracket, .75m stainless steel hose from bottle to regulator, plus 2 adaptors - £240.

 

He said if I find that we don't actually need to use the adaptors he'll take them back and refund me for them - I also got a free pack of washers for the rubber hose for the Calor cylinder worth 95p! Can't ask for more can you really.! :->

[Big Momma]

Was that full installation and labour costs (?) If so then that was a b****y good deal. Let us know how you get on with it. I was quoted £680 so it would pay me to drive up North to have it done (lol)

[LordThornber]

Slightly off thread, but thanks Mel for providing me with more ammo for having one fitted to the next van.

 

I coughed up £18.50 the other day for a Calor Lite refill. OUCH (!)

 

Good luck with the trip by the way

 

Martyn

[Mel B]

Big Momma - 2009-06-17 10:55 PM

 

Was that full installation and labour costs (?) If so then that was a b****y good deal. Let us know how you get on with it. I was quoted £680 so it would pay me to drive up North to have it done (lol)

 

Some of the prices quoted for putting in a refillable bottle are extortionate! I don't know how some have the cheek!!! At the shows etc it was going to be quite a bit more just for the kit to fit ourselves so we were going to buy it off the web anyway as there are a couple of sites where you can get the bits and pieces cheaper than direct form Gaslow, at the shows, or dealers etc. Basically Waudby's agreed to price match and, as they're only 15 miles away, if we have any problems we can soon go back to see them. The chap even gave me his card with his mobile number on it and said to ring him direct if there were ever any problems, whilst here or abroad.

 

He put the bottle in, attached the hoses to the bottle and regulator, and then pressure tested it to make sure it was all okay. All I have to do is mount the bracket in the locker - I did dally with putting it in the skirt (I have the tools!:->) but when we change vans in years to come it will leave a big hole, although you can get blanking fittings for them, but it is going to be much easier to put it in the locker and I can always change it to go in the skirt if I find I want to do that as we went for the longer filler hose.

 

I'm sure if I'd wanted I could have had him fit the bracket for me for a probably very reasonable fee but I'm quite capable of doing that myself.

 

If you have someone local to you who does installations why not try asking them if they'll price match too? You never know, you've got nowt to lose. :-D

[Mel B]

LordThornber - 2009-06-18 9:02 AM

 

Slightly off thread, but thanks Mel for providing me with more ammo for having one fitted to the next van.

 

I coughed up £18.50 the other day for a Calor Lite refill. OUCH (!)

 

Good luck with the trip by the way

 

Martyn

 

Hi Martyn

 

You don't have to wait, you can take it with you when you change vans anyway. If you go down the route we have, by having the bracket in the locker when you come to move it to another van, all you need to do is undo the hose to the regulator, unfasten the bracket and the whole lot comes out. Easy-peasy! :-D

[kontiki]

I swapped a 3.6 kg calor bottle for a calorlite to use as a backup for my refillable (I've also got a adapter off eBay for refilling calor bottles) I also had to pay £18.50 for the refill, there was a place nearby to me that had the calorlite but the bottles didn't have the gastrak gauge on them but their price was £16.50 for the calorlite.

 

Anybody thinking of exchanging for the calorlite you can exchange almost any size for the new bottles up to the 1st July, after that you can only exchange the 6 or 7 kg bottles.

[Mel B]

Thought I'd let you know how we got on with our first 'fill'! I finally managed to get the time to fit the filler bracket into the gas locker ... what a palaver! Had to mount it at the top of the locker and make a plate from thick alumninium sheet to strengthen it, it took a while but it's done.

 

So, we duly went off yesterday afternoon to fill, with instructions to hand. Got to the first garage (49.9p per litre) ... where's the gas pump ... had to ask as we didn't know what it looked like! :D

 

Once parked next to it we proceeded to try to attache the nozzle 'coupler' ... what the !!!!! It was extremely difficult and took both of us, the pressure we had to exert to put the thing in and then try to twist it was rediculous! We finally manged it, then the lever refused to lock in the open position, more fiddling ... accompanied by gushes of gas as it released ... makes you jump when you're not ready for it!!! *-)

 

Eventually we got it to stay put and with trepadation pressed the green button .... a small chug then nowt, not a sausage. Hmmmmm ... what had we done wrong .... okay, try again, let the lever go and then pulled it back and secured it again ... pressed the button ... hisssssss ... then nowt. This was getting silly!!! The girl from the garage came out as she could see we were having 'fun' and tried to help ... she suggested removing the nozzle and putting it back into the housing on the pump to reset it, then trying it all over a gain ... oh what joy! After doing this 3 times we finally admitted defeat and she decided that the pump must be faulty as it had been playing up before ... at least it wasn't us! 8-)

 

Fortunately there is another garage at the opposite side of the road a few hundred yards away, who also do autogas (50.9p per litre) - at least we knew what the gas pump looked like this time! :$ We managed to get the nozzle secured and the lever on much easier (not as knackered ... the pump that is not us!) and pressed the big green button ... nowt ... uh-oh ... then thankfully it sprang to life and started to chug away happily depositing gas into the tank. It cut off at just shy of 19 litres so our attempts at the other garage had put a bit into the tank (for free!) as it takes 22.5 litres apparently. It cost £9.53 - should've been £11.45 if we'd had to pay for the whole lot. :-D Seeing as father in law had just paid over £20 for a camping gas 907 refill this was very good indeed.

