Towing a small car

[Jodi]

What are the pro'c and con's of the different methods of towing a car behind a motorhome. Is a trailer better then directly towing the car? We have a Ford Fiesta diesel, is this a suitable vehicle to be towed by something like the Autotrail Cheyanne?

[rupert123]

Jodi in your previous thread you were looking to buy a motorhome. If you want to tow I would suggest you instead look at keeping your caravan. I have always struggled to understand the logic of buying a M/H then towing a car behind it and no one has been able to explain it to me. Does not answer your question I know and plenty do tow cars, each to their own, but baffles me.

[takeaflight]

Hi Jodi, ignore the holy than thou lot.

 

To try to answer your question, first you need to establish the towing weight of your motorhome, there will be a plate somewhere with the limits on. If you are unsure to the meanings post them and a decent forum contributor will explain.

 

This will dictate what and to some degree how you tow.

 

I use a trailer but it does add around 350Kg to the weight.

 

Roy

[rupert123]

takeaflight - 2010-03-13 1:18 PM

 

Hi Jodi, ignore the holy than thou lot.

 

To try to answer your question, first you need to establish the towing weight of your motorhome, there will be a plate somewhere with the limits on. If you are unsure to the meanings post them and a decent forum contributor will explain.

 

This will dictate what and to some degree how you tow.

 

I use a trailer but it does add around 350Kg to the weight.

 

Roy

 

If this aimed at me suggest you explain. I have simply made a valid point, one you may not want to hear, but valid all the same.

[tonyishuk]

Broadly thinking along the same lines as the Jodi asked.

 

What I have found is that Brian James Trailers give good advice on what trailer to use from their range.

 

Always some debate about towing a trailer or the car.

 

FWIW, try moving a car by pushing / pulling it on the road then put it on a trailer and see the difference in rolling resistance. Trailer wins every time.

 

Good part of the arguement as far as MPG go.

 

Rgds

 

 

[trooper]

I have a trailer for our smart, one problem which has been mentioned to me by other trailer users and I find they are right is that the trailer is hard to move manually on shingle hard standings etc.

I was a caravaner for many years and I still wonder whether we did right getting a motorhome at times.

[vicwo]

Jodi I tow a Smart using an a frame or trailer, i have both.

The a frame is very easy to set up and use. On the motoway both are about equal but on side roads you may get the trailer weight bouncing the back end a little. Motorhome steering sometimes feels light with the trailer too. My partner is disabled so its down to me to do stuff. So Reversing is possible with a trailer but the aframe i have to jump out if a problem arises.

I had to take the car off with aframe on a narrow lane in France when i met a lorry head on but it was soon resolved.

Someone mentioned why not a caravan? Well my partner is too uncomfortable in a car on long journeys. In the back of the m/home she can travel forever. That is one very good reason. If i want to leave the Smart at home i can. You still need a car to pull a caravan. Driving round the vineyards with the roof down in my little car is the best feeling.

Go for it Jodi only one life---Live it

 

Vic

 

[takeaflight]

Moving the trailer around a grass pitch can be hard work, to over come this I have a tow bar on the car.

 

 

 

[mel wood]

rupert123 - 2010-03-13 1:53 PM

 

takeaflight - 2010-03-13 1:18 PM

 

Hi Jodi, ignore the holy than thou lot.

 

To try to answer your question, first you need to establish the towing weight of your motorhome, there will be a plate somewhere with the limits on. If you are unsure to the meanings post them and a decent forum contributor will explain.

 

This will dictate what and to some degree how you tow.

 

I use a trailer but it does add around 350Kg to the weight.

 

Roy

 

If this aimed at me suggest you explain. I have simply made a valid point, one you may not want to hear, but valid all the same.[/quote

 

I feel that Rupert 123 has made a valid point. We too have never understood the logic but each to their own way.

