derek pringle Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 1foot, I started work at 15 as an apprentice and at 23 yrs of age went to work for a different employer. I stayed with this employer for 36 yrs . Not one day in the public sector have I worked. What is wrong if anything with the public sector is unlikely to be the fault of Mel or her work colleagues. Seems she stood up to the plate on her own 2 feet and did not leave by dubious methods ala your friend{accordeing to your own words] cheers derek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Seeing as this thread has diversified into a Private versus Public pension debate:D............I would like to suggest there is a 3rd way........Given that in order to have the equvilant 12k a year of in pension you now need in excess off 200k of cash in your pot to invest in an annuity8-)........This sum is way beyond the majority of the private sector;-)I might of been able to build up such a pot.......IF.....I carried on working long days building my business................Paying even more tax8-)..................Sod that:D.... We decided to enjoy life.......which as most people agree. life is all about balance;-).......So now we do a little work and we have a lot of time away in the camperB-)........ We can do this because we have reduced the amount of money we need to live on, and I believe we will get by quite comfortably on our small pensions, I might carry on doing a little work just to keep the brain ticking over:D Once we get to the old and dribbly stage there's no point in having pots of money;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
francisgraham Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 I'd just like to mention that, like 95% of the threads on MMM I've not been in this one. I looked, it didn't interest me and had nothing to which I could add. I do notice there that there are some people in this thread who seem to appear in every one! They're usually the ones who accuse me of posting too much! Carry on people, debate is fun, you have every right to do but just extend that right to everyone else. I shall now leave this thread for ever! :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordThornber Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 francisgraham - 2011-10-24 9:13 AM debate is fun, you have every right to do but just extend that right to everyone else.QUOTE] Amen to that............................... Martyn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1footinthegrave Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 I swore I would not come back on this thread, but let me tell you all a true story. A ( once ) friend of mine was employed as a lifeguard by Birmingham City council. He ( like me )was a heavy smoker. It was a well known scam by employees to get out early on ill health retirement grounds with all manner of reasons. He like most smokers had a chronic cough by the time he was in his late forties. I won't go into all the inns and outs of the lengthy process, suffice to say he was able ( with a clever solicitor ) to successfully bring an action against the council citing chlorine fumes from the swimming pool as being responsible for his decreased lung capacity. He was eventually awarded a lump sum in compensation, and an index linked pension that was paid immediately, this was at the age of 49. His lung capacity improved overnight, with his now free time he sold up, moved to Wales and spent a good many years renovating a house there. He's 67 now and has received more years in pension than he actually worked for the council. . I heard every little detail of the scam as it hatched to fruition.Did it piss me off, you bet ya I don't put Melb in that camp she has obviously been very thrifty to put aside what, maybe 150K /200K to last her till she and hubby get their pension. but there are diabolical abuses almost always funded in the public sector, that really was the point I was trying to make. That really is the last thing I have to say on the subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PJay Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 it would be interesting to know , how many of the early retirees have children and grandkids? Mel says they don't have any. We did not retire early, as fortunatley we both enjoyed what we did for a living, even though we were not self employed. We have three offspring and nine grandchildren , who we help with uni costs and when the time comes for learning to drive, help towards lessons. , so far 4 now drive and two more have reached 17 in the last couple of months.. I know we can afford to help out, but you can't take your money with you to the grave, shrouds don't have pockets , as the saying goes. We've had friends retire early an d found they got bored, so went back to work. (again no kids ) We've had friends who were going to do this and that (When we retire) and have died before making the pension age. So I say if you want to do something , go ahead and do it. We all only have one go at living PJay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 1footinthegrave - 2011-10-24 9:33 AM I swore I would not come back on this thread, but let me tell you all a true story. A ( once ) friend of mine was employed as a lifeguard by Birmingham City council. He ( like me )was a heavy smoker. It was a well known scam by employees to get out early on ill health retirement grounds with all manner of reasons. He like most smokers had a chronic cough by the time he was in his late forties. I won't go into all the inns and outs of the lengthy process, suffice to say he was able ( with a clever solicitor ) to successfully bring an action against the council citing chlorine fumes from the swimming pool as being responsible for his decreased lung capacity. He was eventually awarded a lump sum in compensation, and an index linked pension that was