Quality Control : Motorhomes

[Frank McAuley]

I have recently taken possession of a new Auto-Sleeper Wilton which was two months plus over its delivery date . Despite that I am dismayed at the Quality Control issues,eg:-

. wrong graphics fitted- 4 week wait until Dealer received "proper graphics";

.fridge not properly fitted;

.awning damaged - await replacement;

.habitation door not properly fitted;

.reversing camera monitor defective;

.diesel heating inoperable with "mains supply" therefore only 1 kw of heat

-await remedy;

.alarm system fitted which nobody knew(knows) how to operate- not popular at 4 a.m. when alarm sounds!

 

There have been approx 20 issues which require attention and the mhome is now with the dealer and I'm off to Tenerife to recover from the stress of selecting,purchasing and "getting-to-know" it.

 

I had originally ordered a Fiat based mhome but cancelled due to "judder". Perhaps the judder would have caused less stress! The most disappointment has arisen from the total reluctance of Auto-Sleeper senior management refusing dialogue leaving one with no option but to invoke litigation. This ,coupled,with the Sales Director being made redundant didn't help.

 

I now seek help from the established mhome fraternity as to what action-if any- they consider appropiate! Where are you ANDY?

[Porky]

You have my sympathy. There is no way one can factor in this sort of shoddy work and lack of good customer relations. We as end users are one step removed from the producer and whilst this clearly means the dealer is responsible the producer does not "feel the heat" as it were.

As I understand it a supplier should be given the oportunity of correcting faults which they should do with due diligence.

Confirming every telephone conversation and keeping dated notes and times of them is important as at some point in time if they do not apply due diligence then you could argue that they have frustrated the contract between you and you could seek costs through the small claims court.

Unfortunately these things always take forever to resolve and they will only be resolved as a result of your daily persistance.

We have been fortunate our Autotrail Tracker EKS is superbly finished to a high standard throughout and any minor items have been dealt with very efficiently by Chelston Motorhomes. Also it is a Fiat 3l auto so drives like a dream.

 

Roy Fuller

 

[Rapido-lass]

Unfortuinately this seems more the norm these days - and some of the dealers don't seem to care either. My gripe is that none of these points were picked up at the PDI stage - to me this is more a fundemental dealer can't be bothered issue. However, this doesn't help you at this moment, but many of us know exactly what you are going through. Just look forward to the days you can enjoy using it.

[alf]

Unfortunately Auto-sleepers build quality has suffered ever since they sold out around 2000 we have had 11 Auto-Sleepers in our 40 years motor caravanning we got our last one in 2006 against my better judgment the quality of all the conversion was poor and little concern from the factory we have spoke to several Auto-Sleeper owners and all have had similar problems would I advise anyone to buy a new

Auto-sleeper NO I would not.

 

Alf

[Guest JudgeMental]

 

I think you are safer with German built vans......Its a bit like cars really *-)

[mel wood]

We also had a number of problems on a new Auto-Sleepers Symbol ES bought in November 2008. For the first 4 months it was back at the dealer's at least once each month. Some of the problems were obviously because of poor build quality and poor quality control at the factory. Some should have been picked up at the dealer PDI. It was very frustrating and stressful. We spoke about 'rejecting the vehicle as unfit for purpose' but it was obvious that the only way we could try that approach was via the courts. (It would NOT have been small claims court because of the sum involved.)

 

Eventually most problems were sorted out by the dealer and we were able to rectify others.

 

Our 2002 Auto-Sleepers Trident had no similar problems and was a pleasure to own for over 6 years. Now this new van is sorted it may become 'a classic camper' in our ownership. We would not want to live through the stress of those first 4 months with another motorhome.

 

Note: the Peugeot base vehicle has not caused problems.

 

 

[david lloyd]

JudgeMental - 2009-09-29 3:49 PM

 

 

I think you are safer with German built vans......Its a bit like cars really *-)

 

Sorry Judge - but it don't matter where they are built if the dealer doesn't do a proper PDI and rectifies any issues arising before the owner takes delivery.

[Frank McAuley]

Tyou for your comments. My wife and I would not want to go through the stress - which has not dissipated- again. We initially started to buy an Auto-Sleeper in Jan 2009 and placed an order but there were problems between AS and the dealer resulting in the mhome not being supplied despite us having paid the deposit.

To "cut a long story short" it took us EIGHT months to acquire an Auto-Sleeper Wilton plus 4 weeks to have the current graphics fitted. It's now back with the dealer with approx 20 issues to be resolved.

The circumstances which set my particular circumstances "apart" are:

1. there is NO AS outlet where I live;

2. the deal was done by the now-departed Sales Director and me through a third party who introduced us;

3.AS deny they have a contract with me so where did I get the mhome from- a hat?

 

I have requested the truth -with No pecuniary advantage- but all I hear is silence!! So my advice to potential buyers of mhomes is "BUYER BEWARE"!

