Mike88 Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 The heading of this thread is Ford v Fiat. If its totally pointelss why have we all contributed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nowtelse2do Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 Mike88 - 2009-11-18 12:17 PM The heading of this thread is Ford v Fiat. If its totally pointelss why have we all contributed? Quite true Mike, it would have been better if it had been called 'which is the Best/Worst van'. We all have our favorite makes and tend to stick with them but if we don't try other makes then how can we compare like for like.I have owned 2 Mk4 Transits, 1 Renault Master, 1 Fiat Daily. and that is the order i would rate them. Must confess here, and sorry to say Mike I would not touch your model of Transit as one of my relations had one and it caused him a lot of problems and expense, ECU, Clutch DMF, Ect. The only VW I have driven was the split window one, which was years ago, could never hear if the engine was running but was very comfy & easy to drive.I once hired a 316 Merc, Fastest van I've ever driven also easy to drive.So really it depends on your own experiences and thoughts on the vehicles you have driven.Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rupert123 Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 Mike88 - 2009-11-18 12:17 PM The heading of this thread is Ford v Fiat. If its totally pointelss why have we all contributed? The thread in itself is not pointless Mike. What I meant was when you start off by saying 'I would not buy one because this went wrong' it is not a great argument. All car makers, van makers produce so many there are going to be poor ones among them. If you happen to get one it puts you off but in reality means little because for every bad one their are thousands of happy customers out their. The only way to argue the point is about the relative merits of a vehicle, if one particular vehicle has problems and it happens to yours well it is unfortunate but unlikely to effect them all. In the case of the Fiat gearbox debate other makes problems have been glossed over but it does not mean they do not exist. When you buy a new vehicle you take a risk and hope the warranty will cover it. If there is a basic problem like the Fiat gearbox on some models and more recently the BMW wheel problem then the maker will frantically do two things, first cover it up or deny it then try to figure out a way to resolve it for the least money. It is not nice or honest but that is the way it works, they all do it. If you are doing to do Ford v Fiat you have to compare the package offered not go into the problems that may occur, as I said this is pointless in that contex. God now I have written all that not sure I understand myself but hope I get my point across. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike88 Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 I think in order to make up our minds about the base vehicle we have to take many things into consideration. Part of my research into my next purchase included reading the comments of those who own them. I read about the good and bad with a Fiat (mostly bad) and posts about the Transit, Renault Master and Mercedes which were mostly good. I took into consideration also the kind of customer service that people had received. In terms of appearance and choice the Fiat is miles ahead of the alternatives in my view. The vehicle looks fantastic and drives well. But in terms of customer service and reliability the feedback has been little short of disasterous - at least that is the opinion I have gained. My choice based on all of this would be to opt for another Transit. But as they don't do an automatic I had to consider a Fiat as Mercedes panel van autos (which I definitely wanted) and Renault Master autos are difficult to obtain for a varierty of reasons. The last thing I wanted was a Fiat especially as I owned one of their cars and had similar warranty problems as some of those on here who have experienced the Fiat "get stuffed" Customer Service experience. So what did I do? I bought a Fiat because there was no real alternative for me. I hope the Comfortmatic gearbox proves to be OK but I won't find out for 6 months because that is the time I have to wait as their popularity has grown enormously possibly because of the extraordinary judder issue and the associated hassle in getting a satisfactory fix. Why Fiat failed to test these vehicles going backwards in beyond belief! At the end of the day we all make up our minds based on our own needs. Indeed - and on reflection - this thread is probably pointless but the reason I posted that my Transit experience was totally positive is that the thread was called Ford versus Fiat. If my Fiat is as good as some seem to say then I'll be both ecstatic and surprised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nowtelse2do Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 Mike88 - 2009-11-18 5:34 PM I think in order to make up our minds about the base vehicle we have to take many things into consideration. Part of my research into my next purchase included reading the comments of those who own them. I read about the good and bad with a Fiat (mostly bad) and posts about the Transit, Renault Master and Mercedes which were mostly good. I took into consideration also the kind of customer service that people had received. In terms of appearance and choice the Fiat is miles ahead of the alternatives in my view. The vehicle looks fantastic and drives well. But in terms of customer service and reliability the feedback has been little short of disasterous - at least that is the opinion I have gained. My choice based on all of this would be to opt for another Transit. But as they don't do an automatic I had to consider a Fiat as Mercedes panel van autos (which I definitely wanted) and Renault Master autos are difficult to obtain for a varierty of reasons. The last thing I wanted was a Fiat especially as I owned one of their cars and had similar warranty problems as some of those on here who have experienced the Fiat "get stuffed" Customer Service experience. So what did I do? I bought a Fiat because there was no real alternative for me. I hope the Comfortmatic gearbox proves to be OK but I won't find out for 6 months because that is the time I have to wait as their popularity has grown enormously possibly because of the extraordinary judder issue and the associated hassle in getting a satisfactory fix. Why Fiat failed to test these vehicles going backwards in beyond belief! At the end of the day we all make up our minds based on our own needs. Indeed - and on reflection - this thread is probably pointless but the reason I posted that my Transit experience was totally positive is that the thread was called Ford versus Fiat. If my Fiat is as good as some seem to say then I'll be both ecstatic and surprised. Mike,If there's any chance of canceling, go for the Merc.Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 I think there is one further factor that Rupert has omitted. That is general reliability. He is perfectly correct in saying that one individual's experience of one vehicle is meaningless. However, what is relevant to choice, is the number of faults owners of particular brands, or models, experience.Where a model, or a brand, has earned a reputation for unreliability, it seems to me rather perverse to go out an buy one in the hope it will buck the trend, and far more sense to seek out the one that has a reputation for superior reliability.With cars, JD Power surveys give a clue as to what is reliable and what is not. But with vans? Is there an equivalent reliability survey? Is there a reason why so many of the courier services run Sprinters, beyond bulk purchase discounts? I also note Iveco vans becoming more common. Is that due to reliability, the body size (I think the largest available volume in a panel van), or that Iveco wishes to increase its UK market penetration and has priced aggressively? Offers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nowtelse2do Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 Brian, I think it's the size equaled with good payload. Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david lloyd Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 Brian Kirby - 2009-11-18 6:12 PMI think there is one further factor that Rupert has omitted. That is general reliability. He is perfectly correct in saying that one individual's experience of one vehicle is meaningless. However, what is relevant to choice, is the number of faults owners of particular brands, or models, experience.Where a model, or a brand, has earned a reputation for unreliability, it seems to me rather perverse to go out an buy one in the hope it will buck the trend, and far more sense to seek out the one that has a reputation for superior reliability.With cars, JD Power surveys give a clue as to what is reliable and what is not. But with vans? Is there an equivalent reliability survey? Is there a reason why so many of the courier services run Sprinters, beyond bulk purchase discounts? I also note Iveco vans becoming more common. Is that due to reliability, the body size (I think the largest available volume in a panel van), or that Iveco wishes to increase its UK market penetration and has priced aggressively? Offers? I thought that fleet managers had access to fleet statistics showing the true cost of buying and running the different types of vans over a given period.The trouble with using such statistics though is that motorhomes do not get anywhere near the sort of mileages that commercial users do and have a very different set of purchase priorities such as ergonomics, looks, layout, converter etc.David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike88 Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 Mike, If there's any chance of canceling, go for the Merc. Dave Absolutely no chance as there is only one panel van I could find on one and that was on a vehicle 23ft long. I had considered getting one made but then there are difficulties sourcing an auto and of course the massive price premium. If the stories are correct about the Fiat Comfortmatic gearbox then I am hopeful it will be OK but my fingers are firmly crossed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted November 18, 2009 Share Posted November 18, 2009 well thats put a spanner in the works...was intending to hold out till 2011 for the new transit. there is an econetic version of present 280 panel van out now which is Euro 5 compliant. someone mentioned that a facelift version may be out in 2011 so will probably go with that if anyone still making campers on them! *-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Borderer Posted November 21, 2009 Share Posted November 21, 2009 I don't know about Ford, but my Nuevo, registered by the dealer in July, (last year's model). We bought it in September...just what we were looking for, has been in the local Peugeot dealers since last Wednesday (1000 miles on the clock). New alternator, battery and "pulleys". It was getting a bit squeeky, and the engine management light tended to flash :-) :-( . There you go...we can all buy a Friday van whatever the make :-( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhorsf Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 I thought Ford due to being just about bankrupt had cancelled the new transit model they were working on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 This thread began as an observation that, for two same-size motorhomes with identical internal layouts, but with one built on a Ford chassis and the other on a Fiat, the Ford variant would provide much greater payload. Now, I'm well aware that many forum members don't bother to read beyond a thread's title, but are there any thoughts about Poppy's payload suggestion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bazza454 Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 jhorsf - 2009-11-22 1:47 AM I thought Ford due to being just about bankrupt had cancelled the new transit model they were working on Yes, they have had a torrid time but they are not "just about bankrupt."It looks like they are doing a reasonable job of turning things around, and lets hope it continues - http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2009/nov/02/ford-announces-us-profits Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted November 22, 2009 Share Posted November 22, 2009 Derek Uzzell - 2009-11-22 9:02 AM This thread began as an observation that, for two same-size motorhomes with identical internal layouts, but with one built on a Ford chassis and the other on a Fiat, the Ford variant would provide much greater payload. Now, I'm well aware that many forum members don't bother to read beyond a thread's title, but are there any thoughts about Poppy's payload suggestion. Oh, that was settled within the first six posts Derek - the rest are just stocking fillers! Guilty as charged! :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhorsf Posted November 23, 2009 Share Posted November 23, 2009 Derek Uzzell - 2009-11-22 9:02 AM This thread began as an observation that, for two same-size motorhomes with identical internal layouts, but with one built on a Ford chassis and the other on a Fiat, the Ford variant would provide much greater payload. Now, I'm well aware that many forum members don't bother to read beyond a thread's title, but are there any thoughts about Poppy's payload suggestion. Does Derek Uzzell go to the Lous Walsh School of Rules Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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