titch Posted February 27, 2010 Share Posted February 27, 2010 hello all. can anyone tell me if it's possible to put a fitting on the back seats of our motorhome, for child seats, or seatbelts. as we don't have seatbelts, and wish to take family with us on some trips. if this is possible, where would I find the people that can do this? I live in the south west. regards, titch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spospe Posted February 27, 2010 Share Posted February 27, 2010 Titch You have not given us any meaningful data to work with, for example, what sort of motorhome do you have, or how many seat belt(s) do you wish to fit? Generally the simple answer in these cases is to forget the idea and get a van that has the belts originally fitted by the manufacturer. Retro fitting is normally not easy and the attitude of an insurance company to a claim is very uncertain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
titch Posted February 28, 2010 Author Share Posted February 28, 2010 thank you for your response. I have seen an advert { which has been mislaid unfortuately] for a form of ' clamp' fixed to the frame under the seat cushions, and another one fixed to a childs car seat that marries up to the 'clamp' and they lock together. I own a E425 Bessacarr. {02} and ofcourse buying a motorhome with seatbelts already installed would be ideal,but is not an option at the moment, hence the enquiry :-S regards, titch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted February 28, 2010 Share Posted February 28, 2010 From a practical and pragmatic point of view, many people fit child seats in vans without making them severe crash proof simply to stop small children running about and playing on the loose in a van whilst on the road. As long as the driver and/or the parents of any children so located accept that it is probably not crash proof I don't see the harm as surely any form of restraint against heavy braking or sudden swerving or cornering is better than none? It depends what sort of 'protection' you seek? If it is full blown severe crash protection then this is not a DIY job and may not even be possible at all due the the flimsy nature of motorhome internal construction. Nevertheless from a practical point of view the floor is usually quite strong and any seat belt mountings through the floor with spreader plates to spread the load might be a reasonable cost compromise. Statistically very few vans are ever involved in a serious crash - but then again some are - so it all depends what you want to achieve and the depth of your pocket? This is of course purely a personal point of view and no doubt the purists amongst us will surely criticise me for sharing it with you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJay Posted February 28, 2010 Share Posted February 28, 2010 i think that retro fitting seat belts is no longer allowed. We enquired when we bought our van , if we could have a 5th seat belt fitted on the rear facing dinnette seat, ( for the odd occasion when family used van) as they have three children each, though now all almost teenages. Was told not allowed .Would have made sense if it had been fitted at build, as five berths for sleeping, but not apparently for travelling!! I know you can travel without seat belts on rear facing seats, but for saftey , not a good idea Pauline Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted February 28, 2010 Share Posted February 28, 2010 If it were illegal then of course I would never retro fit a seat belt personally - but if it were already there when I bought the van that is a different matter! I am not advising anyone to follow this route - you make your own decisions based on the available information at the time! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted February 28, 2010 Share Posted February 28, 2010 The problem, I think, would be the insurer's reaction post any accident.Whatever may have been the original reason for fitting the belt, if it failed to perform as legally required, it would open an absolute can of worms. If it looks like a seat belt, straps you in like a seat belt, and clicks like a seat belt, it is a seat belt. No? Is there such a thing as a purely decorative non seat belt?Then, you have that statistically improbable head on collision. The clamps break free, and the child is projected past your right ear and through the windscreen. What will your insurer say now?Arguments along the lines of "it wasn't intended to resist an accident of that severity" or "it was only there to keep the child in his place, not to resist an accident" would just make matters worse. Why, then was it there? Was it perhaps intended to deceive others into believing it was a seat belt, and would be safe? Would others possibly change their minds about what they had understood it to be, if faced with a charge of contributory negligence?If you can't fit a proper seat belt that meets the full requirement, you will, IMO, be better off with none, than with a halfway house. Call me a killjoy if you must, but the anguish that could result from an accident in which a seat belt lash up failed, would far outweigh, and outlive, the momentary joy of a child's smiling face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnP Posted February 28, 2010 Share Posted February 28, 2010 Having seen what happens to the interior of a van after an accident I wouldn't recommend a DIY job. In the accident all of the furniture moved forwards - the fridge came completey out of its housing. The same would happen to the kids if they were not restrained by a crash tested seat belt system. A retro fitted system would cost a lot of money with perhaps major parts of the interior having to be dismantled to get an adequate metal frame into