 

 

[duetto owner]

we got a new autosleeper in may 09

 

water tank leaked from day 1

took 3 visits to get cooker ignition working

noisy heater had to go to eberspacher

roofgutter rails cracked paintwork still waiting fords to authorise repair

sliding door leaks in heavy rain outstanding still fords again

sealant peeling off roof vents

heiki plastic strips falling off the pull over fly screen

plastic pin that hold toilet roll breaks

plastic bit that hold cupboard door shut breaks

edges of window blinds snag and fray and crease silver blinds

now cannot get any hot water gas nor mains.

 

autosleeper need to start a pdi similar to car dealerships where everything is tested and checked before delivery.

a very good van been spoilt by no pdi and poor quality build. To think that we chose them over swift and eldis because they had good build reputation never been so disappointed with a product.

 

MMM need to publish this thread and invite autosleeper to reply.

[graham]

Our Eton was fitted with the Eberspaccher Airlectric system as well as the EB diesel heater. There is no external change over switch and the Airlectric operates automatically instead of the diesel when plugged into the mains. I believe this is standard on all the Ford A/S coachbuilts. Now our dealer did not know it was fitted and it is not on the A/S spec sheet and I only found it when our electric box failed and I lifted the wardrobe floor to see if it was anything simple (it wasn't). So I expect yours is probably the same. Assuming you have the standard vehicle alarm fitted and not an aftermarket one this is a Ford item and its operation is described in the Ford owners manual. Now you have to have the correct manual. In our case somewhere between the Ford production and handover the book ended up being an earlier version which did not cover it. They are available at low cost from a Ford dealer. You immobilise the internal sensor by locking the vehicle using the key. This leaves the vehicle alarm and immobiliser active but means you can move around inside the vehicle without triggering the movement sensor and enter and exit the vehicle using the habitation door. We set our alarm off a few times as well but it works fine once you know. I hope this is of some use and I hope the rest of your issues are soon resolved.

[Guest Tracker]

And that folks, apart from the cost saving, sums up why we NEVER have - and probably never will - never say never? - buy a new van!

[Frank McAuley]

I agree with Duetto Owner with regard to MMM publishing and requesting AS to reply but as I am still awaiting replies from the CEO and MD - I wouldn't hold your breath!

 

It's a shame to see such a good product degraded by poor oversight ,quality control and customer support.

 

I would appeal to MMM to publish and cause AS to "change their ways" before it's too late!

[alf]

When the Trevelyan's sold Auto-Sleepers it became just another business when they ran the firm it was a family firm with reputable name and an excellent build quality. The quality control was bar none.

When the bank bought it they became controlled by accountants and quality and standards were a thing of the past.

Charles Trevelyan as now retired from the service centre.

 

You can see 10 + year old Auto-Sleepers with interiors built by themselves as good as new.

The cabinet doors in ours are all photographed wood effect at 3 years old going milky from sunlight fading when this started at 18 months old I was told draw the curtains to keep daylight out.

Auto-Sleepers humbug.

 

 

This year we decided to replace all the door fronts with new one we were told they had some new style wood fronts we paid lo and behold they were nice but all the 20mm holes drilled the wrong way round they supplied had supplied boobed all the stock was the same they would not be getting any more refund gived less the original postage plus my return postage so much for goodwill

 

Alf

[Mel B]

Hi Frank

 

I'm sorry to hear you are having such problems with you van.

 

Frank McAuley - 2009-09-29 4:28 PM

We initially started to buy an Auto-Sleeper in Jan 2009 and placed an order but there were problems between AS and the dealer resulting in the mhome not being supplied despite us having paid the deposit.

It sounds like the delaer was having some sort of 'falling out' with Autosleeper which, ultimately, has been sorted otherwise I don't think you'd have got your van at all (which in retrospect could have been a blessing).

 

1. there is NO AS outlet where I live;

Unfortunately you've found out the hard way that this can be a problem, even if it was just for minor work, not having the dealership nearby to rectify problems can be a pain in the bum.

 

2. the deal was done by the now-departed Sales Director and me through a third party who introduced us;

It doesn't matter who did the 'deal', you bought the van from the company and they should put anything right.

 

3.AS deny they have a contract with me so where did I get the mhome from- a hat?

This is actually true - Auto Sleeper do NOT have a contract with you, the contract is with the dealer you bought the vehicle from, not Auto Sleeper, they just made it. It is normal for all rectification work to be done by the dealership.

 

I have requested the truth -with No pecuniary advantage- but all I hear is silence!! So my advice to potential buyers of mhomes is "BUYER BEWARE"!

 

Not sure what you expect to be told and by who? Your final sentence is spot on though.

 

I hope the problems get solved quickly for you now so you can enjoy your new van.

[lennyhb]

JudgeMental - 2009-09-29 3:49 PM

 

 

I think you are safer with German built vans......Its a bit like cars really *-)

 

I'm with the Judge on this one I like to support British manufacturers but not in this market, having had a British caravan that had more water in the walls than my garden pond.

 

 

[Mel B]

Tracker - 2009-09-29 5:28 PM

 

And that folks, apart from the cost saving, sums up why we NEVER have - and probably never will - never say never? - buy a new van!

