replacement tyres again

[bikey]

posted regards replacement tyres recently, what my enquiry was for is to ask if anyone has fitted tyres other than expensive cannot get camping tyres and if so what do you think of them.

[rupert123]

Yes fitted Conti Vanco, not for price but could not get the camper at time. No differance but make sure load ratings are the same.

[lizken]

i FITTED cONTI vANCO2 EARLIER THIS YEAR - QUITE HAPPY, AND ALSO UPRATED FROM 3000 TO 3300 KIOLS MGW WITH NO PROBLEMS. :-D

[euroserv]

I think that the answer you are looking for is for a cheaper alternative to the dubiously 'specialist camper' tyres. We run panel vans and they are driven by terrorists that go too fast, bounce up kerbs and over-load frequently.

 

The tyres that we use are normally Hankook RA08 but there have been supply problems recently so have tried Avon AV9 and Bridgestone Duravis. The Avons are quite cheap, the Bridgestones less so. Both look like good quality tyres and we have had no problems with them.

 

In my humble opinion, the alleged virtues of the specialist tyres are mostly to do with comfort and resistance to ultra-violet light which for the average camper that sits around doing nothing most of the time I would say is wasted money. There are a great many 8 or 10 ply tyres around that will do the job more than adequately while allowing you the freedom to change them more often if this is your wish because you spent less in the first place.

 

All you have to do is buy a reputable brand, in the correct size with the same or higher load rating than you already have and that is that. If you travel a lot in the winter it's worth buying M&S (Mud and Snow) tyres and if you don't then a standard tyre is fine or the Uniroyal Rain-Max is ideal for British summers!

 

Nick

[747]

I notice that on another forum, there was information regarding a current offer on camping car tyres at Costco. I believe there was a good reduction if buying a set of 4 tyres.

[Brian Kirby]

euroserv - 2010-11-02 10:58 AM ................. If you travel a lot in the winter it's worth buying M&S (Mud and Snow) tyres and if you don't then a standard tyre is fine or the Uniroyal Rain-Max is ideal for British summers! Nick

Personal view this, Nick (and a bit OT, for which I apologise), but I am coming to the conclusion, reinforced during a recent trip to Greece, that motorhomers might be wise to consider fitting winter tyres, ideally M+S, for year round use, instead of Camping tyres. 

Our problem is not so much one of winter use (though a number of European "mountain states" seem to have laws requiring winter tyres between November and March which, I'd guess, many transiting "foreign" motorhomers inadvertently break), but that most of the problems we seem to encounter relate to lack of traction on soft ground, or on other wet, slippery, surfaces.  Many motorhome tyres get changed due to UV degraded "rubber", rather that wear, so I don't think any (presumed) increase in wear rates would prove much of a problem for most users.

The more robust tread blocks, and increased number of sipes in the tread, together with the (claimed) greater water and slush dispersing capability, of winter tyres would, I think, better suit general motorhome use than the (apparently) high mileage type tread mixes the Camping tyres seem to have.

Why Greece?  Well, having experienced the extreme slipperiness of Greek roads during rain, I began looking at Greek car tyres (I know, sad git! :-)) and noted that many appeared to be winter tyres.

Wet grass is a familiar problem for motorhomers so, if winter tyres bring even modest traction advantage on such surfaces, I think they may be worth considering. 

As an example, the Continental Vanco Winter 2 has much more rugged looking tread blocks, that appear to promise better traction on soft ground, while the claimed better water clearance would seem a general advantage, but especially in heavy rain (southern Europe, generally, doesn't do drizzle, it just turns on the hose at full bore!) on those dense, hard, poorly drained roads, which many southern European countries seem to have.

The obvious caveats regarding load, and speed, ratings being suitable clearly apply, but has anyone else any thoughts/experience of this?

[bazooka]

Hi Brian

Seems to make sense,as you stated few owners change the tyres due to lack of tread so that if all weather tyres havre a shorter life it shoudn't work out more expensive.

Baz

[Rayjsj]

Brian,

When you start to look at Greek car tyres instead of Greek 'crumpet' you really are on the 'downward slope'. ;-)

I recently had to change 4 Michelin XC camping tyres all with more than 7mm of tread left (5 years old, but only 13,000 miles) because the tyre walls were all worryingly cracked, it hurt !! but so would having a blowout on the motorway. I also got 4 Continental Vanco camping tyres. Cheaper than the Michelins but still expensive compared to standard 'Van' tyres.

I never knowingly overload, or drive that fast, I bought them (Camping tyres) because i assumed (silly me !!) that they were designed to withstand UV rays, and being parked in one posistion for long periods without cracking. So, why do we buy them ?? Ray (?)