 

Tried the cooker, after expelling all of the air it worked a treat .... now we'll be 'cooking on gas' ... literally!!!!! (lol)

 

For those of you who already use refillable cylinders ... are the pumps normally easy to use? Were we just unlucky with our first attempt? :-S

[Tony Jones]

You were unlucky to find a faulty pump for your first attempt. Connections can be a bit temperamental - after all, they have to make a gas-tight seal, unlike petrol/diesel pumps. But with a bit of jiggling around (can I watch? >:-) ) they usually work without too much trouble. Once you've done it a couple of times you'll get the hang of it. Continental ones wiull sometimes need an extra adaptor. Have fun!

[tp002c784tp002c784tp]

Mel B - 2009-06-22 6:14 PM

 

Thought I'd let you know how we got on with our first 'fill'! I finally managed to get the time to fit the filler bracket into the gas locker ... what a palaver! Had to mount it at the top of the locker and make a plate from thick alumninium sheet to strengthen it, it took a while but it's done.

 

So, we duly went off yesterday afternoon to fill, with instructions to hand. Got to the first garage (49.9p per litre) ... where's the gas pump ... had to ask as we didn't know what it looked like! :D

 

Once parked next to it we proceeded to try to attache the nozzle 'coupler' ... what the !!!!! It was extremely difficult and took both of us, the pressure we had to exert to put the thing in and then try to twist it was rediculous! We finally manged it, then the lever refused to lock in the open position, more fiddling ... accompanied by gushes of gas as it released ... makes you jump when you're not ready for it!!! *-)

 

Eventually we got it to stay put and with trepadation pressed the green button .... a small chug then nowt, not a sausage. Hmmmmm ... what had we done wrong .... okay, try again, let the lever go and then pulled it back and secured it again ... pressed the button ... hisssssss ... then nowt. This was getting silly!!! The girl from the garage came out as she could see we were having 'fun' and tried to help ... she suggested removing the nozzle and putting it back into the housing on the pump to reset it, then trying it all over a gain ... oh what joy! After doing this 3 times we finally admitted defeat and she decided that the pump must be faulty as it had been playing up before ... at least it wasn't us! 8-)

 

Fortunately there is another garage at the opposite side of the road a few hundred yards away, who also do autogas (50.9p per litre) - at least we knew what the gas pump looked like this time! :$ We managed to get the nozzle secured and the lever on much easier (not as knackered ... the pump that is not us!) and pressed the big green button ... nowt ... uh-oh ... then thankfully it sprang to life and started to chug away happily depositing gas into the tank. It cut off at just shy of 19 litres so our attempts at the other garage had put a bit into the tank (for free!) as it takes 22.5 litres apparently. It cost £9.53 - should've been £11.45 if we'd had to pay for the whole lot. :-D Seeing as father in law had just paid over £20 for a camping gas 907 refill this was very good indeed.

 

Tried the cooker, after expelling all of the air it worked a treat .... now we'll be 'cooking on gas' ... literally!!!!! (lol)

 

For those of you who already use refillable cylinders ... are the pumps normally easy to use? Were we just unlucky with our first attempt? :-S

Hi Mel B

 

When I had my Gaslow system fitted I, like you did not want to fit the filler in the bodywork, and as this is the second time I have had Gaslow fitted to Motorhomes, I also had my previous filler fitted the same way.

 

With a small "L " shaped bracket that comes with the kit ours was fitted on the bottom edge of the Sill (bolted) and a long stainless steel filler hose connected to the filler and bottle, this bottom edge is quite thick and strong. When you look under the bodywork My sill's have alumimium stays as strengheners skrewed to the under floor, I fitted an extra stay on each side of the filler as extra strengh.

 

One of my reasons for fitting the filler this way as well as what I have said above is I was told that some filling stations frown on the fact you are opening a cupboard door to fill your gas bottles.

 

There is also a strong plastic box cover that fits over the Brass filler to keep out dirt.