 

There's only one problem with that though, you're assuming that a second hand van has had any problems rectified ... it could simply be that the previous owners were so sick of it that they PXd it still with the faults and the next owner just inherits them. :-S

[Guest Tracker]

Mel B - 2009-09-29 6:02 PM

 

Tracker - 2009-09-29 5:28 PM

 

And that folks, apart from the cost saving, sums up why we NEVER have - and probably never will - never say never? - buy a new van!

 

There's only one problem with that though, you're assuming that a second hand van has had any problems rectified ... it could simply be that the previous owners were so sick of it that they PXd it still with the faults and the next owner just inherits them. :-S

 

This is of course quite true but so far we have been very lucky!

 

Maybe buying a van that is at least 18 months old gives it a better chance?

 

So does checking the forums and avoiding certain base vehicles, converters and dealers with certain reputations!

[Guest peter]

JudgeMental - 2009-09-29 3:49 PM

 

 

I think you are safer with German built vans......Its a bit like cars really *-)

I unreservedly second that. Could say a lot more but don't want to upset a lot of people.

[Guest peter]

david lloyd - 2009-09-29 4:27 PM

 

JudgeMental - 2009-09-29 3:49 PM

 

 

I think you are safer with German built vans......Its a bit like cars really *-)

 

Sorry Judge - but it don't matter where they are built if the dealer doesn't do a proper PDI and rectifies any issues arising before the owner takes delivery.

Cobblers! shoddilly built products should not even get out of the factory door. Especially if they have ISO2000 acreditation. Which I doubt, they probably wouldn't even get past the first hurdle. It's a bloody disgrace. The dealer should only have to give it a clean and polish and sort out any damage in transit issues. >:-)

[Guest peter]

Tracker - 2009-09-29 5:28 PM

 

And that folks, apart from the cost saving, sums up why we NEVER have - and probably never will - never say never? - buy a new van!

That, plus the fact that you're tighter than a ducks a**e Richard.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But I also wouldn't buy a new one. Can't be a**ed with all that going back for habitation checks nonsense. (lol)

[Frank McAuley]

I refer to forgoing comments :-

Heating: the installed system is not per spec and when I made enqs at AS as to its mode of operation nobody knew. The newly established dealer in my area,in conjunction with AS is now trying to rectify the situation;

 

Alarm: Cobra alarm,enhanced to Thatcham2, and fitted by AS so not covered by the Ford manual. When I made enqs at AS as to its mode of operation- guess what- nobody knew. It was not supplied with a manual- the same applies to the reversing camera;

 

No Pecuniary Advantage: AS , as a sign of goodwill, have offered me "losses and expenses" ( cancelled ferry crossings etc). I do not want goodwill, I expect a simple "we're sorry,we were wrong;

 

Contract: the dealer I had originally ordered an AS from "parted company" and after being fortunate to extract my deposit I dealt directly with AS. They deny this. I am now fortunate that a local company has been established as an AS dealer and hopefully our issues will be resolved because I actually like the mhome.

 

I have merely entered this thread to make potential buyers aware but I have been most surprised at the amount of discontent pertinent to the AS mode of operation- especially it's "Quality Control". At this time "the jury is out"as to the ability of the so-called NEW management. Thank you all for your comments which have been most therapeutic.

 

 

[Brian Kirby]

Frank McAuley - 2009-09-30 7:05 AM .......... Contract: the dealer I had originally ordered an AS from "parted company" and after being fortunate to extract my deposit I dealt directly with AS. They deny this. I am now fortunate that a local company has been established as an AS dealer and hopefully our issues will be resolved because I actually like the mhome. ............

I think the test at to who you actually bought your van from i.e. who, legally, is the supplier, will be the person who, in the first instance (i.e. ignoring that Auto Sleepers will have eventually received your payment via whatever intermediary), received the payments for the van.

Your deposit, plus final payment, whether credit or otherwise, will have passed through someone's bank.  If that someone is Auto Sleepers, there is no point in their protesting otherwise.  If it is not, there is no point in your asserting otherwise.  The trail, via credit card, bank account statement or finance company records will be quite clear and should be conclusive.  Have you pursued this route?  The supplier, whoever that may be, is the person with whom you have, de facto, your contract, whatever they (or even you :-)) may think, or wish, to be the case.

[Frank McAuley]

Tyou Brian . I shall research that.

[broc]

I am not sure if this might help;

 

If the Cobra Alarm is anything like ours fitted to MK7 Transit, using the vehicle remote key to arm/disarm, I have found out the following by trial and error:

 

Our habitation door is not integrated with the cab door central locking.

Pressing remote key 'lock' once, locks the cab doors only. press a second time, within a few seconds, this deadlocks the doors and sets the alarm.

 

To disarm, press 'unlock' once, which also unlocks drivers door only. Press twice, and the passenger door also unlocks. BUT, if you don't then open either cab door, it helpfully relocks & re-arms the alarm after 20 secs ... we found this out the 'noisy' way!

 

So, when disarming the alarm, I always physically open a cab door too. It's a bit of a chore, but we don't annoy the neighbours anymore.

 

 

[Guest peter]

Do a Google and download manual for the alarm from the web.