[duffers]

as Brian says the M+S rating is far more useful for motorhome users

the Michelin Camping tyre claims M+S rating - but it's still only a summer tyre -

 

if you don't want to go to full winter All-Season are good compromise

Continental Vanco and Vredestein both have realistically priced rated tyres

 

[done quite a bit of research recently - suggest if in doubt you e-mail the manufacturers direct - I found them to be very helpful

except Michelin who didn't bother to reply *-)]

[BGD]

I put Hankooks on our MH a couple of years ago, and they seem just fine - but we don't (can't!) go over about 100kph.

 

Brilliant value for money certainly, and conform to all the same EU quality standards as the "usual suspect" big European brand names.

After approx 20,000 kms they seem to be wearing well - as in wearing slowly.

 

But the campsites/wild camping places here in Spain/Portugal tend to be of the gravel, rather than mud, type of surface so I've no idea how they'd cope with slippery surface conditions.

[flicka]

My understanding is that M & S Tyres transmit more road noise & give a firmer ride.

Old Wifes Tale, Right or wrong ?

[Guest pelmetman]

Replaced my 10 year old Hankooks last month with the same again :-D

They seem to last well no sign of cracking, just changed due to age :D

[duffers]

flicka - 2010-11-02 7:11 PM

 

My understanding is that M & S Tyres transmit more road noise & give a firmer ride.

Old Wifes Tale, Right or wrong ?

 

apparently summer tyres are deemed the noisiest overall, it's just the pitch of the winter tyre which makes them seem louder

 

so I'm told

[dshague]

had to wait a week for a Bridgestone camping tyre to arrive from scotland only 8 in stock .cost £112 fitted .van as these fitted from new replaced because of puncher

[Ivys]

I was quoted £113 today per tyre for Michelin Agilis (Headley tyres near Newbury) or £406 for four of them (Costco).

We have Agilis on the front wheels, can't fault them.

 

Rog

 

[Patricia]

I have just had Agilis fitted on the front wheels and I am sure there was a post somewhere on this forum which said they are M & S tyres. Does anyone know if this is true or do I need to contact Michelin?

[Ivys]

They are definitely winter tyres. We had some fitted onto the front wheels in Bulgaria when they had particularly heavy snow (Christmas 2007). The difference they made was great. We drove through some hairy stuff.

 

Rog

 

[Derek Uzzell]

Patricia - 2010-11-02 10:35 PM

 

I have just had Agilis fitted on the front wheels and I am sure there was a post somewhere on this forum which said they are M & S tyres. Does anyone know if this is true or do I need to contact Michelin?

 

Michelin's "Agilis Camping" tyre is M+S-marked (ie. designed to be suitable for mud and snow conditions). I'm not sure if the standard "Agilis" tyre is M+S-marked, but possibly not. An M+S-marked tyre will always carry that marking somewhere on its sidewalls.

 

Both the standard and 'camping' versions of "Agilis' (despite the latter's M+S-marking) are classed by Michelin as 'summer' tyres. For a full-house 'winter' Agilis tyre, you'd need Michelin's "Agilis Alpin" which has a radically different directional tread pattern. See:

 

http://www.merityre.co.uk/michelin-tyres.htm

[Patricia]

When the tyres were fitted I asked the mechanic if they were good for the winter and he gave me the Gallic shrug and a non-commital answer - that is why I am following this thread. I definitely have the Agilis camper tyres (just checked!) and, although you are correct Derek about the Alpin being a winter tyre, the blurb does not mention that the tyres are suitable for motorhomes whereas Michelin actually say that the camping tyre is very good on snow. Very confusing!

 

Still, I am not actually planning on driving on snow if I can avoid it, so hopefully all will be well. Out here it is obligatory to use snow tyres, and chains where possilbe, so as I can't physically fit chains (so I sold them) I shall stay indoors by the raging wood fire!

[Derek Uzzell]

Patricia

 

It's not really that confusing...

 

The vast majority of European motohomes are constructed on 'light commercial vehicle' LCV) chassis (Fiat Ducato, Ford Transit, Mercedes Sprinter, Renault Master, etc.)

 

When these chassis leave Fiat's/Ford'/Mercedes's/Renault's, (etc.) factory, the tyres fitted to their wheels will either be standard 'van' tyres designed for use on LCVs or, if it's known that the chassis will form the basis of a motorhome and the chassis- and motorhome-manufacturers have agreed to it, may have 'camping-car' tyres fitted instead. (I believe only Continental, Michelin and Pirelli currently offer 'camping-car' tyres in the UK.) As far as I'm aware 'winter' tyres are never fitted as original equipment to such chassis.