 

How anyone can say that fitting Gaslow never pays for it's self I cannot understand

 

Terry

[kontiki]

I think many of us have been there, on my first attempt I had to get the girl out to show us how to do it. Other times when abroad I pressed the wrong button & shut the pump off (it was the emergency stop *-) ) Another time in Germany I spent ages trying to get the nozzle to fit the wrong adapter (to be fair they had the wrong pump nozzle for the country & it was only the second time we had filled it up) Another time in Trier, Germany they had a new pump & it wasn't working properly, in the end I got nearly a full bottle for 5 euros as each time they tried to fill it the pump would reset to zero (lol) (lol) .

I have my nozzle fitted in the locker & up to now I have never had a problem filling up. I think that unless you use a lot of gas then it would take a long time to pay for itself, but for conveinence especially abroad then it's a no brainer. One of the reasons I fitted my filler in the locker was that I can remove it when I sell the van.

[Mel B]

As our gas locker is immediately behind the passenger door, which is where the fuel filler cap is anyway, when filing it I left the door open so it 'hid' what we were actually doing ... until hubby closed the ruddy thing!!!!!!! 8-) Fortunately the girl at the first garage wasn't bothered anyway, and the second one (Shell) didn't bat an eyelid. :-D

[Mel B]

Hi all

 

We had to do a fill whilst in France which, seeing as the bottle was full before we left, we were rather disappointed about.

 

The 'gauge' on the bottle apparently only starts to register when there is 50% or less gas in the bottle. When full the needle stays at the top of the green part of the gauge, once you get to 50% or less it is supposed to gradually go down, so half way down the green then it's at 40%, into the top of the yellow 30%, then once it drops to the top of the red you have 18% or less. Our gauge went straight from the top of the green one night, to the bottom of the red the following morning and, no, we hadn't used the heating! All we'd done is boil a kettle to wash up and made 2 cuppas, so it should hardly have moved. We spent an anxious day worrying about the gas due to this (being that it was Bastille day we couldn't get any gas as everywhere was shut!).8-)

 

When we actually did managed to put some gas in it though, we only got 14 litres in so there was still quite a bit of gas left in it but it wasn't reading correctly on the gauge for some reason - when we refilled it, it showed to the top of the green again. :-S

 

Has anyone else had this with a Gaslow system? As we haven't used the van since getting back off holiday, we still have a fair bit of gas left in it (we only had 5 days of our holiday to go after refilling so haven't used enough yet to see if it does the same again. Could it simply have been to do with it being a new system on it's first outing???? *-)

 

We did have a small Calor bottle with us just in case of emergencies but obviously we'd rather not have to carry it around with us if we can help it (we have got a adaptor that attaches to the connector on the end of the pipe from the Gaslow bottle to convert it to one that we can use on the Calor bottle if we need to).

 

The other thing I noticed was the amount of 'air' that appeared to be coming up to the hob (orangey/red flame) and was making the kettle/pans a bit sooty - it never did this before we got the Gaslow system - is this something to do with it being a new system to do you think? Or could it be the Autogas??? :-|

[bob b]

Hi Mel,

         My Gaslow system worked fine from the off. I seem to remember being told that sometimes the cylinder will not fill completely on the first fill from the pump. Subsequent fills should be ok.......all very mysterious.

[Frankkia]

I rather think the 80% stop is set too low. - We have 2 X 11kg bottles and when one has emptied we have switched to the other - adter a few days we have gone for a refill and only got 16 or 17 litres in ( You would think it would be at least 22 ltrs for the 1st bottle plus what we had used from the second).

 

Never had a problem with a sooty / orange flame with Gaslow / autogas but did have it with a Repsol bottle a few years back - completely sooted the fridge chimney up. Apparently the company puts a generous amount of oil in the bottles to stop 'em rusting and if you shake 'em about too much it mixes with the gas.

 

Most gas pumps have a delay on them from when you press the green / black button to starting to fill - usually about 5 seconds or so.

 

The foreign adaptors seem to work a bit easier than the UK version for ease of connection.

 

I think you would have to be full timing to get the Gaslow to pay for itself in a reasonable length of time but for shear convenience - Priceless!

[pkc]

Hi Mel'

If the gas flame is not a nice blue, and continues to soot up your pots and pans, it would be wise to get system checked, (Carbon monoxide and all that)

Found this on the web, it was from a document discussing the problem of blocked regulators with plasticizers, but could be relevant to this, and the first ‘bad gas’ thread by SAS, and those like myself who have refillable cylinders.

 

Quote;

’Heavy ends’ are the trace quantities of higher molecular weight hydrocarbons and unavoidable oils present in the bulk gas that do not evaporate off with normal cylinder use and gradually build up due to multiple refills in the period between regular cylinder inspections’

 

Quote;

‘All returned, empty cylinder are checked and cleaned periodically by the gas bottlers to remove any ‘heavy ends’ and condensate extractions that may have collected. These ‘heavy ends’ and condensate extractions have much higher boiling points (up to 300°C), than the paraffin type gases, and do not boil off when gas is being used.’