paid immediately, this was at the age of 49. His lung capacity improved overnight, with his now free time he sold up, moved to Wales and spent a good many years renovating a house there. He's 67 now and has received more years in pension than he actually worked for the council. . I heard every little detail of the scam as it hatched to fruition.Did it piss me off, you bet ya I don't put Melb in that camp she has obviously been very thrifty to put aside what, maybe 150K /200K to last her till she and hubby get their pension. but there are diabolical abuses almost always funded in the public sector, that really was the point I was trying to make. That really is the last thing I have to say on the subject. So you know, direct from the horse's mouth, of one person who, 18 years ago, deliberately and calculatingly employed a solicitor to help him deceive a local authority into paying him compensation, and an enhanced pension, for a self inflicted condition he part feigned. From this highly dubious individual's behaviour your reasoning seems to run, public servant on the fiddle, so all public servants are on the fiddle. Approximately the logic of "pillar boxes are red, therefore all red objects are pillar boxes". And then you are surprised because more morally sound folk are insulted by the implied slur on their characters! So, I'll tell you another story. These was once a man named Ernest Saunders, who was imprisoned for five years as one of the Guinness four (for manipulating the price of Guinness shares) and who was released after 10 months because he was suffering from Alzheimer's. Shortly thereafter, he became the only person known to have recovered from Alzheimer's. Remember him? Using your logic, what conclusions should I draw from this? That all company directors are dishonest? That anyone suffering Alzheimer's is merely faking it? That all doctors are willing, for the right fee, to make dubious diagnoses? That all private sector workers are bent (Guinness, after all, is a private sector company)? Or again, you could take a certain chief executive of a certain Scottish bank - who I gather it is extremely unwise to name, or even to describe as a banker, in public - who crashed his bank, causing the UK government (AKA you and me) to shell out billions in a rescue scheme, and who walked off whistling with his full pension and other ill earned perks that are of a magnitude that would make your envious eyes water and, amazingly, now has another job - though fortunately not in banking. So, what conclusions should I draw from that? All bankers are corrupt? That the whole UK government was in on the corruption? That it was all a plot to rob the taxpayer of billions? This "cite one rotten apple, and then imply all other apples suffer the same rot" line reasoning really is pathetic. To repeat the story as you have told it above, and then heap insult upon insult by saying "oh, and by the way, I don't mean this to apply to Mel, is sheer hypocrisy. If you're not trying to make the association, why repeat that story in this string? Scurrilous! You added, way back at end of your first post: "anyway enjoy some of my money, sour grapes, you bet ya, !" Yet, when challenged, you later protested your post was not provoked by jealousy. Well "sour grapes", in popular usage, equates to envy, and also to jealousy. For example, Wikipedia has the following entry on envy: "Envy (also called invidiousness) is best defined as a resentful emotion that "occurs when a person lacks another's (perceived) superior quality, achievement, or possession and either desires it or wishes that the other lacked it." Envy can also derive from a sense of low self-esteem that results from an upward social comparison threatening a person's self image: another person has something that the envier considers to be important to have. If the other person is perceived to be similar to the envier, the aroused envy will be particularly intense, because it signals to the envier that it just as well could have been he or she who had the desired object." Seems apt to me! So, all I can usefully add is: know thyself, and then try to learn when to stop digging! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1footinthegrave Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 I'm not sure what your role is on these forums, is it you think to be the font of all wisdom, no offence intended, or you simply have nothing better to do than try to act as some kind of self appointed arbiter. There really is no point in trying to persuade you that these type of things are endemic within the public sector, you obviously live in a parallel universe to me, so lets agree to disagree. P.S thanks for the psychoanalysis. Your pomposity is astounding If you can be bothered take a long hard read of this, and this is the kind of thing that us in the private sector find so objectionable,not jealous, just objectionable and yes I know it's in the Daily Mail http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1323453/100-000-civil-servants-quit-50-pensions.