anthonyj Posted July 29, 2010 Share Posted July 29, 2010 Is it possible to winterise a van with underslung tanks to the point where camping in sub zero temperatures becomes possible? My van has underslung waste and fresh tanks plus truma gas/elec water heater. I never considered camping through the winter before but we are enjoying the new van so much...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
w1ntersun Posted July 29, 2010 Share Posted July 29, 2010 The problem is keeping the water from freezing. No matter how much insulation you have the cold will eventually get through. Unless you have heated tanks or the tanks in a heated space you will get problems. One solution is to have the water sink and shower outlet straight to a waste bucket and keep the fresh water in a portable tank. Fiddly but it does work. I have a drain valve under the sink that diverts the water from the sink under the van so doesn,t go into the waste tank Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robinhood Posted July 29, 2010 Share Posted July 29, 2010 You'll not be able to make it as good as an onboard tank, but insulation, and if necessary the installation of a thermostatically controlled 12v tank heater to the fressh supply will make a big difference. Wouldn't fancy running the latter in really cold weather off hook-up for long, however, unless with a big bank of batteries. Best thing with the waste tank is to leave the drain tap open, and let it drain into a bucket (though you could use the same approach as above) FWIW, I've only had an (unwinterised) external water tank freeze on me once. It was in February and WELL below zero, and didn't thaw for several days. www.caktanks.co.uk will supply both insulation and 12v heaters and fittings. HTH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted July 29, 2010 Share Posted July 29, 2010 If thats your van in photo, it appears to have a large area of single glazing, if so in winter you lose a lot of heat throu them and suddenly it's not so nice in the cold :-( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted July 29, 2010 Share Posted July 29, 2010 You need both good insulation and also some form of heating for long term winterisation. I failed with this when we had the Autotrail Scout. An alternative is to fit a possibly smaller tank inside the van, under one of the seats perhaps and add another pump. Then if you keep the van warm enough for you it will be warm enough for the tank. Even a 25 litre container and a submertsible Whale pump hidden in the base of the wardrobe will do a lot for you. Hold it secure with a ratchet strap. The pipework is plastic and you don,t need to bother about the water level gague connections because you can look at the water level in the tank inside your van. Has that inspired you enough? Chive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lennyhb Posted July 29, 2010 Share Posted July 29, 2010 The waste tank on our van is underslung it is inside an insulated enclosure and has a feed from the blow air heating, never had any problems in cold weather. I would think as Clive says it is best to reposition the fresh water tank inside the van. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freewheeler Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 The waste tank isn't much of a problem. I simply used engine antifreeze in ours, and this seemed to work fine. The fresh water tank, however, isn't quite as easy. I insulated one on a Lunar Roadstar, by removing it and took a lot of time and effort insulating it using polystrene, finally covering it with silver bubblerap, as sold in rolls, for behind domestic radiators. As others have said, this wasn't as good as onboard tanks, but certainly worked o.k. in -7 degrees, when other ralliers on the same site, including an Hymer and a Rapido, had problems. I slipped a jiffy bag over the exposed part of the drain tap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lennyhb Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 Freewheeler - 2010-07-30 9:10 AM The waste tank isn't much of a problem. I simply used engine antifreeze in ours, and this seemed to work fine. How do you dispose of your waste, do you take it to a garage and ask to put it in their waste tank? You are not allowed to pour it into drains & sewers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fionablueinky Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 Hi We have an underslung water and waste tank, the waste tank I just leave open and have a bowl under never had a problem with that, the fresh water tank I had an tank heater fitted and insulated the tank and pipes myself and went to York in January in -9 and didn't have any problems the insulation on the pipes is really good but my job on the tank I had to take off in spring as it kept comeing down at the back as there wasn't anything to hold the bungy straps, so would like to get it done by my dealer this winter, just make sure when you empty the tank that you drain everything down and also open the taps to make sure theres no water left, I didn't do this the first time and there was a bit of frozen water in the pipes that made it more difficult for the water to come through from the tank the next time I went out, but after having the heat on it was ok. I wouldn't like to be without electric in really cold weather and we use a small oil filled radiator that sits between the cab seats, we have the diesel heating on when sat in the van on low and just the radiator when we go to bed. And a good external silver screen helps a lot as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