 

So what happens if and when these build to a certain level? Smelly gas? Regulator problems? Or does the agitation of the vehicle movement keep them at an acceptable level?

The under slung fixed type have been around for a good while, so I guess there are no major issues.

Comments from anyone in the LPG gas trade would be interesting.

As for recouping the cost of the Gaslow system, have you seen the price of secondhand kit on Ebay? If you sell the system at a later date it’s a no brainer, wish I’d done it earlier.

 

(Gaslow, all commissions to be sent to PKC at this address.)

 

Regards PKC.

 

[Derek Uzzell]

Mel

 

I once saw a sectioned Gaslow bottle displayed at an outdoor leisure show. I recall thinking at the time that the float mechanism that operated the contents-gauge and the 80% cut-off valve were both significantly less well engineered than the equivalent mechanism/valve used on more expensive Stako refillable bottles. I was also once told (not by Gaslow) that the same 80% cut-off valve was employed for both sizes of Gaslow cylinder and this might explain why LPG refilling quantities apparently varied from bottle to bottle.

 

Nevertheless, although the Gaslow-bottle gauge will always show "Full" until the LPG contents have dropped below 50% capacity, the gauge should - from that point onwards - indicate a gradual reduction in the contents level. That your bottle's gauge dropped suddenly from 'Green' to 'Red' suggests that the float mechanism was sticking. It's possible that it will free up with use: otherwise you'll need to get it replaced.

 

(Incidentally, Countrywide (mentioned in early postings to this thread) have sent a notice to members of their LPG scheme, prohibiting the refilling of 'free standing' gas bottles. The notice includes a photo of an older Hymer motorhome. This has serious fire damage to the bodywork area where the fridge is located but, as no details of the accident are given, it's impossible to know wheter or not the fridge itself was involved.)

[lennyhb]

When we took delivery of our van our Belgium dealer told us not not fill up on French gas.

We have met a couple of people in our travels who both have had to clean the fridge jets after running on French gas for just a couple of weeks.

I filled up in Holland earlier in the year & have noticed that the tips of the flames are sometimes a bit yellow never noticed when running on Belgium or UK gas.

I always try & fill up in the UK as UK gas is 100% propane & it's as cheap as any where else.

 

Not sure what make our bottles are but the gauges are very accurate over the full contents of the cylinder, they are fitted into the top of the cylinder & have to view with a mirror. Even more difficult since I modified the locker & it's now 2" lower, last year I ripped the bottom of it so I reduced the height when I repaired it to give more ground clearance.

[Derek Uzzell]

lennyhb

 

Based on your description and photos, your gas bottles may well be Stako-made.

 

I'd be interested to know where your Belgian dealer got his information about 'bad' French autogas from.

 

Most UK motorcaravanners opting for a refillable LPG reservoir will have made this choice because they will be operating their motorhomes outside the UK and, when they do this, it's a fair bet many of them will tour in France. Refillable LPG reservoirs have been around for quite a few years in the UK and, logically, if French autogas were significantly 'dirtier' than that of other European countries, by now one might have expected this factor to be well recognised within the UK motorcaravanning community. I'm not aware that this is so and, in my own case, since 2000 I've been using autogas sourced from the UK and France and I've noticed no extra sooting from the French gas.

 

French motorcaravanners have been slow to climb on to the refillable LPG bottle bandwagon, but such containers began to be marketed in France about 3 years ago. Since then, I've seen no comments in French motorhome magazines about problems relating to those bottles. French autogas does differ from the UK stuff in having a high butane content that can cause potential difficulties in very cold weather, but that's another matter. There appears to be no firm evidence that it's generally of a lower standard of 'cleanliness' than in other countries, or that its constituents can lead to problems with motorhome gas appliances.

 

Having said that, if LPG intended to fuel vehicle motors is utilised to run motorhome domestic appliances, I'd suggest that there's bound to be some question as to what the effect will be. Given the manner in which autogas is stored and dispensed, I'd also suggest that there's a fair likelihood that there will be variations in the cleanliness standard of the gas dispensed by (UK or foreign) LPG pumps. That Dometic advise against using autogas to fuel their refrigerators doesn't surprise me one bit.

 

As a matter of course I tend to disbelieve anything people tell me unless the information is plainly correct or reasonably credible. I recall asking the German dealer from whom I bought my Hobby how often he used a sterilising product in his motorhome's fresh-water tank. He replied "Only when the water supply is likely to be polluted - like in France."