[Rosbotham]

Yes, but (and apologies if I'm wrong on this) Rupert has answered a few posts which were asking advice on towing a car with "I can't see the point in doing it". If the OP had wanted advice of whether to tow a car, they'd have asked for that...Jodi asked which way was best.

 

To provide my view, first thing you do need to check is the maximum train weight versus the MTPLM for your motorhome (see the plate that should be under bonnet). I'm reasonably sure that a lot of the Autotrails are 4tonne with 5.25 max train weight, which leaves 1.25 tonne for the towed vehicle which could preclude use of a trailer.

 

To date, we've towed a Smart Car on a Chris Cox A-frame. Advantages are that you hardly know the car's there (really do need a reversing camera), very quick to hitch/unhitch, upfront cost. Disadvantages are that there is a bit (!) of legal ambiguity (UK almost certainly ok, Europe more worrying), reversing can be a bit of a pain, wear and tear on the toad vehicle (we once had ours break down...unrelated to towing but impaired ability to be driven...and having a trailer could have been handy because we could have simply bunged it on the back).

 

We've just moved to a trailer, largely because we've got a new car and didn't want to trash the warranty. Too early to be definitive, but main advantages are no modification to car, ability to reverse. Against this car+trailer's far heavier, we're struggling a bit to get the noseweight down to a reasonable level, will need to find somewhere to put it on site and we're having to get our towbar modified because the trailer's not quite sitting level (not an issue with A-frame).

 

As someone else commented, we've had a towbar fitted to our car to allow us to manouvre the trailer a bit easier on site.

 

Hope this helps,

 

Paul

[takeaflight]

What are the pro'c and con's of the different methods of towing a car behind a motorhome. Is a trailer better then directly towing the car? We have a Ford Fiesta diesel, is this a suitable vehicle to be towed by something like the Autotrail Cheyanne?

 

 

I know this is a mistake ! but here goes.

 

Read the question !

 

Essentially "different methods of towing a car behind a motorhome."

 

Essentially "If you want to tow I would suggest you instead look at keeping your caravan."

 

How does that answer the question.

 

[RogP]

Hi Jodi

I'm just about to get an A Frame for our car.

 

My reasons are that we don't intend towing if we go abroad so the "legality" is less of a concearn. But mostly for ease of use , cost isn't a factor for us , right tool for the job is.

 

When considering trailers and A frames I based my decision on :

 

Trailer weight , from what I can tell the trailer could be 200kg or more which for the car we need to tow put us on or just over the MHs limits.

Trailer storage at home - we don't have anywhere to put it.

Trailer storage on site - some sites seems to either frown upon or insist its not on your pitch (others may dispute this its just from the occasions on site I've heard wardens asking to move them).

Cost (based upon new) trailers seem to be be about £1300+ , A frame £700+ .

 

With regards why we came back to MHs after towing caravans for a few years. We found we only ever used the caravan for 2 or 3 main holidays in a year , yet with previous MHs we had many many weekends or long weekends. Why , because by the time I get home from work , get changed , get the caravan sorted and hitched up it only leaves about an hour to drive to the site for 8pm and then another hour or so getting the caravan set-up usually in the dark.

Contrast that with I can come home for 5pm and be pulling the MH off the drive by 5:05pm , thus 3 hours to get somewhere. Also if needed I can drive the MH into work and head off from there at 4pm cant do that with a caravan.

Apart from the above things like ease of set up and decamp far quicker than a caravan and with me having to do most the set-up I tired of the hassell and it was taking the shine of my precious holidays

 

So why tow a car then - my wife has MS and for main holidays we could not go a week or 2 without some transport , cant be bothered with buses and trains or making sure the site had bus stops near as the wife cant walk far and we have 2 large dogs so taxis don't want my business. Hiring a car would not workout any cheaper over time and I like my own things not someone else's.

 

 

 

 

[stantheman]

I use an A-frame and sure, you don't know the car's there. I considered a rear-view camera but the Brake-Buddy, the preferred method of braking the towed vehicle, (both on tow and in a breakaway situation), provides a wireless sensor in the cab.