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayjsj Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 1footinthegrave - 2011-10-23 10:08 PM peter - 2011-10-23 9:55 PM Mel, I bet you wish you had never started this thread in the first place now. I'm with you, if you can by your past thrift, retire early, then darned well done and b*llocks to the bleeding hearts of the small minded. I'd make a bet that most of you guys are or have been employed in the public sector pushing bits of paper around doing some non job that this country is groaning under the weight of, otherwise you would get it. Most of you think I'm bitter and twisted for holding the views I do, do you know what, I could not give a monkeys, now lets leave it shall we. Well you say, 'lets leave it at that' (you with the last word, and Always right of course !) and then you go and spoil it by having another 'pop' . I have Never worked in the Public Sector, but think what you are spouting is utter 'Tosh' (for want of 'meatier' word). Most in the Public Sector are 'Public Servants' and get treated like that by certain sections of the populice, OUR Nurses, Teachers, District Nurses, Midwives etc.,etc., do Marvelous work, much above and beyond the call of duty or pay grade, They DESERVE a graceful retirement without 'sour grapes' from folk who didn't have the intelligence to better themselves to gain a 'better posistion in life' , Which is what MY parents taught me. I started as a 'Manual worker' a crane slinger actually, and ended as a Mainframe Computer Engineer. Begrudging what others have, only leads in one direction DOWNWARDS. in to the gutter. Mel, Have a Lovely Retirement, you deserve it ! From a fellow Retiree and DOG LOVER. ;-) Ray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Yes, Daily Mail, so only true enough to get folks blood pressure up. Sorry if I got on my high horse, can't understand why! :-D I suggested you start a new thread in chatterbox, but you have chosen not to do so. Had you done this, you may have discovered rather more then even the Daily Mail knows, from folk who have detailed knowledge of what is actually proposed, rather then relying on a part informed, politically motivated, newspaper reporter. Some on here have been, and are, a lot closer to events than any newspaper reporter can ever get - and the truth is even stranger than you might imagine. All I would add is that we have been there before, but it was kept much more in the dark last time. It was the product of Conservative political dogma last time, as well, and no (before you go off on yet more flights of fancy), I am not a Labour supporter. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Well if there's any truth in the article from 1 foot8-)............I'm glad my tax bill is zero this year:D........and long may it be so;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malc d Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 pelmetman - 2011-10-24 3:07 PM Well if there's any truth in the article from 1 foot8-)............I'm glad my tax bill is zero this year:D........and long may it be so;-) You really should let us all know how you avoid VAT, and taxes on petrol/diesel. (We won't tell anyone else) ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 1footinthegrave Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Brian Kirby - 2011-10-24 2:51 PM Yes, Daily Mail, so only true enough to get folks blood pressure up. Sorry if I got on my high horse, can't understand why! :-D :-) No Brian stick to the Guardian, or is it the Beano..............that reminds me must apply for that job in the back page of the Guardian last week. Job advert for Newham Borough Council’s Change Project Portfolio Manager. Paying a salary of £43,368 per annum, the new recruit “will have overall responsibility for the integrity and coherence of the change projects allocated within the Customer Access Programme,The council is transforming the way it delivers public services. Gives me a kind of warm glow every time I see how my taxes are being spent,now if only could land the job.................. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tonyg3nwl Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Hi, I have just about managed to plough through all the rant and rage both for and against pension pots be they self funded, employer funded or state funded. It matters not one jot for Mell and hubby and I just wish them both a long and happy retirement. I used to work for ITV and served 30 years before commercial forces forced Maggie and co to sell the assets and privatise it all. I was 'fortunate' enough to be able to be offered a 'generous' redundancy package and part of this was an option to commute some of my entitlement to a lump sum and accept a lower pension. Financial advice at the time was to do this on the basis that cash in my pocket could be used as I wish, and there was always the chance that I could keel over next day and lose a lifetime of retirement on pension.. Fortunately, that hasn't happened to date (some 20 years later), and I look forward to the next 20. The combination of redundancy and commutation paid off the outstanding mortgage and the balance was given over to the 'rich bankers' to play with and grow a bigger pile. This worked at first and we were able to buy various luxuries including current motorhome. Then along comes Gordon and cronies and milks the gravy train to help pay for them as have a lot less. I understand the reasoning, but dont agree that it should be my good fortune that helps out those who havent been in the right place at the right time. Life isnt Fair and never has been. After Gordon comes 'the greedy bankers'. I pay them to bust a gut to make what's left earn enough to keep me in the manner to which I have become accustomed. Their contract and expertise earns them rich rewards...but is that FAIR... maybe they get overpaid, not for me to decide Along comes David and co and tries to tell bankers to loan (part of) my money to some small enterprises who may well fail in the modern climate. That is not very sensible to my mind...please chose wisely to whom you will lend it.. Any small income that it does produce is half inched away by the revenue ... is that fair? I m not complaining, and return back to the original thread, to wish Mel all the best throughout whatever your retirement throws at you. may you have many long years ahead. Nils illigiterum carborundum (Don't let the b.s.trds.grind you down) tonyg3nwl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 malc d - 2011-10-24 3:44 PMpelmetman - 2011-10-24 3:07 PMWell if there's any truth in the article from 1 foot8-)............I'm glad my tax bill is zero this year:D........and long may it be so;-)You really should let us all know how you avoid VAT, and taxes on petrol/diesel.