deegee Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 I am planning to buy a new or newish second hand motor-home from a dealer. I have nothing to part-exchange. I've never done it before and feel a bit green (I full-timed in a self-built for ten years so never had anything to do with dealers). What is the protocol? How much is the usual deposit? Is there a contract or should I make one considering that this is almost the price of an apartment? Is the dealer held to a particular delivery date for a new van? How do you pay such a large sum of money (presumably not in tens and twenties?) What is the usual "discount" or the negotiated extras that I read about? Who offers the warranty, the manufacturer or the dealer, who is responsible for what and is there anything special to look out for? Any advice appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clive Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 Firstly decide on which model you want. Test drive several at different dealers. Be sure it ticks all the "must have" boxes on your check list and most of the "likes" Get the best CASH price offer from each dealer (assuming you dont want HP)! Negotiate the 3 year minimum warranty and don,t let the dealer make it conditional on them doing servicing and habitation checks. Get all the details in writing first. When you eventually decide pay the depoist by CREDIT CARD. This gives you certain clout if things go wrong. For example on your first drive of YOUR vehicle you may find (if its a Fiat/Peugeot) that it judders like heck going backwards and you wish to reject the vehicle directly after handover.. If its a baddun then this is the best way, just say NO find me a goodun! they are not all like that. Sales of new vans are no where near as boyant as good second hand vans so if going for new negotiate like hell. Take your time, they want your money more than you want their motorhome. C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murphy99 Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 Hi Deegee, You will save a lot of dosh on nearly new, but that said we just bought new as got a great deal P/X on "old" Van getting back what we paid in 2003.! We originally bought in Belgium and imported to UK saving 40 %. You can't do that now. Agree with everything Clive said and do negotiate like mad.! We got the Dealer to "throw in" small HD TV ( should have included DVD combi ), 85 cm fully auto. parabole, second leisure battery, Awning, cabin air con, etc etc. BUT one thing we overlooked was spare wheel, jack and brace.! Euro. Vans and cars made last 3 years or so don't include them, just a bomb for punctures whick OK if you don't shred a tyre. Just forked out 300 + € so be warned. New member living in France. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 murphy99 - 2011-06-26 6:05 PM We originally bought in Belgium and imported to UK saving 40 %. You can't do that now. . What do you mean by "you cant do it now" why ever not? New and used can be sourced in Germany/Belgium no problem... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 Clive - 2011-06-26 4:29 PM When you eventually decide pay the depoist by CREDIT CARD. This gives you certain clout if things go wrong. Whilst the CC company may (or not) get involved on your behalf in any dispute, you deposit will not be secure if dealer goes under unless total value is below £xxxxxx (forgoten the limit at moment), most new vans (if not all) will be above the figure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colin Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 murphy99 - 2011-06-26 6:05 PM spare wheel, jack and brace.! Euro. Vans and cars made last 3 years or so don't include them, just a bomb for punctures whick OK if you don't shred a tyre. Just forked out 300 + € so be warned. . Our Globecar built this year included spare wheel, jack and brace, we made no request for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 As above plus, if buying a new van, make sure every factory fit optional item (base vehicle manufacturer or converter) is clearly and properly listed. If the order form is in partially legible manuscript, type out a clear copy and send it to the dealer as confirmation of what should be there, making sure you get the terminology exactly right. If you negotiate for extras to be fitted by the dealer (e.g. awning) make sure they, too, are fully described as to make, size, colour etc. There should be no ambiguity, and no gaps for misunderstandings. Then, take you copy with you when you go to collect, and check them all off. Try not to buy from a dealer who is further from home than you are prepared to drive. If the van develops several faults, a series of 200 mile, or more, round trips can become a major problem. Remember, only the base vehicle chassis is made by robots, the rest is assembled by hand, and hands do make mistakes. Perfection may be the objective, but it is not always achieved. Be realistic. The warranty issue is more complex. On a new van you will get warranties from the converter and the base vehicle manufacturer, as well as from the individual equipment manufacturers (fridge, toilet, hob, space/water heater, electrical power supply unit, water pump etc). So, quite a bunch of documents. Make sure the workings are properly demonstrated before you pay the balance due. That means water in the tank, a gas cylinder connected, and a mains supply live. If something doesn't work, say you will come back with the balance when they've fixed it. When you get it home, crawl all over it, to familiarise yourself with all the parts and how they work, by reading through all the manuals, preferably sitting in the van. However, the warranties are promises by manufacturers to make good defects always with the proviso that certain conditions have been met by the user. Make sure you read and understand those provisos. Guarantees mean exactly what they say, no more, no less. They are not legally enforceable against the guarantors, and there is no concept of reasonableness that can be applied. Manufacturers may take a generous line with warranty issues, if they so choose, but there is no obligation on them to do so, and many will simply stop at the written word. Even so, if you think their interpretation of their own warranty is wrong, quiet persistence sometimes results in a change of tack, or a "without prejudice" offer, so it is worth querying a rejection that seems completely wrong, or based on misunderstanding of actual circumstances. Having said all the above, it is the dealer who is legally liable to you for the sufficiency and merchantable quality of what he sells. It doesn't matter a fig what the warranty says, or whether the manufacturer accepts or rejects a claim, if something fails, or proves defective in reasonable use, the dealer has to fix the problem. Always turn to the dealer if something is wrong, and reject any attempt on his part to push you towards whosever guarantee for remedy. If