Either way, by the time you know it's gone, it's too late!

[Brian Kirby]

Rosbotham - 2010-03-13 9:48 PM ........ I'm reasonably sure that a lot of the Autotrails are 4tonne with 5.25 max train weight, which leaves 1.25 tonne for the towed vehicle which could preclude use of a trailer. .............. Paul

This bit is not quite correct.  The GTW is the actual laden weight of the tow vehicle plus the actual laden weight (ALW) of the trailer.  The MAM if both must be respected when loading but if, for example, the ALW of the van is below its MAM, the difference can be used on the trailer provided it remains within its MAM.

No one has yet mentioned reversing.  With a long tow vehicle and a short trailer this will always be difficult, but will be easier with a trailer than an "A" frame.

Since the car has brakes, these must function when towed on an A frame (because the car becomes the trailer which, if its MAM exceeds 750Kg must be braked and, if its MAM is lower than 750Kg but it is fitted with brakes, the brakes must function).  If towed on a trailer, the trailer brakes will operate in the normal fashion, on over-run.

The legality of A frames outside the UK is a bit "grey".  Most folk seem not to have problem, but a few have.

For more on A frames, use the search facility, enter "A frame" as the keyword, select "Motorhome Matters" as the forum to search, select all posts as the time limit, gather up a ice-pack, and read!!  :-D

[tonyishuk]

I have used the following mounted on a Discovery, Could be useful on a motorhome if the car cannot be fitted with a tow bar.

 

http://www.watling-towbars.co.uk/front_towbars.html

 

Ideal as you can see where you are pushing.

 

rgds

[Rosbotham]

Brian Kirby - 2010-03-15 12:58 PM

 

This bit is not quite correct.  The GTW is the actual laden weight of the tow vehicle plus the actual laden weight (ALW) of the trailer.  The MAM if both must be respected when loading but if, for example, the ALW of the van is below its MAM, the difference can be used on the trailer provided it remains within its MAM.

 

Yes, Brian, you're right...I had intended to say "and if you load your motorhome to it's Maximum Authorised Weight". Having said that, Autotrails only tend to have e.g. 465kg spare payload (example : Frontier Savannah/Cherokee, which I think are the successors of the OP's van), so the amount of extra weight you can "grab" for the trailer is a bit constrained.

 

Agree with all your other points.

 

Paul

[Brian Kirby]

Rosbotham - 2010-03-15 8:03 PM

Brian Kirby - 2010-03-15 12:58 PM This bit is not quite correct.  The GTW is the actual laden weight of the tow vehicle plus the actual laden weight (ALW) of the trailer.  The MAM if both must be respected when loading but if, for example, the ALW of the van is below its MAM, the difference can be used on the trailer provided it remains within its MAM.

Yes, Brian, you're right...I had intended to say "and if you load your motorhome to it's Maximum Authorised Weight". Having said that, Autotrails only tend to have e.g. 465kg spare payload (example : Frontier Savannah/Cherokee, which I think are the successors of the OP's van), so the amount of extra weight you can "grab" for the trailer is a bit constrained. Agree with all your other points. Paul

True, but it seems there were several chassis/engine options, and also several Cheyenne models, so which would allow what could only be determined in relationship to an individual vehicle, taking account of dealer fit and DIY additions.

[Jodi]

Thank you all for your varied and helpful answers. Some have been very good and useful, others not. :-S

 

We have two dogs and we enjoy long walks with them in the countryside. We have no problem packing everything up and driving the motorhome to a nice spot and going off for a nice long walk for several hours and the thought of coming back to said M/H and making a nice cup of tea and having 40 winks before setting off somewhere else is very appealing. However, leaving a forty odd thousand pound van in a lonely car park full of all our things is quite frankly asking for trouble, thats if the car park is big enough for a large m/h. Having dogs quite often precludes us using public transport as not all will allow dogs onboard. having a small car along with us will allow us to do this and also to visit places where parking is difficult for motorhomes. I'm sure many of you will have experienced this at times. We don't have to take the car. There will be times when we will be moving around more often rather then staying in one place. The abilty to tow a car or not gives us more choices. I hope this answers why WE want to tow a car

 

As one or two of you said my question was how best to tow a car not should I tow a car.