art338 Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 I reckon an outside open drain pipe with a -10c wind will see the inside of the pipe freeze even in the day time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rosbotham Posted July 30, 2010 Share Posted July 30, 2010 You need to keep in mind there can be a big difference between generic air temperatures, and temp on the underside of (not all that well insulated) motorhomes. I've got underslung/uninsulated tanks, and have been out to minus 4 with no issues. Mainly because the van's well heated hence temp under it is probably nothing like that, even allowing for heat rising rather than falling. Wouldn't risk anything lower than that, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted July 31, 2010 Share Posted July 31, 2010 Forgot to say that our expeirence 3 years back in the NEC temporary camp site was enough. Everything froze including the water bowzers. So it was a 25 litre can sat between the front seats as a temporary get by with a 500 watt heater running 24/7 while we were in the show. Brrrr. Thats when we seriously looked at fully winterised German vans. The rest as they say is history. C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted July 31, 2010 Share Posted July 31, 2010 poor choice of van by the looks of your avatar if you want to winter camp comfortably...I appreciate you may of not considered winter camping before getting it. All the more reason to do the homework. Buy in haste repent at leisure :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anthonyj Posted July 31, 2010 Author Share Posted July 31, 2010 I should just point out that the camper in the picture is my old one - not got round to changing the picture yet! But thanks for all the useful responses on here I have a lot of ideas how to cope now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted July 31, 2010 Share Posted July 31, 2010 anthonyj - 2010-07-31 5:50 PM I should just point out that the camper in the picture is my old one - not got round to changing the picture yet! But thanks for all the useful responses on here I have a lot of ideas how to cope now. Ah you see! if you want help we need proper info! :-D you can add your vehicle details beneath your signature? your old van looks more like what the Americans call a day van to me..... so what van have you :-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted July 31, 2010 Share Posted July 31, 2010 Much depends on what you intend doing. Winterise is a much used, but ultimately vague, term. If all you intend is using such a van in lowland UK, then the measures described above should suffice. However, if you intend skiing breaks in the Alps/Pyrenees, where -25C with wind chill is possible, forget it! A van constructed with underslung fresh and waste tanks is, in truth, a three season van (sorry, another vague term :-)). It will lack insulation in critical areas, apart from tanks, and it is probable water lines, which are far more prone to freeze, will also be underslung somewhere. A bit of frost at night, in still air - which is frequently the lowland UK experience, will be fine. Persistent sub-zero temperatures, implying much lower night-time temperatures, will not. Remember also that roads frequently fall to lower temperatures than the surrounding land, because they are dark in colour, lack texture, and are relatively dense. And what do you drive along from A to B? Exactly: so beneath your van is a howling gale of sub zero air exacting severe wind chill with added moisture and salt to further lower surface temperatures. Anything under the floor that can be frozen, will be frozen and, once frozen, it won't thaw quickly, if at all, because zero is merely the melting point of ice and to change from being ice back into water, it has to draw heat from its surroundings. Those surroundings are, of course, lacking in exactly that commodity, so you are stuck with a couple of very large ice cubes under your van. Better make sure you take plenty of gin! :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anthonyj Posted August 1, 2010 Author Share Posted August 1, 2010 Plenty of gin - the best suggestion so far!! Now driving a Compass Avantgarde 100 (same as Eldiss Autoquest 100) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flicka Posted August 1, 2010 Share Posted August 1, 2010 Hi Anthony, May be better if you say what Motorhome you have now. 8-) We have an Autocruise Sportstar & Autocruise supply a "winter kit" for dealer fit @ £190 comprising:- Winter Pack (Dealer fit) •Tank heaters •Drain insulation •Fridge vent covers http://www.autocruise.co.uk/star-range/prices & other manufacturer' may do likewise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel B Posted August 2, 2010 Share Posted August 2, 2010 Re antifreeze in the waste water tank ... wouldn't it be classed as toxic waste or something and illegal to just dump???? 8-) Would putting a good dollop of salt in the waste tank, to mix with the contents, prevent some freezing??? :-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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