position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tracker Posted February 28, 2010 Share Posted February 28, 2010 I too have seen motorhomes severely damaged by collision and they are a real mess which makes you wonder how anyone can survive - but survive they usually do. Unlike a car and some modern vans which are crash tested as an entity, many vans were built prior to rear seat belt legislation and it is largely a matter of luck and the point of impact whether anyone gets hurt either by the impact itself or by flying fittings or possessions that become projectiles. Undeniably any child restrained by a 'proper' seat and belt would stand a better chance of surviving a serious collision or impact just as front seat passengers would. Nevertheless any form of restraint might be interpreted as better than none at all as long as the restraint itself has not been fitted in such a way that it causes greater injury than no restraint at all - and I am thinking here whether a lap only belt with it's propensity to cause internal injury is better or worse than no restraint at all? I realise that this is a huge can of worms with far reaching legal ramifications but I would sooner a child or grandchild of mine was seated securely to withstand the effects of normal driving and maybe a minor shunt than seated or standing with no restraint at all. Having travelled many thousands of miles with my own adverturous and often bored youngster in the back of the van many moons ago long before seat belt laws and politcal correctness came to pass I speak from that experience rather than 'modern' experience. I might be wrong legally but who is to say that I am wrong morally? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted February 28, 2010 Share Posted February 28, 2010 From what I can make out the E425 probably has a rear L shaped lounge. Unfortuately this is just not suitable for fitting a frame and seat belts in the rear. Even if a frame could be fitted and clamped to extensions of the base vehicle chassis the occupants would have no protection in a rear shunt. I am sorry but in my view you just have the wrong van if you have seats at the backwall to safely carry pasengers. Where adults are concened then it is their choice if they wish to sit in rear unbelted but as to children it is another story and they should have proper approved seat belting arrangements and the max safetly possible Regarding the 'frame clamp' you have seen advertised I suspect it is one which clamps to an approved frame for seat belts. One of the problems with using seat belts to restrain child seats is they are designed to fit into seats with more of a bucket shape and with side forces they stay reasonably in place. In a motorhome with flat cushions they can tllt severly with side forces and the clamp arangment for child seats gets around this problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flicka Posted February 28, 2010 Share Posted February 28, 2010 titch - 2010-02-28 2:11 PM thank you for your response. I have seen an advert { which has been mislaid unfortuately] for a form of ' clamp' fixed to the frame under the seat cushions, and another one fixed to a childs car seat that marries up to the 'clamp' and they lock together. I own a E425 Bessacarr. {02} and ofcourse buying a motorhome with seatbelts already installed would be ideal,but is not an option at the moment, hence the enquiry :-S regards, titch It's a no brainer, Titch IMO, What you describe should not be on the market, hope the manufacturer / seller has good Public Liability Insurance, I can envisage many claims heading their way. The "clamp fixture" and transport children at unacceptable risk level. (I also suspect the "clamp fixture" would soon cause the seat base(s) to disintegrate) for a few quid or spend & part exchange existing M/H for one with Manufacturer fitted Seats & Belts. (not at the rear wall) - even if it means an older vehicle or someone else transport the children in a seperate vehicle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brambles Posted February 28, 2010 Share Posted February 28, 2010 I have tried having a search for ISOFIX system kits which could be retrofitted to a mtorhome seatbelt base frame but cannot find anything. This is not to say there is not one out there, but I feel unlikely as to be Isofix approved I think has to be tested in the vehicle it is fitted to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
titch Posted March 1, 2010 Author Share Posted March 1, 2010 first, thankyou all for your helpful comments. my intention was to fit proper seat belts inpreference to the 'clamp' type I saw advertised. not myself, but by a m/home body specialist. My intention now is to have the family follow by car. This will prevent us taking the grandchildren on their own, but compromising safety is never an option. Sobeit, untill we change our present motorhome. once again, thank you. nice to know there is someone out there with whom to converse. :-D regards, titch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel B Posted March 2, 2010 Share Posted March 2, 2010 Hi titch - welcome to the nut house. :-D I think most of it has been covered above and as you have now made your decision this is mainly for information only for anyone else who is considering this. The fitting of the seat belt itself is only PART of the safety story - the other is the seat itself - in motorhomes with rear seatbelts nowadays the seat itself has a strong metal cage within it to withstand the extreme forces that would be experienced in a crash. I don't believe there would be any realistic (or cost effective) way to retrofit this in any motorhome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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