[Brian Kirby]

In which case, all I would add is get the motorhome first, and get some use from it before embarking on getting car + trailer or whatever. 

You may find that your perceptions, which at present understandably seem to be based on your caravaning experience, may shift to using your van in ways you do not, at present, think you will adopt.  Then, if you find you don't need to extra car clutter, you won't end up with the wrong car and a useless trailer!

[Jodi]

Brian Kirby - 2010-03-16 11:58 AM

In which case, all I would add is get the motorhome first, and get some use from it before embarking on getting car + trailer or whatever. 

You may find that your perceptions, which at present understandably seem to be based on your caravaning experience, may shift to using your van in ways you do not, at present, think you will adopt.  Then, if you find you don't need to extra car clutter, you won't end up with the wrong car and a useless trailer!

Already have a small car Brian, which may well be suitable for towing, but I take your point about the trailer or A-frame. Thank you.

[pilote742]

It's also worthwhile checking with your insurance, I was enquiring about MH insurance and asked about towing a vehicle, the company indicated that they would only cover if the towed vehicle was in a trailer and not on an A frame

[Rosbotham]

The advice to check with insurers is true enough. I won't go into all the ins and outs here (there's a thread on another motorhome website...), but suffice to say I had the devil's own job getting fully comp insurance for my car on a trailer. Some places will provide cover, however.

 

I would say that when towing my Smart on an a-frame, getting cover 3rd party was easy (in fact it was covered on both Smart and MH insurance). Bizarrely my old car policy...had to change when I got the trailer...would cover the car 3rd party being towed, but wouldn't cover it 3rd party on a trailer.

 

Paul

 

 

[lookback]

Hi Jodi. I have an Autotrail Cheyenne and have been towing a Daihatsui Charade, fitted with a Chris Cox A frame, for over 3 years and have toured France, Spain and Portugal with no problems at all from the local police. I do find towing a car in the UK is ideal because this country is far from being motorhome friendly when it comes to parking in towns. Insurance for the car is not a problem and the NFU will insure your car fully comp both when you are towing and driving it. They will also supply a letter stating this fact. The car has been invaluable touring around various tourist sites and allowing my dog to accompany me. Go for it

[Jodi]

lookback - 2010-03-16 10:49 PM

 

Hi Jodi. I have an Autotrail Cheyenne and have been towing a Daihatsui Charade, fitted with a Chris Cox A frame, for over 3 years and have toured France, Spain and Portugal with no problems at all from the local police. I do find towing a car in the UK is ideal because this country is far from being motorhome friendly when it comes to parking in towns. Insurance for the car is not a problem and the NFU will insure your car fully comp both when you are towing and driving it. They will also supply a letter stating this fact. The car has been invaluable touring around various tourist sites and allowing my dog to accompany me. Go for it

Thank you lookback, that has been a very good bit of advice. I'm sending you a PM re your Cheyenne ownership

[Rosbotham]

lookback - 2010-03-16 10:49 PM

 

Insurance for the car is not a problem and the NFU will insure your car fully comp both when you are towing and driving it.

 

Can I be just a little pedantic. You mean "Getting insurance for the car is not a problem..." The issue is that neither MH nor car insurers universally provide cover - some do, some don't. Anyone starting to tow should therefore not take it as a given that their insurance will cover them, and should check. You are correct that should they have an issue, there are insurers (e.g. NFU, Peart, Quotea, Comfort) who will provide alternative cover...however that may involve either waiting until renewal time, or cancelling an unsuitable policy early.

 

Paul