you are happier taking (for example) a heater to Truma under warranty for them to repair or replace by all means do so, but it would be wise to first take it to the dealer. Whatever you do, write to the dealer confirming the defect and asking for his proposals for remedy. If you agree to take the van to a specialist yourself, record back to the dealer that you will do this, and what was done, making clear you still hold him responsible should the fault reoccur. Why? Because many warranties expire after 12 months whereas the dealer remains liable for the adequacy of what he has sold for 6 years. That does not mean he has to go on fitting new heaters for 6 years, just that he has a legal obligation to arrive at a reasonable settlement with you during that time. Clearly, some items won't last that long due to normal wear and tear, so in this case the concept of reasonableness must be at the forefront of your dealings, on both sides. That legal liability exists in consumer law, and is very clearly stated in the legislation. However, it can be an immensely costly and time consuming process trying to gain enforcement of your rights so, unless the poo really goes into the propeller, quiet persuasion and negotiation, while seeking to retain good relations with your dealer, is by far the most effective route. Under present circumstances, for all the fine words in the legislation, it is frequently the case that even serious deficiencies are more quickly and cheaply remedied with the costs shared between dealer and owner, or even entirely at the owner's expense, than by trying to drag a recalcitrant dealer through the courts. However, looking on the bright side, choose the dealer with great care, and the van with even greater care (we're talking quality here - not colour of furnishings or layouts! :-)), and you will have a happy buying experience and enjoy years of (generally) trouble-free motorhoming. It can happen, and in truth happens far more often that the pessimists will imply. Just be on your guard, that's all! :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murphy99 Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 Hi JudgeMental, Change to tax laws as I recall but do check it out for yourself. Let me know if I wrong please. Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murphy99 Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 Hi Colin, Both our 2011 Hymer and 2008 Citroen Picasso C 4 came without Spare , Jack, or Brace,( only checked Citroen after purchase of Hymer ), also friend in UK had to buy for his Frankia and Ford Saloon Car. Maybe you luckier than us but for a prospective purchaser worth a check. Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 murphy99 - 2011-06-27 7:35 AM Hi JudgeMental, Change to tax laws as I recall but do check it out for yourself. Let me know if I wrong please. Keith We are members of a European (open) market? Just imported a new van a couple of months ago...You pay your UK VAT and that is it. If you buy used (over 6 months old and 6000 miles) you dont have any VAT to pay as it was originally paid in Europe....(make sure of this). Some German dealers make you pay German VAT and then return it when you send proof of UK VAT payment (mine did not) Belgium probably easier to deal with as nearer, if you have a problem, but Germany being a larger market can be more competative..... My new Adria Twin SP came with spare wheel...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murphy99 Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 Hi JM, Well done with the spare, jack and brace but can you still get the 40 % price reduction we managed back in 2003.? Keith New member living in France. Just bought a 2011 Hymer Van 562 with twin berths. Went to Adria Dealer in Brantome who said " don't have twin berth model in stock " and when I asked if he could get one for us to look at he said " non ". !! I don't think they understand Marketing over here.!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek Uzzell Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 JudgeMental - 2011-06-27 9:07 AM Just imported a new van a couple of months ago...You pay your UK VAT and that is it. If you buy used (over 6 months old and 6000 miles) you dont have any VAT to pay as it was originally paid in .. 6000 KILOMETRES, not 6000 miles. See: http://customs.hmrc.gov.uk/channelsPortalWebApp/channelsPortalWebApp.portal?_nfpb=true&_pageLabel=pageImport_ShowContent&id=HMCE_CL_000165&propertyType=document#P37_2688 As a general rule of thumb, it seems likely that new panel-van conversion motorhomes will have spare wheels (and the tools to fit them), but new coachbuilt motorhomes may well not. Even the motorhome manufacturers can't necessarily be trusted regarding the latter - Hobby's 2011 English-language brochure states in one section that the whole "Toskana Exclusive" range has a spare-wheel as standard, but (in another section) that it's just the 750-model Toscana Exclusives that have a spare (which is probably right). Otherwise, it's just the Iveco-based Hobby Sphinx that has a standard spare-wheel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JudgeMental Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 murphy99 - 2011-06-27 9:43 AM Hi JM, Well done with the spare, jack and brace but can you still get the 40 % price reduction we managed back in 2003.? Keith New member living in France. Just bought a 2011 Hymer Van 562 with twin berths. Went to Adria Dealer in Brantome who said " don't have twin berth model in stock " and when I asked if he could get one for us to look at he said " non ". !! I don't think they understand Marketing over here.!! I did it with last van in 2007 and significant saving on RHD UK price then...This time less, but better in my pocket then anyone elses! exchange rate poor at the moment.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murphy99 Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 Hi JM, Quite agree with that, even a few percent will buy you some good 2005 Bordeaux Rouge.!! Keith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel B Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 On the warranty issue, if you don't want to have to return to the dealer you purchase your motorhome from, make sure you can get the warranty servicing and repairs done elsewhere BEFORE you buy it, some other dealers will not carry our work on vehicles they have not sold, despite what your selling dealer may say! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mirage Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 Only mugs buy motorhomes I bet thats what the dealers say between themselves, the industry is peppered with badly contructed vans and faulty equipment, if you can`t stand hassle don`t bother. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deegee Posted July 6, 2011 Author Share Posted July 6, 2011 Thanks everyone. Feel much better informed now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.