(We won't tell anyone else) ;-)I was referring to income tax............fortunately we don't earn enough to pay it;-)...........I still have to pay the stealth taxes though which I reckon covers my use of the NHS etc, fortunately diesel is a business expense:D.........I don't mind paying my way:D Now you know why I voted Lib Dem:-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel B Posted October 24, 2011 Author Share Posted October 24, 2011 Well, I know I wasn't going to post on here anymore but feel I need to, to say a big thank you to all of those who have come to my defence and wished me well, it is much appreciated. :-D I didn't bother looking at the Forum yesterday at all as, to be perfectly honest, I just wasn't in the mood for another 'bashing'. :-( I did have some reservations about looking into today but am please I have with all the nice comments - so again, thanks guys! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 It's all your fault Mel:D.............You should stay at work and keep folk like me in the style we wish to become accustomed(lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest peter Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 You're welcome Mel I don't know what One Foot in the Mouth's problem is. (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel B Posted October 24, 2011 Author Share Posted October 24, 2011 pelmetman - 2011-10-24 6:05 PM It's all your fault Mel:D.............You should stay at work and keep folk like me in the style we wish to become accustomed(lol) Sorry Dave ... you ain't got no style! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest pelmetman Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Mel B - 2011-10-24 6:26 PMpelmetman - 2011-10-24 6:05 PMIt's all your fault Mel:D.............You should stay at work and keep folk like me in the style we wish to become accustomed(lol) Sorry Dave ... you ain't got no style! :DHow could you say such a thing Mel8-)............I've now got a pair of "Fatface" shorts and straw hat;-).........So I am officially trendy:D......not sure if they go with my "Bay City Roller" jacket though:-S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhorsf Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Mel B - 2011-10-24 5:52 PM Well, I know I wasn't going to post on here anymore but feel I need to, to say a big thank you to all of those who have come to my defence and wished me well, it is much appreciated. :-D I didn't bother looking at the Forum yesterday at all as, to be perfectly honest, I just wasn't in the mood for another 'bashing'. :-( I did have some reservations about looking into today but am please I have with all the nice comments - so again, thanks guys! :D You are very welcome Mel do not let the" PI$$ on your chips" brigade spoil your enjoyment of your news Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian Kirby Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 Seconded - er, sort of. (lol) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derek pringle Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 1foot, I do agree with you in the fact that that there must be faults within the Public Sector, God knows government after government are trying to find the right solutions and systems that work for us all and are economic. Surely this is what Mels department is attempting to do. However,do not get get fixated that these problems do not lie within the Private Sector and NONE of your money goes toward funding this area. The difference is the Public Sector is supposed to be for the good of all and as such paid for by all. You should be more irate at the way your taxes and prices you pay for commodities and services go to fund institutions that should definitely not be such a burden on us ,namely Banks etc.. The Terms and Conditions of normal employees in these areas are in the main far superior to the rank and file in Public Services. You make your previous posting seem like you are sorry you could not do the same as your friend/friends which does not sound very moral anyway.Good luck and chill. cheers derek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ham Posted October 24, 2011 Share Posted October 24, 2011 GOOD LUCK MEL. I got out after 34 year’s service (and on call 24/7 for 15 of those years (money was good though)) with BT, Came home from Holidays and was told my Job was going to India And would I like to go out for 6 months to train the people that where taking over my Job . I won’t repeat what I said , So finally at 60 years of age they let me go with a nice fat pension and 3 years wages .I did and do not care one bit what anyone thinks about the type of package that was given to me. I earned it and was going to take it. Now I am enjoying it. So to Hell with others views go and enjoy yourself you do what you want to do after all they are only Jealous. Oh and the laughable bit is BT had to Bring back the work to the UK after 6 months as the work required the experience and knowledge of working at the customers premises . But unfortunately For BT the six engineers had taken the money and run Ham……. Have van will Travel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverback Posted October 25, 2011 Share Posted October 25, 2011 good on yer mel!!! :-D dont care if your public, private, or won the lottery... you do what you want, dont forget... do not dump your water, keep a fire extinquisher handy, and a torch :-D just in case there is a motorcyclist following you and gonna burgle you..you might remember a post year ago ish :-D live long and prosper... apointed eared man said go for it my girl :-D we are in 2 years time.. and stuff the pension!!!!!!!!!!!!!! jon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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