 

If we take Continental and Michelin as examples, each tyre manufacturer currently offers three ranges of tyre suitable for LCVs. Continental offers Vanco-2, VancoCamper and VancoWinter-2; Michelin offers Agilis, Agilis Camping and Agilis Alpin.

 

Vanco-2 and Agilis are 'standard 'van' tyres, while VancoCamper and Agilis Camping are aimed at the camping-car (motorhome) market. These ranges are classed as 'summer' tyres.

 

Vanco-Winter 2 and Agilis Alpin are specifically designed for cold weather use where plenty of snow and ice is a likelihood and, consequently, are classed as 'winter' tyres.

 

A tyre may carry a "M+S" (Mud and Snow) marking, indicating that it is an 'all-weather' tyre, with above-average traction in muddy or very light snowy conditions, and for use in low ambient temperatures. But a tyre (even if it is M+S-marked) cannot be accurately called a 'winter' tyre unless it carries the snowflake-and-mountain winter-tyre identification symbol.

 

When the time comes to replace a motorhome's existing tyres, then replacing 'standard' with 'standard', or camping-car' with 'camping-car', is the simplest and least controversial option. If there's then a choice between a tyre that's marked M+S and one that isn't, I guess that the former SHOULD be better than the latter for motorhome use. No idea if changing to genuine 'winter' tyres would be a wise plan for most UK motorcaravanners, but the option to do so is certainly there.

 

There was a reasonably recent Pro-mobil comparison of 'standard' and 'camping-car' tyres. It's on:

 

http://www.promobil.de/test/zubehoer/test-sommerreifen-fuer-reisemobile.303732.7.htm

 

(Just for the record, I said earlier that Michelin's "Agilis Alpin" has a directional tread pattern. It hasn't, though its predecessor "Agilis Snow-Ice" did have.)

[747]

On the last big tyre thread, I said that your small independant tyre shop is a good place to look and I still abide by that. There was also a 'shortage' of available tyres then.

 

I got a tyre which had a higher rating than my Agilis for 2/3 of the price.

[duffers]

well put Derek, although I'm struggling to get a translation on the link

 

btw - I was told that in the UK winter tyres are starting to be called cold weather tyres - to try make them more appropriate for use here

 

 

 

 

[Derek Uzzell]

747 - 2010-11-04 2:33 PM

 

On the last big tyre thread, I said that your small independant tyre shop is a good place to look and I still abide by that. There was also a 'shortage' of available tyres then.

 

I got a tyre which had a higher rating than my Agilis for 2/3 of the price.

 

If a tyre's 'rating' (presumably the Load Index and/or Speed symbol) is a vital criterion for selection, then it's easy to make big savings. A new Michelin Agilis 215/75 R16C 113/111R tyre is likely to cost around the £140 mark, whereas a higher-rated Nankang CW-20 215/75 R16C 116/114S can be obtained for under half that figure.

[Patricia]

Thank you Derek but like you Duffers the German is beyond me. I have though read the French version of the Michelin product page and it states there that the Agilis Camper is suitable for extended temperatures and allows sufficient adherence for the occasional transport over some difficult conditions such as tracks, mud and snow. This is reassuring enough for me as I have no intention of driving far in those conditions anyway. However, if I was intending to go to the ski-ing resorts I would probably buy at least two of the Alpin for the front wheels.

 

For me, skimping on tyres and brakes is a no-no.

[747]

Derek Uzzell - 2010-11-04 6:07 PM

 

747 - 2010-11-04 2:33 PM

 

On the last big tyre thread, I said that your small independant tyre shop is a good place to look and I still abide by that. There was also a 'shortage' of available tyres then.

 

I got a tyre which had a higher rating than my Agilis for 2/3 of the price.

 

If a tyre's 'rating' (presumably the Load Index and/or Speed symbol) is a vital criterion for selection, then it's easy to make big savings. A new Michelin Agilis 215/75 R16C 113/111R tyre is likely to cost around the £140 mark, whereas a higher-rated Nankang CW-20 215/75 R16C 116/114S can be obtained for under half that figure.

 

Hi Derek,

 

My new tyre is a 16" Mohawk and was bought as a spare. I prefer this to a tube of gunk and some breakdown companies are no help to you if you do not carry a spare.

 

You talk about the load rating as a vital criteria. I have a tag axle Fiat with a MAM of 5 ton. The owner of the tyre company said that the Agilis rating of 113/111 had a safety margin that was a bit close for comfort on the front wheels. He knew that motorhomes are quite often overloaded and that is why he recommended the Mohawk as it is 116/114. It was not my cheapest option but I went with his comment.

 

He was also the only company that could supply a high pressure steel valve at the same time. None of the big chains stock them nowadays. Another good reason for choosing the little guy. :D